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The Home Page on my computer is by MSN and is full of items about "celebrities", pop groups, the world's biggest this, smallest that and other forms of juvenilia. So it's not surprising that UFOs feature prominently. Allowing for the hyperbole and fakes, some of the footage shown does pose a question about the origin of some of the objects. I suspect that this subject has been raised elsewhere on these forums but I am interested in ascertaining other members views.
I'm not really a buyer I think. I know that some footage looks mysterious but I'm probably more of a skeptic. Maybe some of them were prototype cold war spy planes or something, I don't know?
Yes, I'm sceptical too and I imagine that some were , as you say, secret aircraft developed during the cold war and even now, because governments may still want to keep potential enemies in the dark. However, I think the sightings have been too numerous for that to be the whole picture. Many of them must be due to natural phenomena and, as I mentioned, some of them are faked but there is still a question mark over the origin of some of the objects sighted.Quote:
Originally Posted by Neely
I'm pretty doubtful about the validity of UFO sightings, but it'd be pretty silly to think we're the only live conscious beings out there. I'm not a believer, but I'm not a non-believer either, if that makes sense.
Well, all I can say is that I spend a fair bit of time stargazing, and I've never yet seen anything up there that I can't explain.
I don't think we're alone in the Universe, but nor do I think small green men fly down in their saucers and kidnap hillbillies for a spot of friendly anal probing.
It'll be a while before I break out the tin foil hat...
I don't care for MSN, I use google as my home page. :sosp::smilielol5:Quote:
Originally Posted by Brian Bean
I have to agree with you.Quote:
Originally Posted by Hurricane
Many people likely mistake common flying objects, like airplanes, for UFOs when they've been up much too long, or been having much too much fun with various legal and illegal substances.
I'm sort of like several people here -- it wouldn't surprise me at all that life exists outside our planet. And, really, now that I think of it, it wouldn't surprise me much if UFOs -- in whatever form they may be -- have visited us in some way. I would be surprised if a UFO is big, metal ship. Anything capable of traveling through that much space has surely found a better way than that.
Like everyone else who posts, I doubt whether the pictures we have are actually ships. The potential for life is high, somewhere in the universe. But the idea that the ships are evidence of it are doubtable. I think that the sign of UFOs are often a) weather balloons, b) test aircraft(specifically with pictures in Area 51), 3) Pictoral anomalies, or 4) Photoshop.
Can you give links?Quote:
Originally Posted by Brian Bean
Pretty hard to comment without seeing what you mean, although every single UFO photo to date hasn't been evidence of alien contact, so I'm highly doubtful these will be anything more than the usual fakery, mistaken identification and tricks of light that all the others have been.
The idea of UFOs visiting earth is laughable, given the distances involved. An alien species able to defeat light-speed and pick us out of thousands of trillions of stars & planets would probably figure out a way to send a message rather than an anonymous spaceship.
The fact that UFOlogists believe crop circles are made by aliens is a clue to the level of delusion involved in the fantasy.
Actually on the history Chanel there was a very interesting documentary series called ancient aliens, the theory suggested was that UFO's from space first planted the seeds of life on earth and in some way guided humanity, it was laughable at some points yet at others its was very interesting, any of you guys see it ?
I read a good description of the distances involved in space in Bill Bryson's A Short History of Nearly Everything. Fascinating.
Stuff that you can't identify = UFOs - ok. How that somehow implies visiting aliens I'm not sure.
I’ve always held out for the possibility. Perhaps it is a lingering fascination from my childhood.
My son and I are familiar with the History Channel program and have watched it.
He is particularly fascinated in the Mesoamerican alien connection. (Look, if it keeps him off the street, then by all means!)
Now for those who seek hard evidence, (Atheist, that includes you) look no further than Roswell New Mexico. Pay a visit to the “UFO Museum and Research Center” on Main Street. We’ve been to the museum twice, the most recent trip being this past March.
Below you will find the link to the museum web site. Hopefully the link will remain intact as it travels the firmament to our readers in distant lands. For those with little time or interest, I would suggest you at least consider the “Roswell Incident” and “Virtual Tour” tabs at the left side of the screen and listen to the 1947 radio broadcast just below the images.
http://www.roswellufomuseum.com/
In closing, here is a photo from one of the museum’s exhibits:
http://i963.photobucket.com/albums/a...a/IMG_1464.jpg
The life size diorama depicts the famed alien autopsy carried out on one of the occupants of the saucer that crashed near Roswell.
And here is a “Basic Alien Types” chart I found on display:
http://i963.photobucket.com/albums/a...a/IMG_1461.jpg
Another interesting UFO phenomenon is the “Marfa Lights” in Texas:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CFnDrG1iH04
Gilliatt
Yes indeed.Quote:
Originally Posted by Paulclem
People who think earth is visited by aliens suck at maths.
Me too. Many's the night my wife and I stare at the stars wishing Gort would arrive.Quote:
Originally Posted by Gilliatt Gurgle
Hey, I was AT the autopsy.Quote:
Originally Posted by Gilliatt Gurgle
;)
Were you the one on the table? :DQuote:
Originally Posted by The Atheist
Quote:
Originally Posted by The Atheist
I was always terrified at Gort in the original "The Day the Earth Stood Still" Remake was not nearly as scary.
I saw the original after the remake, and have to agree. The first one brought depth to the concept, that was mostly unknown in the remake.
Here is a video that might prove interesting to this discussion .
http://video.yahoo.com/watch/6941536/18040969
And here is another.
http://www.bing.com/videos/search?q=...C&FORM=LKVR14#
Yep, they're pretty typical of videos that UFOlogists try to use.
It's just so damn stupid. The first one, I managed to watch about 45 seconds of it - it's so blindingly obvious that the smudges, dots and blips which are supposed to be UFOs are actually dust, moisture and other artifacts that I didn't see any point in watching more.
The second is a collection of well-known fakes and fallacies joined into one.
If only these people would come up with something new, they might gain some respect, but making extraordinary claims based on idiotic assumptions leaves me cold.
http://img508.imageshack.us/img508/6...craftident.jpgQuote:
Originally Posted by Neely
I agree that the opening of the first video is as you say, but if you watch on there is some more interesting stuff. Much of the weird pieces of machinery shown floating around is probably space debris from the junk yard that now surrounds the Earth. However, there is an interesting admission from a former astronaut about extra terrestrial life. If the USAF colonel in the second video was lying, he was pretty good at it.Quote:
Originally Posted by The Atheist
I don't think the forum would accept the existence of God on such scant evidence so why accept it for UFO's. Perhaps crop circles are just more believable.....
Even though I live in a "hot spot" I've never seen anything. But I know some serious people who say they have.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iOJiwS6YMtk
I should just say it is also a hot spot for hallucinogenic substence abuse.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hurricane
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Originally Posted by Lokasenna
Agreed.Quote:
Originally Posted by The Atheist
Considering the huge number of stars solely in our galaxy (200-400 billion) the number of galaxies only in our supercluster and the distances involved the chance of alien life getting in our little corner of the universe is very very slim.
Damn shame really.Quote:
Originally Posted by manolia
Even the evidence of Rhea last week pioints to the fact that inhabitable planets must exist in reasonable quantities, so the chances of other life out there are extremely good.
Just the damned distance. Stuff Einstein!
Now this is interesting - today's NASA Picture of the Day:
http://apod.nasa.gov/apod/image/1011...ell_heavey.jpg
And here's what they say about it:
I'll admit, if I saw that bearing down on me from out of the clouds, I might think it was the Martians...Quote:
Explanation: Is that a spaceship or a cloud? Although it may seem like an alien mothership, it's actually a impressive thunderstorm cloud called a supercell. Such colossal storm systems center on mesocyclones -- rotating updrafts that can span several kilometers and deliver torrential rain and high winds including tornadoes. Jagged sculptured clouds adorn the supercell's edge, while wind swept dust and rain dominate the center. A tree waits patiently in the foreground. The above supercell cloud was photographed in July west of Glasgow, Montana, USA, caused minor damage, and lasted several hours before moving on.
That is sensational.Quote:
Originally Posted by Lokasenna
Just goes to show that fact is more exciting than fiction.
Yes for life as we know it (carbon based). If one considers the possibility of other life forms, quite different from us, the chances increase :biggrin5:Quote:
Originally Posted by The Atheist
(on a side/serious note, this sounds very sci-fi but the universe is a marvelous thing..who knows)
Meh..I might think it's them OriQuote:
Originally Posted by Lokasenna
I saw a UFO, that is to say I had time to study it from quite close range for many minutes.
It wasn't a 'flying saucer', it didn't have 'little green men' in it.
Nor was it a secret military project.
And it was huge.
And yes it changed my life.
Sorry - you're expecting me to go into detail. I would, but being a writer's forum you'll just say I was making it up (like everyone else) or I'm nuts (which is as may be) or that I was on drugs, have too much imagination for my own good etc (not, not)
So why did I bother to post?
It's a thread about UFO's. I saw one. Before I saw it - well, I didn't care one way or the other, and I can't even remeber which way I leant.
But I'd like you all to have the chance to experience one, a real one.
What I did was walk along a street in a suburb about 9:30 pm. I wasn't looking for it. I'm pretty sure it wasn't looking for me. In fact UFO's was the farthest thing on my mind.
And then-
They do exist...
Little point posting unless you give detail, but it's your choice.Quote:
Originally Posted by MystyrMystyry
This is part of the problem regarding UFOs, we don't really know how many people may have seen them because some will be afraid of the reaction to their claim.
Not afraid exactly.
More bored.
When I saw what I saw, initially I was really excited, and naively displayed my enthusiasm.
I didn't expect the indifferent scepticism, cynical responses and eyerolling - because it really happened! To me! I've made drawings! Why would I lie about something like that! I don't need to give myself tckets!
I looked for people who could share my enthusiasm, but soon realised that most of these people are a glass and a half-crazy (there was one bloke who initially seemed on my wavelength but as I heard his story - well let's just say it involved alcohol, flying saucers and little green men...)
So really rather than be a totally amazing experience that I wanted to share (I really did) it soon became one of the worst, socailly at least.
Internally I've just largely kept it to myself since I'm not trying to prove anything to anyone, and just quietly glad. It was a personal experience that happened to me, and is part of me.
In a way it was my own personal UFO because I've yet to se anyone describe anything like it.
And of course sometimes I even doubt it, but then I remember the details, conscious and unconscious, the way its greasy metallic surface reflected electric blue from the orange streetlamp, all those weird markings, the 'window' that suddenly appeared, what I saw inside... ...
I've speculated on what they were doing there and have basicly come to the conclusion that it was probably just repairs, because they were so preoccupied it took them a while to see me.
All machines and electronics break down, no matter how sophisticated.
So why were they performing repairs on our planet and not in outerspace? Perhaps they've long realised it's better to be stranded on a planet than in space? I didn't have time to ask them.
And like the song 'I saw a UFO and no-one believed me - I was a long way from home and on my own...'
I briefly thought of knocking on someone's door to say, hey come and look! but almost immediately dismissed the idea because curiously the nearby houses all had their lights out, and only the distant ones could be considered.
So how would you feel if someone came knocking, getting you out of bed and crying Space Aliens! Space Aliens! Come quickly!
Precisely
I figure they possessed some fairly advanced electronics, perhaps understand human nature, and what they did was perform a localised blackout, waited for a few residents to come out and see if it was just their house, repair the fuse if so, before seeing it had happened to other houses, and then going back inside.
And then they landed. As silently as they took off.
Can I just get this right?Quote:
Originally Posted by MystyrMystyry
The thing was huge, above a populated area and nobody else saw it?
Huge is a word. Gigantic is another. Semi-visible.
Above (before it landed) and 'in' a residential area, yes.
I know. it sounds ridiculous.
I've written it all down, and it even reads ridiculous to me.
And if I'd made it up I'd show no-one - I'd say I can do better than that.
You realy had to be there - and I wish you had been (but I get the feeling that you'd have said to me 'Of this we must never speak').
Other speculations. They have sophisticated technology allowing them to traverse only they know how far across the galaxy/universe. We have stealth bombers. Perhaps their technology can stealth from the electro-magnetic impulses of both radar and the human-eye.
I know, it all sounds like bad sci fi, but maybe because truth is 'stranger than fiction'? You should know that better than anyone.
I'm not blaming you - I'm blaming them. It's just the more breath that I blow, well it doesn't make it better for me...
Nor do I know why they had to be humanoid - Pumpkin sized heads, humanesque faces with big black eyes, two spidery arms and legs, oddly proportioned pear bodies. Maybe it's the preferred evolutionary form for the 'brainy' ones (stereo vision, opposable thumbs, able to breath out of water etc etc).
I hope we don't evolve further to look lke them - it didn't look healthy.
And I realise the whole thing poses too many questions, but by all means keep asking...
Have to agree. Nobody else seeing it is peculiar. What time was it?Quote:
Originally Posted by MystyrMystyry
This is the part which really makes me wonder. Alien technology would need to be advanced far beyond that of humans, so it's not like they'd have anything to fear from us. They're obviously happy enough for people to see them, since people see them, so it seems unlikely they'd come here without saying a general "Hello, earth!" kind of thing.Quote:
Originally Posted by MystyrMystyry
Doesn't that seem odd to you?
Amazing how Hollywood got it right.Quote:
Originally Posted by MystyrMystyry
9:30 pm, give or take a few minutes, was the time. I was walking from a mate's house I'd left at 9:15 in order to meet my girlfriend at 10:00 pm. I had no mechanised transport nor watch, but I'd made the same walk more than a hundred times. To get from his flat to where I was takes about 15 minutes depending on pace and I took no shortcuts nor deviations from the most direct normal route.
Think about aliens landing for a minute. As few people who thought of them as celebrities (which is not what Niel Armstrong wanted after he returned to Earth, so why would they?) would largely be the Trekkie/nutjob crowd. Others who'd take an unhealthy interest would be all the paranoid militaries in the world. Paranoids in general.
You'd have a general panic just amongst the already unbalanced members of society. Some would say 'Shoot 'em! String 'em up! They eat children! Cut 'em open to see what they're made of!'
The media would have a field day with camera flashes.
Great welcome for our alien visitors.
So who would they want/need to talk to? The President? And say what? 'We have noticed you are a very violent species and therefore we will not be sharing any of our superior tech with you, not just because you have nothing we need to trade. Also you are inferior to us in every way and you don't even taste nice. That was a joke.'
Perhaps there's an intestellar code of conduct when it comes to dealing with primitive civilisations. Don't interfere with them until they can prove they've bred/evolved out all forms of irrational violence.
Come to think of it, of all the 'real' stories I've heard they've never featured rayguns.
And why would they want to cause even accidental trouble? Maybe they had their own violent ancestors - survival of the fittest may not be so unique to our planet as to all planets.
'Hollywood got it right'
Dr Who got it right - after they realised the audience just didn't identify with faceless formless monsters as readily as monsters that were a similar size and shape and facial placement relative to us.
If Hollywood got it right, they got it right by shorthand after experimenting with giant ants, spiders and lizard effects, Frankenstein, Dracula and the wolfman.
Okay they didn't look like the insectoids of Close Encounters - for one they were clothed in red/brown. The eyes were not as big, round not almond shaped, and when I say they were black they could have been very dark green or ultramarine, dull not shiny. And the big head was a bit like a pyramid that had been very rounded down - no sharp edges or corners. Get freecad or a piece of plasticene for that.
The neck was long and thin. The shoulders broadish but without muscle. They appeared to be eight feet tall, but that could have been my sudden intense encounter - maybe they were even taller.
I was about ten feet from the spacecraft most of the time. I thought of touching it but I just suspected an electric shock or worse (how NASA irradiate everything that returns from the stratosphere and above).
As for the size and shape it was about three stories like a flat block, almost a cylinder but a rounded elongated squaroid.
As for the material - imagine an alloy made of glass and silver.
It's hard, i know, like trying to imagine a colour you've never seen before - but it is a primary colour, not a brown-grey mess.
I've tried photoshop and stuff, but it makes it look even more ridiculous.
Skin colour? Neutral grey? But the lighting wasn't a bright fluorescent lamp like Startrek. It was like a bright ultraviolet tinge to an otherwise subdued almost nightlight. And the walls were covered in faint though coloured LED like lights, in both sparse and clustered patches
The only external light was a crescent moon (over the horizon) and the distant streetlamp - hundred and fifty feet away, two hundred - never checked.
The craft was situated from the edge of the footpath - the curb - over to a small park - about thirty feet deep - at the rear of the local library.
And another detail - you know how some dark people shave their heads and the hairline is perfectly straight across the brow? Like that. And no eyebrows, no blinking but I seem to recall a flick like a snake eye, but then...
I'm aware you're imagining it differently to how it was. If I were to write it as a story (my specialty) I could probably convey a better sense of unity to it, but you're welcome to have a go. It's really quite tiring for some reason.
Before you challenge me about the house/flat dichtomy - his flat was connected to the landlord's house by a single door to grant access to the shared kitchen and bathroom, not the best arrangement he will be sure to agree, but it was two bedrooms all to himself, access to a bathtub and fridge, cheap, and guaranteed privacy from the landlord, and he had a vegetable patch in his own backyard - it was a virtual house.
I'd say the alien thought processes probably give off some radiation-like emissions which have affected you.Quote:
Originally Posted by MystyrMystyry
lol!
No I think it's because I was too intensely straining for every detail
In my reality I've long treated it as a personal joke, but you're someone new to blather on to, so I guess I was being a bit too serious about it (not one of my strong points)
Anyway if you to skies tonight, you never know...
You see that's the problem. There are many serious sightings from serious people. In almost any other field it would be proof enough, but somehow it isn't here. If we believe them, then we look for a more conventional explanation of what they saw. If we can't think of one, then we still assume there is one. I include myself in this. I know a couple of people who have had similar experiences to MistyrMistyry, but still remain sceptical.
Which probably goes to show how easily humans are fooled by tricks of light. You must have seen any number of mind-boggling optical illusions in your time - I think almost all UFO "sightings" result from this, with a smaller percentage due to freak weather conditions and a an even smaller percentage due to an internal error in the brain of the sighter.Quote:
Originally Posted by prendrelemick
A [hopefully] smaller number still are plain old hoaxes.
That's because Occam's Razor still works. Would there really be aliens capable of overcoming the almost-infinite difficulty in crossing deep space only to come to earth to buzz a few people?Quote:
Originally Posted by prendrelemick
I find it intensely amusing that the number of UFO sightings in NZ recently has gone through the roof.
From what I've been able to track down, people are seeing a bright light cruising across the sky to the north-east between an hour and 2 hours after sunset.
In a bizarre coincidence, that just happens to be when the International Space Station is visible from NZ. In the north-eastern quadrant of the sky.
I just cannot figure how all that technology in the ISS is missing the damn UFOs!