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Thread: The Visual Arts: Exploring the History of "Fine Art" and Beyond

  1. #316
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    Originally posted by stlukesguild
    Yes, Fraenger's book... or rather the common English translation doesn't include a separate bibliography according to modern/contemporary formal academic standards. However, the book includes an appendix of some 100+ pages with hundreds of citations and there are hundreds more citations throughout the text itself. Obviously, you have not read or even come across a complete copy of Fraenger's Heironymus Bosch.
    There are citations but there is no specific references so that the reader can’t verify the sources.
    Perhaps, you don’t have a problem about that but I do.
    Too many pseudo scholars and pseudo scientists of my liking.

    Fraenger's studies on Bosch are incredibly well-researched.
    Too bad that he didn’t learned how to provide specific references.



    Yes... it's much easier to make up your own interpretations based on a complete lack of knowledge of the artist, his biography, the culture/society in which he worked, his artistic predecessors and sources of inspiration.
    Well, I haven’t finished Fraenger’s book. Again, it is a pseudo scholar work. If it wasn’t, he would provide specific references. Sorry, but I don’t consider pseudo work as a source of knowledge.

  2. #317
    Artist and Bibliophile stlukesguild's Avatar
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    I am curious where you found that Brueghel was inspired by Bosch’s paintings. Did Brueghel say that Bosch was his inspiration?

    Brueghel's works clearly follow in the fantastic tradition of Heironymus Bosch... especially early on. Bosch was already dead by the time Brueghel had become a mature artist, but his work remained highly popular and there were any number of copies and forgeries:









    Demand for Bosch-like paintings and prints continued well into the 16th century. Hieronymus Co ck, the great Flemish printer and publisher fed this demand with prints after Bosch and in the manner of Bosch. Brueghel was among the many artists who provided images for Co ck, and his print Big Fish Eat Little Fish



    ...was actually published attributed to Bosch... no doubt in hope for a larger audience.

    It doesn't call for a great leap of imagination to recognize that as Brueghel knew Bosch' work, provided prints for the same publisher who was promoting works after Bosch or in the style of Bosch, allowed for one of his first prints for this same publisher to be printed attributed to Bosch... then it is just quite probable that images such as this:







    ... were inspired (at least in part) by the artist's exposure to Bosch's work... Brueghel almost certainly knew of Bosch' Garden of Earthly Delights (which remained in the Netherlands until 1566) either through the original, or through one of the dozens of known copies.
    Last edited by stlukesguild; 01-13-2013 at 10:38 PM.
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    There are citations but there is no specific references so that the reader can’t verify the sources.

    How specific do you need? My copy of Fraenger's book lists hundred of texts which Fraenger cites by title, author, date, and page. How much more do you need to verify? You're not a scholar nor an art historian.

    Perhaps, you don’t have a problem about that but I do.
    Too many pseudo scholars and pseudo scientists of my liking.


    Starting with that face in the mirror?

    Fraenger's studies on Bosch are incredibly well-researched.

    Too bad that he didn’t learned how to provide specific references.

    Again... what do you want? A hand-written copy of the artist's autobiography?
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  4. #319
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    Originally posted by stlukesguild

    Brueghel's works clearly follow in the fantastic tradition of Heironymus Bosch... especially early on. Bosch was already dead by the time Brueghel had become a mature artist, but his work remained highly popular and there were any number of copies and forgeries:
    I asked a question about Brueghel because Fraenger mentioned that the person who ordered the The Garden of Earthly Delights was unknown. He also talked about the secrecy about that painting. So, I was wondering how Brueghel could see it…unless he had the same sponsor. Or perhaps, Fraenger wasn’t that wrong.


    How specific do you need? My copy of Fraenger's book lists hundred of texts which Fraenger cites by title, author, date, and page. How much more do you need to verify? You're not a scholar nor an art historian.
    Well, you have a different copy that I had then. There was only the name of the author. No the title of the book , no page, no year, no bibliography. How would you call that?

    I am really curious and I may look at university library, if I can find a copy you have.

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    I have checked in both university libraries and both have a copy of The Millennium of Hieronymus Bosch. Interestingly enough both copies were published by Chicago, University of Chicago Press [1951].
    The copy I have read was also published by Chicago, University of Chicago Press [1951]
    Very intriguing, I will definitely check it out how did it happened that my copy didn’t have neither specific references nor bibliography.

  6. #321
    Artist and Bibliophile stlukesguild's Avatar
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    I asked a question about Brueghel because Fraenger mentioned that the person who ordered the The Garden of Earthly Delights was unknown.

    The provenance of many older paintings is unknown. In the case of The Garden of Earthly Delights, art historians have not even been in agreement as to the approximate date of the painting. Proposed dates range from 1460-1504. Wikipedia gives a solid general overview of the history of the painting:

    Charles de Tolnay's suggests that the triptych was ordered by Engelbrecht II of Nassau, in or shortly after 1481, when he attended the Chapter of the Order of the Golden Fleece in 's-Hertogenbosch. The Garden was first documented in 1517, one year after the artist's death, when Antonio de Beatis, a canon from Molfetta, Italy, described the work as part of the decoration in the town palace of the Counts of the House of Nassau in Brussels. The palace was a high-profile location, a house often visited by heads of state and leading court figures. The prominence of the painting has led some to conclude that the work was commissioned, and not "solely … a flight of the imagination".

    It is probable that the patron of the work was Engelbrecht II of Nassau, who died in 1504, or his successor Henry III of Nassau-Breda, the Stadtholder or governor of several of the Habsburg provinces in the Low Countries. De Beatis wrote in his travel journal that "there are some panels on which bizarre things have been painted. They represent seas, skies, woods, meadows, and many other things, such as people crawling out of a shell, others that bring forth birds, men and women, white and blacks doing all sorts of different activities and poses.

    Because the triptych was publicly displayed in the palace of the House of Nassau, it was visible to many, and Bosch's reputation and fame quickly spread across Europe. The work’s popularity can be measured by the numerous surviving copies—in oil, engraving and tapestry—commissioned by wealthy patrons, as well as by the number of forgeries in circulation after his death.
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    For those interested, Google Earth includes a feature that allows you to explore The Garden of Earthly Delights and other paintings in the Prado (and I assume other museums) in the most incredible detail:

    http://google-latlong.blogspot.com/2...museum-up.html
    Last edited by stlukesguild; 01-13-2013 at 10:03 PM.
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    Quote Originally Posted by stlukesguild View Post
    [COLOR="#B22222"]



    It is probable that the patron of the work was Engelbrecht II of Nassau, who died in 1504, or his successor Henry III of Nassau-Breda, the Stadtholder or governor of several of the Habsburg provinces in the Low Countries. De Beatis wrote in his travel journal that "there are some panels on which bizarre things have been painted. They represent seas, skies, woods, meadows, and many other things, such as people crawling out of a shell, others that bring forth birds, men and women, white and blacks doing all sorts of different activities and poses.

    Well, we will never know. Fraenger has changed his mind after publishing his book and claimed that the triptych was commissioned by the grand master Jacob van Almaengien, a Jew baptized in Hertogenbosch in 1946 in the presence of Philip the Fair, duke of Burgundy.

    But Bosch got too much of my attention.

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    St.Luke, I must say it again that your posts are a great source of inspiration.

    I did some research about Karen King, a professor of early Christianity at Harvard Divinity School.

    Karen L. King has been cracking the codes of early Christianity for more than 20 years. Two of her recent books on religious figures have been particularly controversial. The Gospel of Mary of Magdala: Jesus and the First Woman Apostle “portrays Mary Magdalene as an important apostle after the resurrection,” King explains. Her other book, What is Gnosticism?, targets a more academic audience.

    King deals with many of the same ideas as Da Vinci Code. But she brushes aside comparisons between herself and the novel’s fictional Harvard symbologist, Robert Langdon. The scholar and self-described feminist says the closest field to Langdon’s nonexistent field of symbology would be semiology, a field unrepresented at Harvard.
    http://www.thecrimson.harvard.edu/ar...ng-before-dan/
    Anyway, I didn’t know that by Karen King unveiled a small, torn papyrus that has eight incomplete lines of Coptic script. King, who received the fragment from an unnamed private collector, says it is a fourth-century CE codex. Nothing is known about the circumstances of its discovery except that it may have been excavated from an area in Upper Egypt.

    Is a scrap of papyrus suggesting that Jesus had a wife authentic?

    Scholars on Wednesday questioned the much-publicized discovery by a Harvard scholar that a 4th century fragment of papyrus provided the first evidence that some early Christians believed Jesus was married.

    And experts in the illicit antiquities trade also wondered about the motive of the fragment's anonymous owner, noting that the document's value has likely increased amid the publicity of the still-unproven find.

    Karen King, a professor of early Christianity at Harvard Divinity School, announced the finding Tuesday at an international congress on Coptic studies in Rome. The text, written in Coptic and probably translated from a 2nd century Greek text, contains a dialogue in which Jesus refers to "my wife," whom he identifies as Mary.

    King's paper, and the front-page attention it received in some U.S. newspapers that got advance word about it, was a hot topic of conversation Wednesday at the conference.

    Christian tradition has long held that Jesus was unmarried, although there is no reliable historical evidence to support that, King said. Any evidence pointing to whether Jesus was married or had a female disciple could have ripple effects in current debates over the role of women in the church.

    Stephen Emmel, a professor of Coptology at the University of Muenster who was on the international advisory panel that reviewed the 2006 discovery of the Gospel of Judas, said the text accurately quotes Jesus as saying "my wife." But he questioned whether the document was authentic.

    "There's something about this fragment in its appearance and also in the grammar of the Coptic that strikes me as being not completely convincing somehow," he said in an interview on the sidelines of the conference.

    Another participant at the congress, Alin Suciu, a papyrologist at the University of Hamburg, was more blunt.
    "I would say it's a forgery. The script doesn't look authentic" when compared to other samples of Coptic papyrus script dated to the 4th century, he said.

    King acknowledged Wednesday that questions remain about the fragment, and she welcomed the feedback from her colleagues. She said she planned to subject the document to ink tests to determine if the chemical components match those used in antiquity.

    "We still have some work to do, testing the ink and so on and so forth, but what is exciting about this fragment is that it's the first case we have of Christians claiming that Jesus had a wife," she said.

    She stressed that the text, assuming it's authentic, doesn't provide any historical evidence that Jesus was actually married, only that some two centuries after he died, some early Christians believed he had a wife.

    Wolf-Peter Funk, a noted Coptic linguist, said there was no way to evaluate the significance of the fragment because it has no context. It's a partial text and tiny, measuring 4 centimeters by 8 centimeters (1.5 inches by 3 inches), about the size of a small cellphone.

    "There are thousands of scraps of papyrus where you find crazy things," said Funk, co-director of a project editing the Nag Hammadi Coptic library at Laval University in Quebec. "It can be anything."
    He, too, doubted the authenticity, saying the form of the fragment was "suspicious."

    Ancient papyrus fragments have been frequently cut up by unscrupulous antiquities dealers seeking to make more money.

    An anonymous collector brought King the fragment in December 2011, seeking her help in translating and understanding it. In March, she brought it to two papyrologists who determined it was very likely authentic.

    On Tuesday, Harvard Divinity School announced the finding to great fanfare and said King's paper would be published in January's Harvard Theological Review. Harvard said the fragment most likely came from Egypt, and that its earliest documentation is from the early 1980s indicating that a now-deceased professor in Germany thought it evidence of a possible marriage of Jesus.

    Some archaeologists were quick to question Harvard's ethics, noting that the fragment has no known provenance, or history of where it's been, and that its current owner may have a financial interest in the publicity being generated about it.

    King has said the owner wants to sell his collection to Harvard.

    "There are all sorts of really dodgy things about this," said David Gill, professor of archaeological heritage at University Campus Suffolk and author of the Looting Matters blog, which closely follows the illicit trade in antiquities. "This looks to me as if any sensible, responsible academic would keep their distance from it."

    He cited the ongoing debate in academia over publishing articles about possibly dubiously obtained antiquities, thus potentially fueling the illicit market.

    The Archaeological Institute of America, for example, won't publish articles in its journal announcing the discovery of antiquities without a proven provenance that were acquired after a UNESCO convention fighting the illicit trade went into effect in 1973.

    Similarly, many American museums have adopted policies to no longer acquire antiquities without a provenance, after being slapped with successful efforts by countries like Italy to reclaim looted treasures.

    Archaeologists also complain that the looting of antiquities removes them from their historical context, depriving scholars of a wealth of information.

    However, AnneMarie Luijendijk, the Princeton University expert whom King consulted to authenticate the papyrus, said the fragment fit all the rules and criteria established by the International Association of Papyrologists. She noted that papyrus fragments frequently don't have a provenance, simply because so many were removed from Egypt before such issues were of concern.

    She acknowledged the dilemma about buying such antiquities but said refraining from publishing articles about them is another matter.

    "You wouldn't let an important new text go to waste," she said.

    Hany Sadak, the director general of the Coptic Museum in Cairo, said the fragment's existence was unknown to Egypt's antiquities authorities until news articles this week.

    "I personally think, as a researcher, that the paper is not authentic because it was, if it had been in Egypt before, we would have known of it and we would have heard of it before it left Egypt," he said.
    http://www.necn.com/09/19/12/Harvard...c473d237b15a45


    A gospel or gospel-fragment might be regarded as “fake” whether its author belongs to the ancient or
    the modern world. In both cases, the aim would be to persuade as many readers as possible to take the
    new text seriously – as a window onto unknown aspects of Jesus’ life, or how it was perceived by his
    later followers. In her thorough and helpful analysis of the text that is coming to be known as the
    Gospel of Jesus’ Wife (GJW), Karen King rightly points out that new items of information about the
    historical Jesus are not to be expected from it.

    It can though provide valuable insights into early Christian debates about sexuality and gender. At least, it can do so if it is “genuine”, genuinely old. King admits to initial scepticism, but is now convinced that this papyrus fragment derives from a fourth century copy of a second century text.

    I shall argue here that scepticism is exactly the right attitude. The text has been constructed out of small pieces – words or phrases – culled from the Coptic Gospel of Thomas (GTh), especially Sayings 30, 45, 101 and 114, and set in new contexts. This is most probably the compositional procedure of a modern author who is not a native speaker of Coptic.
    http://markgoodacre.org/Watson.pdf


    The bottom line is that there are a number of uncertainties about this text—its date, the text itself, its relationship to other texts of the period, and of course its authenticity. All these issues are—and should be—a matter of debate. At least two great Coptic scholars, Luijendijk of Princeton and Bagnell of NYU, regard the text as authentic, dating to the fourth century. So there are two sides (at least) to the authenticity debate.

    What is wrong, however, is for the Harvard Theological Review to suspend publication because of the dispute about authenticity. Dispute is the life of scholarship. It is to be welcomed, not fled from. When a professor at the Harvard Divinity School, backed up by two experts from Princeton and NYU who declare the text to be authentic, presents the case—and tentatively at that—that should be enough for HTR to publish King’s article, not to cowardly suspend its decision to publish. Instead, HTR has cringed because there will now be a dispute as to authenticity. This is shameful.

    http://www.biblicalarchaeology.org/d...mething-wrong/

    I have to do more study about Gnosticism…..but not from Karen King’s books. That’s for sure.

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    Artist and Bibliophile stlukesguild's Avatar
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    Michelangelo Buonarotti:

    When I first really started looking at Michelangelo Buonarotti's work, the restoration on the Sistine frescoes had not yet been completed, and so all the available photographs in books were of darkened, soot covered paintings. Such had Michelangelo been known, at least as a painter, for generations... centuries, even. The artist was put forth as a dark, brooding figure... a sort of Romantic hero... who had painted muscular superhuman images of mankind that were weighed down... leaden... and as lost in the shadows as the faces in Rembrandt.



    It was thus only to be expected that the brilliance, clarity, and glowing colors that were revealed by the restoration of Michelangelo's frescoes would result in surprise... shock... even outrage. This was furthered by the bleached out appearance of the first photographs due to the use of excessive lighting. As a result of the darkened state of the frescoes, the Vatican had installed increasingly powerful lighting to view the paintings. A documentary of the actual restoration process, however, revealed just how careful the restorers were. In corner areas of the frescoes that would barely be seen the restorers would try applications of the cleaning solution for various periods of time analyzing the refuse removed until the slightest sign of paint pigment appeared establishing the time need to clean a given area. At the end of each hour, all the refuse removed from was analyzed for any possible paint pigment. Even the chief critic of the restoration, Professor James Beck, from Columbia, was forced to acknowledge that notion added by Michelangelo's hand was being removed during the process. He changed his criticism to concern for exposure of the frescoes to modern air and its pollutants. The restorers countered that allowing the frescoes to linger beneath layer upon layer of wax, soot, dirt, and varnish was likely even more damaging to the paintings.

    The change in appearance of the Sistine paintings was truly amazing:



    I worked as a research assistant for an art historian specializing in the Italian Renaissance, and she made it clear that the results of the restoration were most certainly to be expected and in line with the usual emphasis of Italian Renaissance painting (clarity of form, even lighting, strong contours, and clean bright colors) as could be seen in examples of Michelangelo's own work... such as the Doni Tondo:



    I was immediately awed by the drawing in Michelangelo's paintings... and even more so by the drawings themselves:















    Michelangelo's drawings were no mere "life drawings". A quote by Degas in Paul Valery's Degas Dance Drawing states: "Drawing is not about what you see, but rather what you can make others see." Michelangelo's drawings illuminated this idea to me well before I could have put it into words. His mastery of touch... the manner in which he knows just where to emphasize a line... or to understate something... allows the viewer to almost grasp... feel the sculptural form of the body in his or her mind's eye. As brilliant as the Sistine frescoes revealed themselves as being following the restoration, early on I recognized that the artist truly was a sculptor. Nothing mattered but the sculptural forms of the human body. The backgrounds in most of the paintings were negligible... often little more than architectural settings akin to those that might frame a work of sculpture. And if Michelangelo wasn't a sculptor... then he was a choreographer... organizing the beautiful and expressive movements of the human body as it twists and turns across the span of the Sistine Ceiling.

    I cannot not look enough at Michelangelo's sculpture... the Drunken Bacchus...



    the Pietà...









    the Risen Christ...



    the David...



    the Medici Tomb figures...



    the "slaves"... struggling to free themselves from the earth... from this "too too sullied flesh"...





    Surely these leaden earthly beings... struggling to be free... to become as gods... virtually sum up the whole of Michelangelo's oeuvre.

    And provide the visual language later employed by Rodin...



    And then there is the Rondanini Pietà... rapidly reworked in Michelangelo's last days... and then left unfinished...



    The elongated figures recall the attenuated saints on the Gothic cathedrals and the electric spirituality of El Greco... while the manner in which these figures cut through the air in an arc suggests something as far removed as the Modernism of Brancusi:



    As much as I love Michelangelo's drawings and sculpture... it is ultimately the Sistine that continually speaks the most to me.

    The narrative paintings on the Sistine ceiling began timidly as the artist was confronted by the vast, cavernous space and his own lack of interest in landscape or background. But soon Michelangelo grew increasingly adventurous... employing simple, bold, audacious designs:





    One element that the artist begins to utilize is a multiplicity of scenes within a single frame... Adam and Eve reaching for the forbidden fruit... and their expulsion from the Garden of Eden are seen in the same image. In The Creation of the Sun and the Moon (Light and Dark)...



    God swoops in toward us from the right... like a great grey-bearded Old Testament superhero... his minions blinded by his grandeur... and then he's gone... exit stage left... offering us a fleeting view of his backside.

    The designs of the narrative scenes and the grouping of the figures are stunning... but at times the single figures... saints and sibyls and Old Testament prophets and "ignudi" are even more grand... their forms expanding and bursting forth from their architectural frames:











    Perhaps the most dazzling... certainly the most beautiful... figure on the ceiling of the Sistine is the rightfully famous Libyan Sibyl:



    Where Michelangelo infused a sense of movement and the passing of time within a narrative image such as The Creation of the Sun and Moon, the artist here succeeds at achieving the same within a single figure... in a manner that is almost Proto-Cubist... and yet appears wholly realistic and natural. The Sibyl is caught in the act of setting aside her reading (or prophetic writings... as evidenced by the quill in the ink jar) and stepping forth from her seat. Her big toe faces us directly as she begins to step forth. Her right leg is in profile... the foot delicately arched. Her beautiful and muscular back ("she" was modeled upon a male nude... see above) is turned to us. The pose as a whole would be virtually impossible... and yet the combination of details suggesting differing points of view... combined with the swooping curve of her glowing orange/peach/yellow robes creates the sense of the figure turning in space.

    No lesson from Michelangelo was greater than this... the recognition of the value in understanding the anatomy of the human body to such an extent that one might distort this for expressive purposes... without losing a sense of "naturalism". This is something I later recognized in Titian... Rubens... and Ingres.



    The Last Judgment, once again, brought to light the superhuman... almost superhero-like aspects of his work. Where the Sistine ceiling employed an incredible array of poses, the artist was now free from the constraints of gravity... and figures flew through the air, twirled, twisted, and summer-salted like some great aerial, acrobatic dance:





    One element of all of the Sistine paintings that was rarely touched upon by art historians... at least at the undergrad level... was the undeniable sexuality of these images. I have long found an incredible sense of irony to the fact that the paintings decorating the private chapel of the Popes in the very heart of Christendom, exuded such eroticism... and eroticism of a homosexual nature at that.





    More than a few Cardinals and Bishops expressed discomfort with the paintings... especially with such details as King Minos penis lunched on by a serpent of hell and the one sinner dragged to his damnation by his scrotum brutally grabbed by a demon. The painter El Greco was so outraged that he offered to paint over the whole of Michelangelo's work and offer something truly worthy of the Holy Church. Luckily, no one took him up on his offer... and his lack of respect for "El Divino" (The Divine One) led to threats by Italian artists causing him to flee to Spain.

    One can only imagine how completely outrageous The Last Judgment must have originally been... when all the figures... even Christ and Mary were nude. Of course Michelangelo's defense was wholly logical: surely those rising from the dead would not be clothed? The moronic attempts of Jeff Koons and Damien Hirst to shock the middle-class art viewers are mere child's play in comparison. Unfortunately... to quiet conservative factions within the Church, the more blatant or "obscene" elements of nudity were covered up by draperies added by Michelangelo's follower, Daniele da Volterra, who subsequently became known as the "braghettone" or "britches maker".

    Oh... and here is a great interactive site for viewing the Sistine:

    http://blogs.utexas.edu/utsoa-deepfo...istine-chapel/
    Last edited by stlukesguild; 01-17-2013 at 12:52 AM.
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    God swoops in toward us from the right... like a great grey-bearded Old Testament superhero... his minions blinded by his grandeur... and then he's gone... exit stage left... offering us a fleeting view of his backside. - StLukes
    I just cannot help thinking of this picture every time I read Exodus 33:23 "And I will take away mine hand, and thou shalt see my back parts:"
    Last edited by mona amon; 01-16-2013 at 02:03 AM.
    Exit, pursued by a bear.

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    Originally posted by stlukesguild

    Undoubtedly, ftil will find some way to turn the discussion of whatever artist I explore into a discussion of Gnosticism, the Occult, and Giordano Bruno's De vinculis in genere. Funny how she doesn't post for weeks... and then the second I add a new post to this thread... Should I feel flattered... or "stalked?"
    Hehehe……you have a way to make me laugh. As I said, your posts inspire me. It is not my fault that it leads me to occult or Gnosticism. Blame yourself.

    Second, I don’t respond, if I don’t feel inspired. Life is too short and the list of books I want to read is quite long.

    Finally, the choice is yours whether you want to feel…… flattered or stalked.

    Don’t forget that it is only a forum. I personally don’t care about virtual reality….but I like to be inspired.

    BTW, I have noticed that when you post nudity, you stop using Thumbnails. You have also changed to a larger image of Bosch's paintings. How I can't be tempted to talk about Bruno then.

  13. #328
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    I'm sorry, St. Luke. Allow me to be real. I hate joining the parade without really enjoying the revelry. Considering all the artists that have influenced you, I expect better. Your artworks are not really that impressive. They are forgettable. Again, I apologize for my honesty.
    "You laugh at me because I'm different, I laugh at you because you're all the same."

    --Jonathan Davis

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    I can't find the website with Sistine chapel. Too bad that I didn't save it. The viewer could see any detail in paintings.

    A few other websites.

    http://triggerpit.com/2010/11/21/sis...-walk-through/

    http://www.sacred-destinations.com/i...chapel-photos/

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    I'm really intered in Michelangelo and I'm sure he has been the greatest master of the Reinassence in a time where the likes of Titian, Raffaello or Leonardo were around. His greatness was such that whereas he's still remembered as the central artist of the Rinascimental art and tought, in his later days he went even beyond that, anticipating the "horror vacui" of the Baroque-period, especially in his last sculptures. What a shame I didn't manage to see the Sistine Chapel, yet.

    What do you guys think about Grunewald? I have recently been approaching to his paintings and I must say he's quite impressive.
    visit-of-st-anthony-to-st-paul-and-temptation-of-st-anthony (1).jpg

    The way he works on symbols, the grotesque use of metaphors, the impressivness of the painting...
    Last edited by Corona; 01-16-2013 at 02:20 PM.

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