If Satanism is a religion (and I don't see why it shouldn't fall into that category), then I wonder how many Christians on this forum are going to respect Satanism?
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If Satanism is a religion (and I don't see why it shouldn't fall into that category), then I wonder how many Christians on this forum are going to respect Satanism?
How is one to define the term "repect"? There are Protestant Christian groups such as the Seventh Day Adventists who sincerely see the Pope of Rome as the anti-Christ predicted in the Book of Revelation. Hence, they see Catholicism as a form of Satanism.
One possible definition of "respect" is to "live and let live." Not persecuting a group, not hunting them down, is a form of respect. The word "respect" in certain contexts simply denotes tolerance. We tolerate the fact that there are others whom we see as unacceptible in some way.
In my opinion, when you brand someone or their way of life as 'unacceptable', you stop respecting them. There are so many people who advocate a so-called-policy of 'tolerance' yet fail to do so themselves. They bitterly attack other religions or target people who follow those. I am more wary of those than of fanatics.
The TRULY tolerant would be tolerant even of intolerance, I suppose.
Sounds more like 'saint' than tolerant to me.
Maybe the truly tolerant would have very little to say.
True.
.....
Ha ha, Scheh you are too modest (or maybe immodest!)
I think we are confused about the term satanism. There is a Church of Satan founded by Anton Levey, but they arn't actually a Satan-worshiping organized religion. Levey's Satanism as is outlined in his Satanic Bible is all about the opposite of Biblical and Christian teaching. Members of the Church of Satan don't believe in a God OR a Devil. People who do believe in a Devil and actually worship him... Well I've only heard of people doing that for shock value, or because they really want to be "evil".Quote:
Originally Posted by Sitaram
As far as Adventists, I used to be one! ...So I know a bit about what they think ;), and they don't believe that Catholisism = Satanism. What they believe is that the Catholic Church is corrupted, in both theology and ecclesiology (doctrine & hierarchy), and that this corruption is the "abomination of desacration" of Revalation. "A of D"=Antichrist, in otherwords, they believe that the Devil is controling the Pope and that the Catholic church is not the church that Christ came to create. However, most adventists even though they believe that the Catholic Church is the antichrist respect Catholics on a personal level. In my lil' white-bread, redneck town the Adventist, Methodist, Baptist, and Catholic ministers/priests are friends and frequently have bible-studies together and respectfully and tolerantly discuss and share their views and opinions. Unfortunately not all the members of the various churches in sleepy ol' New Market are as tolerant or respectful as their ministers are. But no Adventist (who arn't completely retarded) actually accuse Catholics of knowlegable worshiping the Devil.
The thrust of my post was not with regard to R.C. Church = Satanic worship, but with regard to tolerance. Seventh Day Adventists see the Pope as some form of Anti-Christ, you may split all the hairs you like about what that boils down to, bottom line, but my point is that, on some level S.D.A. are "intolerant" of R.C. in the sense that they describe them as deceived by Satan, but, in a different sense, they are tolerant of R.C., in the sense that they do not shoot them on sight, or burn down their churches.
I was trying to get down to an exploration of the real meaning of tolerance, I suppose. But I must post and read all of this in haste, as I steal moments during the day away from my scheduled activities.
And yet, somehow, true tolerance would tolerate even intolerance. I am also trying to explore the implications of such a tolerance (if such a tolerance can meaningfully be said to exist). Various Baptist groups take a dim view of dancing or musical instruments in the Church building.
In the town of Rockford Illinois, I am told, there is, on the one side of town "The Church of Christ WITH MUSIC" (they allow a piano/organ) and on the other side of town there is a "Church of Christ WITHOUT music (instruments are forbidden and all singing is a capella, unaccompanied)
I was debating some issue or other with a very wise person, (I forget which group it was now), but that person remarked to me that if I TRULY understood the position of that group, then I would be PART of that group, and one of its enthusiastic supporters. There is a certain validity to such an observation, that those who embrace and accept have an understanding quite different from those who accepted but later apostasized, or those who studied by never embraced a doctrine or theory or practice or value.
Well, in retrospect, as I look back, I did conclude by saying that "they see R.C. as a form of Satanism." I suppose what I was really trying to get at is that few groups would be tolerant of unabashed Satan worship, since they are scarcely tolerant of groups which differ from themselves by something rather minor. A Baptist minister once told me that he sneaked down to a Congregational church and peeked in to see for himselves that they were dancing in the very church itself (they were holding some kind of social function and had only the church building itself.)
Since this IS a forum for the discussion of various religious texts (scriptures), I will take the liberty to mention certain issues in various scriptures, with regard to the notion of "tolerance".
Huston Smith, world famous scholar/writer on comparitive religions, cites the 48th verse of the 5th Surah (I am working from memory now, so forgive any errors) as THE MOST ecumenical, interfaith, tolerant verse which anyone could possibly imagine, namely, Allah is saying (to paraphrase from my memory): "FOR MY own reasons, I have created you all as different religions. Had I wanted to, I could have created you all as ONE RELIGION. Therefore, If you must contend and vie and contest and compete with one another, then COMPETE IN DOING GOOD WORKS. And when you all return to ME, THEN I shall explain to you the reasons for the various differences between religions."
BUT, in the very next breath, if my memory serves me correctly, the 5th Surah goes on to say, "Do not be friends with Christians and Jews, they have each other to be friends with. He who is friends with them is one of them, and Allah does not help wrong-doers."
My next example, on the issue of tolerance, is also drawn from Islam; not from the Qur'an, but rather from what has been preserved as the oral tradition conserning the "sayings of Prophet Muhammed." In the sayings of that oral tradition, Muhammed gives counsel that, should non Muslims approach and say, "Salaam alehoum" (peace unto you), you SHOULD NOT reply as to other believes, "Oualehoume Salaam", but rather simply say "THE SAME TO YOU". The reason for this advice is the notion, also expressed by various Christian groups, is that the blessings of non believers are really curses. Hence, by responding, "THE SAME to you" you are reflecting back upon them the curse which their blessing carries. This very same sentiment is reflected by strict old calender eastern orthodox Christians, who will not even say grace with a Christian of a different denomination, since the notion is that they unwittingly worship a demon which is disguised as Christ.
We read in the Old Testament of the Bible that King Solomon took to himself something on the order of 800 wives, many of them from the pagan nations. Solomon was tolerant in allowing those foreign wives to build alters on high places and worship in their religions. The God of the Jews was not as tolerant as King Solomon, and caused the nation of Israel to be divided as a punishment.
"Church of Christ!" Haze repeated. "Well, I preach the Church of Christ Without Christ. I'm a member and preacher to that church where the blind don't see and the lame don't walk and what's dead stays that way. Ask me about that church and I'll tell you it's the church that the blood of Jesus don't foul with redemption."Quote:
Originally Posted by Sitaram
(Wise Blood, Flannery O'Connor)
Interesting one, Basil.
http://www.angelfire.com/md2/timewarp/wiseblood.html
In Wise Blood, Hazel Motes seems trapped by his destiny to become a preacher. Though he denies that Jesus exists, Hazel is driven to seek some form of redemption. O'Connor describes the necessity of faith, as revealed the individual’s inability to deny that God exists. Even when an individual attempts to deny the existence of God, the individual is confronted by the presence of God. Hazel’s attempt to run away from God transforms the novel from bizarre comedy to an intense and searching study of the problem of redemption in the modern world.
http://www.commondreams.org/views05/0215-21.htm
http://www.litencyc.com/php/sworks.p...=true&UID=8824
The first chapter of Wise Blood was originally a story in O'Connor's master's thesis for the University of Iowa's writer's workshop, and the novel's episodic, almost picaresque structure suggests the way in which she composed the novel, writing numerous stories and vignettes and then editing them into a linear form. The novel begins with Motes travelling across Tennessee from his home in Eastrod to preach in the city of Taulkinham after he is galvanized into a ferocious anti-Christian stance in the course of military service. But Motes's grandfather had been a preacher, and he himself had displayed a tendency towards religious asceticism in his youth, punishing himself for the sight of a naked woman by walking with stones in his shoes. As he enters the city, Jesus is “a wild ragged figure motioning him to turn around and come off into the dark where he was not sure of his footing, where he might be walking on the water and not know it and drown.”
That's a lame argument. For starters, I don't think it qualifies. And second, would you respect a nazi? I didn't think so...Quote:
Originally Posted by atiguhya padma
Does the term "tolerant" apply in Atheism?
What's with this Christian versus Satanism??Quote:
Posted by AP: Maybe the truly tolerant would have very little to say.
Just wondering whether there's also Judaism versus Satanism or Islam versus Satanism???
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Quote:
Originally Posted by atiguhya padma