The Christian Hell

[skasian]

Totally totally wrong!

Actually, Nicolaus Copernicus lived from 15th to 16th century, Galileo Galilei from 16th to 17th; and Galiliei proved Copernicus theory of heliocentrism.
They both disagreed with Ptolemy on geocentric system, which was in confrontation with RCC inqusition. If you want, I can find some links to prove my statements.

Did you get this straight from your head or can you admit that you did a little research to wrong me out?
You have to forgive me for my inaccurate information I learnt this from school about 3years ago and it seems my memory on that particular lesson is very flawed. Yes I can remember now, Galileo supported Copernicus's not Ptolemy. Thanks for refreshing my form 5 science lesson on astronomy.

[skasian]

No. It has never been proven that there are absolutely no psychics or telepaths in the world.

How do we "prove" that the supernatural do exist? Accounts from eye witnesses seems to be random fake stories to people, documentaries dedicated to such subjects seem to entertain skeptics. Exactly what is needed to prove the supernatural?

[bazarov]

Did you get this straight from your head or can you admit that you did a little research to wrong me out?
You have to forgive me for my inaccurate information I learnt this from school about 3years ago and it seems my memory on that particular lesson is very flawed. Yes I can remember now, Galileo supported Copernicus's not Ptolemy. Thanks for refreshing my form 5 science lesson on astronomy.

I have big head.
To realize that someone said something wrong, you have to be very familiar with what he said.

[Jozanny]

People who do not accept Christ did so at their own choosing and they are put to death.

Statements like these do not even allow the possibility of reasoned discussion.

I am going to regret this, because literature is much loved in my life, but I quit, and leave the forum to such sentiments as these. Anyone who can write that and believe it simply leaves the realm of compassion, mercy, and doubt behind, and to me, beyond amazement. You condemn millions of people in your own mind because you feel so threatened by the possibility of this particular assertion not being so.

When or if this sub-forum is removed, then maybe I will return, but as a disabled woman who believes in the optimism of progressive thought, I can't handle that another human being so relishes the imposition of suffering over a doctrine.

You are on your own Alan. I simply cannot handle this anymore.

[skasian]

I take it then that you didn't see what I said about accurate measurements. Shows my point if that's the best you have.



No.



Sure it does. Creativity is knowing what to look for and interpret results and abstract thinking is designing experiments to observe.



Well, I'm sure I won't be the last to tell you that dictionaries do not confer meanings.



Nope, sorry. Proven countless times to be fake.



How convenient.

As you told me "science is refined rather than changed", you are quite wrong regardless you mentioned accurate measurements in science. The back bone of science was formed by trial and error, and when a rough theory was made, that became the official theory of a particular branch of science until a new theory wronged it. My reference, astronomy, there had to be an idea to be the starting point of a theory. As Ptomely's idea was CORRECTED by Galileo, therefore a branch of science, astronomy was changed. It is true modern science is more about development however the backbone of science was more about corrections, alterations.

"Sure it does. Creativity is knowing what to look for and interpret results and abstract thinking is designing experiments to observe."

Creativity and abstract thinking in science is not all what you may think. It is more about using insight, thinking out the unthinkable. Seeing a blindspot the others have missed. Its discovering things right in front of you while the others are searching too far away. Observation is not a major thing in science, its more about twisting the brain in an uncanny way the next person wont be able to try. Mendel father of genetics didnt start observing pea plants until he commenced to consider an aspect or idea no one else thought of before. What is the point of observing if you do not understand what hypothesis is?

The definition of atheist? Let me explain my definition of it. Non religious person that does not believe in the existance of God or not a follower of God.
If my definition is inadequate, please feel free to add or alter.

I have thought about the method of proving an aspect that is hard to understand and believe. How do you prove such things and do you think such proof are adequate to give sense of belief to people?

[skasian]

I have big head.
To realize that someone said something wrong, you have to be very familiar with what he said.

Beg your pardon, who is "he"?

[bazarov]

Beg your pardon, who is "he"?

Sorry, ''her''.

[skasian]

Sorry, ''her''.

Ah dont apologise. Did I seem like a "he"?

[bazarov]

Ah dont apologise. Did I seem like a "he"?

No, no, no!!! I know you're pretty 18 year old girl, 1,80m height and less then 50kg
I was just taking generally.

[skasian]

No, no, no!!! I know you're pretty 18 year old girl, 1,80m height and less then 50kg
I was just taking generally.

Ah~ Sorry for being misunderstanding!

Err,,actually Im pretty short, 1.67m in height, how did you think of 1.80?!?

[bazarov]

Uffff, sorry! You're still tall for Korean; and a woman so be happy!

[weltanschauung]

I am a devoted Christian, and I have been asked similar questions about hell by many atheists or people that are interested in becoming a Christian.
We believe that hell exists as a realm that is inexplicable in terms of eternal suffering, pain and agony and because there is no sense of time or space, there is no way out forever. Hell is governed by satan and devils and they inflict abhorrent terrors unimaginable.
Now many people have asked the question who goes to Hell and why do people go there when God does cherish each and every one of us, and how come good people in the world that dedicate their life for other people can also go to hell.
The answer is that they do not have belief and faith in God, Jesus.
No matter how many good deeds you do in life, if you do not confess Jesus as your God then you go to Hell. Harsh, but true.
In order to be saved from hell, theres only one way, and that is Jesus once again. Jesus is the bridge between our world and Heaven, and without Him, you may not enter Heaven.
I know that God hates to see that His children have to suffer in Hell forever, but the ones that do not know him and love Him must be punished eternally.
I have been thinking about the people in the world, the ones that it is not their fault that they do not know God. I wondered what will happen to them. I thought it was not fair for them to miss out the good news about Jesus and how He can be their salvation. But it is evident in the Bible that it is us, Christians' duty to spread the good news about Jesus to these people that never heard about Him. I am still not sure what will happen to those people who it isnt their fault that they do not know Him, but one thing I am sure is that we must spread the Word about God.
Then it is up to them to whether to have faith with him and begin to have the greatest relationship with Him which will change their lives forever. See the love of God. See the glory of God. See how we are priceless in the eyes of the Lord. From then on, they will begin to get closer to God, and get closer to the His Kingdom where they will serve and share the joy together with God.

"Harsh, but true."
phillipe, tanto tempore vobiscum sum, et non congnovistis me?

"I know that God hates to see that His children have to suffer in Hell forever, but the ones that do not know him and love Him must be punished eternally."

its wonderful how christians think of god as a huge angry bearded guy that lives in the clouds...
o luce qui mortalibus lates inacessa deus! in lumine tuo videbimus lumen!

l'enfer, c'est les autres...

[Pendragon]

I would like to add to this discussion simply because I believe that God is loving and he gives everyone the chance to accept him or not. It's not his fault if a person goes to hell for their sin of not accepting him. We are given a choice...freely. I do think that hell is a place that will be destroyed along with its followers after Christ comes back (for the people who have accepted him as Lord and Savoir.) The reason I don't believe in someone burning forever is because in Revelation it says that the devil and his followers will be devoured and consumed. What does consume mean? I also think no more sin will be left so when it's consumed it will be gone forever. My take on it.
Cat

BINGO! Just what I stated before, and still ignored by people who wish to believe that hell is eternal. It is punishment for a time, then destruction for good, which is what consume means. Our God is a consuming fire!

[The Atheist]

I did not mention anything about a millennia now did I?

Yes you did; you clearly mentioned "when god returns" and you do it again in a second.

Given that even Paul [?] said it would be "soon" and that's 2000 years back, I think it's silly to presume he'll be here within millennia, even now.

I believe when God comes back the disbelievers and satan will be destroyed. That's how and why I call Him a loving God. They had their whole life to accept or not.

Yes, that is indeed a loving god - one who loves his creation so much that they must bow down before him or he'll fry you.

I must try that with my kids.

God created us to live a wonderful life..one free of sin.

This is simply absurd. If god created us to not sin, why create sin?

Is your god that dumb that he can't see a contradiction there? It would be like me giving my kids a loaded pistol and say "don't touch the trigger".

Man chose to sin and Satan was the creator. He knows he is going to die by fire and he is trying to get as many people taken down with him as he can. He is mad and angry and wants others to suffer so he decieves us if we let him. God is not the creator of sin.

Nope, sorry. If the god created Satan, he surely created the ability for Satan to sin. You just cannot have this both ways - if the god created everything then, it certainly created the sin.

Why would a creator want his people to rebel against him? He would not. He loves us and wants our love and obedience.
Hugs, Cat

Love and obedience, eh? Yet people who disobey him but repent get to go to heaven.

As I keep saying, that's a strange sort of being and one which I wouldn't worship if it were real.

How do we "prove" that the supernatural do exist? Accounts from eye witnesses seems to be random fake stories to people, documentaries dedicated to such subjects seem to entertain skeptics. Exactly what is needed to prove the supernatural?

An example of it happening.

When millions of examples of claims exist, but not a single instance of actuality, I'm pretty ok with saying it's beyond reasonable doubt.

You are on your own Alan. I simply cannot handle this anymore.

Can you just not come to this section? Just stick to the literature part?

It'd be a shame to lose you because some people have distasteful beliefs.

But at least it shows what I've been trying to say - that telling someone they're going to fry because they failed to bow down to a god is pretty hateful and unpleasant.

(To say the least)

Go well, whatever you choose and remember that I've always got a virtual shoulder for ya. We don't see eye to eye on everything, which I think is probably a good thing - but when things do matter, I'd give you anything I could.

Au revoir, cherie!

My reference, astronomy, there had to be an idea to be the starting point of a theory. As Ptomely's idea was CORRECTED by Galileo, therefore a branch of science, astronomy was changed. It is true modern science is more about development however the backbone of science was more about corrections, alterations.

*sigh*

What you're saying actually proves my point, but you seem to have missed that. In fact, it's quite obvious that you haven't understood the subject of science in any meaningful way, so I'll just leave you with your misconceptions.

The definition of atheist? Let me explain my definition of it. Non religious person that does not believe in the existance of God or not a follower of God.
If my definition is inadequate, please feel free to add or alter.

That's fine, stick with it.

I have thought about the method of proving an aspect that is hard to understand and believe. How do you prove such things and do you think such proof are adequate to give sense of belief to people?

Proof is easy. When something works, has been peer-reviewed and can be replicated, then I'm happy with calling it proven.

[Cat_Brenners]

My answered prayers have been proven over and over. That's proof for me!
Yes. I do mention when Christ comes back and He will some day. Hope everyone is ready and does not have to face the punishment of not accepting him.
God did not create sin. Satan did and God is loving because he lets us make those choices. He does not want puppets on a string and make them love him or obey. We have that choice and satan clearly made his choice. And satan wants followers to his fatal end in hell.
Repent means to mean it. Not just do something and say I can do it again later. You have to be sincere and try with Gods help. God helps us when we pray and call on him.
I think it's a shame that someone would leave this forum just because someone believes what they do. That's sad. Does it mean if they don't believe as you do that you are angry and running? Please stay! No reason to leave. We all have beliefs of some sort and I am not leaving because you believe different.

Hugs, Cat