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Thread: Meat Eaters Club

  1. #31
    Vincit Qui Se Vincit Virgil's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Madhuri View Post
    Virgil, I havent read all you posts, but here is something that I have to say:

    There is nothing to be applauded in being a vegan or a meat eater, its just a way of living some people have adopted.
    ...
    I completely agree. I said in the other thread, we in the west probably-and I use that word trying not to imply scientific proof-eat too much meat.

    However, I do think, that being a vegeratian, by default attaches some goodness to this way of eating, which I think is because it does not involve 'killing' animals. This is what I think you are trying to say, that being a vegan doesnt mean goodness, which I understand. The word 'Kill,' is what makes most people think that being a non-vegetarian is not so good (I think that is the primary reason).
    But the killing of animals for food has always been a part of humanity. If there is a religious line of thought that leads one to say it is a higher, more devine plane to not kill animals, then I understand that. But let me tell you some of the vegetarians here in New York that I have met deplore killing of animals and then have no compunction supporting abortion, the killing of unborn babies. But that's another issue which would take us into a political direction.

    Being a Hindu does not mean that person is a vegetarian, it will be determined by the Caste to which he/she belongs. Not all Hindus are vegetarians, and this caste distinction is increasingly becoming less, so you'll find meat-eaters and vegans in all Hindu communities.
    Oh really. I didn't know that. Verey complicated.


    So, just be happy that we have enough to eat and what all we want to eat.
    That is the greatest point of all. Thanks Maddie.
    LET THERE BE LIGHT

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  2. #32
    Vincit Qui Se Vincit Virgil's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by dramasnot6 View Post
    Just to point out The Veggie thread has no intention of establishing a "superior" diet or trying to " I believe it is less healthy to be a strict vegetarian. And I'll prove that as this thread continues." I am in no way in competition or anything and respect everything everyone's lifestyles, eating habbits, EVERYTHING. I AM NOT establishing a holier than thou attitude, i am NOT stating anything is better then anything else. I'm sorry iof anyone was offended or misunderstanding.
    It's more an implied thing Drama. I did not feel you were looking to slight people who are not vegetarians. But I hope you can see that the converse (that meat is bad for you) can be implied. In fact Sleepy said it explicitly in your thread. If no one spoke up to present the other side, a certain belief system would settle in.

    By the way, I'm not a completely crazed meat eater. I have a couple of vegetarian cook books and I do cook non-meat meals. But I do believe that one should not go more than a couple of days without having some sort of meat in a meal.
    LET THERE BE LIGHT

    "Love follows knowledge." – St. Catherine of Siena

    My literature blog: http://ashesfromburntroses.blogspot.com/

  3. #33
    Vincit Qui Se Vincit Virgil's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Koa View Post
    point 1: this forum is getting mad... one thread is started, another one appears in contrast (eg boys VS girls), and they all say the same things...
    You are right Koa. I tried to dissent in the Veggie thread, but I got the feeling I was ruining the thread for others. So I started my own. But in fairness we also have threads that are not split, like the interview thread, or the photos thread.
    LET THERE BE LIGHT

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    My literature blog: http://ashesfromburntroses.blogspot.com/

  4. #34
    Fingertips of Fury B-Mental's Avatar
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    OK, Fish is meat! I know there are people that say, "I don't consider fish meat." Fish is meat, period. You aren't a vegetarian if you eat meat. I don't know why some people treat fish as a non-meat. Some of my research points at the Roman Catholic church. It was the dominant church in Europe for over one and a half millenia. The church had the clean and unclean thing going during lent. Fish that was cured in salt was considered clean meat. It was also one of the easier to obtain foods. Most of the fish was caught and salted on the same vessels, and then shipped to ports around Europe. The funny thing is that the nations that controlled the salt, encouraged the Pope to declare the fish clean. IMO that is the source of this fish isn't meat myth. Anyways, FISH IS MEAT!
    "I am glad to learn my friend that you had not yet submitted yourself to any of the mouldy laws of Literature."
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  5. #35
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    Eat everything that is not poisonous. The Chinese have the right healthy attitude. And look they're very plentiful.

  6. #36
    Memsahib Madhuri's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Virgil View Post
    But the killing of animals for food has always been a part of humanity. If there is a religious line of thought that leads one to say it is a higher, more devine plane to not kill animals, then I understand that.
    hmmm...perhaps....

    If a person does so because they believe in what the religion says, its fine. But, there are some who do it like "Oh, its written in the books." Maybe because they are afraid of what will others say or how will it be taken in the society.

    Like you said, it becomes implied that meat-eating is not so good and vegatarianism is good. I was trying to say the same thing, because the word 'kill' gets attached to it. When somebody says "I am a vegetarian" what is the first thought that comes to the mind....."oh good" These are the feelings that cannot be seperated from either concept. Plz do not take it as if I am advocating that one is good and the other bad.....its just that something by default comes with these concepts.

    But let me tell you some of the vegetarians here in New York that I have met deplore killing of animals and then have no compunction supporting abortion, the killing of unborn babies. But that's another issue which would take us into a political direction.
    no politics.......

    Hey...since this thread started no one has posted any recipe....Dont tell me you guys dont know how to cook.... Or is it that you cannot go beyond 'boiling water'....
    Charms strike the sight, but merit wins the soul.

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  7. #37
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    Some of them would burn the water!!!

  8. #38
    Memsahib Madhuri's Avatar
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    They burn water too... No wonder...
    Charms strike the sight, but merit wins the soul.

    Be the change you wish to see

  9. #39
    Kat in a Hat kathycf's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by B-Mental View Post
    Umm wrong thread Kathy you want the "If it grows shoot it club"
    Eh??? All I meant was that anybody can eat the same old crud whether they are a vegetarian or a meat eater.

    @ everybody:

    I think we need to stop focusing on our differences as forum members and look it the things we have in common. Books, wasn't it?

    No offense to either Virgil or Drama, but for now on I am not going to post in either the veggie club OR the meateater's club. Opinions are great and everybody has them, but it just seems to oversensitive me that this whole thing is getting divisive and I don't like that feeling. So have fun, and I will see you in the chocolate thead or all the other spots I frequent here at LitNet.

    *edit* just to be clear, I am not blaming anybody else here. I am oversensitive and I worry alot and that is the way my mind is. I just worry that people are going to get angry or upset and I don't want to see that happen.
    Last edited by kathycf; 01-21-2007 at 04:10 PM.
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  10. #40
    Vincit Qui Se Vincit Virgil's Avatar
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    Myth #4: Vegetarians live longer. Just the opposite.

    Vegetarians Live Longer And Have More Energy and Endurance Than Meat-Eaters
    Surprising as it may seem, some prior studies have shown the annual all-cause death rate of vegetarian men to be slightly more than that of non-vegetarian men (0.93% vs 0.89%). Similarly, the annual all-cause death rate of vegetarian women was shown to be significantly higher than that of non-vegetarian women (0.86% vs 0.54%). (40)

    Russell Smith, PhD, in his authoritative study on heart disease, showed that as animal product consumption increased among some study groups, death rates decreased! Such results were not obtained among vegetarian subjects. For example, in a study published by Burr and Sweetnam in 1982, analysis of mortality data revealed that, although vegetarians had a slightly (.11%) lower rate of heart disease than non-vegetarians, the all-cause death rate was much HIGHER for vegetarians (41).

    It is usually claimed that the lives of predominantly meat-eating peoples are short-lived, but the Aborigines of Australia, who traditionally eat a diet rich in animal products, are known for their longevity (at least before colonisation by Europeans). Within Aboriginal society, there is a special caste of the elderly (42). Obviously, if no old people existed, no such group would have existed. In his book Nutrition and Physical Degeneration, Dr. Price has numerous photographs of elderly native peoples from around the world (42). Explorers such as Vilhjalmur Stefansson reported great longevity among the Inuit (again, before colonisation). (43)

    Similarly, the Russians of the Caucasus mountains live to great ages on a diet of fatty pork and whole milk products. The Hunzas, also known for their robust health and longevity, eat substantial portions of goat's milk which has a higher saturated fat content than cow's milk (44). In contrast, the largely vegetarian inhabitants of southern India have the shortest life-spans in the world (45). Dr Weston Price, DDS, travelled around the world in the 1920s and 1930s, investigating native diets. Without exception, he found a strong correlation among diets rich in animal fats, with robust health and athletic ability. Special foods for Swiss athletes, for example, included bowls of fresh, raw cream! In Africa, Dr Price discovered that groups whose diets were rich in fatty fish and organ meats, like liver, consistently carried off the prizes in athletic contests, and that meat-eating tribes always dominated peoples whose diets were largely vegetarian (42).
    http://www.vegetarian-diet.info/vege...s-lifespan.htm

    The numbers in the article are footnotes, not ages. This is my final posting as to why vegetarianism is actually less healthy. I hope everyone that has read this and previous posts here now understands that the notion that vegetarianism is more healthy is a perception, a 20th/21st century old wives tale. If you choose vegetarianism, fine, but don't kid yourself that you are being healthier.

    I leave you with this thought. Have you ever seen an olympic or other first class athlete that is a vegetarian? Think about it.
    LET THERE BE LIGHT

    "Love follows knowledge." – St. Catherine of Siena

    My literature blog: http://ashesfromburntroses.blogspot.com/

  11. #41
    Obligatory Seinfeld scene:

    [Old Homestead Steak House]

    HOLLY: I can't believe you've never taken anybody here before.

    JERRY: Well, I'm not really that much of a meat eater.

    HOLLY: . . . You don't eat meat? Are you one of those. . .

    JERRY: Well, no, I'm not one of those.


    (later)


    ELAINE: I mean, she thought it was kind of strange to just order a salad. . . . You know. . . . For a man.

    JERRY: What are you saying? . . . Salad! What was I thinking? Women don't respect salad eaters.

    ELAINE: You got that right.

    JERRY: But you're going over there for dinner tonight, right?

    ELAINE: Um uh.

    JERRY: What is she making?

    ELAINE: I don't know. But I'm sure it had, . . . parents. Call her up. She won't mind if you come.

    JERRY: Oh, don't worry. I'll be there and I'll be packing an artery.
    Optima dies ... prima fugit

  12. #42
    Registered User Nick Rubashov's Avatar
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    There is nothing better than a steak and a baked potato after working your arse off on a farm all day. Nothing.
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  13. #43
    Pièce de Résistance Scheherazade's Avatar
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    In the light of recent misunderstandings and complaints 'the Veggie Club' and 'Meat Eaters Club' threads have caused, those two threads now will be closed.
    ~
    "It is not that I am mad; it is only that my head is different from yours.”
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