If god is everything, doesn't that make him evil as well as good?

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Originally Posted by NikolaiI

I guess the question only leads into another: is the "everything" good or bad? The only way you can criticize God for creating everything is if you say that the everything is bad -- in other words, the sorrow makes life unnecessary, unjustified, in the face of the idea of balancing opposites, which says that life is valuable both for its "Good" experiences and its "Bad" experiences. Why not an infinite affirmation of life? This is what mystics found. They say that beyond duality, beyond the dualities of right and wrong, self and other, there is a boundless, sole, indivisible reality... they say that is God, or the Source. So in other words, God is beyond the dualities of Good and Bad. But also, God is the Supreme good, being the Source of Being, and the Source of Love.

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Nikolai, a well read philosopher, a thinker, a spiritualist is right in stating that God id beyond the dualities of good and bad. There is godliness beyond the attribute of goodness and badness in point of fact. Both devilishness and godliness merge there or thaw there and there will be no conflict there, not discordance. There will be an endless stretch of evenness. I cannot say what will be and what not there in Godliness but all that I can say is Godliness is not the opposite of evilness or devilishness. When there will be Godliness devilishness will melt into godliness. Devilishness is a state and state is not unchangeable and of course Devil will purge him of the devilishness and once purged all will be once again Godliness. How can you find a shadow of darkness when your room is flooded with light.

I think Nikolai can understand and interpret it better than me.

Personally I think God is both good and bad. I know it sounds crazy but in order for someone to understand what Bad is, dont they experience it first? Sure some peple have gone to longer lengths in badness, but a good person always has a bad side. There is no such thing as a perfect person. It's an illusion that we make ourselfs believe is real so that when the times comes we can judge ourselves and others. Everyone has a different view on whats good and whats bad.

Which is why I believe that God must have experimented with badness in order to have a more understanding way of it. Otherwise how is he able to pass judgement on us when he's the one who decides wether we go into heaven or not? How can he send you to hell for your wrong deeds when people have drilled into our heads that he is the figure of goodness? In order for someone to understand something you have to experience it otherwise you cant pass judgement on anyone.

So for me, God is neither good or evil. Why? Cause nobody is. If we were good people there wouldnt be problems in the world today. If we were bad people then we wouldnt have feelings or a conscience. Which lives us with one question: What exactly are we?

Everyone imagines God in his own way, and of course a violent man has the reason of his own for acts of violence and every sinner justifies his sin. People think that a particular circumstance compels him to act sinfully.
No sinner blames himself for the sins committed. It is the onlooker who labels him and the onlooker must at the sinner from the sinner's point of view and also thru the circumstance the sinner was while he was committing the sin.

God justifies or is indifferent to all sinful or sacred acts

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Originally Posted by ana123love

Personally I think God is both good and bad. I know it sounds crazy but in order for someone to understand what Bad is, dont they experience it first? Sure some peple have gone to longer lengths in badness, but a good person always has a bad side. There is no such thing as a perfect person. It's an illusion that we make ourselfs believe is real so that when the times comes we can judge ourselves and others. Everyone has a different view on whats good and whats bad.

Which is why I believe that God must have experimented with badness in order to have a more understanding way of it. Otherwise how is he able to pass judgement on us when he's the one who decides wether we go into heaven or not? How can he send you to hell for your wrong deeds when people have drilled into our heads that he is the figure of goodness? In order for someone to understand something you have to experience it otherwise you cant pass judgement on anyone.

So for me, God is neither good or evil. Why? Cause nobody is. If we were good people there wouldnt be problems in the world today. If we were bad people then we wouldnt have feelings or a conscience. Which lives us with one question: What exactly are we?

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The problem here, Ana, is that you make good and evil things that are "outside" of God - as if they have existence independent of Him. The Bible makes it clear that God has no traffic with evil - evil cannot touch Him - all that is impure, evil, tainted simply burns away in his presence. Good is defined by things that are consistent with God's character; evil is that which is contrary to his character. God is the basis of reality - as such, good and evil do not exist independently of God - they are definitions given to things that either conform to God's character or contradict it.

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Originally Posted by blazeofglory

Everyone imagines God in his own way, and of course a violent man has the reason of his own for acts of violence and every sinner justifies his sin. People think that a particular circumstance compels him to act sinfully.

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Hence the importance of the Bible; without some stable "ground" upon which to base our ideas of God, He becomes whatever we want, and at that point, He becomes meaningless and liable to the wildest flights of fancy.

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Originally Posted by blazeofglory

God justifies or is indifferent to all sinful or sacred acts

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I'd be curious what you base this idea of God on - because unless you have some sort of foundation, you are simply saying "this is who I think God to be" but you just as well could say "God is a 7 foot tall smurf" and assume that to be authoritative unless you have a basis for that belief outside your own opinion. I'm not sure which sacred text makes God indifferent to sin or that he justifies it - except that if he justifies it, it is no longer a sin.

The bible says 'that which is of flesh is flesh, that of spirit is spirit.' In other words, something can only come from its source.

Since this god is the source of evil (Isaiah 45:7; Amos 3:6; Lamentations 3:38) then it shows that he, too, is evil. This assuming the bible is correct.

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Originally Posted by hellsapoppin

The bible says 'that which is of flesh is flesh, that of spirit is spirit.' In other words, something can only come from its source.

Since this god is the source of evil (Isaiah 45:7; Amos 3:6; Lamentations 3:38) then it shows that he, too, is evil. This assuming the bible is correct.

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Or consider that your interpretation might be incorrect...

Isa 45:7
I form the light and create darkness,
I make peace and create calamity;
I, the LORD, do all these things.’

Amos 3:6
If a trumpet is blown in a city, will not the people be afraid?
If there is calamity in a city, will not the LORD have done it?

Lam 3:38
Is it not from the mouth of the Most High
That woe and well-being proceed?

Try looking at the context next time...and use more than just one version.

Since man was created in God's image, God must be having all those traits before passing them on to Man! Consequently God cannot be said to be evil,,,but a 'bouquet' of all sorts of traits exhibited by men!!

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Originally Posted by BienvenuJDC

Or consider that your interpretation might be incorrect...

Isa 45:7
I form the light and create darkness,
I make peace and create calamity;
I, the LORD, do all these things.’

Amos 3:6
If a trumpet is blown in a city, will not the people be afraid?
If there is calamity in a city, will not the LORD have done it?

Lam 3:38
Is it not from the mouth of the Most High
That woe and well-being proceed?

Try looking at the context next time...and use more than just one version.

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We, the Muslims, are lucky in that we have ONLY ONE version of the holy Quran!:)

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Originally Posted by mazHur

We, the Muslims, are lucky in that we have ONLY ONE version of the holy Quran!:)

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Why do you consider that lucky? That would mean that you cannot consider the different translations to understand more deeply the meaning of the passage. Is the Quran not written in more than just one language?

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Originally Posted by mazHur

Since man was created in God's image, God must be having all those traits before passing them on to Man! Consequently God cannot be said to be evil,,,but a 'bouquet' of all sorts of traits exhibited by men!!

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God is ALL GOOD, and anything that is not like God is evil. God created light which is opposite of darkness. The two cannot coexist. It is as such with Good and Evil.

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Originally Posted by BienvenuJDC

Why do you consider that lucky? That would mean that you cannot consider the different translations to understand more deeply the meaning of the passage. Is the Quran not written in more than just one language?

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The holy Quran is read all over the world....by ALL Muslims, regardless of their sect or creed--in Arabic. The Quran in Arabic is the SAME in every Muslims house, mosque or country where ever he lives....Thus there is NO problem in citing an specific verse from the very same source universally!
Moreover many Muslims around the world have memorized whole of the Quran in Arabic word by word! Thus we are lucky in that nobody can fool us by distracting our attention to different versions of the same book!


Translations and interpretations are different things........they may differ and they do but the BASIC Quran is in Arabic and if a serious Muslim wants to check out he can at once make recourse to the Original Arabic text (with literal translation) and cross-check even if he doesn't know Arabic!


This is not the case with the Bible which has been edited by men so many times that the original essence of it is mostly confounded and sorry to use the word 'corrupted'!

Another thing is that we Muslims do not make fun of our holy Book or holy personalities...Muslims are also forbidden by the Quran to speak ill of any other religion, its follower, its books or whatever....for this reason you will note that no Muslim can draw a caricature of Moses, Jesus etc or use filthy words about them even though
so much hate seems to prevail between them especially after 9/11 and due to Palestinian dispute.

The simple answer to the OP is that god is not just good and bad, but everything, period. God is creation, and what you would call bad or good (for simplicity's sake, I'm going to assume you're talking about conventional modernistic western morality) are manifestations of god (the aggregate of energy, matter, and consciousness). Even if one believes that a personal god exists separate from existential life, for that entity to truly be the source and creator of all, it would have to be "beyond good and evil" and in fact be beyond all ideas and human comprehension.

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Originally Posted by mazHur

The holy Quran is read all over the world....by ALL Muslims, regardless of their sect or creed--in Arabic. The Quran in Arabic is the SAME in every Muslims house, mosque or country where ever he lives....Thus there is NO problem in citing an specific verse from the very same source universally!
Moreover many Muslims around the world have memorized whole of the Quran in Arabic word by word! Thus we are lucky in that nobody can fool us by distracting our attention to different versions of the same book!


Translations and interpretations are different things........they may differ and they do but the BASIC Quran is in Arabic and if a serious Muslim wants to check out he can at once make recourse to the Original Arabic text (with literal translation) and cross-check even if he doesn't know Arabic!


This is not the case with the Bible which has been edited by men so many times that the original essence of it is mostly confounded and sorry to use the word 'corrupted'!

Another thing is that we Muslims do not make fun of our holy Book or holy personalities...Muslims are also forbidden by the Quran to speak ill of any other religion, its follower, its books or whatever....for this reason you will note that no Muslim can draw a caricature of Moses, Jesus etc or use filthy words about them even though
so much hate seems to prevail between them especially after 9/11 and due to Palestinian dispute.

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I do not agree with what you are saying, but any example that I might present will most assuredly be censored. The muslim religion does not practice the way that you say. muslims react in an ill manner toward other religions all the time. I'm not saying that all muslims do this, but there are enough that do in fact speak ill of all other religions. More than just speak, they act also.

The OP:

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Originally Posted by Shadowsarin

This is a bit of weird one I think. This came to me when I was reading a Philip K. Dick short story about something similer. This is purly hypothetical and I mean no offence.

If god is in everything and everyone, does that not make him as much an evil malevolent as a divine benevolent?

It just seems to me that evil is as much a thing as good; and something claimed to be everything must surely be both?

Thoughts on this random thought?

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Preaching and championing one particular religion at the expense of others are not allowed on this site.

Off-topic posts will be deleted without further notice.

''Try looking at the context next time...and use more than just one version. ''

The quotes you use clearly prove that this supposed god creates both good & evil. Again, assuming such a god exists.

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Originally Posted by hellsapoppin

''Try looking at the context next time...and use more than just one version. ''

The quotes you use clearly prove that this supposed god creates both good & evil. Again, assuming such a god exists.

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a nice googly by you!:)

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Originally Posted by hellsapoppin

''Try looking at the context next time...and use more than just one version. ''

The quotes you use clearly prove that this supposed god creates both good & evil. Again, assuming such a god exists.

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Calamity is not the same as 'evil'. Calamity can be the destructive results of a storm. Jesus Christ had shown that he had the power over the winds and the waves, which could produce peaceful waters, or such as is...a storm of calamity and destruction. But this is a far cry from the interpretation of creating EVIL. And there is no other assumption based on sound logic than for such a God to exist.