Is a perfect world possible?

[PeterL]

Actually, according to modern cognitive sciences, all human minds are, indeed, far from perfect. We come hardwired with hundreds of reality distorting biases from which we construct useful illusions to help us survive and procreate. Besides preventing us from (easily) discovering truths about reality, they also prevent us from recognizing/correcting flaws in ourselves, or recognizing the flaws within the structures (social, moral, etc.) we're either knowingly or ignorantly a part of. Reprogramming/deprogramming these biases is a difficult endeavor for even highly intelligent individuals that are aware they exist; most don't even know they exist. Here's a good academic introduction, or this website if you want something for free.

And what would make you think that those biases and whatever are not enhancements?

Just because you feel that you are other than perfect doen't change the matter.

[MorpheusSandman]

And what would make you think that those biases and whatever are not enhancements?

This has to be one of the funniest things I've ever read on this forum!

A serious (and simple answer): a bias is similar to a logical fallacy in that both are products of reasoning that demonstrably lead to inaccurate perceptions and judgments about reality. Here's one simple example.

Now, in all fairness, one COULD view biases as "enhancements" only in the sense that they developed to aid in survival and reproduction. A good example might be early hunter-gatherers who were biased to assume that there were predators in every shadow, in every rustle of leaves, etc. They may be wrong 99% of the time, but if they always took actions to avoid being eaten, then their "wrongness" was less important than their survival. These days, we don't have to worry much about being eaten by predators, but those biases still persist, and now the wrong answers they're producing demonstrably, almost always negatively, affect our daily lives.

[PeterL]

This has to be one of the funniest things I've ever read on this forum!

A serious (and simple answer): a bias is similar to a logical fallacy in that both are products of reasoning that demonstrably lead to inaccurate perceptions and judgments about reality. Here's one simple example.

Now, in all fairness, one COULD view biases as "enhancements" only in the sense that they developed to aid in survival and reproduction. A good example might be early hunter-gatherers who were biased to assume that there were predators in every shadow, in every rustle of leaves, etc. They may be wrong 99% of the time, but if they always took actions to avoid being eaten, then their "wrongness" was less important than their survival. These days, we don't have to worry much about being eaten by predators, but those biases still persist, and now the wrong answers they're producing demonstrably, almost always negatively, affect our daily lives.

So you know the reasons for all of what you think of as biases and whatevers existing, or so you think, doyou not? And you still think that human minds are "far from perfect". do you not? Do you also know the purpose(s) for the design of the human mind? And how do you define perfection?

[MorpheusSandman]

So you know the reasons for all of what you think of as biases and whatevers existing, or so you think, doyou not? And you still think that human minds are "far from perfect". do you not? Do you also know the purpose(s) for the design of the human mind? And how do you define perfection?

The reason (singular) every bias develops is because it aided in our survival and reproduction while cutting down on our brain's processing time. The fact (not opinion) that these biases lead to inaccurate conclusions/perceptions about reality is proof that the human mind is "far from perfect." The human mind was not designed, it's the product of millions of years of evolution. If it was designed, the designer was completely incompetent, much like many things on a "designed" Earth. Perfection is anything that is lacking in flaws. A perfect mind would be one which completely and accurately processes sensory input, rather than incorrectly interpreting that data through biases that only exist to help early man survive in the wilderness and procreate.

[PeterL]

The reason (singular) every bias develops is because it aided in our survival and reproduction while cutting down on our brain's processing time. The fact (not opinion) that these biases lead to inaccurate conclusions/perceptions about reality is proof that the human mind is "far from perfect." The human mind was not designed, it's the product of millions of years of evolution. If it was designed, the designer was completely incompetent, much like many things on a "designed" Earth. Perfection is anything that is lacking in flaws. A perfect mind would be one which completely and accurately processes sensory input, rather than incorrectly interpreting that data through biases that only exist to help early man survive in the wilderness and procreate.

Well, think what you like. I don't thin that your backup for your opinion is very good, but its your opinion, not mine.

[MorpheusSandman]

There's nothing about my post that is opinion. You may like to tell yourself that to avoid the fact that the human mind is not perfect, but that's just you being a victim of your own cognitive biases and ignoring a reality you find unpleasant to accept. I don't know what you think is lacking in my "backup," considering I have the whole of the cognitive scientific community on my side. You just have your wishful thinking (another cognitive bias, btw).

[Delta40]

I don't think colour even exists. It's all in the mind and light and shadows fool us into thinking what we're seeing is real. Forgive my layman brain btw.

[ladderandbucket]

I think a perfect apprehension of reality would most likely result in despair. I'm not sure that's the kind of perfection the original poster was talking about. Perhaps the perfect world would be one in which we believed this was the best of all possible worlds despite evidence to the contrary.

I guess the original poster was really asking if we can ever have a political utopia. You don't have to read a lot of history to realise that big political ideas never turn out the way they were intended. It seems the more utopian or radical the ideology the more disastrous the consequences. Life is built for conflict, it is not in our nature to be content.

From a less human perspective natural selection seems like a perfect mechanism for producing perfectly adjusted lifeforms. For someone who had no concept of suffering the ultimate perfection of life might seem inevitable. I don't expect the perfection of life will be descended from humans - complex systems are naturally unstable. I guess the perfect world will be covered in some kind of moss or mould, or perhaps it will just be a big lump of rock.

My understanding of natural selection is that it necessitates unimaginable amounts of suffering. I don't see that any compassionate person can predicate a perfect world on natural selection. Makes me think of Ivan Karamazov: "Imagine that you are creating a fabric of human destiny with the object of making men happy in the end, giving them peace and rest at last. Imagine that you are doing this but that it is essential and inevitable to torture to death only one tiny creature...in order to found that edifice on its unavenged tears. Would you consent to be the architect on those conditions?"

So, no. I do not believe a perfect world is possible for us, but we have to make the best of a bad job.

[Eiseabhal]

Ah me I used to be big-headed but I'm perfect now.

[PeterL]

http://www.online-literature.com/for...hal;1242933]Ah me I used to be big-headed but I'm perfect now.

I know the feeling.

[WICKES]

I do not believe a perfect world is possible for us, but we have to make the best of a bad job.

Wise words. If people spent more time trying to be kind, polite and civilized and less time thinking up grand schemes for transforming 'the system' life would be a hell of a lot better. Truth is it's much easier to join a socialist or Green party and go on marches against nuclear proliferation etc than it is to be sympathetic and kind to the people you meet day to day, particularly when they are ugly and stupid and boring. It's how you conduct yourself here and now with real flesh and blood people that makes the difference. I've always liked that saying "if you want to change the world, begin by changing yourself".

[PeterL]

There's nothing about my post that is opinion. You may like to tell yourself that to avoid the fact that the human mind is not perfect, but that's just you being a victim of your own cognitive biases and ignoring a reality you find unpleasant to accept. I don't know what you think is lacking in my "backup," considering I have the whole of the cognitive scientific community on my side. You just have your wishful thinking (another cognitive bias, btw).

Did you read what you posted? What part of it is not opinion?

[MorpheusSandman]

Did you read what you posted? What part of it is not opinion?

Yes, I read what I posted and none of it is opinion. These are facts known by anyone that knows the first thing about neurobiology and cognitive science. Feel free to argue that it's just opinion, but you need to do something more than simply stating that it is.

[PeterL]

Yes, I read what I posted and none of it is opinion. These are facts known by anyone that knows the first thing about neurobiology and cognitive science. Feel free to argue that it's just opinion, but you need to do something more than simply stating that it is.

I hope that you enjoy you alternate reality.

[ennison]

Malthus was wrong. As for a perfect world being possible (other than in our imaginations) I (Sure as Hell) hope not.