This is a question that Winston often refers to throughout the book. When Winston meets up with the elder Prole and asks him this question the old man just recalls specifc details, such as a fight and the size of pints of beer. Is the Prole specifically avoiding this question/does he not want to remember the past? Or is it simply that he has been manipulated and brainwashed as to forget what his life was like in the past?
I believe that the old man truly forgot what the past was like. Without the pressure that our society places on learning from the past one might feel that it doesn't matter what the past was like and people could easily forget. An example of the manipulation to forget is when Winston and Julia talk about the war. Winston remembers that only four years ago the war was with eastasia while Julia could only remember being at war with eurasia even though the change occurred during her adult life. She also did not care at all about this fact.
I think the old man is forgetfull. He doesn't know about the past much like the other charactors in the book.
I, personally, believe that the old man doesn't answer for a variety of reasons. Yes, I, too, believe that he doesn't remember the past, but I don't think that's all. I think that he just doesn't care to remember and compare the past and the present. It doesn't affect him, in most ways, so he has no reason to desire remembering. If he thought long and hard enough, he would probably be able to reminiscence over the past, but he is too drunk, too ignorant, and too caught up in old, meaningless problems to care.Originally Posted by hunter/jumper
I don't think that anyone really knows if things were better before or after the revolution. Isn't that why they have the people like Winston who rewrite history? If they wanted people to know what life was like before the revolution then there would be no need to rewrite history in the first place.
The old man is a bit thick. He does not see the big picture, which is probably why he has been allowed to live. He has adapted to the new reality, which for him was probably not all that different to the old reality. The proles are not as strictly controlled as the party members. For them the surveillance is not as suffocating. As an old man in 1984, he may have undergone long term unemployment in the 20s and 30s, followed by war and rationing in the 40s, so his standard of living may just not have declined by that much. It's interesting though that when prompted by Winston about the past, the memories he has about an argument he had with a toff seem orders of magnitude less serious than a disagreement with the ruling class of 1984 would be. The picture you get is that society was in no way perfect before the revolution, but a lot more tolerant than it was after the revolution.
According to Aldous Huxley, D.H. Lawrence once said that Balzac was 'a gigantic dwarf', and in a sense the same is true of Dickens.
Charles Dickens, by George Orwell
I think that's easier for the Proles to forget the past because life is so different for them now. The Proles are in a way completely manipulated by the Party and they live in complete fear of the thought police. The man was afraid to voice is opinion about life now and then because if he went against the party, he could be punished. The Proles live brainwashed, distracted, and in unity. It's like they forgot they had minds of their own in which they have free thought. If they did remember, theres no history to prove it because the truth about the past is all being destroyed.
I do agree that the Proles are brainwashed but I don't think they live in fear of the Thought Police. Their poverty and ignorance control them. That's why the Party doesn't need to place them under constant surveillance with telescreens. The old man doesn't voice his opinion because he's afraid of being vaporized, it's his ignorance and lack of education that restricts him.
"The trouble with quotes on the Internet is that it's hard to tell if they are real or not." -Abraham Lincoln
I think part of the reason most proles don't remember the past is because at this point most of the proles who were alive before the revolution are getting up in age, therefore their memory is starting to weaken. Mix that with being told consistantly that the world is better now, and the fear of what might happen if they do stand up for what they actually believe and its easier for them to deal with how their lives are now, than risk punishment, and they've been told something (the old world was horrible, new world is great) so much, its likely some of them are starting to believe it. Just a thought.
I believe that life was definitely better before the revolution. The proles are not well educated, therefore easily manipulated and brainwashed, as said above. As long as they are distracted with other things (ex: pornosac), they are not going to care very much about the government.
Last edited by FanCpantsPossum; 11-20-2012 at 10:32 PM.
I too believe life was better before the revolution because you where aloud to show emotion freely. Also you didnt have to be afraid of your kids for turning you in to the thought police. my question is why cant people in 1984 have thier own opinion in the book? just because you have an opinion doesn't mean you have to share it, right? And dont you have a right to thing what you want?
I believe he has in fact been thoroughly brainwashed. To the point where to past may or may not have existed in the first place, which is working towards the goal of the party. However since he only remembers such simple things could be an indicator to simpler times, meaning times were better before.
The society wants control over everything you do, say, think, read write, etc. That's why the government is taking away words from the dictionary and brainwashing the people into thinking it is making language "easier", when in all actuality, they want to limit expression, because that could lead to rebellion over all the control the government powers have. They are trying to take away the people's rights by limiting their ability to express themselves, be unique, and be different.
Posting Permissions
Reply With Quote