naughty students

This question is for both teachers and not teachers:
Assume that you have a naughty child or teenager in your class, keep laughing and throwing jokes. What are the procedures that you would take to solve such a problem that really distracts you and distracts the students' attention and accordingly hinder your lesson to go on smoothly. For me, I find it an unhealthy way to use threatening (by reducing marks or any other threat) or worst violence. Though thankfully I did not face a lot of this type of students but when I was put in such a sit, I would just throw a look of the I DID NOT EXPECT THIS FROM you sort! The good thing is that it works most of the time cuz a student feel that he was highly esteemed but he ruined his pic! If that doesn't work I would ask him to pass by me to discuss his behavior . I've just put my steps in the long way of teaching , I'm still have more to learn. That's why I'm interested in your theories and experiences .

I'm not a teacher yet, but have done a couple of internships teaching at schools and I do youthwork on a weekly basis...
if students are noise I'll just stare at them intently.. that usually sorts them out...
as for cracking jokes and stuff.. it depends on the students age and gender.. if they are boys anywhere from 8 to 16 they're probalby going through puberty and are trying to sort out the hierarchy... so some of their jokes might be a way of testing you... if you can reply to their jokes etc with better line they usually respect you from that moment on and don't try to give you sh*t anymore...
it's got to be a funny line that doesn't attack them personally, though.. it shouldn't be ironic or insulting either..... sometimes when my boys do something naughty to show off I'll just laugh and say something like "yeah, you're such a big gangster. come on, cut it out now".. surprisingly this has worked quite well so far :)
but I dunno about really disruptive students... some of them might be bored and need easier or more difficult exercises to keep them busy...

Well, I remember that at one time I was one of those type of boys, disruptive and noisy. What they (and including me back then) need is a swift kick in the behind. :lol: Of course I'd be fired immediately. But that's why I couldn't be a teacher. :nod:

I'm no teacher either, but I do perform some training within our company every now and then, and: surprise, surprise... Adults are not very different from children. They can be disruptive too, you know. They just go about it a bit differently.

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Originally Posted by SleepyWitch

so some of their jokes might be a way of testing you...

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Testing you? You bet they do, and it's not only the boys either... Some girls in that age can be pretty aggravating too. Anyway, I recently visited my daughters school (4:th grade) for a full day, and some of the boys immediately decided to test me with some not so subtle pranks (then sneaking a look in my direction to see my reaction).

It was all I could do not to start laughing, but I soon coaxed them into talking about this and that, and it turned into a great discussion instead. As it turned out, all they really wanted, was to have someone listening to them, and I happily obliged. :nod:

/Claes

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Originally Posted by ClaesGefvenberg

As it turned out, all they really wanted, was to have someone listening to them, and I happily obliged. :nod:

/Claes

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I prefer the swift kick in the behind method. :lol:

lol virgil , I was also one of them but I was also very active and aways got good grades which make teachers tolerable and not harsh!

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Originally Posted by miss tenderness

lol virgil , I was also one of them but I was also very active and aways got good grades which make teachers tolerable and not harsh!

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Luckily I got good grades too, but with boys they tended to be more strict. Boys can cause a lot of trouble.

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Originally Posted by Virgil

Boys can cause a lot of trouble.

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I'm pretty new to teaching, and last school year, one of my classes had 17 boys and 1 girl -- and since I'm an itinerant teacher of English (my word choice -- I don't have my own classroom), I found myself in a chem classroom with all those tables and glass things...it was challenging.

Bottom line -- I liked those kids. I learned early-on that they were kinesthetic learners (they loved the 'hands-on' stuff), and I indulged them as much as I could. "You care too much," they'd tell me. "We're dumb." (They were 'lower-level' students - many with ADHD and emotional problems.) But I didn't buy their self-labelling. Not for a minute.

When things got too bad (those raging hormones!) I'd have to ask them to leave the classroom; but, for the most part, we learned together. To me, that's what teaching is all about. And when the end of the year came, we parted company on good terms.

I believe in getting to know my students, in showing them that I care about them as human beings, and being tolerant -- hey, we all have bad days. When every day is viewed as a new beginning, kids usually respond in a good way.

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Originally Posted by Virgil

I prefer the swift kick in the behind method. :lol:

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Well... I can't shun the method as such. I have been known to put my boot up peoples backsides on occasion. It is not exactly my first choice, but there are times when it becomes necessary. :smash:


/Claes

Having just graduated highschool last week I can say this much. Give some lee-way. If you rule with a Stalinist iron fist over the classroom you will lose a lot of respect and they will not listen to you.

The first day is the all important day, if you start out funny and athourtative the students will listen to you, but don't become their "favourite teacher" because that just means your a push-over and a "friend" more then a teacher.

If you are forced to kick students out send them to the office (where the principal or vice princapal dwell). My favourite class to this day was Drama because I could do anything and my fruity teacher would say, "Kyle, maybe you should go take a walk." or the ultamatium of, "Kyle you can go to the Cafeateria or the office, your choice. If I were you though I would chose the office."

I do not evy the job of a teacher but I had many enjoyable ones. I always like the etremly knowlegable and worldly teachers. They were easier to respect, but mostly |I thought teacher were more bullies who needed someone to push around after highschool, but maybe that was just my schools teachers.

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Originally Posted by lavendar1

"You care too much," they'd tell me. "We're dumb." (They were 'lower-level' students - many with ADHD and emotional problems.) But I didn't buy their self-labelling. Not for a minute.

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Good for you! I am not a teacher yet...but I am very much looking forward to becoming one, and I am still sorting out hypothetical situations such as this one, so I'm glad to see a thread about it. (In other words...thanks for all the ideas! :) )

Lavendar, I just saw that quote and I had to think about a book I read early this summer, called "True Notebooks" by Mark Salzman. He voluntarily taught a writing class in a juvenile detention center...and THOSE kids definitely felt the same way and were definitely hard to keep under control. Mark's tentative use of authority and strong use of conversation to keep the class on track really won the class over...and when he spoke at a convention I went to in April, he said he was still in contact with the kids through mail.

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Originally Posted by Virgil

Luckily I got good grades too, but with boys they tended to be more strict. Boys can cause a lot of trouble.

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xactly ,my sisters's son tell me stories that he and his friends plot!! Awful ones , I'm sure if they were my students I would never be lucky to know how to deal with them or even bear the situation , like hanging pieces of paper on the teacher's back when he passes them or putting a plastic snake on the earth or at least sleeping when the lesson is presented. You know what is the worst thing girls can do? Mainly chatting or laughing and more worse chatting under the tables by writing small papers lol.

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Originally Posted by rabid reader

Having just graduated highschool last week I can say this much. Give some lee-way. If you rule with a Stalinist iron fist over the classroom you will lose a lot of respect and they will not listen to you.

The first day is the all important day, if you start out funny and athourtative the students will listen to you, but don't become their "favourite teacher" because that just means your a push-over and a "friend" more then a teacher.

If you are forced to kick students out send them to the office (where the principal or vice princapal dwell). My favourite class to this day was Drama because I could do anything and my fruity teacher would say, "Kyle, maybe you should go take a walk." or the ultamatium of, "Kyle you can go to the Cafeateria or the office, your choice. If I were you though I would chose the office."

.

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Rapid Reader(nice name by the way), nice participation. I agree with the part of being simple , down to student's level but not to the extent of making them crossing all limitations. Big congrats for ur graduation …you seem a very naughty student but very brilliant.

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Originally Posted by miss tenderness

Rapid Reader(nice name by the way)

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Um... I hate to point it out, but the name was not quite "Rapid"... Close but no cigar ;) Apart from that I agree: A great post, RR.

/Claes

thanks to point this out Claes :) how r ur daughters by the way?

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Originally Posted by miss tenderness

how r ur daughters by the way?

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I have but one, but she's making enough noice for at least two: She just had her 11:th birthday, and has not wound down yet :D

/Claes

Well, I agree with most of you in the way you deal with misbihaving students. In my opinion, first, you should try to find the cause of their misbehaviour. We can't solve a problem without knowing its cause. Once this done, you would know how to react. To give a swift at the back or to react in another way are all useful ways of reacting to your students' misbehaviour. And all depends on the situation you are in.
But before all this. Make rules the first time you go to class. If some one brakes them, you should punish him/her imediatly. In this way, your students know what is expected from them. Try not to give your students' a dead time. That's to say, make them always busy doing something. In this way they will be concentrated in doing what they are required to do, and always reward them for their effort. Give them a purpose for what they are doing. For example, you can't work for free. If somebody asks you to do a work for him/her, you will ask to be paid. That's the same with your students. Their reward will be something that makes them motivated in doing the task they are asked to do.
Most trouble makers are so because they want to prove something to others. Try to make profit of this and make them the center of interest. Involve them as much as possible in classroom activities and ask them to do things that make them important in the eyes of their classmates. Ask them to clean the board and write the date for example.
If you face any problrm with your students, just go back to the years when you were a student yourself and you will find somehow a solution to that problem. I think that you've noticed that some students are eagar to learn in maths for example and don't like English. What makes them so? Once this question unswered, your problem is solved. And the unswerd will only be provided if you know more about your students, their needs, their way of learning, and their social backgounds. There are many factors that interveen in these maters.That's why you are asked to teach only few houres for the remaining are not for having rest at home but to learn from your students. For me, a teacher is just a student him/herself; given exams each moment s/he doing his/her job and should be always prepared, for failure is not tolerated.

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Originally Posted by adilyoussef

Well, I agree with most of you in the way you deal with misbihaving students. In my opinion, first, you should try to find the cause of their misbehaviour. We can't solve a problem without knowing its cause. Once this done, you would know how to react. To give a swift at the back or to react in another way are all useful ways of reacting to your students' misbehaviour. And all depends on the situation you are in.
But before all this. Make rules the first time you go to class. If some one brakes them, you should punish him/her imediatly. In this way, your students know what is expected from them. Try not to give your students' a dead time. That's to say, make them always busy doing something. In this way they will be concentrated in doing what they are required to do, and always reward them for their effort. Give them a purpose for what they are doing. For example, you can't work for free. If somebody asks you to do a work for him/her, you will ask to be paid. That's the same with your students. Their reward will be something that makes them motivated in doing the task they are asked to do.
Most trouble makers are so because they want to prove something to others. Try to make profit of this and make them the center of interest. Involve them as much as possible in classroom activities and ask them to do things that make them important in the eyes of their classmates. Ask them to clean the board and write the date for example.
If you face any problrm with your students, just go back to the years when you were a student yourself and you will find somehow a solution to that problem. I think that you've noticed that some students are eagar to learn in maths for example and don't like English. What makes them so? Once this question unswered, your problem is solved. And the unswerd will only be provided if you know more about your students, their needs, their way of learning, and their social backgounds. There are many factors that interveen in these maters.That's why you are asked to teach only few houres for the remaining are not for having rest at home but to learn from your students. For me, a teacher is just a student him/herself; given exams each moment s/he doing his/her job and should be always prepared, for failure is not tolerated.

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Adil, these are some of the wisest things I have ever heard. You must be an excellent teacher.

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Originally Posted by ClaesGefvenberg

I have but one, but she's making enough noice for at least two: She just had her 11:th birthday, and has not wound down yet :D

/Claes

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LoL ,yah , I'm sure that you 're not that old to have daughterS, sorry if I've given that pic. .yours seem very naughty then? I dunno I love naughty kids,but not students, more than those who tend to be quiet.
Give kiss to your lovely rose, I'm sure she is making ur life colorful and happy.

You know, that rapid and rabid matter, I do sometimes look at things and get an idea about them ,but never go back to revise if they as what I've figured out or not! Mostly it happens wed me in questions of exams. I sometimes read a q and since I already have an idea of what it might be , I do not complete reading the q. , this leads to disasters . thankfully, I did not reach disasters! Maybe I need you to give me a notice in such cases. Do not worry , they are rare but they do happen sometimes.

Adilyussef, very good essay man! If we are able to go step by step by your nicely worded solutions I'm sure we'll be the best teachers ever. Teachers can not have same ways in presenting lessons and dealing with abrupt problems, it's fully controlled by the various personalities of teachers. That's why they can not follow same solutions for whatever fits one can not fit another but they should try their best to act within the educational limits of solving problems just like what you've stated above.

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Originally Posted by Virgil

Adil, these are some of the wisest things I have ever heard. You must be an excellent teacher.

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I second that!

One of the big skills I learned (but of course haven't mastered) during my brief time substitute teaching was how to manage a classroom. A lot of things depend upon situation. One thing that worked for me was if a whole class was slow to quiet down, I would say in a calm, normal tone of voice, "If you can hear me say, 'shhh'." Mostly, I got weird looks, but even those kids said "shhh" and it trickled around the room till I had their attention.

For one or two disruptive students, a seating change is neccessary. As a substitute, many students wouldn't take me seriously. Though I didn't do it at the time, (hind-sight is 20/20) I really should have sent them to the office. One interesting tip I learned was that as I teacher, I should make a seating chart with post-it notes so that when I have to change a seat, I just re-stick the name on the note somewhere else on the chart! Of course, if you have a substitute, photocopy your chart so student won't switch it on them.

Sadly, I had to use the threat of sending students to the office a lot and even follow through with it because to a student, a substitute means a "free day". Some teachers even gave me referal slips already filled out to send a student to the office, complete with the offence! All I had to do was to show it to the student who was acting up!

Okay, just one more thing. When I observed some classes during my substitute training, one teachers lesson was to read aloud Jack London's To Build A Fire. I observed this for two classes and in both, about 90% of the student's fell asleep! Her solution to this was to mark down the sleepers in her grade book. Though I didn't say anything (she was an older 'seasoned' teacher), I strongly disagreed with this tactic. High school students 'live in the moment' and don't really care that they were marked dowm for sleeping. What I would have done was to have the student's act out the story as it was being read. After all, that was what they evidently wanted to do anyway judging by their rowdy behavior at the beginning of class.

I think you should read Rookie Teaching for Dummies (it was one of my required reading texts). Though I haven't been able to utilize the info yet, I found it very practical. It's set up like a textbook so that you can just take a chunk from here or there to use. I read the entire book and enjoyed it.

Boy, this is long! Tell me if I'm rambling too much!

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Originally Posted by Virgil

Adil, these are some of the wisest things I have ever heard. You must be an excellent teacher.

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Thank you dear Virgil! I hope that one day I'll be just a good teacher who is loved for his work and rewarded for his efforts. I feel so happy when I see people understand things that were difficult for them. I just love my job.
Virgil, you are a very nice man. Thanks again!

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Originally Posted by Shea

Boy, this is long! Tell me if I'm rambling too much!

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thanks Shea , it's not long I really enjoyed reading it and I'm looking for the articles you recomended:)

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Originally Posted by miss tenderness

thanks Shea , it's not long I really enjoyed reading it and I'm looking for the articles you recomended:)

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It's actually a book in the "Dummies" series and is written by a math teacher named W. Michael Kelly who has quite a humorous wit. I really laughed out loud at parts.

must be enjoyable then. I'll check it soon :)

i'm not a teacher but i say just to tell this student if he won't be quiet and quit disrupting your class then you will give him a 5,000 word essay on how to shut his/her mouth and stop being a disruption..

lol like this shelby,I'm thinking of trying it.

Well, reading everyone's opinions here makes me feel rather mean comparatively. I just graduated from high school a few months ago, and I cannot express the relief I felt at never again having to be stuck in a class with people who didn't have some sort of business there. I always said, all throughout high school, "Why do you not simply get rid of them? They're annoying as hell! They don't belong here; kick them out!" I've always said the teacher's job is not the parent's. A school is not a day care. If the student is not capable of being civilized, they simply have to be removed for the sake of those who are, because LEARNING DOES NOT TAKE PLACE OTHERWISE. And that's what school is for, after all. Once is enough, frankly. Certainly one need not hold things with the "Stalinistic fist" mentioned earlier, but it is generally rather obvious when there is a problem - though perhaps this only seems so to me because I am a student. Anyway, yeah, I'm obviously a bit on the intolerant side, but this is simply because it was always the students like me - who did the work, paid attention, were dead silent throughout, never cheated, and, if nothing else, PRETENDED TO CARE about the subject - that suffered for the idiocy of our more...let us say "audibly munificent" counterparts. Sorry, I'm waxing self-righteous here, but such was the case.

Only "true" solution for this. Is a personality. A personality who'll get student's respect and love. That's all...

Fear, thats the best way to control the little blighters.;)

after practice , I totally agree with Kilted.

To keep this going... I teach in an alternative school where the gangsta thug students aren’t afraid. Some of them are personally familiar with the wrong end of a beating from gang violence, up to and including being on the wrong end of the firearm. Fear is out of the question. Continual, steady moral modeling and a little bit of pressure with standing up and saying no is what I have found that works the best. I have had to get firm and send them home for the day, but they have to come to me the next day to get back into class. They all have. They call me at home; ask for help for their friends and family. I am what they call a player hater, but they seek me out. Christ accepted them all as they were and weeded out their problems afterward (sorry to get on the soapbox). It can work. You will get prematurely gray, but it can work.

Jamesian, in regular public school, I do somewhat agree. But, the government doesn't allow it. We need to work towards a stronger model, much like the Asian model where students are categorized and placed as their intelligence allows. We would have a large number of agricultural facilities.

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Originally Posted by Shea

Okay, just one more thing. When I observed some classes during my substitute training, one teachers lesson was to read aloud Jack London's To Build A Fire. I observed this for two classes and in both, about 90% of the student's fell asleep! Her solution to this was to mark down the sleepers in her grade book. Though I didn't say anything (she was an older 'seasoned' teacher), I strongly disagreed with this tactic. High school students 'live in the moment' and don't really care that they were marked dowm for sleeping. What I would have done was to have the student's act out the story as it was being read. After all, that was what they evidently wanted to do anyway judging by their rowdy behavior at the beginning of class.

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I have a "sleeper" in my class, and could use some advice to keep him awake! I have noticed that including movement, or anything that gets them up out of their seat helps. However, I don't want to always make this a part of our day. Any suggestions? I realize I must keep the curriculum engaging, and try my best to do this, but the problem with this one student is that he does not get enough sleep at night nor does he eat breakfast before class and also says that all the reading I assign is boring- even though I don't think he's attempted all of it. I'm trying not to give up on him, but think he needs more discipline in going to bed early and participating in class- or drop the class. Suggestions, please!!:(

Coming from a highschool's student perspective, the best way to make your mark as a high authorative figure, is to set your grounds at the very first day of class. Respect upon students can be gained by a very witty teacher :p

Just let us kids alone.Kids will be kids.

My pop was a teacher and he would make the kids copy pages of this enormous ancient dictionary (obviously an english teacher) anyways when he retired the former students gifted the dictionary back to him... my family loves that dictionary!

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Well, I agree with most of you in the way you deal with misbihaving students. In my opinion, first, you should try to find the cause of their misbehaviour. We can't solve a problem without knowing its cause. Once this done, you would know how to react. To give a swift at the back or to react in another way are all useful ways of reacting to your students' misbehaviour. And all depends on the situation you are in.
But before all this. Make rules the first time you go to class. If some one brakes them, you should punish him/her imediatly. In this way, your students know what is expected from them. Try not to give your students' a dead time. That's to say, make them always busy doing something. In this way they will be concentrated in doing what they are required to do, and always reward them for their effort. Give them a purpose for what they are doing. For example, you can't work for free. If somebody asks you to do a work for him/her, you will ask to be paid. That's the same with your students. Their reward will be something that makes them motivated in doing the task they are asked to do.
Most trouble makers are so because they want to prove something to others. Try to make profit of this and make them the center of interest. Involve them as much as possible in classroom activities and ask them to do things that make them important in the eyes of their classmates. Ask them to clean the board and write the date for example.
If you face any problrm with your students, just go back to the years when you were a student yourself and you will find somehow a solution to that problem. I think that you've noticed that some students are eagar to learn in maths for example and don't like English. What makes them so? Once this question unswered, your problem is solved. And the unswerd will only be provided if you know more about your students, their needs, their way of learning, and their social backgounds. There are many factors that interveen in these maters.That's why you are asked to teach only few houres for the remaining are not for having rest at home but to learn from your students. For me, a teacher is just a student him/herself; given exams each moment s/he doing his/her job and should be always prepared, for failure is not tolerated.

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I definetely agree with this.
My philosophy teacher is a strict man and may be seen as rough. But I esteem him so much.
You understand how to behave with teachers the first time you meet them....the ones who try to be friends, the ones who never chide you or that let you copy in front of them (like my Art teacher) won't get your respect and will go on complaining about that!
In my class there are 16 girls and ONE boy...so, you can imagine the kind of atmosphere( very tense but quite noiseless) and it's impossible to chat without standing out.I chat and laugh a lot, most of times because I'm bored, but I become a very good student with those teachers I like and esteem because I want them to like and esteem me, while I show the wild side with the ones I don't respect because I don't care about their opinion.
In my opinion, students can recognise good teachers and if you want to be one you have to:1) be impartial 2)be the boss, not because you are the teacher and they are the students, but because you know something they can learn 3)love your profession 4) not speak ill of other teachers in front of your students (I have teachers who act like that)
well, I know it's quite hard....

I have a question about the situation of having a student write a 5,000 (or whatever length) essay as punishment. I think it is a good idea. However, does it work? If the student doesn't write it, what do you do then? Tell him to stay in detention until he writes it (which might be a month), etc? I'm just thinking of the problems of parents coming back and getting mad about this issue? How would someone use this method if the student balks at something like that?

I haven't been a teacher (though it looks like I will be one, one day), but I've been a student. Do you have a head or deputy head who is feared? If you do, it allows you a neat twist on "good cop/bad cop". Be the nice, fun teacher in the classroom, but whenever anyone plays up (at all -- don't be afraid to be harsh), send them for a good roasting from the deputy head. Hopefully, this means they come back to your class thinking it will be better to stay on your right side, since you are a decent teacher, but crossing you leads to having to spend time with a mean bastard. (I'm convinced this is the main role of a deputy head -- to instil fear. If yours doesn't, then my tactic doesn't really work; in that case, being your own "bad cop" might be necessary.)