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Originally Posted by
Quark
Thanks for the visuals Janine. The train station would look quite similar in the story as it does in that picture. This story was written only fourteen years before the turn of the century, so not much would have changed. Those other items were pretty standard Russian appliances in the day. It's interesting to actually get a look at them, thanks.
Quark, glad you liked them. I thought the station photos were quite interesting. I hope everyone enjoys them. I liked the objects, since I have read of such in the stories and also other novels, but didn't have a clear idea of just what they looked like - such as the samovars. I think those are quite unique and I also liked the odd looking key.
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Now, you say of Podtygin,
The conclusion of the story leads us to believe that he started off much like how he ended in this episode. He isn't necessarily lazy. He's just disenchanted with work since it doesn't help him in any way. The action of the story represents one cycle in what we're led to believe is a continuous loop for him. He begins with a resolution that eventually fails and he ends in cynicism and drink.
Well, disenchantment in the world can breed a sort of laziness or lack of incentive - sort of a 'why even try?' attitude or as we spoke of before in "Misery" a sort of inertia. I would imagine up until this story begins, this is the attitude that Podtyogan has adopted in his daily life. Yes, this story does represent one cycle of in his life - just one day, isn't it? I read last night in a general commentary book about Chekhov, that he liked to simply portray a slice of life and show the reader one little series of events in a person's life or a few individual lives. Also, by doing so he is showing us that this is not the way to live. When he shows the meaness of characters such as are apparent in "Misery" again he is showing us this is wrong; as we read we do feel an outrage for those insensitive characters. In reality I was surprised to find that Chekhov, himself, was actually not a pessimist but very much an optimist. I found this quite interesting, but I am familiar with this device in writing of such sad affairs. Dickens did the same and so did other authors in order to impart the idea that life could indeed be changed and better, if one moved away from their dire situations. This is hard to explain and I think I am doing a poor job here of bringing this idea across. I think by pointing out this attitude that poor Podtyagon is hemmed into one can see there might be other alternatives or one should not live this way. It is not a hopeless story, in other words; maybe so for the character, but not for the reader.
I also, read that this story is a kind of comedy and I guess today we might label it a dark or black comedy of sorts. The beginning and the end do have a comic aspect to them. I laugh now when I hear it read out loud. You have to think how funny he sounds with his way of speaking and his self proclaimed plan for reform.
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Right, immediately we notice how shaky his determination is. At the beginning this does make him suspect, but by the end of the story we realize the reason for the uncertainty. Doesn't the action of the story justify his doubts? Like I make the point above, this probably isn't the first time he's made an idiot of himself in front of train-load of people. I would not feel too confident about my chances of reforming if every time that happened to me.
Yes, his determination is shaky and displayed in his words, even the inflection in his voice, so that we are leary and questioning of his convictions, or at least I was.
How do you view the reason for his uncertainity? Do you say, that all who work with the public have this excuse, to not work hard and to drink and give up on life? I don't completely feel 'the action of the story' justifies Podtyagon's doubts or his actions. He has a choice, at one juncture of the story, to pursue the argument with the ill man, or to drop it. He chooses the confrontation. Did you ever work with the public, Quark? Sometimes the worker has to bend or give in, because the public can be quite irritating, to say the least. At times they can be downright hostile - it comes with the job and territory to stay calm and to treat the customer nicely at times, just to avoid a full-blown confrontation. I have worked in retail and I know. They used to have a slogan, 'the customer is always right'. It is sort of like 'innocent until proven quilty'. When Podtyagon pursues the argument with the customer a sort of powerplay ensues between them and the ill man uses his own condition as a sort of power device to acquire sympathy from all around him - in other words he uses this to fight off Podtyagon. Of course he is not playing fairly. So one decision to pursue the argument leads to the people in the coach criticising and condemning Podtyagon for his actions. It now seems the whole world is against him.
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I didn't notice that. It's a good observation. Both antagonist and protagonist are both prone to a drugging themselves. This makes both of them even more indistinguishable.
Well, they are actually similar in this way. Basically the story is about 2 characters - these two and there is this powerplay, as I said above, between them.
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You think that both the invalid and the ticket collector are using the misconduct of the public to justify their own shortcomings? It is possible, but probably not likely. Podtygin is persecuted by the public, after all. His lament at the end while being partially his fault is not completely his fault. And, what part is his fault wasn't done intentionally.
I don't think I said that the effect of the public on them is what makes them have shortcomings. Is that what you mean? Podtyagon must be very sensitive to let it truly bother him just what the public thinks. It is, afterall, just one day in his life. It is not a momumental moment but he sees it that way. I think because his convictions on stopping his drinking habit are so frail and shaky he is overly sensitive to this situation he finds himself in. I agree - the end is partly his fault and partly not. However he again makes the choice to give up on life, and drown his own existence in a bottle. Both he and the invalid seem to like to get numb to the world around them.
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Yeah, these words aren't said politely at all, although that doesn't mean that they were said intentionally impolitely. We commented earlier on how his first speech is spoken both enthusiastically and apprehensively. That is, that he wants to succeed but knows he cannot. This makes his initial pep-talk comic because his intentions are so divorced from reality and we can tell it just from his tone. In his demand for tickets he uses the same comic tone.
Yes, he comes off as rather abrasive and rude in his manor. At least listening to someone read (audiobook) and play out the lines, he is throwing at the public makes it seem so. He is very comical but also quite annoying and loud. Yes, it is true that he is actually divorced from reality in his new set of convictions. One knows perfectly well he will end up not sticking to the new plan.
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Podtygin says in his first speech: "HERE goes, I've done with drinking! Nothing. . . n-o-thing shall tempt me to it."
That is pretty funny, if you think about it...."n-o-thing shall tempt me to it." It only takes the space of one day to tempt him back to the old habit of drinking to drown his dissatisfaction and disappointment with the world.
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We notice that two characteristic of his early speaking are repetition and o-o-verly stre-e-ssed and elongated sounds. His demand of the passengers sounds similar. He says, "T-t-t-ickets . . . P-p-p-please!...T-t-t-tickets, please!...T-t-tickets, p-p-please!" He says it three times with elongated first sounds. He's applying that same hopelessly optimistic tone that he was using earlier.
Yes, I agree - 'hopelessly optimistic tone' - good way of putting that.
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This isn't evidence that he wants to fail.
I don't think consciously he wants to fail but then again I don't think he truly pictures himself succeeding either. His efforts to succeed are pretty minimal. What give his new resolution just one day and then give up? Hardly an effort.
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It's just showing how out of touch the ticket collector must be. Later in the exchange with the invalid he yells, "Don't shout here! This is not a tavern!" He shouts at someone to tell them to stop shouting. Clearly the ticket collector isn't totally with it here.
I don't think he is thinking logically or practically at all. As you said he shouts to someone not to shout. I know people who do that and one has to just laugh or shake one's head in dismay.
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After the first outburst of the invalid Chekhov writes, "Podtyagin considers whether to take offence or not -- and decides to take offence." Podtyagin has to decide whether he's offended or not.
Well, I talked about this fork in the road in an earlier comment. I feel that at this point Podtyagon took the wrong road if he was to remain on his path to reform. However, from the beginning his odd sort of abrasive tone of enthusiam to undertake his job is a sure sign he will fail. He kind of takes the wrong road from the time he boards the train. It just snowballs and reaches it's height when he confronts the invalid.
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Why does he have to decide how he feels? Can't he just react? No, he has to decide based on the completely unrealistic resolution he made earlier in the story, and that seems to be what's making him so out of touch. All of this gives us the image of a willing, even enthusiastic reformer who's very ideas of reform make him unconscious of what's going on around him. None of that, though, makes me think he's intentionally sabotaging himself.
I don't understand your first two questions exactly. I do think he is deciding unrealistically how to answer the invalid. He is annoyed obviously and assumes the man is cheating him not having a ticket. Perhaps the man doesn't have one, who knows. Letting one ticket go probably would not have been a huge offense for Podtyagon but now instead he will bring on himself a worse offense and situation, by opposing this ill passenger. I did not say he was intentionally sabotaging himself but that unconsciously he does not believe he will be successful in his new conviction and therefore he is not helping himself in anyway; therefore, in a sense he is unconsciously or subconsiously sabotaging his success and reform.
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Whew, I thoroughly exhausted myself with that last paragraph. I'll have to answer the rest of your post later. The only other thing I want to say right now is that I'm still not sure about next month's story. I'm getting to it. It will be one from the book I'm giving you, so don't be worried about not having it. I'm sure LitNet will have it, too.
Whew, me too...exhausted! I don't know if I can even post anymore today, in this thread. I have to go out soon and will be back later, but I want to watch a movie I bought, and send out e-cards for Easter. It all takes time. I do have some good commentary I came across last night - not on this story but general information about Chekhov and his writing of short stories and sketches. I don't think I will have the time to post those until next week, but I think you will all find it quite interesting. You know me, I like to pursue the author to some extent. Now I am curious about our young Anton Chekhov.
