Government authorities. Well, at least in my country, there's this institution which screens out books and movies :rolleyes:
And to answer your other Q: no, we are not allow to swear in this forum.
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Originally Posted by yellowfeverlime
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Government authorities. Well, at least in my country, there's this institution which screens out books and movies :rolleyes:
And to answer your other Q: no, we are not allow to swear in this forum.
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Originally Posted by yellowfeverlime
Thought so...
In May, 1899, Stalin was expelled from the Tiflis Theological Seminary. Several reasons were given for this action including disrespect for those in authority and reading forbidden books. Stalin was later to claim that the real reason was that he had been trying to convert his fellow students to Marxism.
Funny, huh? Maybe banned books started the Russian Revolution...
The problem with banning books, for whatever reason, is that it infringes on the market place of ideas and exempts individuals from forming their own judments of the book's quality. Ray Bradbury's Farenheit 451 is an interesting case study in censorship, and it makes the point that the more information and different viewpoints available, the better off society is. I think people often forget that we don't have the right not to be offended, and the gods be thanked for it. It is what opens up dialogue and necessitates an examination of the very things that make us human.
I was wondering why books are banned, then why are they printed. Becasue people want to read them... and why do they ban them... to make them unpopular... and what happens... they become more popular.
No kidding. In a society that is at the front and center of the information age, banning a book is in some ways the best thing that could happen to it. The ensuing attention it receives can give it a lot more prestige than it originally would have had, and people want to read it for themselves. Censorship is a serious problem when it is enforced as an absolute silencing mechanism, and in our society that is a fairly unrealistic, though no less disturbing, occurence.
My opinion exactly.... I mean if you look at most of the banned books, they're mostly about an individual trying to be his/her own self. When they're banned- what is that supposed to teach you? Don't think differently from everyone else.Quote:
Originally Posted by yellowfeverlime
Besides, banning books just makes them more popular, so it's pointless :D
Popular to certain people/groups not popular to most people
Why was "Little Red Riding Hood" banned anyways?????
Something to do with alcohol where there's one version shows that the girl taking food and wine to her grandmother...Maybe people in general think that it's unappropriate for a little gal to do that.
And here are some (IMO) ridiculous reasons of why certain books banned:
And here are some (IMO) ridiculous reasons of why certain books banned:
Call of the Wild by Jack London: Too radical
Twelfth Night by Shakespeare: Alternative lifestyle introduction
Alice in Wonderland by Lewis Carroll: Animals should not use human language and should not be put on the same level as humans
The Catcher in the Rye by J.D. Salinger: Sex scenes, themes of questioning authority, unsuited to age group (oh I'm dying to read this book)
I Know Why the Caged Bird Sings by Maya Angelou : Sexual content, racism, offensive language
What about burning books? I totally disagree. DEBATE IS ON!!!!!!!!!!!!!! (aLWAYS WANTED TO SAY THAT!)
What amazes me most about book burnings (besides the obvious idiocy) is that people will purchase books just to have something to burn.
It seems each time Rowling releases a new HP book, some group somewhere will be shown on the news burning the book. And every time I have seen pictures from an event like this, I always see people pulling pristine, new books from bags that were purchased just for the occasion.
It cannot believe these people will offer financial support to authors and publishers they disapprove of so strongly.
In the late 60s or early 70s,I bought a copy of "The Anarchist Cookbook"because I was told Dr.Timothy Leary had contributed his personal recipe for ACID made out of common kitchen ingriedences and the book was about to be banned!I was neither an anarchist nor an acid freak but thought Leary would be a classic hedonist an the book would be vintage.Well the book didn't get banned and to the few that still remember him he is generaly viewed as the burn out hippy professor!
I had read a "Cookbook "was confiscated from from Nichols that had the method for making a nitrogen,diesel fuel bomb that McVeigh used.Hmm?
Fool, one of the members here, said that many things in The Anarchist Cookbook don't work..What do you think Okmit?
I don't know what didn't work for him?I'm aware of a couple botched attempts to make an explosive that was a mix of melted lard an gasoline that killed a few would be bomb makers.And there was also a recipe that called for skinning a tree toad ,drying the skin,pulverize,mix with a turkish tobacco and smoke for a wild trip that a few never came back home from.Quote:
Originally Posted by subterranean
I think the key is the Cook not the Cookbook.I still can't Bake a Betty Crocker Cake!
Sounds dangerous enough for me...:eek:
Yes, you have a point here..
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I think the key is the Cook not the Cookbook
Is it just me or are they making some of those things up. Also on the subject of burning books- they're just supporting the authors. They burn books- where do they get them? By buying them. To whom do most of the profits go to? The author!!!! What a surprise :eek: (not). The whole idea is just stupid.Quote:
Originally Posted by subterranean
Banning books is the most awful thing one can do, and I blame the ignorant parents and neoconservatives for it. I read Fahrenheit 451. Do you want to know the real reason why certain books are banned? Because they make you think, and people dont want to think. They want to bury their heads in the sand and leave their children uneducated and brainwashed. The restriction of ideas is a very good start for brainwashing. I read a lot this year, on my own and in school, and I have come to see that literature is probably the greatest lasting human achievement. The perpetuation of ideas has a significant, positive impact on a free society like ours, and once ideas are restricted, we're not free anymore. Most of the books on the banned list (I read the list in Intelligence Report, Spring 2005, published by the Southern Poverty Law Center) were banned because they disagree with the neoconservative, Christian Right ideals. The group of parents are hardly ever the majority, but they fight with volume more than reason, and as such, usually get what they want. Ray Bradbury sums it up nicely yet depressingly in pages 57-62 of the 50th Anniversary Edition of F451
yeah i picked the choice that sounded most annoying "i could careless...i hate books". no i like books and *sarcasm* i think that it helps stop the corruption of children
This poll is loaded. Im the guy who said I like the isea. Not because I want to see good, new, inovative literaute that makes you think banned. However, speaking from experience i know that porn can be very harmful. We all know the bomb recipies can be harmfull too.
I like the idea of banning THESE books and similar atrocities. The poll is loaded because it gives a good reason for the most likely answere within the question.
Of course the books that i wouldn't mind seeing banned are not liturature. If books were to be benned who would have the authority? I wish i could answerre that. We all know that authority would become corrupt or be bribed or be threatened even. Its too abd there has to be evil in the world as well as excelent literture.
I posted this in the Mark Twain Huckleberry Finn "This book is racist" topic
I think that censorship or basically blaming a book for inciting any sort of violence is an ill-aimed panacea.
I think that most `normal' well-adjusted people process some of the more disturbing information/literature/media out there and remain `normal'.
The minority ill-adjusted dysfunctional person will end up doing any number of anti-social acts if they go on living their life without any realisation that they need help, until they end up in jail or something. A book can be a convenient way out I suppose.
Kids who enact `revenge' or violence of some sort on their peers are disturbed and ill-adjusted and need help. They will find guns or violence or whatever else to express their outrage and anger. I think there is not enough prevention in place to staunch such need in the first place. Oh ya, but parents can blame the govt. on how their kids are turning out, blame school system etc.
People start believing that the gov'ts job is to protect them from disturbing things. People start forgetting how to make their own moral and value judgements, they don't have to because the gov't. is thinking for them.
That is disturbing. :)
I think that one has to take into account the premise of a book, why it was written.
Is it a non-fictional instruction manual?
Is it revisionist fiction history?
Is it an autobiographical memoir?
Thankfully there are books being written, even today, that are direct result of the current culture. So that in 100 years from now someone will get an idea of how things were in our time. No it isn't all rainbows and roses :)
You have a point Scher about drawing the line.. but I still think it's more accurate and authentic to have a wide-range of `literature' from any given point in history for future reference. So in Twain's time, what if all his books had been censored and burned and we now don't have an accurate portrayal of African-American history? I don't want my history sanitised, I want to know how wretchedly horrible Hitler was, so hopefully it never happens again.
Children unfortunately have to be exposed to uncomfortable ugly things sooner or later. If I had children of my own, of course my responsibility, I would do my utmost to prepare them for the ugly things in this world that will IMO never go away. At least I can hope that they will then be well-adjusted people armed and ready to deal with such moral and social quandry. Exposure to the dogma and beliefs of religious sects and splinter groups included. ;)
Sweeping things under the rug doesn't make them go away, the accumulation will just trip you up and come back to haunt you. In My Opinion, Your Mileage May Vary.
But Logos, I think that's what all parents do. They prepare their children based on the values and norms they have, which they may consider the best. I think this is because in general, people consider that a child's very first lessons and values come from his/her family members. So parents tend to transfer their norms, knowledge, and values to their children as early as possible. And those are significant to a child's personality and character development.
My mother raised me in Christian values in my childhood, and of course she would expect me to be a good Christian in my future. But when she saw my bookshelves, somewhere in her heart, she must have felt that she has failed in some way.
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Originally Posted by Logos
Banning books is awful, and why would you burn a book?
I wholeheartedly agree! However, pornography isnt often harmful. Our imaginations contribute greatly to sexual activity, and our imagination consists of images from erotica. I will say that certain porn is bad, such as mock-rape scenes and violent S&M, but normally, erotica consists of consenting adults who know that they are being filmed. Not all porn is harmful.Quote:
Originally Posted by Logos
As much as I am against banning of books, I believe that certain books should be read at different age levels. Hold Cather in the Rye off until high school, please. It is the outright removal of books from the curriculum for illegitimate reasons ("So-and-So is a radical who didn't like African-Americans"), that I get upset about. I think Ray Bradbury puts the process of book-banning succinctly in F451 when Montag was speaking with the Captain.
On irresponsible parents, my ex-neighbors, who moved out 7 or so years ago, were very sheltered from reality, they grew up in a strict Christian household, weren't allowed to SEE a vieogame system, let alone own one (one of the two brothers asked "Whats a Nintendo 64?") and the mother was the end-all-be-all. One of the two kids whom I was friends with, actually said to me "Puberty? That sounds bad. I dont want that."
Well, parents, "what you dont know cant hurt you" is the biggest, most destructive lie ever perptuated by supposedly intelligent people.
When I have kids of my own, I am going to give them the knowledge they truly need to make educated, intelligent decisions based on relative morality (that includes the positive side of sexual activity as well as the risks!).
Banning is impossible,they just go underground.Burning a book is one of the least violent forms of protesting an attack on ones phylosophical perspective.Quote:
Originally Posted by Nobody
Salman Rushdi had a million dollar bounty for writing "The Satanic Letters." I'll bet he would have preferred that Ayatollah Ruhollah Khomeini and the boys would have just held a bon fire of his book.
i thought i've responded to something like this, but oh well.
a bibliophile myself, i actually don't disagree with book-banning. i don't know much about how book-banning really works (are we talking domestic book-banning? international-wide?), but i think excluding certain books from the school's library is not a bad idea. yes, the world is harsh, and children will know the be exposed to the truth eventually, but if i were a parent, i'd rather my children stay innocent for as long as they can. they have only what, 12 years to be children? (the number is decreasing with every passing year) and the rest of their life to be kicked and punched and spat on in the face (can be figuratively or literally).
it's also worth remembering that some books are, well, trash. if i were a dictator and the world is under my control, for example, i'd ban all those paperback romance novels. :p there are also books that are way too graphic and explicit that they'd best stay inside people's head instead of written, plausible for children to accidentally see.
granted, book-burning is stupid and a waste of paper and trees. and those who condemn harry potter because it includes wizardry and stuff are, to put it gently, dum.
Not sure if this was directed at me? I wasn't specifically referring to porn in my post although that too is something I feel has no reason to be banned by the government :)Quote:
Originally Posted by MiSaNtHrOpE
I think this looks familiar also? Dejavu for two perhaps.Quote:
Originally Posted by underground
Most of us here, I think, are using values (good, awful, bad, acceptable in some terms),thus we're talking in qualitative term, In person to person level, the question about banning books is a relative thing.
For example, underground stated:
Now, If I were to ask him/her some titles which he considered as trash, there is a posibillity that other members, including myself, would challenge him.Quote:
it's also worth remembering that some books are, well, trash.
The subjectivity, course, also apply to people who have the authorities to ban or not to ban certain publications, because they are using their knowledge/values/norms/religious/political bakcgrounds to make determination.
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Originally Posted by okmit
I can't believe that this was posted. What about the Nazi's in Germany? They would hold rallies regularly burning banned books. Its a form of mind control. Actually, I'm offended by the thought of it.
I didn't mean that porn is harmful to the adult performing the activity...were talking about books not films, that would just be silly of me. But since you brought it up i will be silly and oblige. Porn is harmful psychologically to the viewer if he/she tends to use a lot of it (in films, books, magazines ...). Furthermore, pornography is one of the most addictive things i can think of (next to television).Quote:
Originally Posted by MiSaNtHrOpE
This hits quite close to home with me, and I am willing to explain to you why in a more intimate setting, so if you wish to know please send me a private message via this website. Just please don't assume that such a blaspheme against such a beautiful loveing act is harmless.
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Originally Posted by IrishCanadian
And so does alcohol....
Well, alcohol is bad, but if they ban a book with it in it, then wouldn't people be wantign to know more about it, then drink instead of read... weird, but just a question.
i think this whole business of banning books is really uncalled for. maybe it is justified when people do bombs and things like that but really, things like porn and the like should be given age brackets and not banned altogether. you see, what may be normal to one person may be porn to another. i think what should happen is that people should be given the freedom to read what they want and judge for themselves whether its good or bad.
It depends what people mean by "banning books."
Certainly there are books that should be banned in Jr.High, Elementary, maybe even high school. With the way children interact with each other there are some things that should not be brought to their attention.
But "Mein Kampf" is banned in Gemany- One cannot forget history. They are trying to ban it in Canada, books are knowledge that shouldn't be erased.
I’m curious what everyone thinks about books that are blatant lies such as Japan trying to rewrite their history regarding their relations with China and the Nazi's stating the Holocaust never happened and the old history books of the South that totally discredit the North and why the war was fought. My mother who’s from Kentucky has an old school book like that and any child reading that back in the 50's could have easily grown up to be completely ignorant of the truth unless a wiser, unbiased person stepped in to enlighten them.
Excelent point, hmmm. I'd probably ask it only to be published with a forward by a hired historian (easier said than done). Because such political atrocities are a good insite to historical propaganda and political power struggles.
Ah, but for the right price I bet you can pay anyone to write whatever you want ;)Quote:
Originally Posted by IrishCanadian
`Peer review' process is only so good as the body governing it's actions. If it's the propaganda-based, then they're all on the `wrong' idea, right? but they don't care they're getting their message across.