Revels before Lent

[SleepyWitch]

hehe, thanks for all the trouble you take reading my story!

I've come up with something to make it better. will type it up in a second and post it. If you haven't reread it yet, wait for the new version

[SleepyWitch]

I've uploaded the revised version (spello correction will follow.).
I've highlighted the major changes and the following passage is on pages 18/19 but I'll quote the new version for your convenience:
_______________________________________________
Julia made towards the door. Bernhard didn't move.
"There's one more thing." He put his arms around her and held her very gently. Julia gasped and blushed furiously. Should I.. no. She returned his embrace. He was only a little taller than her. She could feel the warmth of his skin through his shirt. He ran his index finger down her nose and let it rest on her lips. Julia trembled. She closed her eyes. "There's nothing wrong with your smile." he said. He kissed her on the forehead.
"I'm sorry I called you dull." she whispered. It was out before she knew what she was saying.
"It's OK. I'm used to it. "'The whore' calls me that all the time." Bernhard said softly. He could not ban a touch of sadness from his tone.
So he had overheard everything she had said on the telephone. Was I right about Irmgard and the tennis guy? Something in his expression told her that he did not want to talk about it. She rested her head on his shoulder. All the thoughts she had kept at bay while she marked her papers raced each other in her mind now. Does he know about 'the whore'?... Is he out for revenge? Tit for tat? No, not him. How do you know?.. I.. I just do.
They were still standing there holding each other close. E-mail Nadine? No, decide for yourself! Julia remembered as a fact what she had said to Bernhard in the afternoon. The memory was a tiny globule of light just beneath the bone of her skull, between her eyebrows. She somehow knew what she had said, but the memory felt like something that had happened to someone else a long time ago...too much happening all at once… accident.. conference…this. When she tried to focus on it, the tiny globule twisted and dodged. It resisted analysis.
"Uncle Bernhard, you truly are the dullest person I've ever met…" her own voice echoed in her head. "I've ever met, but.. but. Access denied. Access denied. Please specify your query.
Bernhard was still holding her. How warm he feels! Access denied. Don't rationalize, Frau Doktor. This is not a term paper, it's life. Take it or leave it. Life…blood… rushing… warmth…breath… feel. Why? When? Something in the way he said it. "You go to work and..". Access denied.
"I find it confusing, too." Bernhard stated.
Then he let go of her, turned around and walked down the dim corridor. Julia followed him. By the time they reached the dining room and sat down with Aunt Irmgard and the children, his eyes were pale and expressionless once more.
___________________________________________

feedback, Uncle Virgil? Schoko?

hehe, I'm ready to discuss A n C now

[Virgil]

Wow, just read the post here, and it is very intense now. I like it. This part gave me goose pimples. That is very good writing, Sleepy. Almost like D.H Lawrence.

Uncle Bernhard, you truly are the dullest person I've ever met…" her own voice echoed in her head. "I've ever met, but.. but. Access denied. Access denied. Please specify your query.
Bernhard was still holding her. How warm he feels! Access denied. Don't rationalize, Frau Doktor. This is not a term paper, it's life. Take it or leave it. Life…blood… rushing… warmth…breath… feel. Why? When? Something in the way he said it. "You go to work and..". Access denied.

But I still have to re-read the whole story. I'm not sure this scene was prepared. It seemed to come from no where. Although I suspect it was me reading it poorly.

[SleepyWitch]

Hehe, good old Virgil. thanks for taking so much trouble...
i don't think it's your 'fault'... it's my 'cyberpunk' way of writing.. too fastpaced etc.

this scene is on Tuesday when he comes to her room to tell her dinner's ready.
the other key scene about their relationship is on Wendesday, but it's too vague and needs brushing up...
or maybe, in the context of this revised passage, it's no longer too vague now??

[Virgil]

Sleepy I read the second draft.

Quick typo that didn't get corrected. In the second paragraph it should be "two" metres, not "to" metres.

Let me preface this by saying this is just my opinion; chuck it if you don't agree.

Now that I understand the story I can see why I was confused a bit on the first reading. First let me say that the re-write is an improvement. You needed to get Uncle B more fleshed out and in conflict with Julia. But I have structural issues with the way you work the story. I beleive the story really starts on page 8 (?, pages weren't numbered) with the paragraph:

Uncle Bernhard opened the door. He looked puzzled for a split second. "Oh it's you. I didn't expect you back this early. Come in." he said.

(1)The story is about Julia's relationship with the Uncle and to start off with that street scene and the Aunt's background is to project a different story line. I think you also feel compelled to give a lot of information about Julia. The reader will identify with Julia; the story is told from her point of view. I don't mean to say drop the background of the first seven pages. I think you have to take what's important and back fill it in.

(2) I also feel that anything that doesn't have to do with either the carnival or the relationship with the Uncle is fat, and sometimes distracting fat. Either you have to cut the fat or build the "flesh" around it. And here the flesh is the carnival and the uncle.

(3) The natural climax is that powerful scene between Julia and the Uncle on the bed. That is a great scene. Nothing comes close to its power after. But that comes six or seven pages from the end, a full 25% of the story is still to occur. Everything after that seems anti-climatic. Nothing after that seems like a climax. The story peters to its conclusion because you feel compelled to give each day of the week some due.

(4) I thought the ending with the CD was bad. I'm sorry. I hope I'm not hurting your feelings. I don't mean to. I feel harsh in saying that. First, it's corny and overly emotional. Second, it tells you the theme like pinning a tail on a donkey. A reader shouldn't have to be told. Third, it's another appendage, it's not the story.

And so it feels like you have appendages at the beginning and appendage at the end with the core of the story buried.

Let me guess at how I think you envisioned this. I think you envisioned it as a novel rather than a story. This seems more like a novel compressed than a story. The vision of a novel would be Julia's experience, as it went through a complex series of events that makes up her new being. The vision of a story is different. It is a tale, a story for lack of a better word. It focuses on a concentrated event and in no way can it be comprehensive. The art of a story is the art of telling a anectdote, a tale, a story. I think your vision was too comprehensive and it dissipated the story.

But let me conclude. You have the core of an outstanding story. A powerful relationship. I feel you need to reconceptualize it.

[SleepyWitch]

ok.. i can cut out the song if you thinks it's corny. i can live with that it was just a silly idea anyway

let's see what i can do about the first seven pages. i'm not too happy with them either, but at the moment I don't have the time/inspiration to get rid of them and restructure everything.
Please keep calling it a draft to remind me it needs a lot of reworking!

hehe, don't worry about hurting my feelings. I'm a very lazy witch and i need people to kick my *ss and remind me to work hard. I tend to write stuff up and leave it the way it is and make up excuses so I don't need to change it.

I don't mean to say drop the background of the first seven pages. I think you have to take what's important and back fill it in.

sorry, you lost me there. what does "back fill it in" mean?.
do you mean the opening line of the story should be when he opens the door and the first seven pages are shortened and then maybe fill in in a different place? Like Julia could remember what happened on her way to the town?
like this:
actual chronology:
Julia and her friend drive to this town and there's the accident with the boy - she stays with her relatives whom she hasn't met in ages - there's the carneval and her conference - the Bernhard thing - she goes back home

present draft: same as above

new version: B opens the door - stuff happens in the same chronology as above - somewhere in between Julia has a flashback/remembers what happened on her way there (and Sleepy links it to the main plot in some way, e.g: Julia is still shocked about the accident/her life is full of stress anyway--> so she can't think straight about B.) - Julia goes home and Sleepy cuts the corny donkey's tail????

bah, Virgil you're such a strict teacher

hehe, i more or less agree with you, except everybody else tells me the story is great (except Schoko, who liked the first part better than the second).... but then "everybody else" are my friends in real life and they'd shout "Great, we love it!" if I wrote "Fish have gills."

Let me guess at how I think you envisioned this. I think you envisioned it as a novel rather than a story. This seems more like a novel compressed than a story. The vision of a novel would be Julia's experience, as it went through a complex series of events that makes up her new being. The vision of a story is different. It is a tale, a story for lack of a better word. It focuses on a concentrated event and in no way can it be comprehensive. The art of a story is the art of telling a anectdote, a tale, a story. I think your vision was too comprehensive and it dissipated the story.

guilty as charged. I'm too lazy/ don't have the time to write a novel, but I'd like to have great characters anyway

[arhem, why do you keep calling it "the scene on the bed", they are not on the bed, but in the doorway ]

hum, what about the passage where Juila wakes up in the middle of the night in her room? i hoped that would become clearer in the light of the "scene on the bed", but apparently it hasn't .... grrrrrr, I'll have to change it then and include loats of tacky allusions

~THANKS~

[Virgil]

ok.. i can cut out the song if you thinks it's corny. i can live with that it was just a silly idea anyway

let's see what i can do about the first seven pages. i'm not too happy with them either, but at the moment I don't have the time/inspiration to get rid of them and restructure everything.
Please keep calling it a draft to remind me it needs a lot of reworking!

Well, don't just cut indiscrimantly. Think it over and plan how you want to work the background info.

hehe, don't worry about hurting my feelings. I'm a very lazy witch and i need people to kick my *ss and remind me to work hard. I tend to write stuff up and leave it the way it is and make up excuses so I don't need to change it.

Frankly I don't think you're lazy at all. You did a lot of work in a short amount of time.

sorry, you lost me there. what does "back fill it in" mean?.

Oh I meant that you have to work the details that you cut in somehow, through exposition, dialogue, flash back. However you feel comfortable. A little of each perhaps to provide variety.

do you mean the opening line of the story should be when he opens the door

I thought that was a good place to start. Perhaps the paragraph before. But the story should sart with them meeting.

and the first seven pages are shortened and then maybe fill in in a different place? Like Julia could remember what happened on her way to the town?
like this:
actual chronology:
Julia and her friend drive to this town and there's the accident with the boy - she stays with her relatives whom she hasn't met in ages - there's the carneval and her conference - the Bernhard thing - she goes back home

present draft: same as above

new version: B opens the door - stuff happens in the same chronology as above - somewhere in between Julia has a flashback/remembers what happened on her way there (and Sleepy links it to the main plot in some way, e.g: Julia is still shocked about the accident/her life is full of stress anyway--> so she can't think straight about B.) - Julia goes home and Sleepy cuts the corny donkey's tail????
[COLOR="RoyalBlue"]

There are a number of approaches. Why not have the Uncle pick her up rather than the aunt? This way you get more Julia/Uncle interaction. If you feel that the street scene is important (I guess the blood is a thematic element) does it need to be getting picked up at the beginning of the week? How about driving home with Uncle driving or just in the car on the way back from Carnival? You'll have to rearrange some ot these things. But ask other people's opinion too.

bah, Virgil you're such a strict teacher

Oh, I'm not. I would be such a softy as a teacher.

[arhem, why do you keep calling it "the scene on the bed", they are not on the bed, but in the doorway ]

For some reason I thought they were sitting on the bed. I just checked, they're not. Was it in draft number 1? Sorry. That might make it more intense if they are sitting on the bed.

hum, what about the passage where Juila wakes up in the middle of the night in her room? i hoped that would become clearer in the light of the "scene on the bed", but apparently it hasn't .... grrrrrr, I'll have to change it then and include loats of tacky allusions

Yes, shouldn't that come before? As an anticipation? Or you can transition into the ending from there if you want to leave the story with Julia desiring her Uncle.

I think you will have to ask yourself how do I want to conclude this? Do you want Julia to have an insight into Uncle's person or do you want her to go away desiring him? If it's the second, that could be tricky because it introduces a future possiblity that could leave the reader hanging.

~THANKS~

your welcome. It's been fun reading and thinking about it.

[SleepyWitch]

hehe, I've thought of a preliminary solution. Will write it later on today after my courses...
It's not as good as it should be but I think it will make it a little bit better...


hehe, "desiring her Uncle"... that's exactly the point... this scene when she wakes up is AFTER ... *nudge nudge* *NAUGHTY*.... so I will have to change it to make it clear what they've been up to meanwhile (He comes to her room with the tea and photos in the evening and when she wakes up it's 3.07 a.m.!!!! ...plus the aunt returns from her adventures at the tennis club...)

[Virgil]

hehe, I've thought of a preliminary solution. Will write it later on today after my courses...
It's not as good as it should be but I think it will make it a little bit better...


hehe, "desiring her Uncle"... that's exactly the point... this scene when she wakes up is AFTER ... *nudge nudge* *NAUGHTY*.... so I will have to change it to make it clear what they've been up to meanwhile (He comes to her room with the tea and photos in the evening and when she wakes up it's 3.07 a.m.!!!! ...plus the aunt returns from her adventures at the tennis club...)

Are you saying they slept together? I didn't catch that at all. I must be so naive. But I just went back to read it, and I can't find even a suggestion. You'll have to make that clearer.

[SleepyWitch]

yep, I know... the question is: how do I do that without using tacky clichéd allusions?
hehe, but you did interpret this scene as her desiring him... so that's OK... a little ambiguity is fine with me... i wouldn't mind if the passage could be read as either (desiring him or 'AFTER')... ideally, I'd like to create some ambiguous tension so that the reader is aware of both possibilities but can't be sure what happened.
as it seems, I've already succeeded in that you don't catch what happened now all i need to do is make the reader aware that there are two options

[SleepyWitch]

second revision is up.
my very preliminary 'solution' to the problem of the two plots is inserted on page 7.
I've also brushed up the 'on the bed' passage (p.20) and numbered the pages

[Virgil]

OK, I'm not sure if I'll get a chance until after the week end. I'll try.

[SleepyWitch]

take your time birthday-boy
I've just mailed it to a friend who's going to do a PhD in literature maybe she can sort out my mess

[Virgil]

take your time birthday-boy
I've just mailed it to a friend who's going to do a PhD in literature maybe she can sort out my mess

Actually my afternoon just freed up, so I will look at it. As to PhD's looking at creative writing, urrgh. Once literature is established, lit professors have some contribution. Otherwise they would all be Shakespeares. But frankly most couldn't tell a good creative work from a hole in the wall. Unless of course they are creative writers themselves.

[Virgil]

Sleepy, I have a question which I kept forgetting to ask. In the third scene where Aunt Irmgard picks them up, why did you shift point of view. Everywhere before and after that scene you tell the story from Julia's point of view, except for that scene. Not that you can't do that, but shifts of point of views are startling and usually need a rationale. Given that you don't do that anywhere else, it makes that scene stand out, and I'm not sure why.