Legal Marijuana

http://www.schizophrenia.com/prevent...reetdrugs.html

David Suzuki did a great doc showing the evidence behind the link between marijuana and psychosis. The link is proven. But again, this is valid only in relation to a small genetically predisposed subset of the population.

People who think marijuana is generally evil or destructive are just wrong. And anyone who drinks alcohol has no right to preach against the legalization of weed. Alcohol is worse. Drink a micky of whisky everyday for 10 years and behold the degradation unleashed upon your health. Smoke several joints a day for 10 years and you might be lazy and apathetic, but your skin won't be yellow, you won't be hooked up to a dialysis machine. You could have a lung disorder, but even that is rare amongst hardcore stoners.

I wish medical marijuana was legal. I have a suspicion that it would work better than all of the narcotics I've tried and used

I am lazily not bothering to read all posts in this thread before I post so I don't know if anyone else has answered my question already, but here it goes. This post has to do with the varying effects of marijuana. Sometimes smoking marijuana is very pleasant. A pleasant high might be one in which the marijuana intensifies the senses and changes perception in an interesting way. And then there are the scary-as-hell experiences induced by marijuana. You shake, you shiver, you open your mouth to speak but you drool instead. Then you say something totally incoherent, and the the most routine tasks are suddenly impossible, and everything is terrifying, and they are all talking about you and there is all this background noise that no one can hear but you and the only thing to do at that point is to go pull the covers over your head until all of it stops. Why is that? Is it the kind of weed? I know there are different varieties... Maybe some is laced maybe some is old maybe it's a defect of the brain and maybe it is a little bit of all of it. If someone could answer these questions and guarantee that the product you get isn't going to make you afraid to answer the phone then I think legalizing is probably a good idea.

Shalot, I have to think that reaction would be induced by something laced with something else.

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Originally Posted by Shalot

I am lazily not bothering to read all posts in this thread before I post so I don't know if anyone else has answered my question already, but here it goes. This post has to do with the varying effects of marijuana. Sometimes smoking marijuana is very pleasant. A pleasant high might be one in which the marijuana intensifies the senses and changes perception in an interesting way. And then there are the scary-as-hell experiences induced by marijuana. You shake, you shiver, you open your mouth to speak but you drool instead. Then you say something totally incoherent, and the the most routine tasks are suddenly impossible, and everything is terrifying, and they are all talking about you and there is all this background noise that no one can hear but you and the only thing to do at that point is to go pull the covers over your head until all of it stops. Why is that? Is it the kind of weed? I know there are different varieties... Maybe some is laced maybe some is old maybe it's a defect of the brain and maybe it is a little bit of all of it. If someone could answer these questions and guarantee that the product you get isn't going to make you afraid to answer the phone then I think legalizing is probably a good idea.

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The weed grown nowadays is often 20 times more potent than that produced back in the 60's. Growers often use nasty chemicals. And like Varenne said, it could have been laced with something.

I've had similar experiences with un-laced weed before. It felt like everyone in the room were thinking bad thoughts about me. When I would smoke it by myself I would feel fine. Some people just react that way to it. Friends have told me they've felt that way too. I stopped smoking it for just that reason. Then last summer I partook with a few friends and it was a pleasant experience. I can't explain it. There's probably a bunch of complex neuro-chemistry going on there.

Darcy makes great points. Pesticide free organics are probably the safest bet. The shaking could depend on a few other factors, like how much sleep a person has gotten before getting high, and what and/or when they may have eaten last. I'm pretty sure weed effects the hypothalamus. The hypothalamus controls body temperature (chills or warm fuzzies), hunger (munchies), thirst (dry mouth), sleep (disturbed circadian rhythms). Different people have a greater or lesser flow of hormones from the hypothalamus to begin with. If marijuana decreases or increases the flow in someone already experiencing a flux, well yeah. Adverse reaction time, probably.

Yes, isn't it just dastardly when the media portrays harmful substances in a cool, sexy way?

http://files.coloribus.com/files/ads...mall-41348.jpg

I mean, they are practically forcing people to harm themselves, it's almost murder.

http://derekkinzel.com/wp-content/up...the-World1.jpg

We as a society must not stand those pro-weed monsters who corrupt our children and harm our nations' health by pushing their decadent lifestyle!

http://www.anorak.co.uk/wp-content/g...ndar/april.jpg

IS EVERYONE TAKING CRAZY PILLS?!?

It's the exact. Same. Thing.

Questions:

1. Have you ever drank alcohol?
2. Are you comfortable with permitting the legality of alcohol?

If the answers to both or either of these questions is "yes," and yet you still insist that smoking marijuana should be a criminal act, than you must be wearing hypocrisy blinders which in all likelihood were given to you courtesy of government propaganda.

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Originally Posted by Neely

Ha, it seems that one out of every two/three 'hoodies' I pass on the streets, morning or night, are smoking drugs. At least on the council estates. The stuff reeks. Imagine opening that up to every corner shop and Tesco, trust me, people will be drugging it up all over and then we'll have drug packets to go alongside the cans of Stella and packets of fags that we have now littering up the streets and parks. No thanks.

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Oh come on, don't you know anything about teenagers? They will get high and drunk whether it's legal or not, because that's what they do. I can not see how making weed legal will increase the rate at which teenagers smoke it, many of them already smoke it every day as an expression of rebellion (and by the way, you've gotta admit rebellion is much more fun if it's illegal - the illegality of weed is bound to attract teens to it). I strongly suspect that teenagers wouldn't smoke any more or less if the law were changed, because they don't give a sh*t about the law anyway; but normal, work-a-day adults would have less of a deterrent to smoke might see a pack at the convenience store and they might give it a go, and it should be their damn choice whether they want to put a comparatively mild mind-altering substance into their own body. Honestly, Canadians and Brits are from the same species. Last month I smoked weed with a few of my old highschool teachers at a hockey fundraiser and no one cares, it doesn't have all of this stigma associated with it. Occasionally someone might get too high and behave like an irritating hysterical pre-teen girl, but again, it's just like drinking: their friends take care of them, or if they don't have any friends with them you aren't allowed to be drunk in public to the point where it causes a disturbance so people call them a cab, or if that doesn't work they try the cops.

Seriously, to Canadians (and especially we libertarian-like Albertans), the big deal that Brits and Americans are making over weed is unbelievably childish. Quick fix: act like grown ups and not nail-biting doomsday predictors, stop trying to boss everyone around based on a future which has already been proven a fallacy by countries like Canada and The Netherlands in which weed is already decriminalized and things are working just fine. Making decisions based on an imaginary dystopia is causeing a lot of harm: societies in which weed isn't fully legal get no money out of weed consumption (money which they could certainly use right now), it all goes to criminals; people who are caught holding a joint are sentenced to prison in some places, INSANE; quality isn't controlled, shady drug-dealers cut their weed with chemicals which lead to experiences like the one Shalot described above; disallowing domestic crops literally funds terrorism (look it up); police resources are spent chasing around hippies instead of actually doing good; tax dollars are poured into those ineffectual "don't do drugs" commercials, or in the case of America, the psychotically expensive War On Drugs. Seriously, how could the alternative be any worse, you might have to smell marijuana smoke once or twice more often/week as you're walking past someone's house?

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Originally Posted by Shalot

Maybe some is laced maybe some is old maybe it's a defect of the brain and maybe it is a little bit of all of it.

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I don't use marijuana, although I have had a handful of experiences, none of which were positive, when I was an undergraduate. One of the advantages of legalizing it is to be able to certify its quality for public safety. There still would be the illegal stuff that might be laced, but hopefully what one would get wrapped in plastic with an FDA label on it would serve one's needs.

I can't believe that anyone would be so trusting as to take a hit from a joint that was passed around at a party, although I've done it myself. That's sort of like drinking out of someone's bar glass without knowing what was in the drink.

Anyway, I know there are people who get addicted to whatever, legal or illegal, and cause an immense amount of harm to those around them as a result. They probably would cause harm anyway even without the substance, but it can make the damage worse. I could list a couple of relatives in that situation, but we probably all have similar stories.

I don't think there is any positive connection between creativity and marijuana use. I'm more inclined to believe in an inverse correlation, however, but I don't have any statistics to back that up either.

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Originally Posted by JuniperWoolf

It's the exact. Same. Thing.

Questions:

1. Have you ever drank alcohol?
2. Are you comfortable with permitting the legality of alcohol?

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I think its even worse, even more hypocritical than that. It can easily be argued and likely even proven that alcohol is way, way, way more harmful and destructive than marijuana. I know of one person whose life was negatively affected by marijuana, but countless come to mind whose lives have been wrecked by alcohol. I think both should be legal. If they want to ban something they should ban the junk food that`s making us fat and sick and is going to bankrupt our medical system. The new omnibus crime bill will crack down on marijuana, its cultivation and possession, instituting minimum sentences. A big step backwards.

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Originally Posted by Darcy88

I think its even worse, even more hypocritical than that. It can easily be argued and likely even proven that alcohol is way, way, way more harmful and destructive than marijuana. I know of one person whose life was negatively affected by marijuana, but countless come to mind whose lives have been wrecked by alcohol.

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:yesnod: Thanks for saying that, I was going mention this but I thought it might send me on a seperate train of thought which would detract from my main point.

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Originally Posted by Darcy88

The new omnibus crime bill will crack down on marijuana, its cultivation and possession, instituting minimum sentences. A big step backwards.

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They're doomed to fail, they always do. Did you take the DARE program? I lol'd. Our politicians are caving to pressure from the south, because if weed is openly accepted up here American citizens might start thinking "why not us?" It's such a pain in the ***, Canadians won't tolerate it.

I think a wise solution is to legalize marijuana. Heck, all hard drugs that are causing a great deal of harm.

I've been told that in the Netherlands, where they have legalized questionable activities and the like, they have backed up this reasoning with the practical solution of having the government supervise, regulate, and have healthcare workers on hand to ensure the safety of these practices. For instance, making certain that prostitutes are in top bills of health, without any STDs, so that 'customers' are not harmed, and disease doesn't spread.

It can be argued by some that tax-payers should not be putting hard earned money into such institutions and filth.

However, it seems clear that it will continue.

Behind closed doors on the black market, which is considerably more dangerous, even in the case of marijuana, where drugs have a tendency to be mixed. Or out in the open where it can be monitored. If it is monitored, there is a higher chance of better hygiene and less casualties, and these people can be offered help, and can approach help without being overly scrutinized.

Regardless: I don't drink, or smoke. Anything.

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Questions:

1. Have you ever drank alcohol?
2. Are you comfortable with permitting the legality of alcohol?

If the answers to both or either of these questions is "yes," and yet you still insist that smoking marijuana should be a criminal act, than you must be wearing hypocrisy blinders which in all likelihood were given to you courtesy of government propaganda.

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There is no question of permitting the legality alcohol because alcohol is already legal. If something is legalised there is no going back. Opening the door to a whole host of other drugs is not something I think is a good idea.

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Oh come on, don't you know anything about teenagers? They will get high and drunk whether it's legal or not, because that's what they do. I can not see how making weed legal will increase the rate at which teenagers smoke it, many of them already smoke it every day as an expression of rebellion (and by the way, you've gotta admit rebellion is much more fun if it's illegal - the illegality of weed is bound to attract teens to it).

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Exactly, so your approach is to legalise cannabis so the teenage taboo can then move onto crack cocaine or something like that? If you open the door and embrace cannabis then you are opening the door to everything else which is dangerous. I’m telling you if you legalise the stuff in the UK, and make it readily available, there will be a massive boom in drug taking. Not something any politician is seriously going to back here.

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I strongly suspect that teenagers wouldn't smoke any more or less if the law were changed, because they don't give a sh*t about the law anyway; but normal, work-a-day adults would have less of a deterrent to smoke might see a pack at the convenience store and they might give it a go, and it should be their damn choice whether they want to put a comparatively mild mind-altering substance into their own body.

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You are kidding. If the stuff were legal and readily available (and therefore cheaper) there would be a massive increase in consumption. It would also encourage people who wouldn’t otherwise smoke to do so as you say, I can’t see this being a terribly good idea myself as the harmful anecdotes about the drug keep rolling in (see above) despite claims that it is as pure as milk. Again I’m not that bothered what people do and I wouldn’t go on a march against it, I just wouldn’t sign my name on a petition to legalise it either.

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Seriously, to Canadians (and especially we libertarian-like Albertans), the big deal that Brits and Americans are making over weed is unbelievably childish. Quick fix: act like grown ups and not nail-biting doomsday predictors, stop trying to boss everyone around based on a future which has already been proven a fallacy by countries like Canada and The Netherlands in which weed is already decriminalized and things are working just fine. Making decisions based on an imaginary dystopia is causeing a lot of harm: societies in which weed isn't fully legal get no money out of weed consumption (money which they could certainly use right now), it all goes to criminals; people who are caught holding a joint are sentenced to prison in some places, INSANE; quality isn't controlled, shady drug-dealers cut their weed with chemicals which lead to experiences like the one Shalot described above; disallowing domestic crops literally funds terrorism (look it up); police resources are spent chasing around hippies instead of actually doing good; tax dollars are poured into those ineffectual "don't do drugs" commercials, or in the case of America, the psychotically expensive War On Drugs. Seriously, how could the alternative be any worse, you might have to smell marijuana smoke once or twice more often/week as you're walking past someone's house?

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Yes I know and have said that some of those are fair arguments, but just the same I wouldn’t want to give the green light to further drug use; I just don’t think it is the right idea and I don’t think that as a government decision it would send out the right messages to the public. It's a dead argument anyway as it's not going to happen here for at least the next ten years or beyond any time in the future, in fact I'm pretty sure that canabis has moved up the drug rating here recently by the previous government, not down.

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Originally Posted by Neely

There is no question of permitting the legality alcohol because alcohol is already legal. If something is legalised there is no going back. Opening the door to a whole host of other drugs is not something I think is a good idea.

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It's not a "whole host," it's a comparatively mild plant which is less harmful than alcohol by far. Alcohol is not legal because "it's always been that way," it's legal because the consequences of making it illegal are stongly detrimental to society. Those same consequences are going on right now in terms of marijuana: gang activity, unjust prison sentences, ect. Also, it's legal because it should be. You should not be allowed to tell another fully grown adult not to put a mild brain-altering chemical into their system, citizens can not be treated like children or else they'll start to act like children (trust me, in Canada we have native reservations - BAD idea). This is especially if you're telling them not to smoke weed while at the same time sipping a glass of wine, that's not alright.

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Originally Posted by Neely

Exactly, so your approach is to legalise cannabis so the teenage taboo can then move onto crack cocaine or something like that? If you open the door and embrace cannabis then you are opening the door to everything else which is dangerous. I’m telling you if you legalise the stuff in the UK, and make it readily available, there will be a massive boom in drug taking. Not something any politician is seriously going to back here.

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That argument falls flat immediately. Alcohol is legal in the UK, yet do teenagers turn up their nose at it for being "not bad*ss enough?" No, they drink their faces off. Teens drink and they smoke weed and cigarettes and sometimes they do non-addictive hallucinogens like mushrooms or salvia (which is fully legal in Canada) for a laugh so they can have a story to tell about "that b*tchin Canada day when I thought Jason was turning into a werewolf." That's what they do, that's the level they're at. Maybe when they get older, say mid-twenties, they'll take a little sample of the harder drugs and 99% of the time they'll come to learn through experience that hard drugs are to be done very sparingly if not at all because they are WAY different from weed and alcohol. Teenagers don't do meth, not because of the cops (who are quite impotent), but because of this:

http://investigation.discovery.com/r...images/f-4.jpg

All drugs are not equal. Weed is not meth, and kids are not stupid.

I'm sorry to pull this card on you, but if you have no experience with any of this, then really, you don't understand it. People who push or support anti-drug legislation are always people who have never so much as tried weed. Why? Because people who have tried it know what it's like, it makes you hungry, sleepy and paranoid (as long as you're not a schizophrenic, apparently). Nothing to rage about.

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Originally Posted by Neely

You are kidding. If the stuff were legal and readily available (and therefore cheaper) there would be a massive increase in consumption. It would also encourage people who wouldn’t otherwise smoke to do so as you say, I can’t see this being a terribly good idea myself as the harmful anecdotes about the drug keep rolling in (see above) despite claims that it is as pure as milk. Again I’m not that bothered what people do and I wouldn’t go on a march against it, I just wouldn’t sign my name on a petition to legalise it either.

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Readily available to teenagers? No. Age restrictions, my friend, just like alcohol. And hey, if it's still has that "not allowed" status, kids will just like it more. Sneaking around to drink was one of the funnest parts of being a teenager. It would really be almost exactly the same as alcohol, which means it would be like things are now. In today's world, what happens when you bust someone underage with alcohol? You confiscate it, suspend them and call their parents. What happens when you bust someone underage with a joint? You confiscate it, suspend them and call their parents. Legalization would have very little effect the lives of teens.

Also, if it were legal there would be more open information about it. Right now, we're like Catholic school kids trying to muddle through the murky world of pre-marital sex on an abstenance-only education, where they teach "just don't have sex or you will get aids and die."

Public service commercials: "Oh, you want to know about the harmful effects of weed? It will kill your father and rape your mother!!! It will make you a psychopath! After you smoke weed, the next morning you will wake up in a pool of baby blood, or maybe you'll jump off a roof and you won't wake up at all! JUST DON'T DO IT!!!!!"

Then of course we have the people who KNOW they're being lied to but they don't know anything else besides. My friend Steve lost his mind once at a party on a pregnant woman for smoking a joint, to which the pregnant woman responded: "oh don't worry, weed is natural, it's good for baby. I smoked with all my kids, it just makes them more relaxed children."

Politicians lie to people to keep it illegal, but people know they're being lied to so they assume that the opposite is true. Don't you see how screwed up that is? If it were legal, there would be no reason to manipulate and lie, the honest bare facts could be known. People could arrive at their own informed decisions, which is how it should be.

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Originally Posted by Neely

It's a dead argument anyway as it's not going to happen here for at least the next ten years or beyond any time in the future, in fact I'm pretty sure that canabis has moved up the drug rating here recently by the previous government, not down.

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I guess so, you guys have more important things to worry about over there. In my country at this time, marijuana/the rising number of head injuries in hockey/staying above the rest of the world's economic **** storm/dangerous winter storms and death, that's what's news.

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Originally Posted by JuniperWoolf

. Occasionally someone might get too high and behave like an irritating hysterical pre-teen girl,

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:iagree:

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Originally Posted by Emil Miller

:iagree:

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Not now, kitten.