Originally Posted by Adolescent09
Thank you. I am greatful for your kind words.
Thank you. I am greatful for your kind words.
"I believe in Christianity as I believe that the sun has risen, not only because I see it, but because by it I see everything else." - C.S. Lewis
The erroneous belief in evolution is both a by-product of and a cause of atheism. There are those who think it is off-topic to notice the effect this has on communities and societies. The UK (temporary thing) is today darker and worse off as a result of the clouds of atheism. Only in those areas where Christian communities survive is there sustained sacrificial charity and the blood doner units know where to go if they want blood - and it's not into the heart of darkness in the modern UK. Off topic? No way! But bound to offend some as the truth always does
Discrimination against atheists is seen once again. {edit} Come to the US and watch christians beat up and harass atheists because they don't believe in God. Who's the wrong one there? Are you saying atheists lack morals? {edit}
Last edited by Scheherazade; 05-05-2007 at 04:29 AM. Reason: personal remarks
Just because religion does some good - even if it does a lot of good - it doesn't make it right.
That's the problem. I like and admire many chrsitians and I will be the first to tell you that many christians are good-hearted, generous people. So are many atheists.
I would be enormously surprised if atheists and humanists aren't every bit as generous and good-hearted as christians. The problem is with "apathetic agnostics" or the non-religious who just don't have any interest in the eternal verities. The lowest common denominator of society, if you will. Unfortunately, many christians, as well as being generous and good-hearted, tend to lump those non-religious people in with atheists as a group, which in terms of a descriptor, is fair, but in terms of philosophy, is not.
An atheist - to me (and I am, after all, THE Atheist) - is a person who has looked at the evidence for and against gods and has reached a decision that the "god" option is an empty shell. Much as christians will argue that only xyz are True Christians, I resent being classed with people who are too lazy or too ignorant even to think about these questions.
I know sufficient atheists [as described] and christians to be able to assure you that they are every bit as humanist and caring as any christian.
Go to work, get married, have some kids, pay your taxes, pay your bills, watch your tv, follow fashion, act normal, obey the law and repeat after me: "I am free."
Anon
You know, Hyper, not every Christian is out to harass you. I have been a Minister since 1982. My stand on this issue has always been clear-- I believe in God and that Creation took place. I believe that God's creatures have since evolved, and continue to do so. I call no one by any bad names, and step in for the defense if others do. If you can point out any place where I have offended, I will make it right with you. That's as fair as a man can be. I stick by my word. You have a nice day. You may rest assured that even though you cannot believe in God (which I do not hold against you, why should I, pray tell?), I will still pray for you. If I cannot show kindness, I am not much of a Christian.
God Bless.
Pen
Some of us laugh
Some of us cry
Some of us smoke
Some of us lie
But it's all just the way
that we cope with our lives...
Without the existence of christians there would be no charity in the world.
Right.
And the four billion plus people on earth who are not christians spend their time either ignoring each other, or callously using each other as merely objects and means to an end.
Right.
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When donkeys fly.
<As far as I'm concerned, the truly "childish mind" is the mind that decides that all of reality should be defined by that mind and that mind alone.>
So I take it, for you, all of reality is not defined by your religious beliefs then?
Creating a wider narrative around silly notions certainly does not improve the prospects of those notions. Besides, what makes you think that there isn't such a narrative associated with a belief in fairies?
To claim that christianity was not based on pre-Christian mythology you would need to demonstrate some kind of immunity to the Roman and Greek influences that would have been a daily occurrence in the days of the gospel writers. Bearing in mind that at least one of the New Testament writers was Roman himself, I would suggest that is a tall order.
Faith is believing what you know ain't so - Mark Twain
The preachers deal with men of straw, as they are men of straw themselves - Henry David Thoreau
The way to see faith is to shut the eye of reason - Benjamin Franklin
The teaching of the church, theoretically astute, is a lie in practice and a compound of vulgar superstitions and sorcery - Leo Tolstoy
Maybe you don't discriminate against atheists, but many Christians do.
I believe in God as well, but I on the other hand took the leash off my collar.
Last edited by hyperborean; 05-08-2007 at 04:59 PM.
I replaced the word 'gender' with 'religion' in Judith Butler's Gender Trouble
and nothing happened. It still didn't make sense.
The Bible is nothing more than a code of ethics, which many people claim to live their life by, but don't - me included.
Why does anyone care if God exists or not? It's not like you have to believe that He exists to live by a code of ethics -- and even if you could prove that he exists, then what? Are we going to be contempt and quit living life because we know the end? Is He going to come to my anti-birthday party?
' Oh, Jesus got so drunk and pushed over the poker table. Some weird Freudian problem he has'
The issue seems to be enlightenment - solving philosophical problems is enlightenment for us (see Plato); but should it be? What happens in Lear:
Nothing! x5
and nobody can explain the same word repeated five times.
So find enlightenment elsewhere? Hmm. I wonder where? Maybe in literature? We all like books, right?
I believe in evolution, but not evolution as an answer. I believe there is no answer, and therefore we shouldn't go looking for it since there is no proof. Everything in a sense is relative, and one cannot even proof that existence exists.
Not by my beliefs, no; by God? Yes.
"Silly" to you. Provide me the narrative associated with fairies that attempts to answer to cosmic questions that Christianity does, please.
Suggest away - because the Bible tells us that God implanted "eternity" in our hearts and an awareness of God; as such, it is perfectly reasonable for Lewis to argue that prefigurations of Christ were anticipations, not models, of the myth-made-real to come.
"I believe in Christianity as I believe that the sun has risen, not only because I see it, but because by it I see everything else." - C.S. Lewis
Fundamentalism 101: god exists, QED.
.
Go to work, get married, have some kids, pay your taxes, pay your bills, watch your tv, follow fashion, act normal, obey the law and repeat after me: "I am free."
Anon
But what is the point of it all if you can't verify this cosmic origins that you speak of and you say you does not need verification - so all this is quite meaningless isn't it? You might as well believe in anything - even the Great Elephant Tree in the Sky because you don't have to verify it.
I sent my Soul through the Invisible,
Some letter of that After-life to spell:
And by and by my Soul return'd to me,
And answer'd "I Myself am Heav'n and Hell :"
Blog: Rubaiyats of Lote-Tree and Poetry and Tales
Why don't you address my challenge instead of telling me about the unverifiability of my position (which I have never, for the record, claimed).
"I believe in Christianity as I believe that the sun has risen, not only because I see it, but because by it I see everything else." - C.S. Lewis
If there were a narrative associated with fairies that attempted to answer cosmic questions, or moral ones for that matter, would that make its account on fairies any more credible?
I could make up that sort of book right now if I wanted to; the only difference between that hypothetical book and any other holly book would be its age and populartity; give it a couple of thousand years and maybe my book would be as credible as the bible.
Besides, why should popularity add credibility to anything?
Last edited by Guzmán; 05-09-2007 at 04:20 PM.
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