My mother is a fish.
I'm 17 too, turned last April. I've read As I Lay Dying and I'd like to go for a few others, but I've got a ton of books on my list to read as it is.
My mother is a fish.
I'm 17 too, turned last April. I've read As I Lay Dying and I'd like to go for a few others, but I've got a ton of books on my list to read as it is.
"In the sunset of dissolution, everything is illuminated by the aura of nostalgia, even the guillotine."
- Milan Kundera, The Unbearable Lightness of Being
Originally Posted by Ryduce
Oh, this is turning into Faulkner Readers Anonymus! I will join too!
Hey, I am Scher and I am 57. I have read As I Lay Dying and The Sound and the Fury and I would like to read more!
~
"It is not that I am mad; it is only that my head is different from yours.”
~
What's the deal? Caddie and Quentin, Darl and Dewey Dell, what do you think William Faulkner's intentions were in portraying characters with this inclination? Is there some biographical information I'm missing out on?
and somehow a dog
has taken itself & its tail considerably away
into the mountains or sea or sky, leaving
behind: me, wag.
- John Berryman
Faulkner's men are fairly well beyond mystified when it comes to females. Because Faulkner often potrays women as "earth mother" figures - that which is connected to fertility and - ultimately - the mystery of creation - they become almost mystical beings to men. In Quentin and Caddy's case, it is Quentin's unability to deal with his sister's sexual initiation; he cannot bear to think of his sister with "that knowledge" - the same knowledge that makes Benjy freak out because Caddy no longer (after her deflowering) "smelt like trees." Faulkner portrays his young female charaters in such a way that their loss of virginity changes them in some intangible way - at least in terms of how the men closest to them see them. It is Caddy's sexual awakening that draws Quentin more than an actual sexual attraction; the same is true of Dewey Dell and Darl: he's not sexually attracted to her so much as he is drawn to the idea that his sister (an asexual being as sisters are to brothers) has become a sexual being (she's now pregnant).
Other more skilled critics have discussed this, but I don't have my notes in front of me. I think a large part of this idea comes from the identity males derive from the females in their lives - and the change from virgin to sexual being disorients these brothers (whose brotherly instincts may be to protect virginal sister from "violation" from another man - a sort of "invasion" of territory that the brother may feel protective of).
"I believe in Christianity as I believe that the sun has risen, not only because I see it, but because by it I see everything else." - C.S. Lewis
great post redzeppelin, it was a lovely read
Doc awakened very slowly and clumsily like a fat man getting out of a swimming pool. - John Steinbeck
Thank you - I feel a little bad, because I really wanted to give a more "solid" response, because I did a lot of research on Faulkner in grad school, but I still can't find my notes because I'm sure I have something scribbled down somewhere about the incest theme in his work.
But thanks again.
PS - oh, and re-reading my post reminds me that female characters in Southern literature tend to be metaphors for "the South" - which plays into a whole "post-Civil War" thing that deals with the Northern violation of the south (isn't Dalton Ames - the guy who seduces Caddy, a "northerner"?)
Last edited by Redzeppelin; 01-09-2007 at 11:58 PM. Reason: minor epiphany
"I believe in Christianity as I believe that the sun has risen, not only because I see it, but because by it I see everything else." - C.S. Lewis
I was just going to say that
The whole southern context is, I think, quite important to understanding Faulkner's "infatuation" with incest. Recall that marriage within a very small circle was rather common in the class of the Southern plantation gentility, the original class to which the Compsons belonged. Ashley and Melanie in Gone with the Wind, if I recall correctly, were first cousins. Hand in hand with this phenomenon is also the obsession with the purity of blood lines. If you really believe your bloodline is the purest, the only way you can keep it untainted is by, urg, incest. I am by no means contending that this is a rigorous or even valid argument. Personally, however, this has helped me to at least speculate on the frequency of incest in Faulkner's works, without resorting to concluding that this dude must have had some serious Oedipal issues.
On a side note, I am by no means well-versed in the Bible, but isn't incest also very prevalent in the Old Testament? Greek mythology is also full of it (think the Olympians, Oedipus, Antigone, and Electra). then Faulkner may also be using incest as an echo of ancient Greek and Hebrew texts as a part of his plan to construct a mythology, or Bible, of the Old South. Absalom, Absalom! certainly has a very biblical feel to me, not the least because of the Henry-Judith-Bon triangle. (Which just reminded me: Henry and Charles Bon are both named after English kings, and European royalty are known for their intermarriages.) This certainly points to incest as something other than an idiosyncracy, but a pattern of behaviour persisting through history with an almost mysterious, quasi-religious aura.
John Irwin, a Faulkner scholar, has written a book, Doubling and Incest/Repetition and Revenge, on the incest motif in The Sound and the Fury and Absalom, Absalom!. I skimmed it for my term paper last year and it certainly contained some very interesting points. I'll probably read the book in detail when I have some time in the summer.
Last edited by omegaxx; 01-10-2007 at 12:29 AM.
Well said - I forgot about the biblical parallels - Faulkner's big on that (esp. in Absalom - where incest is a huge theme). Irwin is a great critic - his books are excellent.
"I believe in Christianity as I believe that the sun has risen, not only because I see it, but because by it I see everything else." - C.S. Lewis
incest is to the aristocracy as adultery is to the bourgeoisie, i've heard it said though from where or from whom i fail to recall. though dirt poor in terms of per capita income, the inhabitants of yoknapataphaw (?) county are not without a strain of aristocratic pride, the foremost among them being, if my memory serves me correct, colonel sartoris.
Hi, I'm looking for a first Faulkner book to take from the library. I started to get interested in American literature after reading Salinger's Catcher in the Rye, which literally changed my life (or, at least ME, to be more accurate). I also got interested in American music from the first half of the 20's century. (folk, acoustic blues, ragtime...) I'm also reading now "The Great Gatsby", which was mentioned in The Catcher. Oh and, to be clear, I'm not American : P
Anyway, I have read that Faulkner is a good, renowned writer of American literature, as well as is Steinbeck - but I heard that Faulkner is more "hardcore" (if that makes any sense), and I want something more "hardcore".
So what can you suggest?
Last edited by LemonBoy; 04-06-2007 at 02:08 PM.
Faulkner is fabulous; so many good novels to choose from. But if you want something, hardcore, as you put it, you should go with "The Sound and the Fury".
Whoops, you got me a little wrong.. I guess I wasn't clear enough. I was saying that I've chosen Faulkner because I wanted something more hardcore, but as for a book by him I want something more "introductory" - meaning a book that will make it easy for me to get into Faulkner.
Oh, I see. An easier Faulkner book would probably be "Light in August".
You will probably find Faulkner's short stories more accessible than any of his novels. "A Rose for Emily" and "That Evening Sun" are two good ones which you can find here and here. This version of "That Evening Sun" is a little different from the version in Collected Stories; this version is how it originally appeared in American Mercury.
Last edited by Basil; 04-06-2007 at 03:47 PM.
I agree with Basil, some of the short stories might be a better way to start. If you insist on a novel I would go with As I Lay Dying. I would also use a cliff notes or spark notes or something like that to help you with the plot shifts. But he's the greatest novelist.
LET THERE BE LIGHT
"Love follows knowledge." – St. Catherine of Siena
My literature blog: http://ashesfromburntroses.blogspot.com/
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