who is the most overrated writer ever?

[aeroport]

Of course it is always possible to discover critical opinions by great authors that suggest the failings of another master. I almost would have expected as much of James. In almost every way Whitman's poetry goes counter to the highly ornate (some might say overwrought) perfectionism of form, the Baroque, excessively Latinate and even obscurantist language, as well as the sense of reserve... with regard to an open display of feelings... especially sexual... as favored by James (How's that for a Jamesian sentence?) One can imagine James turning up his nose at this crass and unsophisticated country bumpkin who would be poetic visionary. Of course H.G. Wells is no less favorable in his opinion of James... and his critical opinion is direct and to the point... unlike James own criticism of Whitman, referring to his prose as something akin to a "hippopotamus laboriously attempting to pick up a pea that has got into a corner of its cage."

Personally I am able to admire both writers greatly.

How full of Truth your posts always are, stlukesguild!
It's kind of interesting, though, that, in this case, James seems to have been a bit ahead of himself. That was written when he was relatively young, certainly before any of his own "important" works were written (well before Portrait, even). Yet, later in life, he seemed to take up something of an admiration for Whitman. Here's a passage from Sheldon Novick's recently completed bio, discussing reading and literary discussion at Edith Wharton's house:

Someone spoke of Walt Whitman, Leaves of Grass was fetched, and James read while the others sat rapt.
When he read Whitman, James seemed to be speaking directly from his innermost self. His stammer vanished, and he read with unaffected emotion, chanting to emphasize the rhythms of the songs. When he came to the elegy for Lincoln, his voice deepened with emotion, and at the passage that begins "Come lovely and soothing death," his voice "filled the hushed room like an organ adagio."

I'm not sure, but I'm assuming the details (and closing quote) of this passage come from Wharton's A Backward Glance.

[Etienne]

I have learned spanish well enough to read Neruda and others in the original though I am by no means even slightly fluent with it.... And it so immensely beautiful in the original...

Alright, was only making sure

I am curious though, as I refuse to read poetry in translations (besides a few exceptions), are Neruda and Borges hard to read? I'm also not fluent in Spanish although I can read a bit, mostly Borges fictions, in bilingual editions though.

but you are a little harsh here, I do believe, even though I do like how you worded your attack ... I think translations do hold some value.. and judgements of translations are worth something.. a translation can be amazing... whether a language into english, or english into another language... it is irrelevant... what matters is there is still much of the original poet there, enough to decide to like it or not... to love it or not... to draw one into looking at it in the original language... or so I believe...

Yes, there are good translations, and if one likes the translation, probably the original would be at least as good, but a translation can also be bad (for different reasons, the first often being untranslatability) and how does one know whether the translation is good and the original bad or a bad translation to a good original if he hasn't read the original? And even over this, in any translation, especially in poetry, there is something lost.

A better translation than the original is not excluded (it is often said that Dostoevsky is better in translations, for example) but they are the exception, and undoubtedly a subject of harsh debate.

[aeroport]

I think perhaps Jane Austen...
*don't hurt me!*

Whoa, you mean there are women who think this as well...?

[JBI]

You are all a bunch of mis-readers. The question isn't who do you not like, it is who is overrated. Logically there is no such thing as overrated, but that's a different discussion. In relation to the conversation, the real meaning of the thread must be discerned as "Who do you think has too big a reputation for the amount of skill as a man of letters that they posses/possessed. Saying you don't like Whitman isn't a logical argument. That does not relate to the topic, only shares your babbling stupidity.

Whitman, as it has been proven, has earned a significant reputation which can be supported by his influence on almost all Western poetry after him. Comparing him to Neruda doesn't even come close to an accurate argument, because a) Neruda came later, and b) they wrote in different languages.

If you compare, however, Whitman to his contemporaries, The Pre-Raphaelites, Emerson, Longfellow, Thereau, Wilde, Tennyson, the Brownings, Arnold, and Emily Dickinson, you will note that he stands above almost all of those poets easily.

Dickinson is probably his closest contender, but she resides in a separate place because of the rare circumstance of her life and work. Relative to the other American contemporaries named, Whitman easily is the best, hands down. The big 3 Victorians are good, but their influence was far less, and their significance far less.

Whitman as an American poet outshines everyone who came before him, without question. Whitman as a poet of the world, outshines almost everyone who came before him writing in English, with the exception of perhaps 10 names. Unless you can give me names of contemporaries of his who have had better success as poets, I consider this conversation over.

[Mutatis-Mutandis]

It looks to me like StLukesGuild just has a problem with people who have conflicting opinoins to his own. I mean, come on, some of us don't like Walt Whitman. How many times does Islandclimber have to say he respects and appreciates Whitman, but doesn't enjoy his writing? It sucks that isn't enough for you, but you can't force someone to like a poet.

Please read my posts a bit more closely before making statements that are in no way supported by what was written... or stick with your Stephen King.

Haha, I'm sure that is the first of many SK jabs, lol. I misread your posts, and as many will come to learn, I sometimes jump to judgment, post a smart-*** reply, and later regret it. My apologies.

And now, back to SK. I think a character is going to be raped by a gun barrel soon, I can't wait!

[rintrah]

Has anyone mentioned Paul Coelho?

[Mockingbird_z]

why?
i dont think he is overrated, just famous now. no one claims him to be the greatest or something. or am i mistaken?

[rintrah]

You are right. He's certainly isn't rated highly as a literary author - sorry for venting a little frustration!

[Etienne]

why?
i dont think he is overrated, just famous now. no one claims him to be the greatest or something. or am i mistaken?

Actually many people do claim he is the greatest or something.

Extract from a conversation with an otherwise very nice guy:
Him: "I like Coelho very much."
Me: "I've read The Alchemist, and I really didn't like much."
Him: "Well it's because it's philosophy, many people don't understand."
Me: "Ehmm... no, it's not really philosophy... but hey look at that bird (I didn't really say this, can't remember what it was, but an abrupt change of subject.)"

[aeroport]

Has anyone mentioned Paul Coelho?

For several pages a while back, if I'm not mistaken...

[superunknown]

I don't think JK Rowling and Dan Brown really belong in this topic. Their writing is not serious literature, it's entertainment, and they don't claim to be writers in a literary sense. The prose exists solely for the sake of the plot.

[NotWoodhouse]

I'd have to nominate Nathaniel Hawthorne.

[moose gurl]

True, but the topic wasn't "What important writer is overrated?" It was "Who is the most overrated writer?" and whether their writing is entertainment or not, it still qualifies as writing and it's largely overrated. Dan Brown's stories aren't even good. JK Rowling has some story-telling merit, but her first novels were just bad as far as writing is concerned. She definitely evolved as a writer and a storyteller.

[unleashed]

hi, new around here and trying to fit in.

has anybody mentioned Dan Brown?

[moose gurl]

Hahaha, only about a billion times.
Welcome to the club.