the tin drum

the country doctor finished this one this week...what a great read! and what a character! oskar, you little devil, you...

the doc didn't really know what this story was about, only that it was considered a modern classic on post world war two germany, and it was nothing like he expected...but that doesn't mean he was disappointed...au contraire! funny german literature...

if you haven't picked this one up yet, put it on your to do list...it's got the doc's seal of approval...

btw, the country doctor picked this one up at the local library book sale for four bits...a solid buy if he does type so himself...

Did you read it in English? How is the translation? I read it in german, and Grass' language and style are quite unique, including self-invented words sometimes.

I had started reading this book with very high hopes but quickly I lost interest and resented every single page. Could not stand Oscar.

I am still not sure what it was all about. Don't misunderstand me, please... I am sure it carries some deep meanings that were simply lost on me.

So, I would like to hear your interpretations.

Were you reading it in German, Scheherazade?
It's always impossible to have a valid translation from German and the style of Grass is one of the toughest around.
I have read it in Italian, a recent translation trying to emulate the creative language of the original book, then I have compared this new translation to the previous one and in my opinion the book has gained rhythm with this new effort, this is the kind of novel that requires a huge creative effort from the translator. This is one of the books I will read in German when my German will be good enough.
I think this is a work of genius, Oskar embodies - literally - his country and does it in a spectacular way, Germany - like Oskar - was a nation unable to become an adult, a dwarf who thinks to be a powerful adult. The life of Oskar as an allegory of German history is the way I understand the book but what makes it a masterpiece is the continuous literary inventions of Grass: the novel is full of memorable situations and characters.

I read it in English.

I hated Oskar as a character; he was spoilt, calculating, egocentric and malicious at times.

I have read interpratations that Oskar is supposed to represent the German nation but I cannot bring myself view Germans like that.

It reminded me of A Prayer for Owen Meany, for which I did not care much either.

When I read The Tin Drum, the first pages held my interest. The image of the runaway man hiding under the many skirts of the woman, how fantastic! It was worthy of a scene by García Márquez.

But slowly I started losing interest. I found the novel dull, meandering and without point.

I have enjoyed other novels by Grass: Crabwalk and Cat and Mouse.

It's about the rebirth of post-war Germany.

I'm sorry... but I found the novel to be absolutely brilliant... one of the funniest books I have read. Yes, it has all sorts of layers of "meaning" but first and foremost it is a brilliantly and darkly funny read with unforgettable characters and situations. It also reads quite well in English. German is close enough to English that few works of prose form a real challenge for the translator.

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Originally Posted by Lulim

Did you read it in English? How is the translation? I read it in german, and Grass' language and style are quite unique, including self-invented words sometimes.

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english...as to the other thoughts, the scene where oskar gets the audience to go back into their childhood and enjoy wetting their pants can be delved into as deep as the reader wants in the doc's opinion...

but aside from grabbing deeper meanings from the book, the doc agrees that the characters, the new creative scenes that oskar finds himself in and the way that grass ties everything together makes this a wonderful book to read from that vantage point alone...

sorry, but the doc only found the book more engrossing (pardon the pun) the farther he got into it...

and the creative way that grass keeps killing off his characters is a work of a literary craftsman from the doc's point of view...

made of it several years ago. I think it was German made. I remember it had English subtitles. If you enjoyed the book, you are sure to enjoy this thought provoking movie.

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Originally Posted by dfloyd

made of it several years ago. I think it was German made. I remember it had English subtitles. If you enjoyed the book, you are sure to enjoy this thought provoking movie.

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The movie doesn't cover the whole book though. It ends somewhere in the middle.

the doc gets a real flavor for 'german stoicism' in the way that oskar narrates his story...the subtle, dry humour is pure succulence for the reader...

(btw the movie is supposed to end after part two...there are three parts to the book and the doc wonders how they decided to leave a crucial element of the story out of the movie...)

Someone would happen to know which translation of the Tim Drum in English is the "best"? Unfortunately, my German is not quite enough to read novels yet.

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Originally Posted by stlukesguild

I'm sorry... but I found the novel to be absolutely brilliant... one of the funniest books I have read. Yes, it has all sorts of layers of "meaning" but first and foremost it is a brilliantly and darkly funny read with unforgettable characters and situations. It also reads quite well in English. German is close enough to English that few works of prose form a real challenge for the translator.

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I cannot engage here as I used to, but yes, Gunther Grass achieved the impossible, writing a work of art whose journey slowly begins the healing process for a nation guilty of humanity's worst crime, and he does it with humor and pathos in a nearly perfectly sustained tension. I may not have a full grasp of his fairy tale allusions and their interpretive impact--I am in fact still trying to find a critical thesis on the fairy tale metaphors within the novel-- but this is one of the few, and they are few, great works of literature which at least intuitively makes me hesitate to dismiss metaphysical struggle within the human psyche.

I wince to see such a master work trivialized.

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Originally Posted by Jozanny

...he does it with humor and pathos in a nearly perfectly sustained tension...

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this is a well-articulated set of words, and the doc heartily concurs with the thought...

as the doc pointed out earlier about the way grass kills off the characters...humor and pathos...

this book needs to be read by anyone that searches for 'literature'...

the doc finished 'war and peace' just before he picked up this one...as you can see, the doc didn't start a thread about that book...

apples and oranges, and 'war and peace' was a good read, but this book was just an absolute gem of a follow-up to that book...it's in the pantheon of 'masterworks' from a humble old country doctor's point of view...

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Originally Posted by Ghuyuran

Someone would happen to know which translation of the Tim Drum in English is the "best"? Unfortunately, my German is not quite enough to read novels yet.

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perfect can be the enemy of the good...best thing to do from the doc's perspective is to get your hands on a copy and then enjoy!

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Originally Posted by Ghuyuran

Someone would happen to know which translation of the Tim Drum in English is the "best"? Unfortunately, my German is not quite enough to read novels yet.

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The authoritative edition in the US is apparently the Vintage International Vintage Books edition translated by Ralph Manheim. I do not know if this is in fact the edition used for ereaders, but Amazon does have a kindle edition.

I don't know about other European editions--but what I've been kicking myself over is that critical guide I wanted. I came across it in an obscure website notation and haven't been able to find it since.

I regret that I really could not bear down and focus on a decent discussion in the forum book club here. I would have had to drop everything to reread Grass, and his diction even in translation is so rich, dense, it demands the respect of one's critical abilities. There are teaching guides available, but I want the above mentioned if I can find it.

It is easy to imagine that teaching The Tin Drum could take at least two semesters, if not more.