LitNet Poetry Book To Be Published!!

[desiresjab]

Smash hits are popular.

Since we have already stated how high the standards are on a poetic level, that cancels in advance any concessions to popularity by way of relaxing those standards. Yes, all smash hits are popular by definition. The kind of smash hit we are looking for is also a quality piece. That just means it says something and it says it well, in a way that others besides the author can relate to. Sometimes people speak their feelings perfectly well to their own satisfaction, without realizing no poetry was made in the process.

The big test on any piece is to try reading it aloud to someone. If there are any spots where you cringe and wish you could leave that part out for now--or at least explain mid stream what you just said--the poem still needs work. Imagining reading it to someone is not the same same, and does not work. You have to actually read it to them.

[YesNo]

Perhaps you should create your own journal or books and invite people to submit poems to them. That would not involve lit net as a whole. Then you could publish what you want to read.

[Danik 2016]

.....

[Danik 2016]

If you allow me a suggestion, it would be good to establish objective criteria. If you refer to high standards as opposed to garbish people may shy away.

[desiresjab]

Perhaps you should create your own journal or books and invite people to submit poems to them. That would not involve lit net as a whole. Then you could publish what you want to read.

Don't be silly, I am not going to start a journal. If we can get this thing going on LitNet, fine, otherwise I do not have time. I already prefer to spend my time writng rather than promoting. This it, this is my concession to all that workshopping, networking and appeals, that one million books and articles on the subject say an aspiring author must spend his or her time on. This is it, and it is for everyone with a shot. We are coming. I guess. Are we? You don't souind like you are coming or even breathing hard. Come along now. We musn't have you tearing down the enterprise and backing away before it is even started. What will the volk think of you?

[DieterM]

I’ve given this project some more thought. I still consider it to be a jolly good idea because there’s a whole bunch of poetry gems hidden in the Personal Poetry section, and there’s a whole bunch of highly talented people out there who’d deserve to be published and read.

I’m flattered, YesNo, that you’ve thought I could play the editor’s part. But even though that would be a very rewarding “job” for anyone, I must confess that I’ve got the same problem Lokasenna and even desiresjab already mentioned – to be editor of such an enterprise is too time-consuming for one single person. Just take a look at the 653 pages the Personal Poetry section contains! If you do the maths, that makes over 16.300 poems at the very least (it’s probably more because some guys such as haunted or angliholic etc. have created threads where they’ve posted several poems)! Who could possibly sift through all this? Of course you can count on me for doing the layout part if the project gets to that point.

Anyway, I don’t think that a sole editor/selector is a good idea. If this is going to be a LitNet anthology, it should be a LitNet project too. Moreover, I only joined in 2010, YesNo as well, desires jab in 2014 – the Personal Poetry section goes as far back as 2003, so there must be many first-rate poems that we haven’t read but that another LitNet member remembers!

On the other hand, I don’t think that a voting system or a system where each poet submits some pieces of her/his own “production” is the solution either.

This said, how about getting things rolling? Debates are nice and comfy, but what if we actually got started? Here’s what I suggest:

1. First of all, establish guidelines and process. Things should be crystal-clear before we submit the project as a nice and tidy package to those who run the forums.
2. Contact mods and admin to put the project forward for consideration. I don’t think we can go anywhere without the site owners giving their “thumps up”. It’s not only a question of using the name “LitNet” but of making it a real “LitNet” project. If you agree, I’ll contact them and gently “haunt” them until we get an answer. If the answer is “No”, then that’ll be it. But if it’s “Yes”, we can get down to work.
3. Open a thread. Give it a title along the lines of “Treasure hunt” or something like that. Explain the whole project. Section for the thread to be determined at that point – probably the Personal Poetry section, I’d say, and, if the admin/mods allow it, secondary threads linking to that main thread in several other sections in order to draw attention to the project. Each of us might/ought PM their friends too and ask them to participate.
4. Main rule: people are asked to post a list of up to five poems they consider to be their alltime LitNet Personal Poetry favourites. No LitNet member should submit more than one list. People should be allowed to include one poem of their own literary production (but only one; mere selfpromotion is not what we’re aiming at).
5. Set a deadline. We’re in no hurry and want to include as many first-rate poems as possible so I’d suggest a date in autumn.
6. Create a reading & selection committee. I have no idea as to how members should be appointed, to be honest. Suggestions/names are welcome! What speaks for a committee is the fact that, if suggestions come flowing in as I hope, a single person would be overwhelmed by the job (most of us have daytime jobs, after all).
7. If a poem is submitted by several members, we can consider it to “have made it” into the final selection (unless committee members come up with serious arguments against the poem).
8. Once the final selection is made, contact the authors to ask for their permission to include their work in the anthology.
9. Create the book (layout, proofreading etc.). I am willing to do the layout. I also have quite an experience with proofreading English texts, but I think the book should be proofread by more than one person. We want high quality after all, and I am but a fallible human being. ;-)
10. Definitely it should be hard copy plus ebook. I suggest we use the services of that well-known big company whose name reminds of a South American river ;-) Not because I have shares in that company but because it’s really simple to use and thus convenient.
11. Question: what do we do with any proceeds of sales? We should have a clear idea before even submitting our project to the admin, mods and site owner(s). Specific suggestions anyone?
12. Promotion of the book. Again, all of LitNet should participate. Most of us have social media accounts. We should therefore create some sort of promotional wave all over Facebook, Twitter, google+, PinInterest and other whathaveyounot-dot-coms once the book is available for sale.

That’s as far as I got. Remember, I’m only suggesting things, everything’s still open to debate. But I do think we should roll up our sleeves and get things started.

[tailor STATELY]

Well thought out DieterM.

Using Your-Favorite-Poems-from-fellow-Lit-Netters: http://www.online-literature.com/for...ow-Lit-Netters might be a good start since the poems submitted for the thread are by those other than the poets who wrote the poems. This takes us back to July 2007 where some of the poets have since drifted away; although

I'd still be worried about the permissions of those who can no longer be contacted, or who no longer participate like paperleaves, hillwalker, hack, and PrinceMyshkin (and so many others, sigh).

Ta ! (short for tarradiddle),
tailor STATELY

[desiresjab]

I’ve given this project some more thought. I still consider it to be a jolly good idea because there’s a whole bunch of poetry gems hidden in the Personal Poetry section, and there’s a whole bunch of highly talented people out there who’d deserve to be published and read.

I’m flattered, YesNo, that you’ve thought I could play the editor’s part. But even though that would be a very rewarding “job” for anyone, I must confess that I’ve got the same problem Lokasenna and even desiresjab already mentioned – to be editor of such an enterprise is too time-consuming for one single person. Just take a look at the 653 pages the Personal Poetry section contains! If you do the maths, that makes over 16.300 poems at the very least (it’s probably more because some guys such as haunted or angliholic etc. have created threads where they’ve posted several poems)! Who could possibly sift through all this? Of course you can count on me for doing the layout part if the project gets to that point.

Anyway, I don’t think that a sole editor/selector is a good idea. If this is going to be a LitNet anthology, it should be a LitNet project too. Moreover, I only joined in 2010, YesNo as well, desires jab in 2014 – the Personal Poetry section goes as far back as 2003, so there must be many first-rate poems that we haven’t read but that another LitNet member remembers!

On the other hand, I don’t think that a voting system or a system where each poet submits some pieces of her/his own “production” is the solution either.

This said, how about getting things rolling? Debates are nice and comfy, but what if we actually got started? Here’s what I suggest:

1. First of all, establish guidelines and process. Things should be crystal-clear before we submit the project as a nice and tidy package to those who run the forums.
2. Contact mods and admin to put the project forward for consideration. I don’t think we can go anywhere without the site owners giving their “thumps up”. It’s not only a question of using the name “LitNet” but of making it a real “LitNet” project. If you agree, I’ll contact them and gently “haunt” them until we get an answer. If the answer is “No”, then that’ll be it. But if it’s “Yes”, we can get down to work.
3. Open a thread. Give it a title along the lines of “Treasure hunt” or something like that. Explain the whole project. Section for the thread to be determined at that point – probably the Personal Poetry section, I’d say, and, if the admin/mods allow it, secondary threads linking to that main thread in several other sections in order to draw attention to the project. Each of us might/ought PM their friends too and ask them to participate.
4. Main rule: people are asked to post a list of up to five poems they consider to be their alltime LitNet Personal Poetry favourites. No LitNet member should submit more than one list. People should be allowed to include one poem of their own literary production (but only one; mere selfpromotion is not what we’re aiming at).
5. Set a deadline. We’re in no hurry and want to include as many first-rate poems as possible so I’d suggest a date in autumn.
6. Create a reading & selection committee. I have no idea as to how members should be appointed, to be honest. Suggestions/names are welcome! What speaks for a committee is the fact that, if suggestions come flowing in as I hope, a single person would be overwhelmed by the job (most of us have daytime jobs, after all).
7. If a poem is submitted by several members, we can consider it to “have made it” into the final selection (unless committee members come up with serious arguments against the poem).
8. Once the final selection is made, contact the authors to ask for their permission to include their work in the anthology.
9. Create the book (layout, proofreading etc.). I am willing to do the layout. I also have quite an experience with proofreading English texts, but I think the book should be proofread by more than one person. We want high quality after all, and I am but a fallible human being. ;-)
10. Definitely it should be hard copy plus ebook. I suggest we use the services of that well-known big company whose name reminds of a South American river ;-) Not because I have shares in that company but because it’s really simple to use and thus convenient.
11. Question: what do we do with any proceeds of sales? We should have a clear idea before even submitting our project to the admin, mods and site owner(s). Specific suggestions anyone?
12. Promotion of the book. Again, all of LitNet should participate. Most of us have social media accounts. We should therefore create some sort of promotional wave all over Facebook, Twitter, google+, PinInterest and other whathaveyounot-dot-coms once the book is available for sale.

That’s as far as I got. Remember, I’m only suggesting things, everything’s still open to debate. But I do think we should roll up our sleeves and get things started.

Thanks for the thoughtful response. I had about given up on anyone taking it more seriously than fine lip service.

I believe we should not worry about poems from old members a decade ago who may not be findable anymore. Getting permission would be too much work. If they are still alive and interested, they will find their ways back.

Realistically, we may be able to martial ten poets from among ourselves now. Five or six poems from each, and there is a book. We are not going to find thirty or fifty people who can write a world class poem. If we are unable to produce fifty world class poems we should scrap the project in a hurry.

It really does appear to me that the admin is going to take no interest whatsoever. For the moment we might save our breaths. I offered the people free critiques, but few have taken the offer. Most people interested in literature are not trying to create it. That is the way it has always been.

[desiresjab]

Well thought out DieterM.

Using Your-Favorite-Poems-from-fellow-Lit-Netters: http://www.online-literature.com/for...ow-Lit-Netters might be a good start since the poems submitted for the thread are by those other than the poets who wrote the poems. This takes us back to July 2007 where some of the poets have since drifted away; although

I'd still be worried about the permissions of those who can no longer be contacted, or who no longer participate like paperleaves, hillwalker, hack, and PrinceMyshkin (and so many others, sigh).

Ta ! (short for tarradiddle),
tailor STATELY

I looked at some of that thread a while back. It was not good, as far as I got, which was only about 4%. Let the people submit what they think is their best, we are not drag boats. That being said, if someone knows of a special poem somewhere in the archives, we will try to obtain it, of course. I know of several.

[DieterM]

@tailor STATELY: the thread you're talking about could be a good start although I'd still prefer to start a new one for the book – if only to create some new interest because that thread has been very quiet as of lately. I know that many people have left this forum and I share your *sigh* where PrinceMyshkin and hillwalker are concerned because I always enjoyed reading their input, no matter if it was some new bit of their own production or if it was a comment on one of mine; didn't get to know the other two ones.

Now where permissions are concerned, things are simple: poems without permission (for whatever reason) shall not be included, full stop.

@desiresjab: I hear you re. "world class poems". What I had in mind was not to ask people to write specific pieces for the anthology we're discussing here but to use whatever world class poetry can be found in the Personal Poetry section. And my main concern is about resources. We could "martial ten poets" as you say, doing it just the two of us, say. That would mean the whole book would rely on two people with regards to their personal taste, the time they can spend on the project, the network they have built when it comes to promoting the book etc. What good would it do if we published a world class poetry book and no one knew about it?

I for one will ask my LitNet friends if they could spare an hour or so and join our project (there are only eight people listed as my friends, however, three of whom at least having left the forum). Hawkman for instance is someone who not only has written several pieces I really enjoyed but who has a very fine-tuned sense for other people's poetry too. Moreover his taste is different from mine. I love Jerrybaldy's view on poetry; I enjoy Delta40's stand. We shall have variety, I think. I wouldn't want the book to only reflect my taste or yours.

[Danik 2016]

I can already devise two sections of the anthology: one made up of a selection of poems specially submited by the poets and another maybe bigger one made up of a selection out of the archives both voted by LitNet members.
As there probably are people that are not used to evaluate poetry it would be good to establish some objective criteria (the originality and quality of the images, rythm, rhyme, adequate form x content, use of language, etc.)
In time, I myself could help with the selection but I am not going to submit any poems. English is my third language and I feel much more at home with prose than with poetry.
What I can´t devise as now is where the funds for the project are coming from.

[desiresjab]

@tailor STATELY: the thread you're talking about could be a good start although I'd still prefer to start a new one for the book – if only to create some new interest because that thread has been very quiet as of lately. I know that many people have left this forum and I share your *sigh* where PrinceMyshkin and hillwalker are concerned because I always enjoyed reading their input, no matter if it was some new bit of their own production or if it was a comment on one of mine; didn't get to know the other two ones.

Now where permissions are concerned, things are simple: poems without permission (for whatever reason) shall not be included, full stop.

@desiresjab: I hear you re. "world class poems". What I had in mind was not to ask people to write specific pieces for the anthology we're discussing here but to use whatever world class poetry can be found in the Personal Poetry section. And my main concern is about resources. We could "martial ten poets" as you say, doing it just the two of us, say. That would mean the whole book would rely on two people with regards to their personal taste, the time they can spend on the project, the network they have built when it comes to promoting the book etc. What good would it do if we published a world class poetry book and no one knew about it?

I for one will ask my LitNet friends if they could spare an hour or so and join our project (there are only eight people listed as my friends, however, three of whom at least having left the forum). Hawkman for instance is someone who not only has written several pieces I really enjoyed but who has a very fine-tuned sense for other people's poetry too. Moreover his taste is different from mine. I love Jerrybaldy's view on poetry; I enjoy Delta40's stand. We shall have variety, I think. I wouldn't want the book to only reflect my taste or yours.

The reason I want to include more by our poets than can be found in the poetry section is because I believe by and large that people have not shown their best but only things they are working on. Their best pieces would be held back in hopes of legitimate publication.

I would like to see this project happen. I would like to be part of it.

What happened to those lost members? Did they die, or did they just give up? It seems likely this project would interest them.

Since someone has to act first, I do not mind doing it. I feel I should start the thread right now that you suggested, just to get things underway. But maybe you or another should do that. I will try it, and if the thread does not take off, then maybe another thread will.

What will happen? Will the selection process take place publicly right there in that thread, or outside of it and privately?

[desiresjab]

Here we are back over in the original thread as per Dieter's sagaciaous suggestion, where some may want to resume the hows and whats discussion of the LitNet Poetry anthology, or whatever it shall be called.

[Danik 2016]

To avoid confusion, I'm adding the other thread, which contains a lot of submited poems.
http://www.online-literature.com/for...96-submit-here
Seems we are all a bit lost how to go on from here. Giving the impossibility of a meeting with all those who are interested in the project, maybe the one idea would be to put up some basic issues like the format of the book, etc. for vote.

[desiresjab]

To avoid confusion, I'm adding the other thread, which contains a lot of submited poems.
http://www.online-literature.com/for...96-submit-here
Seems we are all a bit lost how to go on from here. Giving the impossibility of a meeting with all those who are interested in the project, maybe the one idea would be to put up some basic issues like the format of the book, etc. for vote.

I like your participation, Dani. You are throwing out a lot of good ideas. But possibly the first thing to do is elect something of a staff. This staff would have some authority to make certain moves on its own, so as to facilitate matters. There is no orderly way for an unknown number of members to vote on hundreds of submissions, without the process descending into chaos. Only an editorial staff can handle this.

Of whom the editorial staff should consist is the question. Let us make this qualification. Your name has to be nominated by another, before you can be considered. Then there will be votes on that. Does that sound feasible?

Of course we do not know the size of this staff, do we? We do not know if someone has to have submitted a poem, to be considered, either. I nominate Dieter to come give us some direction.

Throw out some names, Dani boy or girl. I am assuming Dieter, because he was already nominated once by Yes/No, and does not need to be nominated a second time, to my way of thinking, at least. I think perhaps we might make the additional stipulation that an editor has to have submitted something, to try and stimulate submissions, if for no other reason. If it does not stimulate submissions, we can always drop it. Behind the scenes strategizing, eh?

I think we need to take an actual, official step of some kind.