are women losing their sense of feminity?

[Niamh]

How aobut bodica? and hutchepsouit and the guy who establissed the anciet egyptien middle kingdom.
or shugurt eldorr of course she got too big for her boots and was eventually assasinated by being beaten to death with wooden shoes if I rember correctly and then they invented a great dessert that was supposed to symbloise her dead body ( Its Umm Ali if any one is in the slightest bit interested).

Actually heres another thing in early islamic history women were part of the army and were encouraged to learn to fencing, archery, ridding and swimming. course with 100 years the old male chauvnistic pre isalmic cultural tendencies took over and it wasnt until ( barring the slight shugert eldoor thing) 1919 that women once again ( in egypt at least) took a part in militanish manor.

forgot to mention Bodica! Now that was some woman! And we might as well mention Grainneuille (Grace O'Malley), Queen Meave, Queen Elizabeth I (she didnt fight but was one hell of a political figure....And there is some else i'm forgetting, someone really important....

Oh and as for the hunter gatherers.... thats all based on assumptions.Its quite possible that the women in the tribes where also involved in the hunting as well as the gathering. They would also have been able to fashion tools and weapons. Besides back then people where lucky if they could live till they were in their twenties, and many women were lucky if they could live past twelve or fourteen, dying during pregnancy. Infanticide is believed to have been huge back then. Survival of the fittest. If a man or woman became crippled or injured in anyway, it is believed they were left behind in the settlements weaving baskets, cooking food and looking after the young.

[Lote-Tree]

Oh and as for the hunter gatherers.... thats all based on assumptions.Its quite possible that the women in the tribes where also involved in the hunting as well as the gathering.

Nay. It is not possible. Women rather wash their hair than go hunting. Hunting is man's business. And we do it really well

[Riesa]

Sure, women encouraged the men to go off and hunt, on the slim chance that one of them might be gored by a wild boar through the testicles. Thereby leaving the women more time to eat berries, gossip and wash their hair.

[Lote-Tree]

Sure, women encouraged the men to go off and hunt, on the slim chance that one of them might be gored by a wild boar through the testicles. Thereby leaving the women more time to eat berries, gossip and wash their hair.

My my Riesa, you seem to be a closet MANSOGYNIST

[Nightshade]

What is the opposite of misogynist anyway?


Edit the answer is misandrist --

A person, esp. a woman, who hates men; a man-hater

[Lote-Tree]

What is the opposite of misogynist anyway?


Edit the answer is misandrist --

Can I not invent my own words Nighty?

I think it is called "witticism"

[Riesa]

My my Riesa, you seem to be a closet MANSOGYNIST

I only give what I get, I am the ultimate female, all charity. Do unto others as they do unto you. Do unto thine brothers what they have, without cease, done unto you..

Of course women are different than men. How can we see eye to eye? It'll never happen. But both sexes have an amazing capacity to love, so perhaps it's within reason to expect some understanding, even perhaps a boost up from our masculine counterparts, as opposed to a boot in the face, which women have been given with mud and feces full force, regardless of what Jon says.

It's difficult to be women or men, because the definition is constantly shifting. What we all need to be is true to our own identity, (which I think was Jon's underlying point to begin with) but the odds against most of us accomplishing that truly are staggeringly high.

Some of us can, others have bound themselves, whether it be through a misguided sense of duty to one's parents, religion, or societal structure, a duty which is as real and substantial as the iron bars of a cell.

I'm trying to break out, but I am not a mansogynist, My only true enemy is my self, and my own lack of vision, I admit it, I'm a selfsogynist.

[Lote-Tree]

I'm trying to break out, but I am not a mansogynist,

Bueno! But I was only joking

and my own lack of vision, I admit it, I'm a selfsogynist.

Then we must be two of a kind...I hope there more like us.

[Nightshade]

Can I not invent my own words Nighty?

I think it is called "witticism"

Yeah it was more of a tangent random thought like oh that reminds me what IS the......

[Virgil]

Along with Sleepy's comments about the Cold War:

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/5237236.stm

There are also more links to the related articles on that page.

Really? Surveys are meaningless. That just reflects people's frustrations, which are always there. People physically moving is a whole different real matter. Check this out:

France’s young flock to Britain
Matthew Campbell Paris

THIS Wednesday Marine Fretel, an intelligent, well-educated young French woman, will board a train to London. She has let her Paris flat, packed a large suitcase and said goodbye to family and friends.

She does not expect to return. Fretel is one of the “Eurostar generation” of French professionals fleeing to London and other cities abroad in the hope of better careers in a land of opportunity.

The farewell parties held each week in Paris are multiplying, and although the government puts a brave face on the exodus, this rush for the exit is an embarrassing symptom of chronic French woes as the country prepares to pick its new president.

A dearth of jobs in France, the world’s fifth largest economy, has turned London, less than three hours from Paris by Eurostar, into an eldorado for young professionals such as Fretel. Friends in London have told her that the British capital, unlike the one she is leaving behind, is a “city of dreams”.

[Snip] Read the rest here: http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/new...cle1719875.ece

Mr Virgil, last time I checked, the cold war was not won, it just kinda ended.
My politics profs in England even said American and English politicians and conservative gov. thinktanks were taken by surprise when it did. they could never have immagined that someone like Gorbatchev would turn up. all their scenarios involved (nuclear) war and when a group of feminist political scientists was invited to play a role game against the gov.'s specialists, the women predicted what was actually to happen a couple of years later, whereas the gov. team (all guys) nuked all their enemies without provocation just in order not to look like "wimps"

That may be true they were taken by surprise. What does that have to do with whether it was won? The last time I checked the Soviet Union was fragmented into all sorts of countries and Russia has returned as a nation with its central church. Last time I checked none of the countries that were swallowed into the Soviet Union claims to have a communist government or economic system. Last time I checked NATO still existed, in fact now includes Poland, Hungary, Chech, Slovakia, and others, including now the Baltic countries, actuall Soviet Union satellite nations. Last time I checked East Germany is now part of a free Germany consoldated into a Western country with the Berlin Wall torn down as that great American President once urged. I call that a catagorical victory. I leave you with the prediction that Ronald Reagan had in a famous 1982 speech:

"It is the Soviet Union that runs against the tide of history.... [It is] the march of freedom and democracy which will leave Marxism-Leninism on the ash heap of history as it has left other tyrannies which stifle the freedom and muzzle the self-expression of the people."
Ronald Reagan, 1982 (in a speech to Britain's Parliament)

The Soviet Union is "officially in the ash heap of history."

[Lote-Tree]

Yeah it was more of a tangent random thought like oh that reminds me what IS the......

Come Nighty accept the Suprior Wit

[Niamh]

That may be true they were taken by surprise. What does that have to do with whether it was won? The last time I checked the Soviet Union was fragmented into all sorts of countries and Russia has returned as a nation with its central church. Last time I checked none of the countries that were swallowed into the Soviet Union claims to have a communist government or economic system. Last time I checked NATO still existed, in fact now includes Poland, Hungary, Chech, Slovakia, and others, including now the Baltic countries, actuall Soviet Union satellite nations. Last time I checked East Germany is now part of a free Germany consoldated into a Western country with the Berlin Wall torn down as that great American President once urged. I call that a catagorical victory. I leave you with the prediction that Ronald Reagan had in a famous 1982 speech:

"It is the Soviet Union that runs against the tide of history.... [It is] the march of freedom and democracy which will leave Marxism-Leninism on the ash heap of history as it has left other tyrannies which stifle the freedom and muzzle the self-expression of the people."
Ronald Reagan, 1982 (in a speech to Britain's Parliament)

The Soviet Union is "officially in the ash heap of history."

Just because the USSR eventually broke, doesnt mean it was won by the USA. It was never won, just dissipated.

[Riesa]

Bueno! But I was only joking

Si, yo sabia. 'cept some days are better than others when it comes to controlling my deep resentment and malcontent regarding men.

Then we must be two of a kind...I hope there more like us.

Now that is a scary thought.

[Lote-Tree]

Si, yo sabia. 'cept some days are better than others when it comes to controlling my deep resentment and malcontent regarding men.

Men are not that bad - all they want is to be loved
Like the way their mothers did

Now that is a scary thought.

Don't worry the world be a peaceable place if it was like this

[Niamh]

Men are not that bad - all they want is to be loved
Like the way their mothers did

So a mans aspiration in life is to be molly coddled. It all makes sense! (i think i'll become a hermit)