The Power of Beauty

[Lote-Tree]

har har....
Other qualities inspire love as well.

Yes of course :-)

You could equally argue that beauty inspires lust, as it does in many people.

Kath let me put a suggestion to you:

I think there is two types of beauty.

One that inspires love and admiration in us and the other inspires lust only.

I have to figure out the difference yet. But I believe one is based on the symmetry of the form and the other on the exaggeration of that form...

I would be extremely suspicious of anyone professing to "love" anybody else based on physical appearance alone.

Love is a strange thing Kath and I shall open a separate thread on this...I believe love is to do with finding your own idea of perfection in someone else...more later on this...

I believe the political part arises from the way society seems to value appearances over other qualities. Often the images used in advertising and in movies have been altered with photographic enhancements, flattering lighting and digitized improvements, thus presenting a "standard" that is near impossible to live up to.

True. But it is something we have always done. Even in Ancient past women did those "enhancing things". Even painting and sculptures from the past reflect this also...

You posted pictures of Angelina Jolie. Do you suppose those pictures to be spontaneous...meaning do you think she stumbled out of bed looking like that, or did she undergo a makeup session, lighting check, airbrushing and so on. I worked as a makeup artist and I can tell you that makeup can make a huge difference in someone's appearance, never mind the touching up and enhancing of pictures that can be achieved.

But what does that prove? That we yearn for that perfection of Beauty?

This is where personal preference comes in. Kilted said he found Neve Campbell more appealing than Jolie, and of course nobody can say who is more appealing. Everyone is entitled to their own personal opinions and preferences. In my opinion, the two are both pretty, but I also think Campbell is the more interesting looking one.

I believe both posses Symmetry of Form. Both thus beautiful. The fact that Angelina Jolie does nothing for him - does not mean that they don't posses the beauty of the form...

[Lote-Tree]

A few centries ago having a beauty spot(mole) on ones face was regarded as beautiful. People use to draw them on there faces, or glue them on so they too could be regarded as beautiful. Even men did it. So people would do things just to have that slight flaw if it became regarded as 'fashionably beautiful'.

Strange - in some Indian cultures...a black mark is put on babies faces to ward of the Evil Eye...

[kathycf]

I believe both posses Symmetry of Form. Both thus beautiful. The fact that Angelina Jolie does nothing for him - does not mean that they don't posses the beauty of the form...

Where exactly did I say that they both weren't beautiful? I am trying to show how personal preference becomes relevant in how an individual can find one person more beautiful than another. I had quoted Moira in this as well:

I can agree that symmetry plays a role but i truly believe that 'other details' (preferences) are more important.

Let's face it...beauty means different things to different people. It seems you want to have this "objective" measurement of symmetry in beauty and completely ignore the subjective elements that also play a part in how people perceive beauty.

True. But it is something we have always done. Even in Ancient past women did those "enhancing things". Even painting and sculptures from the past reflect this also

That's all fine and good, but the point that I am making is that computer enhancements, special lighting, cosmetic artistry were NOT available until modern times. Even 100 years ago cosmetics could not perform the the illusions that they do today, because of what is available now.

I think there exists in modern society an unhealthy obsession with appearance. Ancient standards of beauty came from Art, today's standards of beauty come from celebrities who are enhanced to within an inch of their lives in all those depictions of "natural" beauty.

Advances in technology are able to create images of impossible perfection and make it seem commonplace. Most people who read through a fashion magazine may not be aware of all the photographic enhancements, cosmetics, lighting and all that other stuff, so they think the image presented to them is natural. Well, it isn't. This bothers me because I have heard teenage girls in the course of my volunteer work say how much they hate themselves because they think that they're ugly since they aren't perfect. That type of thinking leaves scars.

If you want to get an idea of what I mean re: photographic retouching you can view some examples here. You will need to hold your mouse over the picture to see the "before". There are several examples, some subtle and some not so subtle.

[Lote-Tree]

It seems you want to have this "objective" measurement of symmetry in beauty and completely ignore the subjective elements that also play a part in how people perceive beauty.

I am saying that it is the objective element that we can agree on first and then it is the subjective elements like mark on the chin takes over? :-)

That's all fine and good, but the point that I am making is that computer enhancements, special lighting, cosmetic artistry were NOT available until modern times. Even 100 years ago cosmetics could not perform the the illusions that they do today, because of what is available now.

Yes computers were not available then. But have you seen the Temple Sculptures in the state of Rajastan? - those women don't have realistic physique!

I think there exists in modern society an unhealthy obsession with appearance.

I agree on that. But I think we had this unhealthy obession always...

[Niamh]

Wow some of those changes are unreal!

[Moira]

Yes, Kathy, thanks for that link.
Haven't you seen pictures of celebrities with and without makup? Some pictures are really scary.

[manolia]

A person's physical appearance does not create kindness, intelligence, integrity, compassion or any other of the host of qualities that might be considered to be desirable, so perhaps we could say in that sense that "beauty is skin deep" and that there are other qualities besides the physical that make a person "beautiful".

Very well said!

Physical beauty can attract unwanted attention to a person, make them feel uncomfortable. People make assumptions sometimes about pretty people...that they are vain, or not very bright, or they must be very superficial and only think about their looks.

Again, very well said

Lote i am still waiting for this poll of yours

That is I find hard to believe. Women are more scruniser of women Beauty than men! :-)

Lote do you know what they say about generalisations? Anyway, i prefer to scutinise men

I like to believe that Beauty has it's own standard. As long as a face has a degree of symmetry I believe majority will find that face attractive.

I don't agree with that either. There are many gorgeous things in nature which lack symmetry .

Perhaps in the future when we have uploaded ourselves into our computer hard-drives - then photoshoping whould be liking putting your make up - then we can all be beautiful :-) I am just joking but I understand what you say..

That would be nice...for those who need it

Hey as a Computer Programmer - we have created Instant Messengers - we can have a decent conversation now without ever meeting :-)

But think of internet - here we don't see each other's faces - thus the Beauty Barrier is gone. Only thing we have is how we type our words on our messages and how we express ourselves with words. Internet has level the field between the Body Beautiful and the Body Ugly :-) That is a good thing don't you think?

I am afraid that i didn't make myself clear. Sometimes i write half of what i think . I meant that we don't have the same acquaintances so it would be very difficult to compare them and agree to whom we find beautiful and whom not. (As i told you before i think a bit 'foolish' to start comparing hollywood actors).

So you are a Computer Programmer?? I'll blame you the next time i have problems with the software you guys create
So let me guess in your free time you play last generation RPG games, your pc screen is wider that your tv screen, you speak the computer lingo that noone around you understands..and when you watch a dvd with your friends you spend the first hour playing with the sound and colour adjustments till everybody fells asleep and you end up watching the movie alone? Sorry, i was describing my brother

[Lote-Tree]

Lote i am still waiting for this poll of yours

Dear Manolia - I have tried to create one - I just couldn't here on this forum. Can you tell me how to do it?

Lote do you know what they say about generalisations? Anyway, i prefer to scutinise men

It's no generalisations Manolia - I have found women to be more scrutiniser of women than men! And I should know I grew up in a house full of women and I am surrounded by women :-)

I don't agree with that either. There are many gorgeous things in nature which lack symmetry .

Only if you are squint-eyed LOL :-)

That would be nice...for those who need it

You can't get enough of beauty :-)

I am afraid that i didn't make myself clear. Sometimes i write half of what i think

Then you can improve on that quite easily ;-)

So you are a Computer Programmer?? I'll blame you the next time i have problems with the software you guys create

LOL :-) Yes, sure after you have used the "on" button on the computer :-)

So let me guess in your free time you play last generation RPG games, your pc screen is wider that your tv screen, you speak the computer lingo that noone around you understands..and when you watch a dvd with your friends you spend the first hour playing with the sound and colour adjustments till everybody fells asleep and you end up watching the movie alone? Sorry, i was describing my brother

LOL :-)

I am not much of a RPG fan though but I have played RPG in the past. I prefer Multi-player death-match games like Quake, Unreal and Halo with friends. It is far more relaxing after a hard days work and more fun than trying to figure what your magic orb can do in a RPG game :-)

And to have a pc screen that is wider than the TV screen is quite useful to a programmer - you can have many viewable documents all at once.

As for watching DVD - I prefer the Cinema Experience myself so no fiddling with the knobs :-)

[Lote-Tree]

Things you find most beautiful:



Earth seen from the Moon

[Niamh]

thread merged due to similar thread already existing. I know original is about human beauty, but maybe i might be good to keep them together so people can discuss either or, or use human beauty as an example of beauty in nature.
OP from pg 1.

In the context of Human Beauty:

-Beauty is in the Eye of the Beholder
-Beauty is skin deep
-True Beauty is what is inside.

Is Beauty really in the Eye of the Beholder?

[Lily Adams]

I do not like what most people consider beautiful.

I like "ugly" things. I find them beautiful. Really, I do.

Probably because a lot of things people consider beautiful are fake. I much prefer reality.

But if you're talking about things people used to find beautiful, that's another story.