Chekhov Short Story Thread

[Dark Muse]

I rather enjoyed Sons and Lovers, though personaly, I liked The Rainbow better. And those are the only novels of his I have read thus far.

[Quark]

There's a split among Lawrence fans between those who like the later works and those who go for the earlier stories. There's a bit of a style difference. I liked "Sons and Lovers" more than the "Rainbow", but those are the only two major novels I've read. Most readers consider "Women in Love" to be his best. Janine could fill you in on this more, so I'll let her do the suggesting.

Also, I'm asking the mods to change the name of our thread. Hopefully, we can get something a little more descriptive than just "Chekhov." If it works, I'll let you know what the new name is. I suggested "Chekhov Short Story Thread." That's at least a bit better. I just fear that with "Chekhov" being the title people will think this another one of those threads where people give vague, generalized appraisals of an author's entire body of work and not a monthly short story discussion.

[Janine]

I rather enjoyed Sons and Lovers, though personaly, I liked The Rainbow better. And those are the only novels of his I have read thus far.

This is funny, I read "Women in Love" first and then I think I read "The Rainbow", and I felt lost reading TR, at that time. I felt it paled with WIL and that it seemed to drag along endlessly; I was a little bored. I am hoping when I read it again, which will be soon, and we plan on discussing it (hope some of you join-in, when we do so), I will have a far different/better perspective on Lawrence work, that will translate to the novel. Virgil seemed to favor TR, and I had said WIL, which was my very favorite of L's work. I still think I stand by that, feeling it is much more complete and developed than "Sons and Lovers". As I pointed out ages ago, in the "Sons and Lovers" discussion, Lawrence said, himself, that he would never write a novel again or afterwards, in the same style or manor that he wrote S&L. S&L is a very personal part of L and encompasses his deepest life history and early years. There is a definite separation between this novel and the ones that followed. After my second reading of S&L, I far more appreciated it, because now I know much about Lawrence and his biography; so this keyed me into many of the ideas and thoughts represented in this book. I felt it was a book about a young man coming of age, with his own personal family and personal struggles. As I said, it is a 'young' work.

There's a split among Lawrence fans between those who like the later works and those who go for the earlier stories. There's a bit of a style difference. I liked "Sons and Lovers" more than the "Rainbow", but those are the only two major novels I've read. Most readers consider "Women in Love" to be his best. Janine could fill you in on this more, so I'll let her do the suggesting.

Yes, this is very true, but lately I have personally (for myself) been trying to close that 'gap' somewhat. There was a time, I felt his much later work was something I very much questioned, and was not sure I liked at it or understood it. I just read two of those major works and I liked one: "Kangaroo", but still am not too sure about the other: "The Plumed Serpent". However, one cannot seem to read an L book, even if it pales with other ones you have read, and go away not thinking on it forever. I keep finding myself musing over parts of TPS. Some of the ideas in that book have sunken in, without me even being aware of it. It is very strange how that can happen.
Quark, definitely there is a bit of a style difference in the novels - all of them actually. So you have not read "Women in Love"? That is one you should read. I would love to hear what you think of it after. Our discussion on this site was a major success and it went on the entire month and then some. Virgil said it was one of the best discussion we ever had. Manolia is still talking about and trying to nudge me into saying we can start "The Rainbow" thread soon. I am still listening to WIL on audio and finding it even more fascinating. I read the book twice now. I guess I am averaging two readings now for every L book.

Also, I'm asking the mods to change the name of our thread. Hopefully, we can get something a little more descriptive than just "Chekhov." If it works, I'll let you know what the new name is. I suggested "Chekhov Short Story Thread." That's at least a bit better. I just fear that with "Chekhov" being the title people will think this another one of those threads where people give vague, generalized appraisals of an author's entire body of work and not a monthly short story discussion.

Quark, Excellent idea! Exactly, I have long thought it should be called 'Chekhov Short Stories or Story'; otherwise, it is very deceptive and one would think it is just a thread to discuss the author in general; therefore it just falls through the cracks. I hope they approve the change. One could still put 'Chekhov' in the 'search' block and find it easily.

Anyway, back to Chekhov - last night I printed out the story from online. I put it into my Word program and then changed the font to Ariel 10Pt which reduced the pages down to about 6 1/2ps. Then I printed it, but I only glanced at the beginning and have not read it yet; I can't get to it until the weekend. Will we begin discussion on the first - is that Monday? Monday would be good for me.

[Dark Muse]

I beleive the first is Tuesday

[islandclimber]

Yeah, the first is Tuesday...

Janine I can see my dislike for "Sons and Lovers" sparked a new discussion... I think one of the problems was I had to read it for a university english course, and that usually lessens my ability to like a story... I've had it happen several times with books I later ended up really liking... I read "sons and lovers" when I was 21 I think so three years ago now, and it's not that I intensely disliked it, I just didn't enjoy it.. but at the same time, outside of school I was reading "Love Among the Haystacks and other Stories" and I just loved it... It is one of my favourite collections of short stories.. though I know Lawrence is better known for his novels I like his short stories more... I did enjoy "the rainbow" though when I read it a couple years ago, and "Aaron's Rod" as well... and "Women In Love" was pretty good, again not my favourite of his... but I think if I went back to "Sons and Lovers" now I would most likely enjoy it, it is just there are so many books and so little time as you have said before... right now, besides Chekhov and now the Lawrence short story thread... I'm rereading Borges' "Labyrinths" and I'm reading Dickens "Short Stories" which for another writer predominately known for novels (in fact I did not know he wrote short stories) are fantastic, at least some of them... I'm always somewhere or other in Pablo Neruda's "Residence on Earth" I just can't put it down, and it has been 4 and a half years since I got it, and I'm still reading it over and over... and then I'm reading the only one of the five major Dostoevsky novels I have not read for some strange reason, "A Raw Youth" though I find it to be his poorest work of his later career so far.. oh yeah and Thomas Hardy's "Return of the Native", which is his, poorest work so far in my eyes.. I loved "Tess of the D'urbevilles, it is my favourite tragic love novel probably, and 'Jude the Obscure" and the Mayor of Casterbridge" and his almost comic happier "Far From the Madding Crowd"... But "return of the native" is so mediocre in comparison I find... but to get back to the point, I should read "sons and lovers" again and am sure I would enjoy it if I did, but well, time...

Quark, I saw you suggested "Quark's Awesome Chekhov Club" for a thread title... that is so much better, let's have that as our title!!!

[Dark Muse]

This is funny, I read "Women in Love" first and then I think I read "The Rainbow", and I felt lost reading TR, at that time. I felt it paled with WIL and that it seemed to drag along endlessly; I was a little bored. I am hoping when I read it again, which will be soon, and we plan on discussing it (hope some of you join-in, when we do so), I will have a far different/better perspective on Lawrence work, that will translate to the novel. Virgil seemed to favor TR, and I had said WIL, which was my very favorite of L's work. I still think I stand by that, feeling it is much more complete and developed than "Sons and Lovers". As I pointed out ages ago, in the "Sons and Lovers" discussion, Lawrence said, himself, that he would never write a novel again or afterwards, in the same style or manor that he wrote S&L. S&L is a very personal part of L and encompasses his deepest life history and early years. There is a definite separation between this novel and the ones that followed. After my second reading of S&L, I far more appreciated it, because now I know much about Lawrence and his biography; so this keyed me into many of the ideas and thoughts represented in this book. I felt it was a book about a young man coming of age, with his own personal family and personal struggles. As I said, it is a 'young' work.

Though it has been a while sense my reading of Rainbow, and I no longer have a copy of the book, I throughly enjoyed it, and will look forward to partaking in a discussion of it.

[Janine]

Though it has been a while sense my reading of Rainbow, and I no longer have a copy of the book, I throughly enjoyed it, and will look forward to partaking in a discussion of it.

Great! I will let you know. I have to re-read it myself. I bought a new copy recently.

Yeah, the first is Tuesday...

Ok, then Tues would be even better for me. I have that big baby shower on Sunday.

Janine I can see my dislike for "Sons and Lovers" sparked a new discussion... I think one of the problems was I had to read it for a university english course, and that usually lessens my ability to like a story... I've had it happen several times with books I later ended up really liking... I read "sons and lovers" when I was 21 I think so three years ago now, and it's not that I intensely disliked it, I just didn't enjoy it.. but at the same time, outside of school I was reading "Love Among the Haystacks and other Stories" and I just loved it... It is one of my favourite collections of short stories..

Well, that explains it - two factors - the made you read it and second you were a bit young to appreciate it entirely. I think a second reading, maybe even later in life would change your mind about the novel. Same with "Women in Love" - one has to be in the right frame of mind and right time in one's life to appreciate some novels. I have found this entirely true. I started to read S&L when I was younger and actually hated it. I had to abandon it until years later when I knew more about Lawrence and his actually life story. Then it gained appeal for me. It also stands quite alone as nothing I have ever read before. The second reading of WIL on this site was phenomenal for me and now the audiofile I am listening to is wonderful and I am actually noticing things I had not previously noticed, in two readings! strange, isn't i?
I too read those books when younger - the shorter novellas - 'Love Among the Haystakes' was and is still one of my favorites - sort of in the Thomas Hardy pastoral style. I loved 'The Fox', and others I can't recall now. I plan soon to re-read all of them.

..though I know Lawrence is better known for his novels I like his short stories more... I did enjoy "the rainbow" though when I read it a couple years ago, and "Aaron's Rod" as well... and "Women In Love" was pretty good, again not my favourite of his...

More and more I am appreciating his short stories and short fiction. I didn't think much about it before though I had read some and liked those stories very much. 'Things' is one of my favorites of Lawrence's SS's. I am impressed, Islandclimber....I did not know you read all those Lawrence novels. I read all of those also and a few more this past year. Discussion groups greatly enhance the understanding of these novels. We will be discussion WIL soon and maybe you could join in as well. I think you would see things you had not previously observed in the text. I surely hope I do so.

...but I think if I went back to "Sons and Lovers" now I would most likely enjoy it, it is just there are so many books and so little time as you have said before...

Even a bit later perhaps - maybe when you are about 30. Yep, so many books to read in one little lifetime; I agree.

... right now, besides Chekhov and now the Lawrence short story thread... I'm rereading Borges' "Labyrinths" and I'm reading Dickens "Short Stories" which for another writer predominately known for novels (in fact I did not know he wrote short stories) are fantastic, at least some of them... I'm always somewhere or other in Pablo Neruda's "Residence on Earth" I just can't put it down, and it has been 4 and a half years since I got it, and I'm still reading it over and over... and then I'm reading the only one of the five major Dostoevsky novels I have not read for some strange reason, "A Raw Youth" though I find it to be his poorest work of his later career so far..

Wow, I would imagine Dicken's short stories would be good. I haven't read the other authors you mentioned. I did purchase some Dostoevsky novels from a sale recently - now I am well stocked and ready to read his works. He will be next after L. I tend to read all that one author has written or at least a good portion of it. I will start with the short ones - "Notes from the Underground" is super short.

....oh yeah and Thomas Hardy's "Return of the Native", which is his, poorest work so far in my eyes.. I loved "Tess of the D'urbevilles, it is my favourite tragic love novel probably, and 'Jude the Obscure" and the Mayor of Casterbridge" and his almost comic happier "Far From the Madding Crowd"... But "return of the native" is so mediocre in comparison I find... but to get back to the point, I should read "sons and lovers" again and am sure I would enjoy it if I did, but well, time...

I love Hardy - about 5 years back I read most of his work. I used to belong to the Hardy site online and learned some there but more from a person I connected with there who is making Hardy his lifetime study. He loves "Return of the Native" but oddly enough, I did not appreciate it till much later and now I like it very much. My favorites are "Mayor of Casterbridge", "Jude the Obscure", "The Woodlanders", "Tess of the D'Urbervilles", and "Far From the Madding Crowd" - well, that is a lot of favorites and a great deal of his work! I plan to re-read all of them eventually and I have read some of the lesser novels of Hardy also and liked those. I own about 20 Hardy books. Ever see any of the adaptations? There are some fine ones out there. I can list them for you, if you want. I listed them in another for someone reading Hardy for the first time.

Quark, I saw you suggested "Quark's Awesome Chekhov Club" for a thread title... that is so much better, let's have that as our title!!!

NOT! That would drive people away!... sorry Q!

[Quark]

I felt it paled with WIL

That's what I assumed. I think if I had to compel someone to read a Lawrence book it would be Women in Love. From what I've heard it's quite good. I just haven't gotten around to reading it.

When are you going to start your Rainbow discussion? I'll try and post some things when I get time.

I beleive the first is Tuesday

The discussion begins officially on Tuesday, but I may post something earlier anyway. Janine, if you want to start early feel free to.

and then I'm reading the only one of the five major Dostoevsky novels I have not read for some strange reason, "A Raw Youth" though I find it to be his poorest work of his later career so far

"A Raw Youth" is considered one of his major novels? I haven't even bothered to look at that one. What's it about? I'm starting to read The Possessed actually. I'm expecting it to be quite good. I've wanted to read it for some time.

.. oh yeah and Thomas Hardy's "Return of the Native", which is his, poorest work so far in my eyes.. I loved "Tess of the D'urbevilles, it is my favourite tragic love novel probably, and 'Jude the Obscure" and the Mayor of Casterbridge" and his almost comic happier "Far From the Madding Crowd"... But "return of the native" is so mediocre in comparison I find...

I never made it all the way through Tess. It sort of bored me, although it did give me one of my favorite lines. When the one brother wants to go join the party, and one of his dull, pedantic siblings goes, "But we have to read another chapter of Counterblast to Agnosticism!" Whenever someone tries to pull me away from work to go do something fun, that's always my comeback. "But I have to read another chapter of Counterblast to Agnosticism!"

Quark, I saw you suggested "Quark's Awesome Chekhov Club" for a thread title... that is so much better, let's have that as our title!!!

I know. I should have made that at least the subtitle. I just didn't think the admins would go for it.

[Dark Muse]

The discussion begins officially on Tuesday, but I may post something earlier anyway. Janine, if you want to start early feel free to.

Well sense I have already read the story, that would be fine with me if anyone posted early.

[islandclimber]

"A Raw Youth" is considered one of his major novels? I haven't even bothered to look at that one. What's it about? I'm starting to read The Possessed actually. I'm expecting it to be quite good. I've wanted to read it for some time.

The Possessed is fantastic... I loved it... make sure you get to read the cut by censors chapter "Stavrogin's Confession"... it is intense... besides A Raw Youth it was probably his modern novel, in terms of writing style, explaining its somewhat disjointed and more experimental style at times or so I found... A Raw Youth was the fourth of his major novels, his penultimate, only TBK came after... it is considered the poorest of the 5 and is less well known, much less read... I am actually starting to enjoy it more so, as I get deeper into it... It is D's most modern novel, as it goes more into the discordant, all over the place, modernist trends in writing that came along in the 20th century... it makes it interesting.. but it is much like The Possessed in that it is about the ideological battle between the old guard and the new in Russia, It is about the intellectual, yet illegitimate child of a wealthy womanizing landowner, and the conflicts between them, quite interesting I'm finding as I get deeper and deeper in...

I never made it all the way through Tess. It sort of bored me, although it did give me one of my favorite lines. When the one brother wants to go join the party, and one of his dull, pedantic siblings goes, "But we have to read another chapter of Counterblast to Agnosticism!" Whenever someone tries to pull me away from work to go do something fun, that's always my comeback. "But I have to read another chapter of Counterblast to Agnosticism!"

I love that quote too, though I never thought of it's practical application... hmmm... that is a good idea ... I think part of the problem for most with Hardy, is he writes at a very slow and poetic pace, in no hurry to get anywhere or make anything happen, but it is the moments of extreme emotion both beautiful and tragic, that I love his stories for... especially this one and Jude the Obscure... The letter she writes Angel in this one has to be one of the saddest, most tragic letters in all of literature... and then Jude The Obscure, probably had the most depressing and tragic scenes in all of literature, Janine will know the one I refer to... definitely a tear jerker that one part...


I know. I should have made that at least the subtitle. I just didn't think the admins would go for it.
They probably would not have, but it would have been fun.. it would have given more character to the discussion group, given a fun feeling to a depressing guy!

Oh, like DarkMuse I am finished the story, well all three stories again, so whenever you want to start if it is okay with Janine, please do...

DarkMuse if you want a little more to read, the two stories leading up to this story with the same characters, give you a better understanding of where this is coming from... they are first The Man In A Case and Gooseberries second.. and they are both on here.. and not any lengthier than this one... just a quick read will get you the background to this story, though as Quark mentioned before, they are not essential... someone could post a brief synopsis of them as a lead up to About Love as well I guess, what do you think Quark?

Janine isn't it great that Dostoevsky's short stories are still about 100 pages or longer... more like novellas i would say.. though he does have a couple short ones... But when you begin reading him, let me know, I would love to read along again and discuss any of his works, at a nice relaxed pace, or whatever suits you

[Dark Muse]

DarkMuse if you want a little more to read, the two stories leading up to this story with the same characters, give you a better understanding of where this is coming from... they are first The Man In A Case and Gooseberries second.. and they are both on here.. and not any lengthier than this one... just a quick read will get you the background to this story, though as Quark mentioned before, they are not essential... someone could post a brief synopsis of them as a lead up to About Love as well I guess, what do you think Quark?

Thanks for the suggestion, I just might decide to look into those two stories.

[Janine]

I would like to look into those additional stories too, but it is inconceivable that I can start posting, till next week. If anyone does post now, please don't give away endings. I hate that. I want to work up to the ending, all by myself. If you need to discuss the end, then do so, but please post a big bold 'spoiler' before it.

Go ahead and post, but I really can't do so until next week. I am tied up for the next few days. I guess I can catch up.

[Dark Muse]

Well if we wait it will give me more time to read up those other two stories, but if Quark or anyone else does want to post early I can do that as well.

[islandclimber]

I'll wait for you Janine!!! No leaving you on the sinking ship!!! We all go down together in this thread!! but, seriously, I am content to wait a few days... I just read a most interesting book through the night last night as I could not sleep... and then went to work.. ahhh... insomnia is god... i mean good... but "Sanine" by Mikhail Artzybashev is just a fascinating novel... I was shocked at how good it was considering I had never heard of it, and you can only get used copies as it has fallen out of print... so good and now I need a day or two to mull over the originality and uniqueness of this story...

[Quark]

someone could post a brief synopsis of them as a lead up to About Love as well I guess, what do you think Quark?

Oh, if you insist. No, really, that probably would be a good idea, although someone might object. Should I post a summary? What do you guys think?

Go ahead and post, but I really can't do so until next week. I am tied up for the next few days. I guess I can catch up.

I won't post until Tuesday, but other people can go ahead. I'll probably just answer other people's posts until I start posting chunks of the story on Tuesday. It would be a good idea if everyone alerted each other to spoilers before the actual beginning of the discussion.