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Yes but much of it was tongue in cheek, although he did have a reputation for consorting with wayward women such as Emerald Cunard. His gruff imperious manner was largely assumed in order to debunk pomposity and he was genuinely admired by the British public as, not only a great conductor, but a real character.Quote:
Originally Posted by stlukesguild
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This recording has been the recipient of some rather mixed reviews, with Abbado accused of being overly fussy and Renée Fleming's finale faulted with sounding overly mannered in an attempt to portray the character of an innocent child... although almost all reviews are unanimous in their praise for Fleming and Abbado's performance of the Alban Berg Sieben Frühe Lieder which were the reason behind my purchasing this disc. Admittedly, I am not a Mahlerian to the point of being able to compare this performance of his 4th to several others. I have recordings of the 4th by Bernstein (with Reri Grist) and Reiner (with the great Lisa della Casa)... both of which I am more than satisfied with.
Honestly, I cannot fault this performance. The Berlin Philharmonic is transcendent... able to cut through and hold together the passages of the greatest chaos while illuminating the exquisite third movement with a crystalline clarity. As a sworn admirer of Renée Fleming I must admit that my bias is such that it would surely take a stupendous failing on her part for me to turn against her. having said as much, I will also admit that singers can and are indeed miscast on occasion. Fleming's voice is full, rich, sensuous, and "womanly". She is not the first singer I'd think of for a role like Cio-Cio San, Susanna from Le Nozze di Figaro, or other more "girlish" roles. The fourth movement sets the text of Das himmlische Leben from Des Knaben Wunderhorn as a child's narrative voiced by a soprano... presenting a sunny, naive vision of Heaven yet a vision laden with its darker elements: the child makes it clear that the heavenly feast takes place at the expense of animals, including a sacrificed lamb. Fleming is not the first singer I would have thought of for this role. Della Casa may have been the best... capturing a child-like innocence and yet not abandoning the serious overtones and slipping into something comic that would have completely undermined Mahler's intentions. I don't get the notion that Fleming comes off as some pursed lipped brat, at one of the worst reviews suggested. I do agree that there is a sense that she is holding back or attempting to hide a voice too big for the role. But then I wonder whether the composer were not to blame in part... expecting a soprano to play the role of a choirboy. Nevertheless, this is all really splitting hairs. Fleming performs admirably and one cannot imagine a choirboy or a lesser "girlish" singer handling the more lyrical and rich passages anywhere near as well.
As for Alban Berg's Sieben Frühe Lieder. For whatever reason... in spite of my own admitted passion for song and assuredly for orchestral songs... I only recently became aware of these exquisite works. Listening to these works almost leads me to a greater level of dislike for Schoenberg. Like Adorno, I'm led to wonder just what Berg might have achieved as a tonal composer. Indeed, I begin to suspect that just as Mozart and Schubert's early demise were such a loss to classical music, so was Berg's relationship with Schoenberg. If only he had come under the spell of Strauss or Zemlinsky instead... These early songs already suggest the richness of Strauss' finer works honed with a more "lyrical"... almost "impressionist" sensibility. Anyone who has never given any of the composers of the Second Viennese School a chance should certainly listen to these magnificent songs by Berg... especially anyone fond of Strauss' songs and operas:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oTgy_oOvsPE
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tS8_Tlcemxo
Fleming's performance is absolutely delicious... perhaps less heroic but more "vulnerable" than Jessye Norman's equally stunning rendition.
A friend of mine recently introduced me to the composer Edwin York Bowen, who, I'd never heard of. I'm only beginning my exploration of his music, but I'm impressed - he was obviously a very fine composer who's obscurity is a result of the changing fashion of the time. He was composing wonderful Romantic stuff by the bucket-load at a time when it was seen as old hat.#
Have a listen to this rather fine Toccata. If you like that, then settle down and listen to the entire length of this rather super Viola Sonata.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PCXg8xo31h0
Currently listening to one of Haydn's string quartets (due to a seed planted by Loka in another thread.) I'm then going in the bath with a bottle of St Peter's Organic ale - nothing to do with music but I'm quite excited about it nonetheless.
Any suggestions on the best of Haydn/favourites?
Haydn's wonderful, and in my opinon he's at his best when composing masses - they are all wonderful, but the Nelson Mass and the Paukenmesse are up there with the best masses ever composed. There's also an oratorio called The Creation, which is an absolute masterpiece.
And, as you are discovering, the string quartets are fabulous - he doesn't set out to do anything big or clever with them, all he wants to do is create nice melody, and this he acchieves in buckets!
I just saw a performance by the St. Louis Symphony of Dvorak's 7th Symphony, Crumb's Haunted Landscape, and Strauss's Last Four Songs.
I was a bit disappointed with Dvorak's 7th Symphony, which is what I was most looking forward to. It seemed to lack the power of the recording I have, conducted by Leonard Bernstein and performed by the New York Philharmonic.
I can't find a recording of Crumb's Haunted Landscape. Suffise it to say that it was bizzarre and haunting (fittingly), and I loved it. It had a lot of open space punctuated by odd percussion and piano notes, followed by stirring, yet soft, strings, usually playing only two notes. It was fun. There were plenty of people there who definitely did not dig it.
I also enjoyed Strauss's Four Last Songs, sung by St. Louis's Christine Brewer. Not something I'd necessarily buy an album of, but Brewer's skill was definitely something to watch.
Lokasenna- A friend of mine recently introduced me to the composer Edwin York Bowen, who, I'd never heard of. I'm only beginning my exploration of his music, but I'm impressed - he was obviously a very fine composer who's obscurity is a result of the changing fashion of the time. He was composing wonderful Romantic stuff by the bucket-load at a time when it was seen as old hat.
Have a listen to this rather fine Toccata. If you like that, then settle down and listen to the entire length of this rather super Viola Sonata.
So many unknown/lesser known composers of real merit left to discover... but they're all placed on the back-burner for the time being. I promised the wife no new music or DVD purchases until at least May upon buying a new laptop and an i-phone. As it is I have literally 100 CDs that I have yet to hear.:blush2: I'll need to satisfy my lust for new music to Spotify and YouTube for the time being.
Neely- Currently listening to one of Haydn's string quartets (due to a seed planted by Loka in another thread.) I'm then going in the bath with a bottle of St Peter's Organic ale - nothing to do with music but I'm quite excited about it nonetheless.
Any suggestions on the best of Haydn/favourites?
Generally the peak of Haydn's quartet oeuvre is deemed to be the Op. 76 the two quartets of Op. 77 and perhaps the finest his Op. 51: The Seven Last Words of Christ originally written for full orchestra, and also scored as a choral work. Beyond this almost any of his quartets from the Op. 33 "The Russian Quartets" onward are worthy of hearing. Seriously Haydn is the true father of both the symphony and the string quartet which alone places him among the most important composers of all time. While his efforts in either genre may never rise to the level of what Mozart and Beethoven were later to achieve in their finest works in these genre, the sheer volume of work at a consistently high level is mind-boggling. In many ways this is what keeps Haydn off of lists of the "greatest symphonies" or "greatest quartets/chamber works"... there are so many to choose from of equal merit. With Beethoven there are but 9 symphonies... and by general consensus only the 3rd, 5th, 6th, 7th, and 9th are stand-outs. With Mozart there are 41 symphonies... but truly only no.s 25, 29, 35, 36, and 38-41 are major achievements. With Haydn you have 104 symphonies. There are 12 among the "London Symphonies" alone, which are counted as his finest... but there are also the 6 "Paris Symphonies" and a slew of other symphonies prior to these late works that are fully mature and worthy of hearing. I would greatly suggest investing in this set:
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The symphonies included were well-chosen as being among Haydn's finest. A good many of them reveal a muscular "sturm und drang" energy (as opposed to the negative stereotype of an effete music written to placate prancing bewigged aristocrats) that clearly anticipate Beethoven.
Having said this much, I fully agree with Loka... Haydn's finest works are surely his choral compositions. The Creation is equal (if not greater) than any choral work written by Mozart and Beethoven, and is commonly placed along-side the Messiah, the St. Matthew Passion, The Mass in B-Minor, Mozart's Requiem, Brahm's German Requiem, and Monteverdi's Vespers as one of the towering choral works of all time. But this is but a single of his great choral efforts. There is a second oratorio, The Seasons, almost as fine as the Creation, and then there are a slew of great masses: The Lord Nelson Mass, the Mass in Time of War, Harmoniemesse, Kleine Orgelmesse, Great Organ Mass, the Theresienmesse, the Saint Cecilia Mass, and also the choral setting of The Last Seven Words of Christ. These are all incredibly fine works.
I'm actually delving into the choral works of a couple of other composers... Luigi Cherubini and Giovanni Battista Pergolesi. Using the Barnes and Noble gift cards I got for Christmas I picked up these box sets:
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Cherubini was a composer of the late classical period... a peer of Beethoven... best know for his opera Médée made famous in "modern" times thanks to the iconic performances of Maria Callas. I actually picked this up late last year but have yet to play it:
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Beyond his operatic successes, Cherubini was best known for his choral works. I've long had a recording of his Requiem which I thought was quite good...
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... but for whatever reason never got around to exploring him in further depth. Of course I will admit that the "classical era" as a whole (Haydn/Mozart/early Beethoven) demands that I delve much deeper... but right now it is still the Baroque that beckons most. Nevertheless, this new 7-disc box set was priced at a more than attractive price... and so I leaped... and I am glad that I did. I am listening to Cherubini's Mass in F "Di Chimay" right now... and it is a magnificent and powerful work. I look forward to the rest of the set in eager anticipation.
As for Giovanni Battista Pergolesi... Damn!!! This guy was dead at 26 in the year in the year 1736... and yet already his brilliant Stabat Mater had left behind the traditions of the Baroque and through the use of a greater simplicity, clarity, and transparency he was already closer to Mozart than he was to Handel and Bach... who still had nearly 15 years to live! Pergolesi wrote several operas of note, one of which caused a major dispute in Paris among supporters of the "old school" French Baroque and the new Italian style. He also composed a number of instrumental works as well as a body of highly acclaimed choral works. Had the composer not died so young, he quite conceivably may have stood alongside Gluck and Mozart as one of the founders of the "classical" opera and alongside C.P.E. Bach, Haydn, Gluck and Mozart as one of the figures most responsible for the shift away from the Baroque and toward the "classical" era as a whole.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_2zc0wTORSI
Mutatis-Mutandi- I just saw a performance by the St. Louis Symphony of Dvorak's 7th Symphony, Crumb's Haunted Landscape, and Strauss's Last Four Songs.
I was a bit disappointed with Dvorak's 7th Symphony, which is what I was most looking forward to. It seemed to lack the power of the recording I have, conducted by Leonard Bernstein and performed by the New York Philharmonic.
That happens at times. It could, of course, have been a less stellar performance... and Bernstein, after all, is a hard act to follow. On the other hand, it could simply be that for you Bernstein's reading of Dvorak's 7th is Dvorak's 7th. This occurred quite often when I first began to explore classical music. I would own a single recording of various works and as a result, any deviation from this interpretation I took to be a failing. Even to this day, Marriner's performance of Mozart's Requiem IS Mozart's Requiem to me thanks to the film Amadeus where I first encountered this work. I picked up Marriner's version shortly after, and for years never even thought to explore any alternatives. Since then I have picked up Philippe Herreweghe's, John Eliot Gardiner's, and Harry Christophers'... all fine recordings... but I'll admit it took me a while to come around to appreciating their interpretations.
I can't find a recording of Crumb's Haunted Landscape. Suffise it to say that it was bizzarre and haunting (fittingly), and I loved it. It had a lot of open space punctuated by odd percussion and piano notes, followed by stirring, yet soft, strings, usually playing only two notes. It was fun. There were plenty of people there who definitely did not dig it.
The piece is available through Amazon:
http://www.amazon.com/George-Crumb-L...7458596&sr=1-1
Coupled with William Schuman it should indeed be interesting. I'm not personally big on the more extremes of avant garde modernist experimentation in music, but I have found I do like a number of Crumb's works... which can indeed be haunting... harrowing... disturbing... and disorienting.
I really loved this disc:
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But is surely is an acquired taste.:leaving:
I also enjoyed Strauss's Four Last Songs, sung by St. Louis's Christine Brewer. Not something I'd necessarily buy an album of, but Brewer's skill was definitely something to watch.
Strauss Four Last Songs is one of my favorite works of all time. Indeed, asked to make a top-ten favorites list a while back, I included this gorgeous song cycle. I must have at least 8 or 9... maybe even ten different recordings of this work. I don't have Brewer's recording, but I can imagine she'd be marvelous considering her efforts on the Hyperion recordings of Strauss' Complete Songs, which I do have.
I don't think it was a bad piece--it was by far my mother's favorite of the three performances. Like you said, it just wasn't what I'm used to. I haven't really gotten into buying multiple recordings of one work yet--the only one is Mussorgsky's Pictures at an Exhibition, which I have three versions of. There's just so much out there I haven't heard, I rarely want to focus on just one work--sort of why I rarely read the same book twice.Quote:
Originally Posted by stlukesguild
I'll definitely check out those recordings, too.
Also, since Mahler is mentioned above, I have a question about him, and that is this: why is he so widely hated? I've listened to some of his stuff, and it sounds good to me. I ask because of this quote from one of my favorite sitcoms, Frasier:
Niles: “… Or here, where I sit Sunday mornings playing Mahler while Maris dabs at her watercolors?”
Frasier: “But you hate Mahler. Besides Maris, who doesn’t?"
When looking for this quote, I ran into a few discussions echoing this sentiment.
*read in a pretentious voice* because he lacks all subtly! He is a savage beast, sans the sublime nature of the Romantics before him, nor the wild innovation of the expressionists after him.
Actually, I love Mahler: particularly this piece: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f3hCCTRYcz0 (admittedly, this recording is not great)
I actually haven't come across many who would suggest that they hate Mahler. In fact, within the realm of the classical music aficionados, I would say that the late Romantic period seems to have the most fans: Mahler, Brahms, Sibelius, Bruckner, etc... Wagner attracts the most hostility due to his antisemitic comments (in spite of the fact that Chopin, among others, were far more openly antisemitic), his popularity with Hitler (as if that has anything to do with him), and the fact that as a composer he limited himself almost exclusively to opera. It is telling, for example, that Rossini, Bellini, Donizetti, Puccini, Britten... and even Verdi are rarely discussed by the majority among classical music fans as being among the greatest composers for the very same reason... while composers such as Handel, Vivaldi, Rimsky-Korsakov, and even Tchaikovsky are grossly underrated by those who ignore of are completely ignorant of their operatic achievements.
personally, I think Mahler is a stunning composer. His symphonic achievements are perhaps only surpassed by Beethoven and his song cycles are equally stunning. If Mahler proves difficult to some listeners, I think it has to do with:
1. His inclusion of vocals within a good many of his symphonies ("impurity"... and that dislike of the operatic) 2. The scale and the "meandering" or very large and open structure of his symphonies. We can grasp the forms of Haydn and Mozart and Schubert and Brahms far more clearly. 3. His bending of traditional tonality. Here Mahler goes beyond Wagner heading into the realm of multi-tonality and atonality/dissonance in which case we lose the firm-footing of a home base or major key to which we return again and again... and in the process we lose more of the sense of form.
I just spent almost an hour trying to find this piece. I listen to a lot of classical music but I don't know the names and titles like you guys do. Now that I've found it I post it here triumphantly. It really is sublime. Around the 7:00 mark occurs one of those moments of supreme bliss that touch you to the quick.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qSeg69d3CQ8
Edit: While I'm at it, I may as well post my favourite piece of music, Wagner's Tristan und Isolde prelude. Its not my preferred recording but it will suffice.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fktwPGCR7Yw
Here's what Nietzsche had to say about it:
I completely agree. I think somewhere he also says that without the operatic spectacle presented on the stage that this piece of music, decontextualized, would have driven him mad. He says "spine-tingling." It literally does tingle my spine.Quote:
Friedrich Nietzsche, one of Wagner's staunchest allies in his younger years, wrote that, for him, “Tristan and Isolde is the real opus metaphysicum of all art. . . insatiable and sweet craving for the secrets of night and death. . . it is overpowering in its simple grandeur”. In a letter to his friend Erwin Rohde in October 1868, Nietzsche described his reaction to Tristan's Prelude: “I simply cannot bring myself to remain critically aloof from this music; every nerve in me is atwitch, and it has been a long time since I had such a lasting sense of ecstasy as with this overture”. Even after his break with Wagner, Nietzsche continued to consider Tristan a masterpiece: “Even now I am still in search of a work which exercises such a dangerous fascination, such a spine-tingling and blissful infinity as Tristan — I have sought in vain, in every art.
[QUOTE=Neely;1109202 I'm then going in the bath with a bottle of St Peter's Organic ale - nothing to do with music but I'm quite excited about it nonetheless.
Any suggestions on the best of Haydn/favourites?[/QUOTE]
No, but, more importantly, here's some information on St Peter's organic ale which indicates a very good brew indeed.
The brewery produces around twelve regular beers plus another six seasonal. St Peter's is well known for its Organic beers. St. Peter's Organic Ale was awarded the Soil Associations Silver Medal in the drinks category in their Organic Food Awards 2006. The company wins many awards and accolades for its beers. In November 2007, the Independent newspaper conducted a blind tasting by a panel of judges of bottled beers and lagers to creat a 'Top 50 beers' list and St. Peter's India Pale Ale* was voted overall winner.
Bernstein was a marvellous conductor of Mahler and if I were conducting this I would probably be floating somewhere near the ceiling, but I can't help wondering what Toscanini would have said if he could have seen this video.
http://youtu.be/rECVyN5D60I
I love Tristan and Isolde. Second most beautiful songs in any opera in my opinion is this one: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xWgPiI1ihacQuote:
Edit: While I'm at it, I may as well post my favourite piece of music, Wagner's Tristan und Isolde prelude. Its not my preferred recording but it will suffice.
Number 1 belonging to: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7IfXJEOUD24
(at 1:50)
Thanks Loka, Stlukes and Emil for the notes on Haydn and St Peter's Ale respectfully.
Yes I have found the quartets so far to be quite delicious and very relaxing, unpretensious pieces. I will look further into the choral works as I have still been listening to the Benedictine stuff for a while now so the choral pieces should go down nicely as well.
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The St Peter's Ale was indeed a quality brew, highly recommended, even the bottle was a gem.
http://www.google.co.uk/imgres?q=st+...t:429,r:23,s:0
It seems the brewery have got a pub in London as well?:
http://www.stpetersbrewery.co.uk/london/default.htm