What is your favorite quote? And why?

[Bleeding Pawn]

Is the word "gay" being used here as an alternative for Sodomists or for Les**ns ?and does the act of sodomy cease to persist if they are in a consensual relationship?
I`ve noticed that the "natural" rights of sodomists are very much highlighted, especially during the election season and the politicians are more determined to prioritise their union as God given authority of free will not as God forbidden act. The same goes with the Femen or PETA organisations.

[The Atheist]

Is the word "gay" being used here as an alternative for Sodomists or for Les**ns ?and does the act of sodomy cease to persist if they are in a consensual relationship?

Ask some religious men. Married to women kind of men, that is, since "sodomy" is specifically an act not just between two men, and most couples practice things that can be described as sodomy.

Funnily enough, there is no christian, biblical-based objection to lesbians and lesbianism. Given that the god-chappie is said to be omnipresent, does that mean female couples are ok?

I`ve noticed that the "natural" rights of sodomists are very much highlighted, especially during the election season and the politicians are more determined to prioritise their union as God given authority of free will not as God forbidden act. The same goes with the Femen or PETA organisations.

Can you provide an example of gay rights advocates claiming a god-given authority? Or PETA, for that matter?

I'm interested in your focusing on sodomy - do you have a personal problem you're trying to avoid?

Gay relationships and marriage are about love, not sex.

[Ecurb]

Gay relationships and marriage are about love, not sex.

Well, if "gay" is used as a synonym for "homosexual" this seems clearly incorrect. ("Homosexual" certainly refers to sex, not love.) Personally, I think "same sex marriage" is the more appropriate term. There are opposite sex marriages in which (if we can believe "Dear Abby" letters) there is very little sex involved, and (probably) same sex marriages about which the same is true. I sort of like the now quaint and old fashioned euphemisms such as "long time companion" and "great and good friend", which can be used equally for same sex and opposite sex members of unmarried couples. (As a matter of literary form, I don't like "partner", which suggests that the relationship is based on money and business.)

[The Atheist]

Well, if "gay" is used as a synonym for "homosexual" this seems clearly incorrect.

I don't, so this is a better way of describing it to avoid confusion:

Personally, I think "same sex marriage" is the more appropriate term.

(As a matter of literary form, I don't like "partner", which suggests that the relationship is based on money and business.)

Agree entirely, and it bugs the hell out of me that it's been co-opted by non-married couples. I have had several business partners and every time I refer to "my partner", I'm then required to explain that it's a business partner, as opposed to my wife.

Worst of all, the tendency for 18 year-olds who have been dating for two weeks to refer to each other as their "partner" that I hear all the time.

[Bleeding Pawn]

Ask some religious men. Married to women kind of men, that is, since "sodomy" is specifically an act not just between two men, and most couples practice things that can be described as sodomy.

Given that the god-chappie is said to be omnipresent, does that mean female couples are ok?

The act of sodomy I was refering to here was the act between the union of homosexuals.

All Abrahamic faith denounces the act of homose*uality.

Genesis 18: 8 quotes Bible

“Behold now, I have two daughters which have not known man; let me, I pray you, bring them out unto you, and do ye to them as is good in your eyes: only unto these men do nothing; for therefore came they under the shadow of my roof.

And in the Koran

026.165 Y: "Of all the creatures in the world, will ye approach males,"
P: What! Of all creatures do ye come unto the males,
S: What! do you come to the males from among the creatures
026.166 Y: "And leave those whom Allah has created for you to be your mates? Nay, ye are a people transgressing (all limits)!"
P: And leave the wives your Lord created for you? Nay, but ye are froward folk.
S: And leave what your Lord has created for you of your wives? Nay, you are a people exceeding limits.

These verses clearly contradicts homose*uality preferring heterose*uality as the natural way.

Funnily enough, there is no christian, biblical-based objection to lesbians and lesbianism.

What?!!! Are you trying to emphasize that Bible and all its stories are representatives of moral values of humanity? Does that mean whatever is not mentioned Bible or to which it holds no objection, is tolerable ? So if we go by this criteria then whatever is in Bible is also acceptable?
There are way many graver acts besides homos**uality,mentioned in it and if we go by the standard you put forth then incestuous relations will be the norm today.
Would a sane man or for that matter, any human being indulge in this heinous crime?

Can you provide an example of gay rights advocates claiming a god-given authority? Or PETA, for that matter?

It says God given authority of free will, not a free roller-coaster in the name of authority.

I'm interested in your focusing on sodomy - do you have a personal problem you're trying to avoid?

If we show some concern about a certain social issue, how can it be deemed personal? If we as relevant citizens of a responsible society stand up against a serious crime like rape and vouch for severe punishment for the culprit as an act of justice for the victim, does that mean that we have a personal issue with the act of rape and the rapist?
We do not necessarily have to go through a tragedy to comprehend the side-effects of a certain negative element of our society and the humanity in general.

Gay relationships and marriage are about love, not sex.

Were you saying this out of personal experience? It is all about love and everybody loves to do what they love. How can you be sure that all homose*uals just desire mutual affection and not enjoyment of ones flesh? Does not the love one has for their spouse transgresses beyond the emotional attachment?

[The Atheist]

The act of sodomy I was refering to here was the act between the union of homosexuals.

So sodomy is ok between couples? Pleased to hear that. Once the churches that are still anti-gay see the date, there's some chance they will realise that there isn't a valid reason to oppose homosexuality.

All Abrahamic faith denounces the act of homose*uality.

Genesis 18: 8 quotes Bible

Fail.

The passage is saying the girls should sleep with the men of their father's choice, not the other ones. It makes no comment on lesbians at all. Maybe you should re-read it in context.

Using the bible as evidence in this way means that incest is clearly ok, then. If you read on just a little - Genesis 19:30-36 - then it's clearly ok to have sex with your daughters.

And in the Koran

I didn't mention the koran, but you're right, it does prohibit lesbianism. The koran also says:

And slay them wherever ye catch them, and turn them out from where they have Turned you out; for tumult and oppression are worse than slaughter; but fight them not at the Sacred Mosque, unless they (first) fight you there; but if they fight you, slay them. Such is the reward of those who suppress faith.

Since the koran is infallible, that means it's ok to kill atheists. This is why I don't consider the koran as a serious basis for any kind of morality. As I'm sure you know, that passage is not the only one.

What?!!! Are you trying to emphasize that Bible and all its stories are representatives of moral values of humanity?

Nope; I was just pointing out that the bible doesn't mention lesbianism.

It says God given authority of free will, not a free roller-coaster in the name of authority.

This is pretty simple - either the god gives free will or it does not. I do realise that having a dollar each way has long been a religious prerogative.

If we show some concern about a certain social issue, how can it be deemed personal?

How on earth is it a social issue? They aren't making gayness compulsory. Do you object to people masturbating in their homes? Both the bible and koran prohibit that.

If we as relevant citizens of a responsible society stand up against a serious crime like rape and vouch for severe punishment for the culprit as an act of justice for the victim, does that mean that we have a personal issue with the act of rape and the rapist?

I'm glad you typed that, because it is the crux of the issue. Rape and murder involve innocent victims, and are therefore very much society's problem. Homosexual sex is consensual and has no victim.

I am interested that you are trying to equate murder & rape to homosexuality, though.

We do not necessarily have to go through a tragedy to comprehend the side-effects of a certain negative element of our society and the humanity in general.

Given that statement, here's a very simple question for you:

In what way is homosexuality negative for society?

I've racked my brains trying to think of one rational way it could be a societal issue, but I can't find one. Homosexuality isn't infectious, so seeing and being around gay & lesbian couples won't cause mass outbreaks of gayness.

Were you saying this out of personal experience? It is all about love and everybody loves to do what they love. How can you be sure that all homose*uals just desire mutual affection and not enjoyment of ones flesh? Does not the love one has for their spouse transgresses beyond the emotional attachment?

Crikey, you are out of touch with reality. Gays don't need to marry to get sex: there's even a smartphone app to find sexual partners at short notice. The very fact that some of them are choosing to turn away from the promiscuous lifestyle to marriage is pretty much self-evidence that they're doing it for love.

As it happens, I'm married to a woman and have several children.

[cafolini]

Saddam Hussain will not be permitted to annex Kuwait. This is nor a threat. This is the way it's going to be. Our cause is just. Our cause is moral. Our cause is right. ~ President Bush.

[Inky]

I love the whole poem of Invictus, but the last lines really hit home.

"It matters not how strait the gate,
How charged with punishments the scroll,
I am the master of my fate:
I am the captain of my soul."

Another that comes to mind -

“Two men look out through the same bars: One sees the mud and one the stars.”

Frederick Langbridge

[cafolini]

All that really belongs to us is time; even he who has nothing else has that. ~ Balthasar Gracian

[Bleeding Pawn]

So sodomy is ok between couples?

In what way is homosexuality negative for society?

Sodomy is sodomy whether it involves women or man, though there are some precautions and health concerns that you need to be aware of and take into mind certain medical considerations regarding this activity.

Fail.

The passage is saying the girls should sleep with the men of their father's choice, not the other ones. It makes no comment on lesbians at all. Maybe you should re-read it in context.

Wong.
If you go through the conversations prior to this verse, between the townsfolk and Prophet Lot, we will know that he was in fact subjected to pleading the townsfolk to spare his guests (males) and their modesty, lest they be defiled. As an alternative to their desires for males, he suggested to fulfill their carnal pleasures with females, in turn literally offering his daughters (females).

Using the bible as evidence in this way means that incest is clearly ok, then.

Did not I mention this in my earlier post? or maybe you had missed it by chance.

If you read on just a little - Genesis 19:30-36 - then it's clearly ok to have sex with your daughters.

There is more, if you go down a little further you will find in Genesis 38:11-30, a chain of events unfolding which starts with seduction followed my incest and the end result being, pure bastardy.

I didn't mention the koran, but you're right, it does prohibit lesbianism.

Koran prohibits lesbianism!! Pray do point it out to me where exactly in The Koran it forbids lesbianism.

And slay them wherever ye catch them, and turn them out from where they have Turned you out; for tumult and oppression are worse than slaughter; but fight them not at the Sacred Mosque, unless they (first) fight you there; but if they fight you, slay them. Such is the reward of those who suppress faith.

Since the koran is infallible, that means it's ok to kill atheists.

Really?!!! Atheists?!!! Where is it mentioned atheists? or Do I have to read between the lines to really grasp the true hidden meaning of this quote.
As far as history concerns, there were no atheists in Pre-Islamic Arab region nor in the 7th century when Islam was propagated through out the Arab world as a religion. Rather it was the opposite, since the pagan arabs concept of God was similar to the Greek Mythological Gods, worshiping different gods for different purposes on alternative days.
It seems you are confused to whom them is referred to in this verse and when googling it and going through the earlier threads in the religious section of Lit-Net, it is more probable that you have quoted this verse out of context.

Nope; I was just pointing out that the bible doesn't mention lesbianism.

and here I was thinking that lesbians were categorised as homos**uals but the way you put it, it seems they are a whole new creed altogether. Are you confused or you do not want to accept them as Homos?

This is pretty simple - either the god gives free will or it does not. I do realise that having a dollar each way has long been a religious prerogative.

I was expecting you to raise up this issue, sooner or later.It is evident in the earlier thread/posts in the Religious Texts of Lit-Net that whenever someone`s comments were even remotely related to free-will, destiny, predestination, somehow the ineffectiveness of God as an omnipresent Being was dragged into the issue ending with the confusion related to the existence of God. Enough has been said/discussed regarding this topic that it has become a pretty hackneyed subject, which even though is interesting but has nothing new to offer to prolong this discussion nor have i got to add anything new to it.

Do you object to people masturbating in their homes? Both the bible and koran prohibit that.

Wonders of wonders. We knew that the Bible has contents relating to rape, murder, incest and beastialities but never ever have its biggest detractors, after thousands of years, gone on record to claim the masturbation thing. . Do you have any evidence to back-up this claim of Koran and Bible prohibitng masturbation?

I've racked my brains trying to think of one rational way it could be a societal issue, but I can't find one. Homosexuality isn't infectious, so seeing and being around gay & lesbian couples won't cause mass outbreaks of gayness.

It isn`t contagious maybe because, as they claim, they practice it safe but then we can`t be sure, after reading the report, for whole of this creed to practice it religiously

Crikey, you are out of touch with reality. Gays don't need to marry to get sex: there's even a smartphone app to find sexual partners at short notice. The very fact that some of them are choosing to turn away from the promiscuous lifestyle to marriage is pretty much self-evidence that they're doing it for love.

It seems puzzling to why they go to great lengths to legalise their unholy union. Isn`t the salvation thing their only motive behind all their efforts for equal marriage rights?

As it happens, I'm married to a woman and have several children.

I did not ask you to clarify about your personal life or maybe you mistook my query about your personal experience, in fact I was amused by your firm belief that g*y relationships revolved around love. How can you be sure about that? Do have anyone in your circle who practice it

I'm glad you typed that, because it is the crux of the issue. Rape and murder involve innocent victims, and are therefore very much society's problem. Homosexual sex is consensual and has no victim.

I am interested that you are trying to equate murder & rape to homosexuality, though.

It may not be magnanimous in its seriousness as/when compared to rape but then when has quantity got something to do with such sensitive issues.
Many religious persons claim that they are provoking the wrath of God and the day is not far when the history of Sodom and Gomorrah is repeated ( though it seems absurd to me to think of like that happening today). Another group, a tax-paying-conscious-group,thinks that since homos**uals patients are being taken care of by the public healthcare, their treatment is a burden on the society.

Homos**uality, its magnanimity notwithstanding, is still an issue and if the above given report`s findings is based on truth then this issue should be dealt with with utmost care. Would not it be humane enough to detoxify the society, not from their existence but from the psychological ailments they are suffering from.

[cafolini]

All that really belongs to us is time; even he who has nothing else has that. ~ Balthasar Gracian

[The Atheist]

Sodomy is sodomy whether it involves women or man, though there are some precautions and health concerns that you need to be aware of and take into mind certain medical considerations regarding this activity.

It's a shame the homophobe who wrote that didn't count the statistics from Africa, where AIDS is a primarily heterosexual disease, with millions more sufferers than USA.

If you go through the conversations prior to this verse, between the townsfolk and Prophet Lot, we will know that he was in fact subjected to pleading the townsfolk to spare his guests (males) and their modesty, lest they be defiled. As an alternative to their desires for males, he suggested to fulfill their carnal pleasures with females, in turn literally offering his daughters (females).

Yeah, he was offering his daughters to MEN. You need to read that bit again.

There is more, if you go down a little further you will find in Genesis 38:11-30, a chain of events unfolding which starts with seduction followed my incest and the end result being, pure bastardy.

Does not forbid it, however, plus the rather obvious fact that if the god only created Adam & Eve, the siblings were having sex to populate the planet.

Koran prohibits lesbianism!! Pray do point it out to me where exactly in The Koran it forbids lesbianism.

This is getting a bit strange, because it was you that said the koran prohibited it!

Are you now saying it does not prohibit lesbianism?

Really?!!! Atheists?!!! Where is it mentioned atheists? or Do I have to read between the lines to really grasp the true hidden meaning of this quote.
As far as history concerns, there were no atheists in Pre-Islamic Arab region nor in the 7th century when Islam was propagated through out the Arab world as a religion. Rather it was the opposite, since the pagan arabs concept of God was similar to the Greek Mythological Gods, worshiping different gods for different purposes on alternative days.
It seems you are confused to whom them is referred to in this verse and when googling it and going through the earlier threads in the religious section of Lit-Net, it is more probable that you have quoted this verse out of context.

The context is pretty straightforward: "such is the reward of those who suppress faith". Who it referred to originally is irrelevant, and it's made even more obvious by Saudi Arabia and many other islamic-ruled countries where atheism is punishable by law - by death in Iran.

You realise you're arguing against islamic religious scholars?

and here I was thinking that lesbians were categorised as homos**uals but the way you put it, it seems they are a whole new creed altogether. Are you confused or you do not want to accept them as Homos?

Technically, they are homosexuals, but the word has evolved to mainly refer to gays rather than lesbians. I don't care how they are categorised.

Wonders of wonders. We knew that the Bible has contents relating to rape, murder, incest and beastialities but never ever have its biggest detractors, after thousands of years, gone on record to claim the masturbation thing. . Do you have any evidence to back-up this claim of Koran and Bible prohibitng masturbation?

Koran: 23:5-7 is again recognised by most islamic scholars as anti-masturbation. “And who guard their private parts, Except before their wifes or those whom their right hands possess, for they surely are not blameable, But whoever seeks to go beyond that, these are they that exceed the limits”

Hey, I'm no expert on the koran and islam, so if masturbation isn't banned by the book and the scholars, let me know.

In the bible, the story of Onan is considered by many churches as a prohibition against masturbation. I actually that is incorrect, but who is an atheist to argue against churches. Again, if masturbation is not seen as sinful by churches, please let me know.

It isn`t contagious maybe because, as they claim, they practice it safe but then we can`t be sure, after reading the report, for whole of this creed to practice it religiously

I was referring to the homosexuality being contagious.

It seems puzzling to why they go to great lengths to legalise their unholy union. Isn`t the salvation thing their only motive behind all their efforts for equal marriage rights?

It has absolutely nothing to do with salvation, and everything to do with equality. Denying them marriage is reinforcing their incorrect status as second-class citizens.

I did not ask you to clarify about your personal life or maybe you mistook my query about your personal experience, in fact I was amused by your firm belief that g*y relationships revolved around love. How can you be sure about that? Do have anyone in your circle who practice it

Given the number of heterosexual relationships where the male controls the female, or the relationship is dysfunctional for other reasons, I have no reason to doubt love as the basis for homosexual couples to publicly state their desire for a long-term relationship.

I know a great deal of gay men and lesbian women. Some of them are after love, some are after sex - just like everyone else.

Would not it be humane enough to detoxify the society, not from their existence but from the psychological ailments they are suffering from.

Alas, neither psychologists nor the wider medical community see homosexuality as an illness.

[Darcy88]

It seems puzzling to why they go to great lengths to legalise their unholy union. Isn`t the salvation thing their only motive behind all their efforts for equal marriage rights?


I did not ask you to clarify about your personal life or maybe you mistook my query about your personal experience, in fact I was amused by your firm belief that g*y relationships revolved around love. How can you be sure about that? Do have anyone in your circle who practice it


It may not be magnanimous in its seriousness as/when compared to rape but then when has quantity got something to do with such sensitive issues.
Many religious persons claim that they are provoking the wrath of God and the day is not far when the history of Sodom and Gomorrah is repeated ( though it seems absurd to me to think of like that happening today). Another group, a tax-paying-conscious-group,thinks that since homos**uals patients are being taken care of by the public healthcare, their treatment is a burden on the society.

Homos**uality, its magnanimity notwithstanding, is still an issue and if the above given report`s findings is based on truth then this issue should be dealt with with utmost care. Would not it be humane enough to detoxify the society, not from their existence but from the psychological ailments they are suffering from.

Gay relationships are as much about love as heterosexual ones are. This is a simple fact. If there is any doubt of this in your mind then you need to go interact with some gay people.

That Family Research Council link is so homophobic and bogus I wish I could regurgitate it from my brain. Gays don't suffer from "psychological ailments" anymore than heterosexuals do. Its ironic that anyone would characterize love as a "psychological ailment," ignoring the true ailment here, which is the hatred such people have for people who love certain people.

[Scheherazade]

~

~ R e m i n d e r ~

The aim of this thread is to share your favourite quotes with your fellow Forum members.

If there are other issues you would like to discuss,

please do so in separate threads.

Off-topic posts will be removed without further notice.

~

[Nathanial]

Ask the learned, speak with the wise, and associate with the poor.
slow and steady wins the race.
The good of this world and the world to come is with knowledge.
The destruction of man lies in three (things): his stomach, his lusts, and his tongue.