American English and British Ennglish

[Midas]

Kilted Exile. 'seek and ye shall find' or 'a person will see what he seeks' is another, non biblical, version. You see, I was born in Dunfermline. Last time I was there it was still north of the border, and the people had strong Fife accents - some pleasant, some unpleasant to my ears.


You appear to have a 'chip on your shoulder', sadly, I find, like many fellow Scots, brought about by a low self image. Or, what else can I assume from your seeing that which isn't there, or intended.

I presented to you an objective view to the subject in question, one free of national pride, or lack of it, as either can lead to a fall (in grace).

"O wad some Pow'r the giftie gie us
To hear oorsels as others hear us
It wad frae monie a blunder free us
An' foolish notion

(Apologies to Rabbie Burns)

[kilted exile]

Kilted Exile. 'seek and ye shall find' or 'a person will see what he seeks' is another, non biblical, version. You see, I was born in Dunfermline. Last time I was there it was still north of the border, and the people had strong Fife accents - some pleasant, some unpleasant to my ears.


You appear to have a 'chip on your shoulder', sadly, I find, like many fellow Scots, brought about by a low self image. Or, what else can I assume from your seeing that which isn't there, or intended.

I presented to you an objective view to the subject in question, one free of national pride, or lack of it, as either can lead to a fall (in grace).

"O wad some Pow'r the giftie gie us
To hear oorsels as others hear us
It wad frae monie a blunder free us
An' foolish notion

(Apologies to Rabbie Burns)

Sorry, but you are the one reading too much into things. I have mentioned Scotland nowhere in any of my posts and have no issue with the English (the mother is english) My objection would be the same if I was a cockney, brummie, yorkshire dales lad, geordie or any other place which would fit into your "uncultured" accent criteria.

[Midas]

"Sorry but "poor accents"? what would you define as "poor accent"? Surely its really just the dialect of that area and therefore has nothing whats so ever to do with poor etc. There is no such thing as a poor accent, there are only different dialects.

And also just because these "poor accent" footballers have "bad linguistics" in your eyes, doesnt mean they arent educated. The Dialect of an area can have an effect on peoples speach; they might sentance things differently that to the "text book" English of Posh snobs from Eton, a language that a minority of british speak."

Niamh Get a good dictionary, or thesaurus, and look up the many meanings of 'poor' and you will find the one that fits. You knew exactly what I meant, otherwise why get so uptight.

The beauty of English is that we have a wealth of words with similar meanings, and there are others I could have used. However, the one I chose was quite adequate and would be understood by most even if English is not their first language.

'Education' (which I never mentioned), per se, is not necessarily an indication of ability with the English language. Apparently Isaac Newton was a very poor speaker and it is said when he lectured before he had finished most students had disappeared.

Today, I am convinced that if we banned, under penalty of death, the word 'basically', it would wipe interviews from our Television. There would also be a dampening down of conversation generally. You don't believe? Take note next time you hear some 'celebrity' being interviewed.

Salutations

[Midas]

Kilted Exile, Irn Bru...............Who are you kidding or trying to kid. And please don't come back with you eat Mars Bars but that does not mean you are a Martian or pretending to be one.

[applepie]

[My first language isnot English and Iam studying English literature but the difficult thing which I face is the difference between American English and British English please any one help me in this topic

Wow, who would have thought that such a simple question would start some of the discussion in this post From a very analytical point the main difference between American English and British English has a lot to do with formality. I'm American and speak properly by American standards, but not as properly as someone in Britan. In fact, much that is said I can not understand because of the differences in slang and the meaning of expressive phrases just as much of what I say isn't easily understood because of the words I use. Much of this difference is likely due to the fact that so many different groups have moved into the U.S. If you just consider my heritage, I'm German/Irish/Scottish/British/Dutch and maybe a couple others I can't remember (in short I'm a mutt). With the wealth of immigrants the language has been altered to incorporate phrases, words, and spellings from these groups. Also, the country was not founded by people who could be considered the highest crust of society and didn't speak the language as properly as the aristocracy and people in more elevated professions. Thus you find American English. I can't say if one is better than the other, but you will likely find some distinct similarities and differences between the two as you further your studies even though they are both considered English. I wish you luck in your studies

[Derringer]

Hi rony. Hmmm.. Up in Canada we speak "British" English. The main difference is a 'u' in words such as colour, honour, ect. . Also we usually use 're' instead of 'er' in some words such as centre. That may be a French thing though. In general the differences lie in the accents, which make translation difficult.

I think that if you are attempting a study on linguistics, then you should rather focus on specific dialects. Language changes so much from specific place to place that there can be many differences in language. A good example is Canada- so large, so beautiful- that words can be used in the East for a signifier that have a different meaning in the West. What I would do is compare to specific places -- maybe New Orleans and London-, find literature and then proceed studying. Good luck.

[kilted exile]

Kilted Exile, Irn Bru...............Who are you kidding or trying to kid. And please don't come back with you eat Mars Bars but that does not mean you are a Martian or pretending to be one.

Man, you really are stereotyping. What does me having a picture of Scotland's other national drink have to do with anything? You are honestly trying to psycho-analyse me and my thoughts because of what I have as my avatar? I had the grinch as the avatar for a while, does that mean I'm obsessed with Boris Karloff? Straws and clutching come to mind.....

[Bii]

Actually 'colour' and 'color' are pronounced (or 'said') the same. It's only the spelling which is different which is largely down to the French influence on the English language (the 'u' is a clear French influence).

Essentially the English language belongs to England, albeit that regionally, both within UK and USA, and Ireland, Australia, New Zealand, Canada it is spoken differently. Note there is only one nation other than 'England' who attempts to claim ownership of the language, whereas it is spoken in many parts of the world. Is there an 'Australian English' dictionary, I wonder?

Perhaps all the Brits you have met hail from the sunny South and the majority of people in UK don't speak with a 'posh' accent. Watch Wallace & Gromit if you want an idea of how different Brits speak - if you can understand it that is!!!

[Midas]

To me, the most wonderful part of the EU is that it has brought many nations 'together' in a sort of 'brotherhood' and shared objectives. These nations have had a long warring history between each other.

However, there is no indication, and reason, why any will, or should, give up their language, or their particular 'shade' of culture, including national dress, if they have one.

In Canada, the French Canadians never had to give up their language or traditions. In the UK itself in tiny Wales, there are place name written in Welsh, there are Welsh TV programmes, and there are areas where Welsh is spoken on a daily basis.

Many Dutch generally have had a good command of English for centuries. Though I have found that some do not readily admit to it when asked because they feel that they do not speak it perfect enough for their standards which, in language, are high.

Individuality, culture, and language are personal, and social, preserves. I would not want this to disappear, it brings colour to our world.

However, for understanding, and appreciation, of each other, good communication is absolutely necessary - lack of it brings suspicion, mistrust, and insecurity.

Gradually, since WW2 much to the chagrin of the French who are so proud of their language, and their importance in the world and cultural superiority over their long old past adversaries - the English, the English language, has become the accepted, though unofficial, 'international language. This is mainly because of the powerful influence and economic dominance of the United States. Plus, of course, the reach of the old, far flung, British Empire.

I do not decry the French for their attitude, which is breaking down among the young. I enjoy my visits to that wonderful country, and its people, especially when travelliing on the super fast, smooth, Eurostar direct from London to the heart of Paris. I understand how they see things, and take pride in their culture.

It is said that the most widely spoken language on a daily basis is Chinese. Though I have not seen any reliable statistics on this. I also read that there are more people learning English in China, than have English as their national language.

Slowly, I am getting to the point, so bear with me.

There can be resistance by many to learning a 'foreign' language. This, to me, is understandable for a number of reasons. Yet, today more than ever as the world 'shrinks' and we are travelling more, and integrating more, there is need for a common language. Many foreigners, some who speak more than two languages, tell me that they have found English the easiest to learn. Be that as it may, it is becoming more widespread and accepted throughout the world.

Maybe, therefore, it is time to formerly declare it the international language. Wait for it, don't get too ruffled until I explain.

Here is my suggestion: The name be changed to 'Interlang'. It would have its own dictionary. There would be an international body to monitor and guide the language such as adding new words, or adopting words, or
adapted words as in 'franglais' from other languages as interlang develops.

The grammar basis, and spellings, would be on current English - whether British or American doesn't matter to me. Eventually, it will be none 'foreign' nationalistic - the feeling it is something 'English' will disappear
under its new name.

Nations will teach both their own traditional language as at present, but it will be automatic to teach 'Interlang' as a second 'national language'. Everyone will be bilingual. Both Interlang and English will still have to be taught in the UK , USA and the other 'English' speaking countries, as interlang could possibly develop outside the parameters set by the current English language rules.

This would then make the international language truly international, besides it being national through having
the stigma of 'foreign' removed.

Just an idea. Any comments welcome, but keep them objective, and dampen any nationalistic, emotional, stirrings please. We are trying to bring the world together, not hack each other to pieces.

As Burns said: ' For a' that, and a' that, it's coming yet for a' that, that man to man, the wide world oe'r shall brothers be for a' that.' (I am sure he included 'sisters'.)

[Scheherazade]

Wow, who would have thought that such a simple question would start some of the discussion in this post

Lit-Net Forum discussions never fail to surprise us!

Any more inflammatory comments addressed to other members personally or their national backgrounds, this thread will be closed.

[PeterL]

Maybe, therefore, it is time to formerly declare it the international language. Wait for it, don't get too ruffled until I explain.

Here is my suggestion: The name be changed to 'Interlang'. It would have its own dictionary. There would be an international body to monitor and guide the language such as adding new words, or adopting words, or
adapted words as in 'franglais' from other languages as interlang develops.

The grammar basis, and spellings, would be on current English - whether British or American doesn't matter to me. Eventually, it will be none 'foreign' nationalistic - the feeling it is something 'English' will disappear
under its new name.

That's a worse idea than Esperanto. English has readily accepted words from other languages for several centuries, and since WWII has been used by more and more people in non-English speaking countries, but formalizing it as an international language would eliminate the advantages that it has. English became an international language, because it was the language of powerful and wealthy countries. When France was a wealthy and powerful country, French was used as an international language. Your Interlang will be popular around the world when the Interlangese have taken over a few countries and become involved in half of the world's commerce, some advances in science would also help. English, as the international language, is messy enough, but trying to formalize the arrangement would be much messier. Let's let the many versions of English be used as people wish, until another language overtakes it around the world.

[Turk]

That's very silly idea. Why would we accept English as an international language? Just because it's widely spoken today? If there should be an international language it should be most logical and mathematical language. Research a little about computer comparisons of languages and ask linguistics; which language has most logical grammar structure; here's a hint; it starts with Turk ends with -ish.

Today English spoken widely but just 100 years ago French was widely spoken. It's called "lingua franca". And "lingua franca" changes. In past it was Latin. Today it's widely spoken just because imperialism of Britain in past and more than that; power of USA (btw; democracy! We controlled all North Africa, Mid-East, and East Europe for over 300 years but never forced people to forget their languages and religion).

[Nossa]

I don't think we should get into a debate about whose language is more 'logical'..every language has a logical grammar structure in its own..I don't even understand what's meant by logical grammar structure..I know that Arabic for instance has logica grammar structure..and I love Arabic more than any lang. in the world, including English...but that doesn't mean that I won't accept English as an International lang. and the fact that I accept English this way, doesn't mean that I'll forget my native lang. It doens't make sense. We're arguing about something that's been going on for hundreds of years, had it been Turkish, Arabic, French or German, we would have been right here discussing the same thing and saying why should we accept whatever lang. as the International lang.
We don't accept English as an International lang. just cuz it's wide spoken, we accept it cuz this is how it's been for a long time. And it IS due to other reasons, not just the lang. Political, economic and power reason. It's not a coincedence that English has been the number one lang. in the world in the time of the English Empire (the most powerful country in the world) and now it's the number one lang. in the world in the time of the US (the most powerful country in the world).
Do I wish that my lang. was the one wide spoken in the world? hell yeah, but that's not gonna happen any time soon. So, and for many reasons, we accpet English as a lang. we don't accept English as an identity. And there's a huge difference.

[Turk]

Linguistics tells an Arabic child can't talk his own language perfectly until age of 10-11.

And of course every language has it's own logic. But i said "mathematically". Few years ago IBM made a research about it, and Turkish was the best language for computers because of it's perfect logic.

[Nossa]

Linguistics tells an Arabic child can't talk his own language perfectly until age of 10-11.

And of course every language has it's own logic. But i said "mathematically". Few years ago IBM made a research about it, and Turkish was the best language for computers because of it's perfect logic.

Arabic is a difficult language, and many adults can't speak it correctly, and they make a lot of grammatical mistakes, which is ashame.
But this is a new info. for me, that Turkish was found to be the best languages for computers..I guess I'm gonna have to download it on my language bar now...even though I don't know a word in Turkish
But I got your point now..