Playboy centenary

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01-20-2007, 11:38 AM
Logos

Playboy centenary

This topic was originally started by Chris76, but accidentally got erased, but I am able to re-post portions of it, starting on page 2 :)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Niamh View Post
Just a little note for all the fans of J.M.Synge, Next month (21st Jan 07)
is the one hundred aniversary of the first ever performance of the Playboy Of The Western World. It Is also the Aniversary of The Riots in the Abbey theatre dublin caused by the first ever performance of the Playboy!

Hopefully the Abbey Theatre Put on the play next month to celebrate!
01-20-2007, 11:40 AM
Logos

Quote:

Originally Posted by Niamh

Does my accent really come true in my writing?

Quote:

Originally Posted by JackShea
Not a'tall! But I am a dreamer and when I wrote that I was probably dreaming I was at the Abbey Theatre...or The Druid in Galway.

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01-20-2007, 11:42 AM
Logos

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chris76

We`re dealing with Synge`s Playboy at university at the moment. Therefore I`m glad to have found this forum with some experts on Synge involved.

I really wonder whether Synge was ahead of his time writing the Playboy. Yeats and Co. were still trying to create some Irish identity basically on old myths and folk-tales. They did this like numerous scholars on the continent in their countries, e.g. Germany, Italy and numerous Slavian countries. Everybody tried to create a nation these days. All had one thing in common. They tried to define their languages as distinct from other languages and they tried to revive a"glorious" past, both in order to create a nation. The Irish, being the oldest colony of Great Britain, had no lesser right to struggle for a nation of their own than the other countries who had by the time the Irish Revival reached its peak mostly established their own nations already.

But Synge portrayed the Irish peasants as superstitious and easy to manipulate. Did he foresee the dangers of nationalism? Did he realize how narrow-minded people can get, that have but one thing to identify, namely their nation?
What do you think?

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01-20-2007, 11:43 AM
Logos

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chris76

The Irish, being the oldest colony of Great Britain..

Quote:

Originally Posted by JackShea
Well for one, and this is my opinion, the Irish never considered themselves a colony at all but an occupied nation. But I leave the question/answers open to those who were born on Irish soil.

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01-20-2007, 11:44 AM
Logos

Quote:

Originally Posted by Virgil
Niamh, did you want to have a group reading and discussion of the play?

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01-20-2007, 11:45 AM
Logos

Quote:

Originally Posted by JackShea

the Irish never considered themselves a colony at all but an occupied nation.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chris76
You`re right: the Irish probably dislike the term colony and you`re also right in saying they were an occupied nation. (Please forgive my language not being as exact, I´m not a native speaker.) But in my understanding you could indeed speak of a deFacto-colony, if the governmental power that affects everyday life is a foreign one for some hundred years.

Nevertheless, I posted this to discuss Synge being a foreseer of the dangerous sides of nationalism or not.
Please consider: the play Playboy of the Western world nowadays is quite a funny one to read or see on stage, but why did the people protest in 1907?

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01-20-2007, 11:50 AM
Logos

Quote:

Quote:
Originally Posted by Chris76
We`re dealing with Synge`s Playboy at university at the moment. Therefore I`m glad to have found this forum with some experts on Synge involved.

I really wonder whether Synge was ahead of his time writing the Playboy. Yeats and Co. were still trying to create some Irish identity basically on old myths and folk-tales. They did this like numerous scholars on the continent in their countries, e.g. Germany, Italy and numerous Slavian countries. Everybody tried to create a nation these days. All had one thing in common. They tried to define their languages as distinct from other languages and they tried to revive a"glorious" past, both in order to create a nation. The Irish, being the oldest colony of Great Britain, had no lesser right to struggle for a nation of their own than the other countries who had by the time the Irish Revival reached its peak mostly established their own nations already.

But Synge portrayed the Irish peasants as superstitious and easy to manipulate. Did he foresee the dangers of nationalism? Did he realize how narrow-minded people can get, that have but one thing to identify, namely their nation?
What do you think?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Niamh
Yes i do believe Synge was a head of his time when writing his Plays, Hence why most were not fully appriciated until well after Ireland gained it's independence. I also believe that he was more realistic in his portrayal. You have to note that Synge lived for a while amonst the Irish people in the west, many of which still lived relatively simple lives compared to the lives of people in Dublin. The portrayal of the Aran islanders as viewed in some of his plays, and his Prose 'the Aran Islands' was more or less what had been shown in the first ever film shot in ireland in c1900, also called 'The Aran Islands'. (The story that the Playboy was based on can be found in this book) A lot of these people were very supersticious, and the Irish were notoriously supersticious. still are to some degree!
Also only a few years before, a man called Michael Cleary murdered his wife claiming that she had been swapped by the fairies and the body they found was infact that of a changling. (There goes home rule!)

It might be interesting for you to know that Synge spent a few years living in Germany. While there he did some translations of Petrarch and a few others.

Quote:

Originally Posted by JackShea

Quote:
Originally Posted by Chris76 View Post
The Irish, being the oldest colony of Great Britain..

Well for one, and this is my opinion, the Irish never considered themselves a colony at all but an occupied nation. But I leave the question/answers open to those who were born on Irish soil.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Niamh
You're right. i dont think we ever did class ourselves as a colony. more like an oppressed nation. Everytime the Irish fought for their freedom the english squashed us like bugs and reinvaded us.(seeing as most of the rebels were originally anglo Irish aristocrats) Ever wondered why a country as old as ireland only to this day has a 4million population? most of it was because of the english. the plantations, Oliver Cromwell and his 'to hell or to Connaght' (reason why irish is mainly only spoken in the west), their lack of assistance during the famine etc. Ireland was regarded by the english as the Troublesome colony though! we didnt stop fighting them for 800 years!

Quote:

Originally Posted by Virgil
Niamh, did you want to have a group reading and discussion of the play?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Niamh
I think that might be a good idea. It would be a nice way of celebrating the 'Playboy'. how would one go about arranging it?

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01-20-2007, 11:51 AM
Logos

Quote:

Originally posted by Virgil

I'll start the thread tomorrow and try to rally interest. Worst case, it might just be you and me. Will you be around lit net this weekend for discussion?

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01-20-2007, 11:51 AM
Logos

Quote:

Originally posted by Niamh
Yes i should be around this week end. Thank you Virgil. Maybe some of the people who have posted in this thread might join in?

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01-20-2007, 11:52 AM
Logos

Quote:

Originally posted by Virgil

I have started the read and discussion thread here: (link is gone now )

All who would enjoy a fun read, please join in the discussion.

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01-20-2007, 11:55 AM
Logos

So that's all I could grab, Virgil if you would like to re-post your discussion topic that would be great.
01-20-2007, 01:56 PM
Virgil

Thanks Logos. It was the other thread on this that had substantial thoughts on the play. I'm not sure I can recreate it. I guess we'll just have to move on.
01-20-2007, 04:51 PM
Niamh

Thanks Logos.
01-20-2007, 04:54 PM
Chris76

I read the last posts before the thread vanished. As far as I remember: Virgil, you asked what everybody is afraid of!

I think the all-present fear serves the purpose to depict the characters as really weak.

There you have Pegeen fearing to be left alone in the Pub at night, for obvious reasons. And then you have Shawn who has been chosen to marry Pegeen (!) who is even more weak and fearful. He does not even dare to spent the evening in the Pub (Shebeen is the word used, I think) to protect Pegeen, well, at least to accompany her.

Shawn definetely is the biggest weakling of the play. And, I think, there is another side to it. Shawn repeatedly says:

"I'm afeared of Father Reilly"

Father Reilly remaining an off-stage character all through the play on the one hand represents Shawns profound religiosity.

On the other hand, maybe even more important, being afeared of a Father whatsoever is a direct contrast to Christy Mahon who allegedly killed his father, meaning he hadn't been afraid at all.

This is, I think, the reason why Pegeen falls in love with Christy. She does not want a weak, god-fearing, father-fearing Shawn-type-of-guy. She prefers a strong man, a patricide, a hero, a ...... Playboy.

Does this sound convincing to you? What do you think?
01-20-2007, 05:03 PM
Virgil

Very good, Chris. That was the general gist of my post. And yes, your answer does sound convincing.
01-20-2007, 05:22 PM
Niamh

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chris76

I read the last posts before the thread vanished. As far as I remember: Virgil, you asked what everybody is afraid of!

Shawn definetely is the biggest weakling of the play. And, I think, there is another side to it. Shawn repeatedly says:

"I'm afeared of Father Reilly"

Father Reilly remaining an off-stage character all through the play on the one hand represents Shawns profound religiosity.

Does this sound convincing to you? What do you think?

Synge is playing on the role of religion in Ireland at the time by expressing it through Shawn. The Catholic Curch in Ireland condemned unmarried people from intimacy, even plutonic imtimacy before marraige, and shawn refuses to stay the night with Pegeen because he's afraid of the wrath of the church, father Reilly being the personification of this.
07-27-2009, 04:29 PM
David R

Hi there,

I've always thought that this is a play that should be read by anyone with a bad father. Although Christy doesn't kill his father in reality, in his mind he has done so. The result is he becomes astonishingly successful as a ladies man and a sports man. He becomes a hero, a playboy of the Western World. We see he begins to grow in confidence as he tells how he killed his father and the locals encourage him. The message is that to be free of bad parents you must kill them psychologically.

There is also the question of why there were riots when the play opened. I believe the rioters were protesting at the amoral nature of the characters in the play which clashed with romantic nationalist views of the peasantry as noble. They didn't see the humourous side of the portrayal. But there is also the idea that it is human nature to be fascinated by wickedness, something which the rioters found unpalatable.
03-01-2010, 03:59 PM
MSG74

Appeal of the playboy of western world

Please shed light on how does the playboy of western world appeal to the modern audience.