Post-Is Jesus really God?

Sorry if i offended you or any one here, when i respond sometimes i respond to users all together wihtout copying and pasting what every one said, i only make my answer one subject responding them.
Pbuh mean peace be upon him, we muslims use it when we talk about prophets like Muhammed, Jesus, Moses, Adam (for respect) when we talk about prophets we must put it after thier names. Also we use ra with prophet Muhammed companions which mean may ALLAH be pleaed with him.
I will try to respond on other saying tomorrow if Allah wants, its a little bit late here.

Its amazing the claims on here, no offense to you who disbelieve in Christ, but you simply paste and post with no real evidence. My point in the 1 Timothy verse, you got it all wrong! Paul wrote 1 Timothy and in that verse its Not Jesus talking! You say that there are 50000 errors in the Bible but you do not understand means. As quoted from Lee Strobels a case for Christ

"It is misleading because of the ways variants are counted. He explained that if a single word is misspelled in two thousand manuscripts, thats counted as 2000 errors."
"The New Testament, then, has not only survived in more manuscripts than any other book from atiquity, but it has survived in a purer form than any other great boook - a gorm that is 99.5% pure"

Now it is true that 1 John 5:7-8 is not found in manuscripts til the 15th or 16th century but this does not refute evidence of the Trinity. 2 Corinthians says May the grace of the Lord Jesus Christ, and the love of God, and the fellowship of the HOly SPirit be with you all.

Once again, the variations are minor and no substantial doctrine of the Christain faith is affected by this. Both my andShoutGrace have given ample content. But you seem to ignore bothw hat we write or choose to not accept them. We have shown many times that Jesus claims to be God. We have shown that the Trinity exists. We have shown that the Bible is consistant with its early manuscripts which u can check if u want to and truly seek knowledge as you claim.

I woudl ike to ask some questions about Islam but this is not the thread for it. If one is started Id like to ask some questions

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Originally Posted by ThatIndividual

Ok, here it is. Ready? Here's the answer...

Jesus IS god insofar as people actually worship him.
People worship Jesus = Jesus is god to those people. QED.

HOWEVER...

There is also this notion that Jesus is EVERYONE'S god... (or in other words, THE God. The Almighty God of this universe.)

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that's all dandy if truth is subjective...either the sky is blue or it isn't. Jesus is either the God or he isn't a God at all. You can either be a polytheist that believes in Jesus(that would be an interesting scenario) or Jesus is a God, or he isn't a God. If he is a God, then he is the God. Especially considering the fact that the Bible makes claims on both his deity and monotheism. As C.S. Lewis said, " A God. The God. One word can make all the difference in the world."

Hi, Mr/Mrs/Miss Ruf...., you didn't answer my question, or i should rephrase it?

Sorry, i forget to fulfill my promise of telling you guys the name of my bible as i did promise.
GOD NEWS BIBLE.
-With Deuterononical Books. Todays English version.
Printed in India by Photo Process at Swapria.printing works pvt,ltd 2002.
Publish with the king permission of United Bible Societies.
ISBN 81-7109-563-1

Yes, Please rephrase the question for me so I can attempt to answer.

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Originally Posted by rufioag

Yes, Please rephrase the question for me so I can attempt to answer.

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Question:
Where does Jesus say-"i am God," or" I am equal to God," or" worship me"?
But, I have qouted where he said-"I am an Apostle sent by God".-Muslims' belief.
And again, you said the verse wasn't as I qouted it, thus, I told you why think it is so, and now(before this post) post my proof.

Muhsin

Have we not given enough evidence? Once again, you constantly ignore my answers and clearly do not understand. 1st Timothy, in whatever version you read is written by Paul. There is no arguement of this.

“and that is why I was sent as an APOSTLE and TEACHER of the Gentiles to proclaim the message of faith and truth. I am not lying, I am telling the truth”(1 timothy 2:7)

That is the verse you quoted and i will use it. Paul is saying that he was sent as an Apostle and a Teacher! An Apostle is defined by 1)any important early teacher of Christianity or a Christian missionary to a people
or 2) one of the original 12 disciples chosen by Christ to preach his gospel .

Paul was an apostle of Christ, one that was sent forward to teach the message. You can choose to accept this or deny it. Or you can take a phrase out of context and not understand it. I have repeatedly attempted to make it shown to you. But lets expand from your verse to include 1 timothy 2:5-7

5For there is one God, and there is one who brings God and human beings together, the man Christ Jesus, 6who gave himself to redeem the whole human race. That was the proof at the right time that God wants everyone to be saved, 7and that is why I was sent as an apostle and teacher of the Gentiles, to proclaim the message of faith and truth. I am not lying; I am telling the truth!

Christians believe in one God, we have established that, but we believe one God exists in the Trinity, we have shown proof of this. Here we have Paul writting about Jesus in one portion then using I in the next. Now if it was Jesus he was talking about he would have said Jesus not I.

Copy and Paste? I copy and paste only verses of bible, i am sure there is nothing with that, the problem of different versions from bible was because scholars didnt copy and paste them, they reformed it according thier views. Other words are not copied and pasted, even an english person will notice my english and will notice its little bit weak. My bible is in my mother english language, and i have another one in not english language but my second language.
Who said to you i dont believe in Jesus pbuh, i do believe in him as PROPHET, no muslim is a muslim if he doesnt believe in Jesus pbuh as prophet even if he beieve in Muhammed. We follow this verse here: John 17:3 And this is life eternal, that they might know thee the only true God, and Jesus Christ, whom thou hast sent.
Jesus was SENT (his words, not paul or mathew or luke). Massenger or peophet need the word SEND-as all know this verb need three things: source (the one who send);the one who is sent (for sure cant be the source, the source cant send him self); destination. Jesus pbuh here mentioned God as ONE, and then we were informed that God sent some one (source) and then Jesus said about him self he was sent, destination is people. Where he said i am God. Even Jesus pbuh agree with this John 13:16 Verily, verily, I say unto you, The servant is not greater than his lord; neither he that is sent greater than he that sent him.
So massenger must be sent from some one to some one, and the one who is sent(Jesus) cant be greater than the one who sent him (God).
U said i ignored ur answers and grace, well if u mean the verse about Jesus pbuh was before Abraham pbuh, i gave u and answer before (didnt ignore it). Even this verse is against trinity (trinity is FATHER-SON-HOLY SPIRIT), before Jesus was born was he SON, and the Father was a Father? always christians say that Jesus need a father coz he got mother, well before he was born he didnt have mother. Beside i gave u an answer also about what he meant, and how also we got like this saying, but no one understand from it that Muhammed is God. i was u were we all were before Adam pbuh (in God's knowledge).
Perhaps i ignored some answers u gave like Dehydration and heart beating, and loosing blood, i didnt know what respond, Dehydration happened to God? Heart beat? Loosing blood? i think ignoring these sayings better than responding.
You refuse the idea that Jesus said abuot him self i am prophet, and he is not PROPHET. Lets go back to the old test: Ac 7:37 This is that Moses, which said unto the children of Israel, A prophet shall the Lord your God raise up unto you of your brethren, like unto me; him shall ye hear.
As u said Jesus is not prophet, then this verse cant talk about him, and prophet didnt come yet. If u agree that Jesus pbuh is prophet then he cant be God. Godprophet no brain can accept it. The strange thing that christians who believe Jesus pbuh is God, use this verse and they say it refer to Jesus pbuh, even Moses pbuh said like me (was the son in trintiy like Moses? was Moses pbuh a God?).Please not to skip.
John 10:30 "I and my Father are one"
When i talked about Jimmy Swaggart and POpe i was talking about how they say things that even dont exist in bible and no one said to them any thing, pope pray to vergion Marry pbuh, no one said to him stop there this isnt in bible, they invented saints, no one said any thing, i gave the Pope as example because he represent the biggest group of christians, and he say things from his mind but people kiss his hand- i gave this example after u said that scholars cant miss the canceling of verses, the problem is that most people doesnt read bible, priests do the job for them and they invent thing and order people to do, i am not talking from my mind,i saw this thing in europe, and how people left bible and do what priests do.
You copied and pasted a part from what i said which is: and the Pope is considered the biggest scholar. The one who read this verse in this form will think or i am catholic, or i follow Pope, or consider him the biggest scholar. That what will happen when we cut the words of someone, but if a person read all my paste will think of non of these things. This thing reminded me with the verse John 10:30 I and my Father are one. Christians always say this verse show Jesus pbuh is God. Thats what will happen if we cut a part from all paragraph, lets take a look on the story. The story begin in John 10:22 begining from this verse we see that Jews come to Jesus pbuh and ask him are you the Christ (they were waiting for a prophet), and Jesus say respond him what he is doing and in John 10:25 he say that he make in his father's name (is he God?), and then in Jonh 10:30 he say this famous verse, but ets go on after it, begining from Jonh 10:31 we see that Jews wanted to stone because he said he is God, Jesus responded them denying he said he is God (we can understand it from his words), he ask them isnt the one who talk from God is god (according to Jews language-doesnt mean they r God), and he say if the one who talk from God is called god according your rules, then why y want to stone me if i said i am son of God. Jesus pbuh answer is so clear he didnt claim he is God, even Jews who wanted to stone him he answered them his saying he is son of God like saying to a prophet god. Then what mean i am and God one- it means that his goals are God's goals, his teachings are God's teaching, he is one with God in works and teaching, like me and u are one if we have same goal, same think. Me and my brother muslim are one because we have same thoughts same work, we are not one Fisically. In other words its a form of saying i am prophet, i do what God want(he work by God's name). In no form we can understand he is saying i am God.

I will try not to mix up things here, because the thread is about Jesus pbuh, not bible, but after i saw what the 99.5%, and that i didnt gave proofs, well i gave u a link about what scholars say, and they talked about historical errors not mispealling or comma. I will try to give you proofs add cancel (cause: not using copy and paste).
Difference between NIV and NLT
First verse is: Ezekiel 23:20
NLT: She lusted after lovers whose attentions were gross and bestial.
NIV: (better not to write it, not so good words, but there are donkeys, horses and genitals not mentioned in NLT version).
KJ version:( same thing about mentioning it, but there are flesh no genitals, but donkeys and horses exist).
In NLT scholars wrote attentions, its a basic difference. There is a big difference between descirbing genitals or emission and between attentions, or cancelling donkeys and horses, if God said Horses and donkeys then they must be existed.
Perhaps the first one is more polite thats why they reformed it. still 99.5%?
Or the difference is silly, or it doesnt affect on the trinity and the whole idea of bible, but for sure it affect the 99.5%.
Its known that the original Mathew was written in Hebrew, thats why u will see alot of propheces from the old test in book of Mathew. The one who wrote it was trying to convince Jews.
KJ version Mathew 27:35 "And they crucified him, and parted his garments, casting lots: that it might be fulfilled which was spoken by the prophet, They parted my garments among them, and upon my vesture did they cast lots."
Now adays versions no existence for the prophecy, in a scilent way they canceled it. Its seriuos thing, or the prophecy refer to someone or not, it can be understood by logic, the one who read the prophecy in KJ version can check it in old test to see if its a prophecy that refer to Jesus. But now adays they discovered its wrong(what wbout the other prophecys).
There are alot of other things canceled here and there, not only matter of translation or mispelling or comas. The interesting thing that the canceled verses touch the base of christianity- Is Jesus pbuh the begot son of God (was canceled) ? does trinity exist(was canceled)? Does God talk such words about sex like in Ezekiel 23 (was reformed)? Even in 1952 the part from Jonh that talk about resurrection of Jesus pbuh was canceled and was putten under the page and not in the main chapters, but the canceled verces were putten again in the context of the bible not only like an explaining, it was so big to be canceled. The problem is that printing the books without the part of resurrection cost them alot.
Also about a real proof, no one talked about the apocrypha, which bible is true the one with or the one without. Trinity can be known by using apocrypha also or without? just tell me about the apocrypha chpaters, they r enough big to be Canceled or Added.

I read and understand what is written in the Holy Bible, I believe because I know that no good works will get me to Heaven.

Also when i say cut and past, im saying u just take things out of context of the era, situation, overall aspect.

Mt 19:17 And he said unto him, Why callest thou me good? there is none good but one, that is, God: but if thou wilt enter into life, keep the commandments. According Jesus pbuh the one who keep the commandments enter into the life, by ur work, if every one try honostly to act in good manner and keeping God's orders will get into life.
But Paul chaniged all and said that keeping the commandments doesnt make the person survive, but crossing Jesus pbuh does.
Paul canceled circumcising, and even Jesus pbuh did it.
Watching what Paul said when first time he became christians, we see his words contraddict each other, once he see light and doesnt hear voice, once he hear voice and no light. Paul Paul Paul.
They take their priests and their anchorites to be their lords in derogation of Allah, and (they take as their Lord) Al-Masih, the son of Maryam; yet they were commanded to worship but One God: there is no god but He. Praise and glory to Him: (far is He) from having the partners they associate (with Him). Surah 9 verse 31.
The explaining for this verse in the Holy Quran is that their priests (christians) made the things that God not allowed allowed, and things allowed not allowed, leaving the book and whats written in it, thats why ALLAH say they took thier priests lords.
Paul said not keeping commandments will make u win, while Jesus pbuh say the opposite, Paul cancelled circumcise, while Jesus pbuh didnt even he did it. Pope pray to vergion Marry without clue from book and people follow him, also Buddhist pray to person so are they right?. Eating pig, Jesus pbuh didnt say its allowed and Jews untle these days dont eat it, while we see in bible Jesus said not all what get into u make u dirty but what go out from you (he was giving lesson about saving the mouth from speaking bad, he didnt talk about dirty that bad words cause not what food cause) then after his words are finished we see the verse said by the one who wrote the bible: and Jesus made all food allowed. Just like that.
God is known by mind not emotions, God eat God died God dress God beaten. All are words cant be said about God. God is God creatures are creatures.

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while we see in bible Jesus said not all what get into u make u dirty but what go out from you (he was giving lesson about saving the mouth from speaking bad, he didnt talk about dirty that bad words cause not what food cause) then after his words are finished we see the verse said by the one who wrote the bible: and Jesus made all food allowed. Just like that.

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Thats correct. You yourself stated it! The man summarizing what Jesus said knew him well and and spent three years with him. Jesus took him aside at some point during those three years and explained to him better, as if that was even necessary.

Jesus said, "It is not what goes into a man that makes him unclean, but what goes out of him." He explicitly stated that he did not hold to the Jewish custom of watching whether or not your ate pork with blood or meat from which had touched the sciatica et all.

This verse is explicit. It is easy to understand. Surely this is not why you don't put your faith in Jesus?

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When i talked about Jimmy Swaggart and POpe i was talking about how they say things that even dont exist in bible and no one said to them any thing, pope pray to vergion Marry pbuh, no one said to him stop there this isnt in bible

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None of this matters to people who do read the Bible. Why should I bother with what the Pope or anyone else is doing?

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Pope pray to vergion Marry without clue from book and people follow him

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Simply stated, I do not care what the Pope does, nor do many Christians. If the Pope loses faith tommorrow and decides that God doesn't exist, what does that mean for me? Absolutely nothing. If Billy Graham loses faith tommorrow and decides that he can't believe in the truth of the Gospel, what does that mean for me? Nothing. DO NOT judge God by the personhood of men or their deeds.

As for Jesus calling only God good, I guess I will cut and paste the earlier discussions which I am not sure you have read or not.

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Where does Jesus say-"i am God," or" I am equal to God," or" worship me"?

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re: Jesus' claims to divinity

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Jesus clearly states that he is God throughout the bible.


There are different ways that Jesus claimed to be God, be equal to God, and have a uniform relationship with God. I myself think of them in this breakdown.

------Jesus the "Son of Man"
------Use of the word "Abba"
------The "I Am" claims
------The miscellaneous claims
------The book of Revelation

The Son of Man title obviously and qualitatively (in my mind, there are Christians who have studied intensely and have a larger view) comes from one of Daniel's eschatological prophecies.

"I saw in the night visions, and behold, with the clouds of Heaven there came one like the Son of Man, and he approached the Ancient of Days and was led into his presence. And to him was given dominion and glory and kingdom, that all peoples, nations, and languages should serve him; His dominion is an everlasting dominion which shall not pass away, and his kingdom one which shall not be destroyed." Daniel 7:13, 14.

One interesting thing to note here is that elsewhere in the Old Testament it is only God who comes on the clouds (Ps. 104:3, Is. 19:1). Accordingly, the Son of Man originates in heaven and comes by divine initiative. The phrase as used in Daniel is "bar enash". What is the significance? The combination "bar enash" and its parallels in Old Babylonian carry the meaning of an heir or successor to royalty, or of a free man of the highest class. A "man" here is not just any man, but as we might say, "THE MAN", as in royalty.

Daniel was written at a time when this phrase had a specific and known meaning. In the context of Daniel 7:13, in which the one "like a son of man" comes to the Ancient of Days (Almighty God) and is given dominion of the sort that God alone possesses, the significance of Jesus' own "son of man" usage cannot be overstated. It is functionally equivalent to saying that he was the entity described in the prophecy. Jesus had no money but he obviously had an education. He knew that the Pharisees and the Sanhedrin knew to whom the prophecy refered. The Messiah. When he describes himself as the Son of Man he asserts the fact that he is fufilling Jewish Messianic prophecies.

Son of Man verses : Mat 8:20, Mat 12:8, Mat 12:32, Mat 13:41, Mat 24:30, 25:31, Mrk 2:28, Mrk 8:38, Mrk 14:62, Lk 9:58, Lk. 18:8, Lk 19:10, Jn 3:14, amongst many others. Also interesting to note is how severely Jews respond to his Son of Man title in certain instances.

"Abba" means "Father" when used among human beings - and to use the term when referring to God was unthinkable! It was not used by Jews in such a familiar way until the Hasidim movement, which began in the 18th century. The use of "Abba" (which equals our "Papa," or perhaps "Daddy") is "without analogy in the Jewish prayers of the first millenium A.D."

Abba is an affectionate term used by young children to talk to their biological fathers. An adult wouldn't call their father "abba", just as we today wouldn't call our fathers "Daddy". Whenever Jesus talked about our relationship to God, he used the term "pater", a respectful adult term meaning "father". For instance, when he told us the Lords Prayer, he used "''pater". Whenever Jesus talked about his own relationship with God, he used the word "abba". When he says "The reason my father loves me is that I lay down my life - only to take it up again", (John 10:17) he uses the word "abba".

In Mark 14:36, the word "abba" is used by Jesus, along with "pater". Jesus used both the familiar term and the term of respect - as did Paul in the Galatians. So these two verses read, "Abba, Father." Note that the retention of both the Aramiac and Greek words is a strong indication that the use of "Abba" goes back to Jesus Himself, since there is no reason why the early Christians should not have been satisfied with Greek equivalents for both words.

Jesus' claims to being the great "I Am" have been a source of personal joy for me. In the gospel of John, when he said "Truly, truly, I say to you, before Abraham even existed, I Am" (8:58) I literally laughed and felt awed by his existence. I also like his style. The crowd had been ridiculing and deriding him, so he put it to them as literally and persuasively as he could.

I guess that the main history of "I am" goes back to Exodus 3:14. (God said to Moses, 'I AM THAT I AM.' And he said, 'Say this to the people of Israel, 'I AM has sent me to you.').

[I took the following from David Mark Ball's 'I Am' in John's Gospel: Literary Function, Background and Theological Implications].

Here are some other parallels . . .

* John 4:26//Is. 52:6
* John 6:20//Is. 43:1-3, 5, 10
* John 8:18, 24, 28, 13:19//Is. 43:10
* John 8:58//Is. 43:13

1. In Isaiah ani hu is "always attributed to Yahweh" and is a statement only he can make. Anyone else making the same statement would be guilty of "an attempt to claim equality with God or displace him."
2. It signifies that "Yahweh alone is God", is sovereign over history, and creator.
3. Though Isaiah is a main focus, Jesus' "I AM" sayings match him with the "the Bread of which the Old Testament spoke, the Light of which Isaiah spoke, the Shepherd of whom Jeremiah and Ezekiel spoke, and the Vine of which many Old Testament passages spoke." The words I AM "thus act as a formula which applies Old Testament and Jewish concepts to the person of Jesus who embodies and fulfills them." [end reference].

I AM thus provides a powerful self-identification in which Jesus identifies himself with the roles and person of YHWH in the Old Testament.

As for miscellaneous claims . . .

Matthew 11:27. "All things have been handed over to Me by my Father: and no one knows the Son, except the Father; nor does anyone know the Father, except the Son, and anyone to whom the Son wills to reveal Him."

Matthew 12:28; parallel in Luke 11:20. "If I cast out demons by the finger of God, then the kingdom of God has come upon you."

Matthew 23:34. "Wherefore, behold, I send unto you prophets, and wise men, and scribes..." In Jewish belief, it is God that is responsible for sending prophets. In saying that He will send prophets, Jesus is equating Himself with God - once again, assuming a role reserved for God alone.

Matthew 24:5; parallels in Mark 5:23, Luke 21:8. "For many shall come in my name, saying, I am Christ: and shall deceive many." This statement would be meaningless if Jesus did not perceive Himself as Christ. The title "Christ," of course, is a Greek equivalent to the Jewish term "Messiah". Therefore, this can be considered to be a claim to divinity if it is shown that Christ/Messiah is a divine title.

Matthew 28:18; similar quotes in Luke 24:25, 46. In this post-resurrection address, Jesus says that all power in heaven and on earth has been given to Him - in short, power that only God has.

Matthew 26:64; parallel in Mark 14:61-4. The high priest asks Jesus directly if He is the Christ, and Jesus answers in the affirmative.

Matthew 9:2; parallels in Mark 2:5, Luke 5:20 and 7:48. Jesus tells people that "their sins are forgiven." This may not seem significant to Western eyes, so an illustration is needed. If John does something bad to Joe, then Joe can forgive John. But it would be ridiculous for Jake - unless he were somehow related to Joe - to forgive John for what he did to Joe. Forgiveness requires the RIGHT to forgive; therefore, Jesus' forgiving the sins of others that He had no personal connection with indicates that He believed that He was the only One who was offended by all sins and therefore had the right to forgive them: God, the author of all moral law. Moreover, this is particularly a noteworthy claim in the context of Judaism, for as Charlesworth notes, "The faithful Jew...acknowledged that only God can forgive the sinner." So in effect, Jesus was assuming the place and role of the entire Temple sacrificial system authorized by God and claiming to be God's broker for forgiveness.

As for Revelation, just chapter 1 ought to suffice (I'm probably running out of room!). Revelation 22:12, 13 are useful.

Jesus summarily equated himself with God. He said he came for his lost sheep (John chp. 10), and to give his life as a ransom for many (Mat. 20:28).

We can either agree or disagree with him. But I think it can be and has been (in other places by smarter and more proficient people than I) shown that Jesus himself knew himself to be the Son of God, equal to God, and the answer and hope for every person. What we do with his assertion is a separate issue.

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Originally Posted by muhsin

However, I’d quoted some verses like:
You have never heard His voice, nor seen His face (john 5:37)

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This does not say that the ONE TRUE GOD had never been seen or heard, but that only the FATHER had not. JESUS, as the UNIQUE SON of the FATHER, had seen HIM in an infinite way no creature had. The FATHER is spoken here as such in terms relating absolutely and exclusively to HIS relationaship as such with the SON. This relationship is not between CREATOR and crature, but between TWO PERSONS that are, together with the HOLY SPIRIT, the ONE TRUE GOD in THREE PERSONS, in a contextc of ONE in the particular Role of the FATHER bestowing an extension of HIS own Nature as from HIMSELF to an EQUAL in an emptied state. I explained this in part in the other thread, using statements that are also in the same Book, and, thus of the same fabric of thought. JESUS no where says that the Jews had never seen the ONE TRUE GOD, nor that only the FATHER is the ONE TRUE GOD, but only that the FATHER, as such, had never been directly manifested to HIS critics - later adding in private, to HIS Disciples, that HE, as the SON, is the DIVINE MANIFESTATION of the FATHER, with WHOM HE is EQUAL. Also in this Book, in the conflict HE is in with those HE tells had never heard the FATHER's Voice, nor seen HIS Face, they even understand HIM to mean precisely about HIS SON-ship what I myself have said and believe - that it is in a sense that makes HIM EQUAL with GOD. HE never denies the statement, but later confirms it in private. In what HE says about a Psalm that speaks of mere Sons of GOD as "gods", HE points out a thing that might have made them think HE adduced less about HIMSELF, leaving it with their consciences to wonder why they could only take HIS words as stating something more than this. In effect, then, they were coming to such suspicions about HIM without HIS even having to suggest anything outside of accepted Scriptural statements - yet, despite this, they wanted to pretend that only HIS assertions had moved their minds in this direction.

In the Hebrew Scriptures, people see the ONE TRUE GOD, but not the infinitude expressed within the DEITY by the FATHER to the SON. It doesn't mean the PERSON WHO is the FATHER wasn't seen - but had it meant such a thing, the only way the clear examples of men seeing GOD in the Hebrew Scriptures could be explained would be by the fact that not only the FATHER is the ONE TRUE GOD, and that a different PERSON of the TRINITY had been seen.

1 Timothy 6:16 also refers to GOD in all HIS Infinitude. One must always seek to find, as you are doing, why exactly a certain thing is said a certain way at a certain time, in a certain context.

Exodus 33:20 is in a part of Moses' progression into deeper familiarity with GOD as HIS Friend.