Respect for Religious Belief

[atiguhya padma]

Yeroptok,

Well said. Couldn't agree more.

[psycojones]

ap, i read your explanation about people and their beliefs, and i must apologize. i miss understood what you ment. i see what it is you are taking about, and i do agree. i was brought up under the christian belief, and when ever i questioned christianity through out my childhood, i was told to pray for the answer. after i left home and began my own life, i found that god was something to hide behind, and gave no real answer to the questions i was in search of.
a psycojones quote,"all of lifes greatest mysteries, is us, just not opening our eyes to the reality which surrounds us."

[subterranean]

Thanks AP, though I have to admit that I never heard some of the names you mentioned
The reason that I asked you cause I find some troubles finding good literature as reference. Please excuse my lack of knowledge ..

[Bleeding Pawn]

Some comments I would like to make regarding people and their beliefs:

I think there is a clear distinction between a person and that person's belief. I feel that I can respect a person, whilst considering one or more of their beliefs to be silly.

Some people cannot distinguish between themselves and their beliefs: it is as if their belief is their life. One without the other is too terrible for them to contemplate. I would say this is a rather immature and unhealthy position to hold.

I know a monotheist who says that there are no circumstances under which they would abandon their belief in God. I think this is extremely silly. It doesn't stop me respecting her though.

In being able to step outside your belief and take the perspective of 'the view from nowhere', as Nagel put it, you maintain a healthy position for yourself and your belief. It helps you to grow.

All beliefs should be critically addressed. There should be no monopoly of courtesy towards religious belief.

Exactly, you have raised many a good questions which should be clarified. Many followers ( with out any disrespect, it also includes me) are astute believers of their particular faith just because it was handed down the generations as a family heirloom ( pardon if i mentioned it earlier somewhere). The reason being that we have just stopped questioning ourselves and our credibility. Believing in something, or for that matter in Some One, is mentally and spiritually sedative ( in a positive sense) and many faithfuls consider that they are eligible, since they have spent their life earning, to a gratuity at the end of their existence in the form of permanent residency in Heaven. And why not since years of sacrificing their desires they earned the right to it but sometimes the destiny doesn`t work in proportion to our expectations.

Different followers, different mindsets. Nowadays we do not have an appetite for truth, some consider since they are following a certain faith they are on the right path to salvation and some claim that what we were served in a platter at childbrith is the nice and healthy truth and even though it might be but we do not search for any evidence which lends credence to that certain theologies (dogma?) other than just our passion and astuteness in implementing on the doctrines. It would be more worthwhile to know WHY is it that we believe that what we were brought up ( or programmed?) to believe because our quest for truth does not end when we know it rather it starts a whole new journey altogether where every step is an implementation of ones acknowledgement of it.
At the end of the day we have to utilise religion as a medium to find significance in our life by realising that the truth we know of, is really the reflection of The Eternal Truth. To rephrase a quote by D.Brown "Religion has become and will be a part of the fabric of reality.

As I have said before, it does no good to respect the belief held by the mentally delusional that God is speaking to them. I consider this to be a religious belief".

God? Speaking? in today`s world? Well that is out of context if we take into point the definition of talking 1) to influence, affect or 2) to converse as in interaction. If it is the former then God is known to speak through revelations as in the case of biblical apostles and in the form of inspiration through nature in ordinary folks but if it is the latter then that settles it since the last time GOD conversed with HIS creation was with the biblical apostle Moses as found in the abrahamic beliefs. Now it is no secret that some spiritual gurus of cults claim they are in direct contact with God but we must be aware that religion as of today has become a commodity with a certain monetary value tagged to it and who ever possesses it are eager to en-cash it at an appropriate time for their own benefit and increase their ever- burgeoning cash till.

Finally, I am glad to see that the UK is waking up at last, to the benefits of teaching atheism in schools. Hopefully, if this does occur, it will bring some reasoned argument into religious education.

I always used to wonder what were the consequences that led to the situation as portrayed in the movie Matrix.

In the end i do not want to start a debate or raise a new discussion but to just clear the air of certain doubts. Thank You.

[cafolini]

The belief is a parameter that brings together a congregation. Only a small percentage of people take their beliefs and place them against that of another congregation. Usually they know full well what they are doing. There aren't that many idiots in this world. By comparison, although also a small percentage, the one's that make so much noise about questioning beliefs are idiotic. No need at all. That's why they are not more than beliefs for anyone who has not lost his/her senses.

[Bleeding Pawn]

ap, i read your explanation about people and their beliefs, and i must apologize. i miss understood what you ment. i see what it is you are taking about, and i do agree. i was brought up under the christian belief, and when ever i questioned christianity through out my childhood, i was told to pray for the answer. after i left home and began my own life, i found that god was something to hide behind, and gave no real answer to the questions i was in search of.

Its the same case everywhere , when we used to question any misconception towards the teachings of Bible we were advised not to go digging around in the meanings of it. We always used to have that doubt concerning why Jesus wept and cried, why he bowed down to another Being and all that stuff.

[conman89]

I am a libertarian I respect other beliefs political or religious as long as it doesn't interfere with the liberties of others. Political beliefs often times interferes with the liberties of others more than religious beliefs do.

I have no problem if you are a Muslim and want to practice your faith but I do have a problem If that includes killing people of other religions because it infringes on their liberties.

Political ideals seem to effect us more such as wire taps innovation of privacy attack on constitutional rights taxes gun control and so on and so forth. They effect the persons liberties and I can not respect oppression and infringing on liberties.

I respect your belief as it affects you but not believes that unjustly negatively effect others

[Vota]

Double post.

[Vota]

Lately I've been having repeated discussions about religion with a friend of mine that considers herself a Buddhist. I don't consider myself devoted to any one religious system of belief, but I do enjoy reading the bible and find many of it's teachings to be compelling. Perhaps it's because Christ is the ideal father figure in my eyes, which I can relate to because of my own issues with my father. Maybe it's because I love the simplicity of what it says, but marvel at it's richness when explored, and it's depth of history.

My friend is fairly secure in her belief that Buddhism is better than all others. I disagree, and have a few reasons, but throughout our talks I've let her know one key difference between us. She feels her beliefs are correct, and therefore superior to all others; I do not believe any one religion is superior to any other, simply because all religions came from a specific place and culture that influenced their development. Many are off-shoots of previous religions and systems. Religions blossomed throughout different periods of history, therefore it seems faulty to believe one is greater than all others, because that thinking does not account for all the people that never had access to it. How can one be truly superior to another? Who says it's superior? Aren't these ultimately just opinions of fallible beings? I'm not a god. I'm not God. I'm pretty sure nobody else on this planet can claim that either. So if no one is omniscient and all-powerful, then how can anyone claim their way is THE way?

I feel that everyone has a right to believe what they want to believe, so long as it does not infringe on the rights of others, or harm others. I might believe that ants are sacred, and every ant you've every stepped on unknowingly, will cause you a karmic loss of 1 year. So you might be set back hundreds of lifetimes, if you believe in some form of reincarnation. Prove I'm wrong. You can't. You can make some very logical and rational arguments as to why my belief is faulty, but you can not empirically prove that my thinking is incorrect. Every thing we know, we have labeled in a way that we can understand it. That doesn't make it correct, no matter how right is may seem or how eloquently you can dispute it.

Shifting thoughts, "I" feel that politics is essential to human life, whereas religion is only essential to those that feel it is. As an example: If one were to raise a community of babies from birth to adulthood in some type of isolated, though nourishing environment, and never influenced their beliefs in any way, or introduced any concepts whatsoever beyond those required to survive, then a political system, however crude would form. Its likely that some form of religious or spiritual belief might form as well, but that is not crucial to the co-existence of human beings. It may be crucial to the mental health of some people, but it is not crucial to a functioning, healthy society or community. When I use the word crucial, I mean crucial in the sense that air, water, and food are required to sustain all humans. In this sense, political systems are inevitable if the species is to survive and flourish. Families are political systems. Politics is an inevitable result of human interaction.

[Dark Star]

I am a libertarian I respect other beliefs political or religious as long as it doesn't interfere with the liberties of others. Political beliefs often times interferes with the liberties of others more than religious beliefs do.

I have no problem if you are a Muslim and want to practice your faith but I do have a problem If that includes killing people of other religions because it infringes on their liberties.

Political ideals seem to effect us more such as wire taps innovation of privacy attack on constitutional rights taxes gun control and so on and so forth. They effect the persons liberties and I can not respect oppression and infringing on liberties.

I respect your belief as it affects you but not believes that unjustly negatively effect others

I agree with most of this, but you have to keep in mind that religious beliefs often influence political beliefs. The battle we're having over the right to abortion and gay marriage (or gay soldiers being allowed in the military, etc.) are examples of that. The influence of religion on politics in the Middle East should also be quite obvious.

[kari]

I have the strong belief that we are different people, therefore, we can require differences in our religion or spirituality to keep us heading towards being the best we can be. I think respect should be given in that aspect. What you need to feel close to your god may not be what another needs, or another. As long as it is a belief system that keeps the person happy and inspires them to be better people, respect is due. Otherwise what are you portraying in your own belief system? Respect only if you agree? To respect does not mean you have to go along with anothers belief system, nor does it mean you can't speak your mind about what you disagree with. It simply means do all of that if you choose, but with respect. I also think, however, that needs to go both way...which it usually doesn't. Too many people think what they have set up for themselves that works great for the person they are, means it is right for all.

[Phocion]

I agree with most of this, but you have to keep in mind that religious beliefs often influence political beliefs. The battle we're having over the right to abortion and gay marriage (or gay soldiers being allowed in the military, etc.) are examples of that. The influence of religion on politics in the Middle East should also be quite obvious.

Not only that. The enforced torture of the terminally ill is a clear result of Christianity. And the Christian fear of the intemperate mind had a big role in inaugurating and continuing the disastrous drug war that is still being fought and ruining lives on a daily basis. Homosexual sodomy was still illegal in some us states until (i think) 2003 - beliefs that have resulted in this kind of persecution for 1000s of years don't deserve my respect, no matter how dear some people may hold them. Religious ideas and religious morality has been throughout history perhaps the greatest threat to civil liberties, and if you want proof of this, look at the societies that are still run on religious lines. The liberty of others, or God's will - what do you think matters more to the truly devout?

The only way i will respect someone else's religious beliefs is if they keep them entirely to themselves. If someone feels the need to tell me about their beliefs then i feel the need to tell them why i think they are wrong. You cannot bring up something in a discussion and then get upset when someone rubbishes it.

[Foe]

As an atheist -- an apostate, really, who has devolved into atheism -- I have no problem respecting the religion of others. Religious beliefs are not laughable or empty to people like me, and here's why:

I live out in the country, a little over a mile from my hometown, on land that was once the farm my wife grew up on. The wind blows out here, rain and hail fall, snow flies, and the sun bakes us like thin-crust pizzzas in a Domino's oven. We have lived on this three acres of land for a decade now, and are just beginning to breathe life into it. I cannot calculate the millions of gallons of (expensive) water we've poured into the sandy clay here, or the tons of (expensive) powdered manure we've spaded into the ground, or the hours and calories I've expended building retaining walls, shoveling fill dirt, building porches and decks and patios and sidewalks, planting trees (often three or four in the same spot, year after year,) and installing thousands of feet of drip system ... and all the while the elements have tried their very damnedest to destroy what I have built, and more often than not they have succeeded. I can easily understand how perfectly rational men would begin to suspect that something, someone, has it in for them. I've wondered it myself a time or two.

It is actually a short trip from my experience to the unfathomable, self-contradictory mythology of an ancient tribe of militant goat herders that has become modern Western religion. And that trip has produced the bulk of the Western literary canon, beginning with the scriptures themselves. How can we not recognize the beauty of, "In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God?"

No, it is not difficult to respect religion and the literature that it has wrought. Any other discussion of religion, in my humble opinion, belongs in a different forum altogether.