D.H. Lawrence's Short Stories Thread

[Janine]

Yes, night on the town. I always enjoy that. Got to eat at a Mexican restaurant, which for some reason we don't have on Staten Island. Had a big margarita. And then we stopped at this Barnes and Noble that is a block or so away from the Philharmonic. It's got four floors of books. Actually I stopped at the magazine section, something I hardly ever do, and they had a huge collection of literary magazines. I hadn't even heard of many of them. I didn't buy any but it was cool to go flip through them. At least I know where to go to explore magazines for literary submissions, if I ever get so bold.

As to the story, are we up to the section where they go inside Wini's apartment?

Soon we are getting to that part.....I think it is next; but I need tonight off now....it is getting late. I can try and post something tomorrow, but I am a nervous wreck...unsure what tomorrow will bring. The baby might be on the way on Tues or this week. I can explain later. Today was her due date, you know. I am doing laundry right now and tired out. I might be summoned to the hospital anytime this week; just talked to my son. Just warning you, if I should disappear and you wonder where I wandered off to. Find me at the hospital nursery

Virgil, they don't have Mexican food on Staten Island? get out?! That is odd. I am glad you enjoyed your big margarita, and Mexican foold....ummmm.
The B&N sounded like a 'book lover's dream'. What kind of magazines, and just why did you say you had to be 'bold' to check them out again? I am really suspicious of you now... Are you being truthful or talking in a fog of code? hummm...you have me wondering now....literary magazines... indeed!

[Quark]

I still see her as a temptress, with no desire for a relationship or marriage.

I'll have to consider this question of her motives further. Doesn't L say something like the kiss was all she wanted. That does make her sound like a temptress, but I have a difficult time reconciling that with the portrait we get of her in other scenes. If she's merely interested in Coutts sexually for that night, why is she jealous of his relationship with Connie? Why is she so timid, too? I would think she would be unabased about this if she were a temptress.

[Dark Muse]

I am not sure if I see her as truly being "jealous" in the normal sense. Really I think she is just messing with Coutts, becasue I do not think she beleives Coutts should marry period. Though also she does not really want Coutts to herself, at least not in the comitted relationship sense.

[Virgil]

Soon we are getting to that part.....I think it is next; but I need tonight off now....it is getting late. I can try and post something tomorrow, but I am a nervous wreck...unsure what tomorrow will bring. The baby might be on the way on Tues or this week. I can explain later. Today was her due date, you know. I am doing laundry right now and tired out. I might be summoned to the hospital anytime this week; just talked to my son. Just warning you, if I should disappear and you wonder where I wandered off to. Find me at the hospital nursery

Oh best of luck. I probably won't be on much this week. I have guests from out of town visiting at work and a major presentation to brief. I'll be missing much of this week I'm afraid.

The B&N sounded like a 'book lover's dream'. What kind of magazines, and just why did you say you had to be 'bold' to check them out again? I am really suspicious of you now... Are you being truthful or talking in a fog of code? hummm...you have me wondering now....literary magazines... indeed!

Janine you've got such a dirty mind. Perhaps I was ambiguous but I meant now I know what magazines exist to submit some of my writing to. Go back and read what I wrote. I did not mean anything along the lines you are implying.

[Quark]

I am not sure if I see her as truly being "jealous" in the normal sense. Really I think she is just messing with Coutts, becasue I do not think she beleives Coutts should marry period. Though also she does not really want Coutts to herself, at least not in the comitted relationship sense.

Jealous is probably too strong of a word. I'm not sure what I mean. I don't know why I'm even arguing against her being a temptress since I was the first person to call her that. I think I'm just reacting to the idea that Winifred's and Coutts' relationship is purely sexual. There seems to be some attraction that isn't purely libinous. It says Coutts love and hates her. That half that is love I don't think is merely sexual.

[Janine]

Jealous is probably too strong of a word. I'm not sure what I mean. I don't know why I'm even arguing against her being a temptress since I was the first person to call her that. I think I'm just reacting to the idea that Winifred's and Coutts' relationship is purely sexual. There seems to be some attraction that isn't purely libinous. It says Coutts love and hates her. That half that is love I don't think is merely sexual.

Here is what I have been saying and questioning all along. No, Quark you are not using too strong a word in 'jealous' - I do think that Winifred is jealous of Connie. I don't see this as a purely sexual attraction on Winifred's part. It may be on Coutts but I doubt that as well. If you go back and read my prior posts you will get more insight into what I am saying. Dark Muse and I actually have been debating this part in quite a number of posts. I agree with you in that the text does clearly state that is was a love/hate relationship - go back and check that part of the text. I quoted it in my post, too. It said they feel back into the same old love and hate relationship - something like that. If it said love then there was not purely this sexual shallow thing between them. She may be toying with him but not in a shallow sense - she is really working hard to get him back. I see him falling under a certain spell but where do we see that she is a true temptress? Where did that word come from and who said it first? Oh, no I see you have owned up to it. I did not realise you said it first. Was it in the actual text or even implied? I don't see her that way entirely and if I can relate her to one that is where the analogy stops. She may be playing this game as a temptress would but in actuality I think that Winifred would like Coutts back, but on her terms and not his. His are the sexual terms; hers would be something more meaningful, even if not marriage, but at least a kind of commitment. I no way see Winifred as a loose woman or a promiscuous woman. She might be just as nice a girl as Connie but more progressive in here thinking.

[Dark Muse]

LOL yes it is true, me and Janine, have been going back and forth upon the issue as I am inclined to belive thiat thier relationship is basically a shallow one, that is not really founded on anything "real" I agree with what Antiquaria says about Winni, mostly just wanting to control men, and Coutts in particular, I do not think they really love each other, and think theres is more of a sexual attraction. Though I do not think they have acutally been sexually intimate, I do think they are driven more by the physcial tension between them, than anything else. I do not think they really have any interest in being in a relatiosnhip with each other.

[Quark]

If you go back and read my prior posts you will get more insight into what I am saying. Dark Muse and I actually have been debating this part in quite a number of posts.

I've seen the back-and-forths between you two, but I was replying specifically to Antiquarian's post. I thought that was a good place to start since that's what set off the most recent debate between you and DM. Like I say, I have to look into this more; but, when I do, I will respond to all the views on this point.

temptress? Where did that word come from and who said it first? Oh, no I see you have owned up to it. I did not realise you said it first. Was it in the actual text or even implied? I don't see her that way entirely and if I can relate her to one that is where the analogy stops.

Yes, it was me, but I forget what led me to call her that. I'll go back and look.

[Janine]

I've seen the back-and-forths between you two, but I was replying specifically to Antiquarian's post. I thought that was a good place to start since that's what set off the most recent debate between you and DM. Like I say, I have to look into this more; but, when I do, I will respond to all the views on this point.

Yes, this whole contraversy is giving me a headache by now. I don't even know how important it is to the story. I just know that Lawrence tried to 'make it' with several 'modern' thinking women who turned him down, so I am drawing from that knowledge. I don't think he and Winifred were totally shallow with each other. Afterall, he enjoyed her music and appreciated it. If you go back and look at the text that I posted (their walk across the country to her place) things may become clearer to you. I don't think any of the women that Lawrence knew were 'shallow type' women; so I can't imagine him writing about one here; again I am drawing on a huge resource of prior knowledge. I don't feel shallow people talk to each other in the manner that these two individuals are speaking. Of course, they are playing a verbal game but it is very much a game full of wit and intelligence. If it were purely 'sexual' this is not how they would be speaking to each other, even in the early 1900's. No, this is more of a power struggle game, not a purely a sexual game. If the conversation was all about sex and only sex I don't think Coutts would be interested, he is not that type of guy. He knew this girl well from another time; they had a relationship. How can things be totally sexual and shallow when you had a relationship at one time with that person?

Yes, it was me, but I forget what led me to call her that. I'll go back and look.

See how rumors get started!

Anybody else having internet problems on here? I was attempting to post something - actually an edit in the Chekhov - and it refused to go through at all; other posting is soooo slow, I think I will fall asleep.
Besides that, I have to get offline now. We are having a kind of theatening windstorm and might have lightning as well. I better unplug, and soon...a power surge killed my connection once and now I unplug to be on the safe side.

[Dark Muse]

Anybody else having internet problems on here? I was attempting to post something - actually an edit in the Chekhov - and it refused to go through at all; other posting is soooo slow, I think I will fall asleep. Besides that, I have to get offline now. We are having a kind of theatening windstorm and might have lightning as well. I better unplug, and soon...a power surge killed my connection once and now I unplug to be on the safe side.

When I was trying to view the latest post to the Chekhov thread, it would not go through, the screen just came up blank white

[Janine]

Oh best of luck. I probably won't be on much this week. I have guests from out of town visiting at work and a major presentation to brief. I'll be missing much of this week I'm afraid.

Oops sorry I missed you, Virgil, and went right to Quark, last poster. I missed Dark Muse, too...hi DM ....and yes, we are still in opposition - we might have a kind of love/hate relationship ourselves by now. and

Janine you've got such a dirty mind. Perhaps I was ambiguous but I meant now I know what magazines exist to submit some of my writing to. Go back and read what I wrote. I did not mean anything along the lines you are implying.

Who me?... never! well read your post, it does read kind of funny; it was rather sketchy to the thought you would enter something into the magazine. I did not see that idea there at all. Ok, lets review your text and underline key words:

Actually, I stopped at the magazine section, something I hardly ever do, and they had a huge collection of literary magazines. I hadn't even heard of many of them. I didn't buy any but it was cool to go flip through them. At least I know where to go to explore magazines for literary submissions, if I ever get so bold.

So here is how I read that -

"something I rarely do is go flip through magazines I never heard of; but, I did not buy any, (sounds kinda sneaky to me) even though they were cool to explore with their literary submissions; I may get bold someday!"

Well, I guess I didn't get the 'submissions' part down in my mind or what relationship that would have to you. I formed a totally different impression of what you wrote here. You are a riot, Virgil!

[Dark Muse]

Oops sorry I missed you, Virgil, and went right to Quark, last poster. I missed Dark Muse, too...hi DM ....and yes, we are still in opposition - we might have a kind of love/hate relationship ourselves by now. and

LOL yes probably

[Janine]

When I was trying to view the latest post to the Chekhov thread, it would not go through, the screen just came up blank white

Quess what? I just checked and now it is working, but very slowly and my post edit did go through, even though I got that white page, too. Something odd has been going on in here lately. Are they upgrading their system?

[Virgil]

Oops sorry I missed you, Virgil, and went right to Quark, last poster. I missed Dark Muse, too...hi DM ....and yes, we are still in opposition - we might have a kind of love/hate relationship ourselves by now. and




Who me?... never! well read your post, it does read kind of funny; it was rather sketchy to the thought you would enter something into the magazine. I did not see that idea there at all. Ok, lets review your text and underline key words:


So here is how I read that -

"something I rarely do is go flip through magazines I never heard of; but, I did not buy any, (sounds kinda sneaky to me) even though they were cool to explore with their literary submissions; I may get bold someday!"

Well, I guess I didn't get the 'submissions' part down in my mind or what relationship that would have to you. I formed a totally different impression of what you wrote here. You are a riot, Virgil!

Well, what did you think I meant by submissions? I don't usually take nude photograghs of myself and submit them.

[Virgil]

It wouldn't help if you did, Virgil, no matter how good you look.

We've never had people submit nude photos with their stories and novels, but sometimes very good looking people will send in a photo of themselves. I think it's gotten them a few dates, but no acceptances of their material. LOL

Really? What i meant was that I think Janine thought I was flipping through the x-rated magazines. At least that's what i thought she meant.