D.H. Lawrence's Short Stories Thread

[Quark]

I kind of agree with both you and Janine here. It is true that piano music can be very passionate. But I also agree that the act of playing the violen is visually more passionate in appearnce than the act of playing the piano is. I think that the physcial act of playing the piano does come acorss as more cold and distant than the phycial act of playing the violen. But I also think that Pianist do have as much passion for thier music as violenist have.

I agree, but why do you suppose Lawrence has the piano at her place and the violin out in public. I would think it would be the other way around, if the violin is more passionate.

[Dark Muse]

Perhaps for the sake of the seduction of Coutts, it is when they first reunite again that she is really after him, and wants to sort of lure him away, so perhaps that is why she plays the violen in public, and in his view. But than once she had snared him and they get to her place, is when she decides to draw away from him, so perhaps that is why it is the piano that is in her place.

[Janine]

Laura was playing the piano and Winifred played a duet with her.

It's kind of hard for Winifred to carry a piano around, Quark.

!!! I am crying from laughter!

[Quark]

Perhaps for the sake of the seduction of Coutts, it is when they first reunite again that she is really after him, and wants to sort of lure him away, so perhaps that is why she plays the violen in public, and in his view. But than once she had snared him and they get to her place, is when she decides to draw away from him, so perhaps that is why it is the piano that is in her place.

That makes sense. The violin is more like the alluring attitude she adopts. The piano is her true spirit which is revealed when Coutts arrives at her home.

It's kind of hard for Winifred to carry a piano around, Quark.

I'm just saying the symbolism might make more sense if she did.

[Janine]

BUT did Lawrence really think the piano a passionless instrument? Here is one of his most well known poems:

D.H. Lawrence (1885–1930). New Poems. 1916.


Piano

SOFTLY, in the dusk, a woman is singing to me;
Taking me back down the vista of years, till I see
A child sitting under the piano, in the boom of the tingling strings
And pressing the small, poised feet of a mother who smiles as she sings.

In spite of myself, the insidious mastery of song
Betrays me back, till the heart of me weeps to belong
To the old Sunday evenings at home, with winter outside
And hymns in the cosy parlour, the tinkling piano our guide.

So now it is vain for the singer to burst into clamour
With the great black piano appassionato. The glamour
Of childish days is upon me, my manhood is cast
Down in the flood of remembrance, I weep like a child for the past.

Note the two words together "piano appassionato".

Pianos often occompany a violin - both can stand alone and be just as full of passion. Coutts carried Winifred's violin home for her. I think all of you are quibbling about trivals here, with the piano and the violin; also stretching the symbolism a bit. Naturally, she would have a piano available to accompany her on her violin. Who is to say she does not play both? Also, Coutts plays a few bars of a classical song with one hand - it's right there in the text. Maybe he played, as well and once accompanied her.

[Virgil]

Yes, there are a lot of musical allusions in this story. I like them.

Yes I pointed that out earlier. Music has a charming effect, and is either part of Wini's magic or is intended to be a analogy. I think Janine is correct in bringng up that famous "Piano" poem of Lawrence's. It was probably written around this same time as the writing of this story, early years. I think the suggeston in the poem fits the charming effect in the story.

I can't believe how much conversation you guys have had. Discussion of this story must be over 30 pages at this point. This is way more discussion than any of our previous stories.

I'm not sure if you've passed this passage yet, but I thought it was a very significant one:

He ran upstairs. The sense of freedom, of intimacy, was very fascinating. As he washed, the little everyday action of twining his hands in the lather set him suddenly considering his other love. At her house he was always polite and formal; gentlemanly, in short. With Connie he felt the old, manly superiority; he was the knight, strong and tender, she was the beautiful maiden with a touch of God on her brow. He kissed her, he softened and selected his speech for her, he forbore from being the greater part of himself. She was his betrothed, his wife, his queen, whom he loved to idealise, and for whom he carefully modified himself. She should rule him later on--that part of him which was hers. But he loved her, too, with a pitying, tender love. He thought of her tears upon her pillow in the northern Rectory, and he bit his lip, held his breath under the strain of the situation. Vaguely he knew she would bore him. And Winifred fascinated him. He and she really played with fire. In her house, he was roused and keen. But she was not, and never could be, frank. So he was not frank, even to himself. Saying nothing, betraying nothing, immediately they were together they began the same game. Each shuddered, each defenceless and exposed, hated the other by turns. Yet they came together again. Coutts felt a vague fear of Winifred. She was intense and unnatural--and he became unnatural and intense, beside her.

We can see the dichotomy between the two women, at least Coutts' impression of them. Not only is Connie associated with tradition and even religion ("rectory" suggesting a religious home) but with an idolized passed. He says that Wini is unnatural, but frankly I can't help but feel that his relationship with Connie is too much of a dream. It too may be unnatural. And why is Winifred unnatural? That's a very sensitve word for Lawrence. He is always striving to capture what is natural in man. For him to call Winifred unnatural carries a lot of weight. You would think that Winifred's sexuality would be natural for Lawrence. Until you realize that she is playing with sexuality, and that for Lawrence is incredibly unnatural. The magic that Wini weaves is an unnatural element.

Another observation on this paragragh, and it has to do with style. I find it immensely interesting that he buckles the observations of the two women together here into one paragragh. If one were writing this without consciously crafting the paragragh, almost everyone I think would have separated the paragragh into two paragraghs, one for the Connie section and one for the Wini. But Lawrence buckles the two together. It's a conscious effort to show a stark line between the two, has the two women almost butting into conflict, and captures the subconscious dynamics of Coutts' mind.

[Virgil]

Ok. I thought it unusual but perhaps you're right. Though it stll strikes me as an important paragragh. It's the only paragragh where we get description of his relationship with Connie. And he does have Winifred intrude into the paragragh.

[Janine]

Virgil, I read Antiquarian's comments and then your's to her, right after her post; so, I decided to go back to your original post first. I wanted to address it directly, that seemed to me logical.

Yes I pointed that out earlier. Music has a charming effect, and is either part of Wini's magic or is intended to be a analogy. I think Janine is correct in bringng up that famous "Piano" poem of Lawrence's. It was probably written around this same time as the writing of this story, early years. I think the suggeston in the poem fits the charming effect in the story.

Even though, this poem is basically about his mother, one could not say Lawrence saw the piano without a great deal of passion, within himself. I don't think, he would have used the line "piano appasionata", if he did not see the piano as stirring his deepest emotions. I feel these emotions, when I read this poem, almost as though, I could hear and feel the piano keys, resounding with that special music so dear to Lawrence. Lawrence's 'genius' is that, he can convey these deep down feelings. He just taps into this sort of thing so naturally.

I can't believe how much conversation you guys have had. Discussion of this story must be over 30 pages at this point. This is way more discussion than any of our previous stories.

Is that riot or what? 30 pages plus! Geez.. Well, in many of the posts, you may recall, that we were arguing about whether this or that character was likable, or unlikable or even hated. Glad we finally got to discussing the actual text, because so much has been revealed from it. The written word never lies....it may be curious and ambiguous, at times, but it is always fun to try to figure out, just what the author meant by those words.

I'm not sure if you've passed this passage yet, but I thought it was a very significant one:

I was just about to get to this part. Been dying to discuss this paragraph. I will post more text tonight, since I am going out today to a concert. But yes, this paragraph is certainly 'key' to us understanding the difference between how Coutts views the two women, and his difference is very apparent here.

We can see the dichotomy between the two women, at least Coutts' impression of them. Not only is Connie associated with tradition and even religion ("rectory" suggesting a religious home) but with an idolized passed. He says that Wini is unnatural, but frankly I can't help but feel that his relationship with Connie is too much of a dream. It too may be unnatural. And why is Winifred unnatural? That's a very sensitve word for Lawrence. He is always striving to capture what is natural in man. For him to call Winifred unnatural carries a lot of weight. You would think that Winifred's sexuality would be natural for Lawrence. Until you realize that she is playing with sexuality, and that for Lawrence is incredibly unnatural. The magic that Wini weaves is an unnatural element.

Dichotomy is a great word....did we spell that right? Anyway, I do totally agree with you on this paragraph. Oddly enough last night I was re-listening to "Women in Love", Virgil, and I came to that scene when Rupert confronts Hermione; it is in the chapter Class-room towards the end of the chapter. I could not get over the same imagery being used; referring to 'The Lady of Shallot' and the looking glass. I will go online and try and find the text to quote because I think this whole idea relates and is so similar to the way he views Winifred. I would never have thought of Hermione as related to Winifred but in this one respect of their ideas of passion it is so similar. I think by reading this passage I became more aware now of just precisely what Lawrence is trying to get across in this short story. At one furious moment, in the text Rupert even called Hermione... "a palpable body of darkness, a demon"...and when she asks "but why should I be a demon--?"... Rupert replies "Woman waiting for her demon lover--"
Does anyone know who he is quoting there? It seems like quote from another author or writing.
I came back to add this (editing my post). I found it on this site - from chapter 3 of "Women in Love":

Hermione set hard and poisonous against this attack. Ursula stood covered with wonder and shame. It frightened her, to see how they hated each other.

`It's all that Lady of Shalott business,' he said, in his strong abstract voice. He seemed to be charging her before the unseeing air. `You've got that mirror, your own fixed will, your immortal understanding, your own tight conscious world, and there is nothing beyond it. There, in the mirror, you must have everything. But now you have come to all your conclusions, you want to go back and be like a savage, without knowledge. You want a life of pure sensation and "passion."'

He quoted the last word satirically against her. She sat convulsed with fury and violation, speechless, like a stricken pythoness of the Greek oracle.

`But your passion is a lie,' he went on violently. `It isn't passion at all, it is your will. It's your bullying will. You want to clutch things and have them in your power. You want to have things in your power. And why? Because you haven't got any real body, any dark sensual body of life. You have no sensuality. You have only your will and your conceit of consciousness, and your lust for power, to know.'

He looked at her in mingled hate and contempt, also in pain because she suffered, and in shame because he knew he tortured her. He had an impulse to kneel and plead for forgiveness. But a bitterer red anger burned up to fury in him. He became unconscious of her, he was only a passionate voice speaking.

`Spontaneous!' he cried. `You and spontaneity! You, the most deliberate thing that ever walked or crawled! You'd be verily deliberately spontaneous -- that's you. Because you want to have everything in your own volition, your deliberate voluntary consciousness. You want it all in that loathsome little skull of yours, that ought to be cracked like a nut. For you'll be the same till it is cracked, like an insect in its skin. If one cracked your skull perhaps one might get a spontaneous, passionate woman out of you, with real sensuality. As it is, what you want is pornography -- looking at yourself in mirrors, watching your naked animal actions in mirrors, so that you can have it all in your consciousness, make it all mental.'

There was a sense of violation in the air, as if too much was said, the unforgivable. Yet Ursula was concerned now only with solving her own problems, in the light of his words. She was pale and abstracted.

`But do you really want sensuality?' she asked, puzzled.

Birkin looked at her, and became intent in his explanation.

`Yes,' he said, `that and nothing else, at this point. It is a fulfilment -- the great dark knowledge you can't have in your head -- the dark involuntary being. It is death to one's self -- but it is the coming into being of another.'

`But how? How can you have knowledge not in your head?' she asked, quite unable to interpret his phrases.

`In the blood,' he answered; `when the mind and the known world is drowned in darkness everything must go -- there must be the deluge. Then you find yourself a palpable body of darkness, a demon --'

`But why should I be a demon --?' she asked.

`"Woman wailing for her demon lover" --' he quoted -- `why, I don't know.'

Hermione roused herself as from a death -- annihilation.

I think this section, not only is similar to what soon is said,between Coutts and Winifred (the mirror idea),but expounds on that more and makes Lawrence's blood philosophy a bit clearer. Also,to note:when I was listening to this part last night several times it mentioned that Rupert Birkin and Hermione had a love/hate relationship. I thought that was interesting,since Coutts and Winifred seem to have the same type relationship. Of course,Birkin and Hermoine had been lovers and I don't surmise that Coutts and Winifred had been sexual with each other.
Also note Birkin's insistence on the idea of 'will' which I know Virgil has brought up in other stories and I brought up earlier in this story.

Another observation on this paragragh, and it has to do with style. I find it immensely interesting that he buckles the observations of the two women together here into one paragragh. If one were writing this without consciously crafting the paragragh, almost everyone I think would have separated the paragragh into two paragraghs, one for the Connie section and one for the Wini. But Lawrence buckles the two together. It's a conscious effort to show a stark line between the two, has the two women almost butting into conflict, and captures the subconscious dynamics of Coutts' mind.

Well, Antiquarian, you don't think it is genius and Virgil does. Hey, Antiquarian, maybe you are more of a genius than you think you are. You know Lawrence hated being called 'genius'..in fact he told Frieda he was called that but he thought he was a good writer and would maybe become a great writer. He said writing takes practice. No doubt by the time Lawrence wrote this story he had had a great deal of practice.
I personally do think it brilliant the way he incorporated the two women in the paragraph at a key moment in the story. His timing was always so good. He places this paragraph in the text just when it is needed to explain and reveal to us more about his relationship with his betrothed.
Then as Virgil, points out he does have the two woman almost aligned in a sort of conflict or combat. The conflict/combat, is within Coutts himself; as Virgil so aptly put it, it 'captures the subconscious dynamics of Coutt's mind.'
The two women are sort of intertwined in this one paragraph, as the snake image of the train involves an intertwining in the previous text we discussed. Perhaps the gold-and-black snake represents this struggle within Coutt's subconcious mind and the struggle is that involving the two women. The dark side could represent Winifred and the ligth side Connie. It is just a thought.

[Virgil]

That is an interesting passage from Women In Love. Do you think Winifred is similar to Hermione? Quite possible, although Wnifred is half way likable. "Woman wailing for her demon lover" is from Colridge's "Kubla Khan." Here's the entire poem:

Kubla Khan
OR, A VISION IN A DREAM.
A FRAGMENT.
by Samual Taylor Coleridge

In Xanadu did Kubla Khan
A stately pleasure-dome decree :
Where Alph, the sacred river, ran
Through caverns measureless to man

Down to a sunless sea.

So twice five miles of fertile ground
With walls and towers were girdled round :
And there were gardens bright with sinuous rills,
Where blossomed many an incense-bearing tree ;
And here were forests ancient as the hills,
Enfolding sunny spots of greenery.
But oh ! that deep romantic chasm which slanted
Down the green hill athwart a cedarn cover !
A savage place ! as holy and enchanted
As e'er beneath a waning moon was haunted
By woman wailing for her demon-lover !
And from this chasm, with ceaseless turmoil seething,
As if this earth in fast thick pants were breathing,
A mighty fountain momently was forced :
Amid whose swift half-intermitted burst
Huge fragments vaulted like rebounding hail,
Or chaffy grain beneath the thresher's flail :
And 'mid these dancing rocks at once and ever
It flung up momently the sacred river.
Five miles meandering with a mazy motion
Through wood and dale the sacred river ran,
Then reached the caverns measureless to man,
And sank in tumult to a lifeless ocean :
And 'mid this tumult Kubla heard from far
Ancestral voices prophesying war !


The shadow of the dome of pleasure
Floated midway on the waves ;
Where was heard the mingled measure
From the fountain and the caves.

It was a miracle of rare device,
A sunny pleasure-dome with caves of ice !
A damsel with a dulcimer
In a vision once I saw :
It was an Abyssinian maid,
And on her dulcimer she played,
Singing of Mount Abora.
Could I revive within me
Her symphony and song,
To such a deep delight 'twould win me,

That with music loud and long,
I would build that dome in air,
That sunny dome ! those caves of ice !
And all who heard should see them there,
And all should cry, Beware ! Beware !
His flashing eyes, his floating hair !
Weave a circle round him thrice,
And close your eyes with holy dread,
For he on honey-dew hath fed,
And drunk the milk of Paradise.

[Janine]

That is an interesting passage from Women In Love. Do you think Winifred is similar to Hermione? Quite possible, although Wnifred is half way likable. "Woman wailing for her demon lover" is from Colridge's "Kubla Khan." Here's the entire poem:

I don't think the two women, Winifred and Hermoine, are alike in personality. However I do think they are similar in the way in which Lawrence conceived their characters and then perceived them; I think that they both have the same problem when it comes with relationships; true ones. They cannot connect physically (in the deep blood sense) to a man, as Lawrence is explaining to both women, throught his male characters. They can view passion in themselves, but they cannot really experience passion or connect on that level with a man, in the deeper sense - which is devoid of 'self-consciousness'.

It is curious that Lawrence would use the same symbolism, reference to "Lady Shallot" and the looking glass in both stories; and at the same time, I think that makes it even more significant. He explains this idea much clearer in this passage, from 'Women in Love", and this confrontation between Rupert and Hermione. He expands this whole idea/concept in the novel; whereas, in the short story, one is left thinking and surmising, just what Lawrence means - in relationship to Winifred and these symbols and her degree of passionate release. I hope that is clear. It is hard to explain actually and I am a little tired out right now. Guess it was my big dinner; I feel sleepy.

Anyway, Virgil, thanks for looking up the poem - how did you find it? or were you familiar with this poem and that line? A few key lines really stand out to me. This part from which Lawrence extracted that line in the story, is quite interesting:

A savage place ! as holy and enchanted
As e'er beneath a waning moon was haunted
By woman wailing for her demon-lover !

That sounds like images used continually in the story, in the symbol of the 'waning moon', images of 'holy and enchanted', 'savage', and 'haunted'; and finally, in Lawrence's direct mention of a 'woman wailing for her demon-lover'.

I am not sure I fully understand this poem, but the imagery is similar to what Lawrence employs in this short story(ies). I like this part of the poem:

It was a miracle of rare device,
A sunny pleasure-dome with caves of ice !
A damsel with a dulcimer
In a vision once I saw :
It was an Abyssinian maid,
And on her dulcimer she played,
Singing of Mount Abora.
Could I revive within me
Her symphony and song,
To such a deep delight 'twould win me,

That with music loud and long,
I would build that dome in air,
That sunny dome ! those caves of ice !

"A sunny pleasure-dome with caves of ice!" - interesting duality here - the sun and the ice - two frequent ideas that Lawrence often employs symbolically in this stories and novels. Also, note the liberal use of words relating to music, throughtout the poem and often in conjuction with pleasure. This poem is really lovely and mysterious.

This part is great -
"Could I revive within me
Her symphony and song,
To such a deep delight 'twould win me,.."

The whole poem actually is very musical, and very mystical, mysterious. I will read it over again and maybe print it out to muse on the deeper meanings behind the words. Thanks again Virgil for finiding it and posting it.

[Virgil]

I don't think the two women, Winifred and Hermoine, are alike in personality. However I do think they are similar in the way in which Lawrence conceived their characters and then perceived them; I think that they both have the same problem when it comes with relationships; true ones. They cannot connect physically (in the deep blood sense) to a man, as Lawrence is explaining to both women, throught his male characters. They can view passion in themselves, but they cannot really experience passion or connect on that level with a man, in the deeper sense - which is devoid of 'self-consciousness'.

Good thoughts Janine. I pretty much agree.

It is curious that Lawrence would use the same symbolism, reference to "Lady Shallot" and the looking glass in both stories; and at the same time, I think that makes it even more significant. He explains this idea much clearer in this passage, from 'Women in Love", and this confrontation between Rupert and Hermione. He expands this whole idea/concept in the novel; whereas, in the short story, one is left thinking and surmising, just what Lawrence means - in relationship to Winifred and these symbols and her degree of passionate release. I hope that is clear. It is hard to explain actually and I am a little tired out right now. Guess it was my big dinner; I feel sleepy.

Well, that is one of the differences between a short story and a novel. It's not correct to conceive of a short story as a short version of a novel. They are two different art forms.

Anyway, Virgil, thanks for looking up the poem - how did you find it? or were you familiar with this poem and that line?

I knew it. I pretty much know most of the classic Romantic poems off the cuff.

That sounds like images used continually in the story, in the symbol of the 'waning moon', images of 'holy and enchanted', 'savage', and 'haunted'; and finally, in Lawrence's direct mention of a 'woman wailing for her demon-lover'.

I am not sure I fully understand this poem, but the imagery is similar to what Lawrence employs in this short story(ies).

The poem does have a lot of musical elements to it. And it is about being charmed too.

"A sunny pleasure-dome with caves of ice!" - interesting duality here - the sun and the ice - two frequent ideas that Lawrence often employs symbolically in this stories and novels. Also, note the liberal use of words relating to music, throughtout the poem and often in conjuction with pleasure. This poem is really lovely and mysterious.

This part is great -
"Could I revive within me
Her symphony and song,
To such a deep delight 'twould win me,.."

The whole poem actually is very musical, and very mystical, mysterious. I will read it over again and maybe print it out to muse on the deeper meanings behind the words. Thanks again Virgil for finiding it and posting it.

This is one of those poems one should know. If you wish we could discuss it off line.

[Virgil]

We certainly agree 100% there. The novel often has more than one viewpoint character, while the short story usually, not always, has only one.

Short stories with more than three main characters are usually very confusing.

The short story is all about unity, where the novel has room to "spread out" and develop subplots.

I've always said that the short story is the art of telling a story or tale whle the novel is the art of capturing life in writing. Now there is overlap, but I think their primary core focus is somewhat different. Perhaps one day we should discuss it. Down the road I hope. Too many things going on these days.

Virgil, you are lucky to remember poems like that. Lucky or skilled. Probably both. I can't do it.

Oh thanks. Hey I'm old. I've read the core classic poems many times over. Not sure how old you are. Plus I'm not sure I've seen you in the poetry discussions, so perhaps you don't have the same interest in poetry as stories. One can read a poem many times over, and usually does.

[Virgil]

My writing instructor has always taught that the main difference is that the short story has a very narrow focus and everything in it should contribute to that focus. The short story demonstrates a more harmonious relationship of all its aspects than any other literary art form except lyric poetry.

Oh I absolutely agree with that. But those are characteristics of craft.

This unity is what distinguishes it from the novel.

Yes, I think that's what I was suggesting when I distinguished them by art forms. The short story requires a unified story while a novel is multifaceted and strives to capture life. Take Melville's Moby Dick for instance. Melville could have written a couple of thirty page stories from the story part of his material. But when he expanded it to include the whaling life and skill metaphorically tied into his themes, then he expanded his art beyond a story. It's no longer just a tale, but a representation of a particular vision of life.

[Janine]

We certainly agree 100% there. The novel often has more than one viewpoint character, while the short story usually, not always, has only one.

Short stories with more than three main characters are usually very confusing.

The short story is all about unity, where the novel has room to "spread out" and develop subplots.

Virgil, you are lucky to remember poems like that. Lucky or skilled. Probably both. I can't do it.

Virgil and Antiquarian, I certainly agree, also. I just posted that section of "Women in Love" because as I was listening to it last night and got to that part about "The Lady of Shallot" and the looking glass, the whole concept struck me and it cleared up the idea for me of the short story's meaning, concerning those specific images. I agree about all the things you pointed out in conjuction with short stories, Antiquarian.

Secondly, I quoted that part of the novel, because I think it showed how Lawrence felt specifically about passion, sensuality and relationships. This section expresses aspects of Lawrence's 'blood conscienceness'; therefore, I felt it related to our story text in some ways.

I can remember certain lines (if I hear them) and recall what poems they were quoted from; but not the Greek classics, as Virgil is familiar with. I am not familiar enough with those, I regret to say.

[Janine]

Quote by Antiquarian:

I think the short story captures life, too, but only a moment in one life. It has a pinpoint focus that the novel doesn't have. The novel is panoramic, or at least it can be.

Some novels do that also - capture a moment in life....but in a series of many moments in life. I feel that Lawrence does this often. His novels all seem this way to me. It seems each scene and chapter, especially in "Women in Love" are merely moments connecting to each other, intertwining in a sort of intricate pattern. I don't know if that could be called 'panoramic'. I see Lawrence's work more 'microscopic'. He is one author who delves far below the surface, of his characters and their intimate moments in relation to time/place. In Lawrence's novels, I still percieve a kind of 'pinpoint' focus that you say only exists in short stories, Antiquarian.
So, I am not sure I entirely agree with you. I guess that could be a debate in itself, as to what the exact formula is for a short story and that for a novel. I might not know enough about it myself. I was looking beyond the formula, when I posted that section from Lawrence's novel. I was looking for the concepts behind the symbolism and the ideas. I may have been viewing it too microscopically, but I feel it was one of those moments in Lawrence's writing that reveals much of how Lawrence thought and that it did relate to this short story, in concept and symbolism.

Yes, Coutts seemed to want a sexual relationship with Winifred and he seemed to find her beautiful, and the symbol of fire is integrated into the story well, equating with sexual passion.

I was wondering if this meant he did not find Connie beautiful.

Reading about his personal life, my goodness, I felt he treated Jessie Chambers badly and with much insensitivity. I have to admit, so far, reading about his personal life, I do not like Freida at all. Not one bit. I also do not like Lawrence's mother.

Where are you reading about his personal life, Antiquarian...just curious? There are so many biographers out there and some sources are not so accurate. Is this from one of the Cambridge books?

Do you mean Coutts doesn't find Connie beautiful? I thought he had said she was. The woman who Connie corresponds to in Lawrence's real life was quite lovely, I think.

Here again, one can't judge Lawrence's life with a 'black and white' verdict, nor the women in his life. It is way more complex and complicated than that. After reading "Sons and Lovers", I felt I really did not hate anyone...I can honestly say that. I felt so after reading two full length biographies, as well. I felt all the people in Lawrence's life had their flaws and they all were human and made poor decisions, at times. Lawrence may have treated Jessie unkindly, but I don't think he would have been right for her or she for him; not in the long run. Their relationship was a very intense, but conflicted one. There is no doubt that his break with her was heartbreaking. yes, he hurt her but he also was quite conflicted about women at that time. If you read the book you will see just how complicated it all is. Jessie Chambers did write her own biography of Lawrence, but I have never read it. I read that it is quite biased but still I do find I have a curiosity to read her side of the story. It is nearly impossible to come by. I have it in my Amazon 'wishlist', but it is still too expensive for used copy.