Help for scansion, please?

[Bitterfly]

Is this the whole poem? If there was more, I could codify it more, but generally it seems like "free verse" if such a term can be used. Note, I didn't use \ for half-stressed, or lesser-stressed syllables, because I don't scan like that, but if I did, a pattern may have been more apparent.

Yes, I was wondering if it could be free verse. And no, it's not the whole poem, there are three other stanzas, with the same irregularities.

As it is, this poem is not relying on its metre for structure, but rather on its images. The skeleton mimics speech more than verse.

Absolutely!

I think syllabic, now that I read it over, must be the thing Larkin was trying for, though I don't know how successful it is.

I like your idea! Unluckly, after having counted the syllables in the next stanza, it doesn't really work, even though most of the lines add up to seven. That said, I suppose it's normal to find syllabic regularity (since most feet contain two or three syllables).

edit, do you scan holiday as two or three syllables? My accent feels like it is three.

I'd say three - and impossible to make it two!

'bank' will always be stressed. notice that 'gust bank ho' does not have the anapestic feel to it: it's kind of stuccato. for me it's:

An/August/ Bank Ho/liday lark

that way it conforms to the trimeter scheme. but then, i'm not sure.
tricky stuff from Mr. Larkin. have you read 'digging'?

No, I haven't, but I certainly will if you mean it's good!
I think I just like that last line read without the stress of Bank better... probably because it bothers me to have an extra foot.

No, they aren't. The poet does his best to make this poem as irregular as possible in terms of meter. (Note there is no rhyme, either.) I do not know who gave you this task. But in my opinion (as an English teacher) one should ask students to do scansion only for poems that ar fairly regular. The task at hand does not make any sense as there simply are no feet. They can only be made out in a regular meter.

Ah, you think there aren't any feet... Does that make it free verse, as JBI suggested?
In fact, it's not a precise assignment, just one of the things we do first for each class when studying a poem.

[barbara0207]

It is definitely free verse, bitterfly. You have found that by negation, i.e. by not finding any regular meter.

[Bitterfly]

Ah, thanks! I was never quite sure what free verse exactly is! Sounds stupid, but I've studied many more poems with regular meter, so...

[Epistemophile]

how free can a verse ever be?does this degree of 'freedom' decide poetry's descent into prose?

[barbara0207]

how free can a verse ever be?does this degree of 'freedom' decide poetry's descent into prose?

Not necessarily. It has still got the other essentials of poetry: original imagery, condension of thought; and, in form, almost all free verse poems are split into lines, which - if well done - should add to the meaning.

[JBI]

Not necessarily. It has still got the other essentials of poetry: original imagery, condension of thought; and, in form, almost all free verse poems are split into lines, which - if well done - should add to the meaning.

Free verse isn't free, it just doesn't adhere to classical measurements. There is nothing free about Walt Whitman's verse, as everything is chosen for the feel, sound, and effect. The idea that free verse doesn't require metric skill to write is a myth. Free Verse, to be done well, requires as much, if not more skill to pull off.

[barbara0207]

Free verse isn't free, it just doesn't adhere to classical measurements. There is nothing free about Walt Whitman's verse, as everything is chosen for the feel, sound, and effect. The idea that free verse doesn't require metric skill to write is a myth. Free Verse, to be done well, requires as much, if not more skill to pull off.

Agreed - apart from the expression 'metric skill'. The term 'metric' is too much tied to the classical measurements that I don't like its use for free verse. The poet needs a very good feeling of rhythm and sound to create a meaningful and beautiful unity of poetry. It certainly does not do to simply write a piece of prose and split it into lines. Anyone can do that.

Perhaps we can agree on the following: 'free' means 'free from classical measurement'. It can be harder for the poets. They do not have to obey traditional forms but they have to find a form of their own which fits the content perfectly. Being free always means more responsibility ...

[JBI]

Agreed - apart from the expression 'metric skill'. The term 'metric' is too much tied to the classical measurements that I don't like its use for free verse. The poet needs a very good feeling of rhythm and sound to create a meaningful and beautiful unity of poetry. It certainly does not do to simply write a piece of prose and split it into lines. Anyone can do that.

Perhaps we can agree on the following: 'free' means 'free from classical measurement'. It can be harder for the poets. They do not have to obey traditional forms but they have to find a form of their own which fits the content perfectly. Being free always means more responsibility ...

That being said, scansion isn't impossible for free verse, as I think I somewhat showed when I scanned this poem. You can find some interesting things scanning almost any good poet, regardless of form.

That being said though, that hideous trend they call concrete poetry doesn't scan at all.

[JBI]

Just to continue the conversation on free verse scansion: take this example from Eliot's The Wasteland:
U***/*****/
The river sweats
/**u***/
Oil and tar
*U***/*u***/
The barges drift
u****u**/**u**/
With the turning tide
*/***/
Red sails
*/
Wide
*u**/**u***/****u*u**/**u**/
To leeward, swing on the heavy spar.
*u**/**u***/
The barges wash
*/**u**/
Drifting logs
/******u***/***/ (note, not to sure how to stress Greenwich)
Down Greenwich reach
/****u**/**u**/
Past the Isle of Dogs.
(note this line can be scanned many ways, as Wagner's pronunciation is probably different than Eliot's intended one)
/**uuu*/*u
Weialala leia
/**uu**/uuu
Wallala leialala


u/*u*/***u***/***u
Elizabeth and Leicester
*/***u**/
Beating oars
*u***/***u***/
The stern was formed
u**/**u**/
A gilded shell
/****u**/
Red and gold
u***/****/
The brisk swell
/***u**/*****/
Rippled both shores
**/****/***/ *
Southwest wind
*/**u***/****/
Carried down stream
*u***/**u**/
The peal of bells
**/***/**u
White towers
/**uuu*/*u
Weialala leia
/**uu**/uuu
Wallala leialala

/ means stress, u means unstressed, and *are to be ignored.
(I hope I didn't butcher it too hard, I'm a little tired, and I did this rather quickly)

But I think we can discern from this quick scansion (there must be some mistakes in there, I can't quite see them now, but I know some parts didn't feel right). That there is an iambic pulse running through the piece. Even free verse such as this seems rooted and structured. The sound created though, is better understood once you read it with the stresses in mind, and sort of piece where the reader stops, or slows down pace (around the multiple-stressed units, and punctuation) to understand the feel of the poem. Free verse, therefore, as I hope to have shown, doesn't really break free of anything. And as a poet such as Eliot's talent is concerned, is rather more highly thought, I would think, than metrically restricted poetry. Just think of the requirement in playing with sound and form that isn't allowable in closed-forms. The structure, therefore, must be precise and solid if the poem is to work.