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Thread: Can a Christian be a Buddhist? Vice-versa?

  1. #196
    TobeFrank Paulclem's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Musicology View Post
    Buddah was searching for the truth. Jesus searched for nothing. He declared Himself to be the Truth. A big difference, yes ?

    Buddah founded no religion. He founded, instead, a philosophy. A big difference, yes ? And Buddah (unlike the biblical Jesus) performed no miracles.

    Buddah predicted nothing. Jesus did the opposite. The birth of Buddah was not anticipated in the world. But the birth of Jesus was widely prophesised/predicted. A big difference. Buddah fulfilled no prophecies. Jesus fulfilled thousands.

    Etc.

    The only conclusion we can arrive at by fairly considering these two different things is that Buddhism is a philosophy. While Christianity is a revelation, of true religion. Consistent with what came before. Again, a difference is that Buddhism has no atonement for human sins or a relationship with the Creator of the universe while Christianity does.

    Regards
    Buddah was searching for the truth. Jesus searched for nothing. He declared Himself to be the Truth. A big difference, yes ?

    Yes

    Buddah founded no religion. He founded, instead, a philosophy. A big difference, yes ?

    No, though it depends who you ask. The millions of Buddhists around the world consider it to be a religion. Some non-Buddhists consider it not to be. Whether the religion/ philosophy criteria is agreed upon depends upon your point of view. Theists probably consider non-theistic religions like Buddhism as not qualifying.
    Interestingly, Buddhism is open to interpretation like this. A non-Buddhist is free to use the tools employed in Buddhism for their own purposes eg. meditation. Also it's attitude to logic and its systematic approach based upon observation means it appeals to many types of people without requiring a commitment to concepts such as Karma and reincarnation. One such application can be found in psychology, which has lifted many ideas.

    And Buddah (unlike the biblical Jesus) performed no miracles.

    No. There are numerous examples of "miracles" (though these are not Godpowers/God endowed powers but a side effect of spiritual attainment), performed by the Buddha, such as him visiting Tusheeta Heaven to teach Gods, and the story of his conversion of Angulimala - an Indian serial killer - (though Angulimala had been deluded into it).

    Buddah predicted nothing.

    No. It is said that The Buddha predicted the birth if Padmasambhava. Predictions are common in Buddhism. The Western spread of Buddhism was predicted by Padmasambhva.

    The birth of Buddah was not anticipated in the world.

    No, his Mother Mayadevi, dreamt that an auspicious white elephant entered her side at his conception. this was interpreted as being a Buddha. This is different from the prophetic tradition in Judaism though.

    A big difference. Buddah fulfilled no prophecies. Jesus fulfilled thousands.

    No. It was predicted by an astrologer that he would either become a Chakravartin King - of the world, or a great spiritual leader.

    The only conclusion we can arrive at by fairly considering these two different things is that Buddhism is a philosophy. While Christianity is a revelation, of true religion. Consistent with what came before. Again, a difference is that Buddhism has no atonement for human sins or a relationship with the Creator of the universe while Christianity does.

    Again it is a matter of opinion about philosophy/ religion. The term true religion is an opinion. Buddhist tradition says that there have been Buddhas before, and that the religion is rediscovered.

    Buddhism has no concept of sin, but good and bad karma created by the individual which stains their essential purity.

    fairly considering

    Has it been a fair consideration?

    You're right that there is no relationship with a creator God because the idea of a creator God is not accepted in Buddhism.

    So I agree that the two are different, and you can't be both, but not for many of the reasons you give.

    A big difference. Buddah fulfilled no prophecies. Jesus fulfilled thousands.

    Did Jesus fulfil the Judaic Pophecies?
    Last edited by Paulclem; 02-26-2010 at 05:03 PM. Reason: The over zealous swearchecker

  2. #197
    TobeFrank Paulclem's Avatar
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    The conclusion I've been arguing is no, it is not possible to be a Christian and a Buddhist.

    The reasons for this have been that the two worldviews are mutually exclusive. I know some posters have been arguing that you can be the same on the basis of their belief that there is a God or Divine aspect to the universe and that this is the same as the Buddhist realisation of Enlightenment.

    The posters who claim this are no doublt well intentioned in their beliefs, but if it were true, why wouldn't the Buddhist Masters - or The Buddha himself proclaim it?

    Similarly, you don't hear The Pope welcoming Buddhists into Catholic Churches or Protestant Ministers Advocating any of the Buddhist beliefs. Why should they when they havea perfectly coherent worldview, as do Buddhists, that fits their culture and beliefs.

    A question I raised earlier in the thread is why Christian and Buddhist and why not Christian - Muslim, or Jew, or Hindu? I particularly wonder, as the religions of the Book -Chistianity, JUdaism and Islam are very closely related. They even share Prophets, though their attitude to their nature may differ.

    I think one reason is the large misunderstandings that have been propagated about Buddhism - though I don't mean a person, but in the transmission of the ideas over time.

    Also, Buddhism is very acommodating with its methods and non-judgemental in aspect.

    With a proper understanding of Buddhism as a coherent worldview, with very different ideas to Christianity, I don't think there can be any doubt.

  3. #198
    Registered User billl's Avatar
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    Paul, I see you have posted twice in a row. I have been following this thread, and I just want to say that I think you have argued your position quite well, and convincingly.

  4. #199
    TobeFrank Paulclem's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by billl View Post
    Paul, I see you have posted twice in a row. I have been following this thread, and I just want to say that I think you have argued your position quite well, and convincingly.
    Thanks Billl

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    I think a Christian can't be a Buddhist, though I know a couple of people who genuinely and hopelessly try to be both Christians and Buddhists can share many ethical values and... compromise. But if you go really deep into the subject, too many divergences will emerge. Of course, you can combine some Christian ideas with Buddhist ones but... strictly speaking, you'll be neither Christian nor Buddhist then
    Last edited by Maryana; 04-08-2010 at 10:10 PM.

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    Who cares?

    I like your "who cares?" phrase. That is exactly the appropriate question
    !!!

    Unfortunately, those clearly to the right of center (Baptists, etc) seem to CARE more about everyone else's business other than their own !!!!

  7. #202
    TobeFrank Paulclem's Avatar
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    In terms of whether a Buddhist practice is effective or not, the question is pertinent. It's not just about being Christian , but also the myriad of New Age type beliefs that people bring to Buddhism that might affect their practice under the misconception that this is what Buddhism is like. People are free to choose, but to make an effective choice, then the practitioner needs to understand the needs of the Buddhist path.

    That's not to say that tools used by Buddhists such as meditation techniques and beliefs can't be used by non-Buddhists. In fact someone like HH The Dalai Lama encorages people to retain their own religion but use these tools if they are helpful. I'm merely referring to someone who wants to be a Buddhist and engage with the Buddhist path.

  8. #203
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    Please correct me if I'm wrong. Buddah was searching for the truth. So was Mohammed. That's recorded fact. But Christ declared himself to be THE TRUTH ! A very big difference, we surely agree !

    If a Buddhist wishes to be a Buddhist and wishes to engage with the Christian message there will come for him/her an end of paths and the start of a narrow straight road.

    Is this not the vital difference between philosophies such as Buddhism and God Himself ?

    Quote Originally Posted by Paulclem View Post
    In terms of whether a Buddhist practice is effective or not, the question is pertinent. It's not just about being Christian , but also the myriad of New Age type beliefs that people bring to Buddhism that might affect their practice under the misconception that this is what Buddhism is like. People are free to choose, but to make an effective choice, then the practitioner needs to understand the needs of the Buddhist path.

    That's not to say that tools used by Buddhists such as meditation techniques and beliefs can't be used by non-Buddhists. In fact someone like HH The Dalai Lama encorages people to retain their own religion but use these tools if they are helpful. I'm merely referring to someone who wants to be a Buddhist and engage with the Buddhist path.

  9. #204
    TobeFrank Paulclem's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Musicology View Post
    Please correct me if I'm wrong. Buddah was searching for the truth. So was Mohammed. That's recorded fact. But Christ declared himself to be THE TRUTH ! A very big difference, we surely agree !

    If a Buddhist wishes to be a Buddhist and wishes to engage with the Christian message there will come for him/her an end of paths and the start of a narrow straight road.

    Is this not the vital difference between philosophies such as Buddhism and God Himself ?
    Yes, The Buddha searched for the truth. He was a Prince called Siddartha Gautama who decided to try to solve the problem of birth ageing sickness and death. The Buddha is a title meaning one who has realised truth.

    Your conception of the truth is based upon your Cristian worldview, which is fine. The truth, in Buddhist terms, is a very different thing involving escaping from what is called samsara - basically reincarnated life as we know it. The Buddhist view of this life is that it is full of suffering, and the Buddha's teaching was to teach the path that led to the end of suffering.

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    Buddha said that he was not a God.

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    Maybe you don't think there should be divisions, but the Protestants and Catholics have divisions. So do the Theravada and the Mahayana, do you see?

  12. #207
    TobeFrank Paulclem's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by james7777 View Post
    Maybe you don't think there should be divisions, but the Protestants and Catholics have divisions. So do the Theravada and the Mahayana, do you see?
    Who are you addressing James? I'm quite happy that there are different forms of Buddhism. They just reflect the emphasis of those particular lineages of teachers and the cultues where they developed.

  13. #208
    All are at the crossroads qimissung's Avatar
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    According to Richard Gere in The Simpsons episode "She of Little Faith," "Buddhism allows for the tolerance of other beliefs" so one can, in effect, be a Christian and a Buddhist.
    "The important thing is not to stop questioning. Curiosity has its' own reason for existing." ~ Albert Einstein
    "Remember, no matter where you go, there you are." Buckaroo Bonzai
    "Some people say I done alright for a girl." Melanie Safka

  14. #209
    Registered User billl's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by qimissung View Post
    According to Richard Gere in The Simpsons episode "She of Little Faith," "Buddhism allows for the tolerance of other beliefs" so one can, in effect, be a Christian and a Buddhist.
    Nice!

    And here's how the episode ends, for those who forget:

    Marge:........You came back!
    Lisa:...........Yeah, I wanted to spend Christmas with you guys.
    Homer:.......So you're back on the winning team?
    Lisa:...........No, I'm still Buddhist, but I can worship with my family, too.
    Marge:........So you're just going to pay lip service to our church?
    Lisa:...........Uh-huh.
    Homer:.......That's all I ever asked.

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    No because in Christianity God said worship no other gods except me and if you are Buddhist you worship Buddha hence : no.


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