Nihilism

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Originally Posted by Endymion

This leads us to think about the fact that your world only begins from the moment you're born, and ends the day you die. What you do in your life - who you fall in love with, who you meet, etc. - won't make a difference to you, when you're dead (unless, of course, you believe in the afterlife).

So, thinking on a much wider scale, will it really matter, ultimately, what people did with their lives and our planet, when the universe ends and/or our planet dies (which we're sure it will)?

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Yeah, I like the way it was put by Clarence Darrow:
"We are born and we die; and between these two most important events in our lives more or less time elapses which we have to waste somehow or other. In the end it does not seem to matter much whether we have done so in making money, or practicing law, or reading or playing, or in any other way, as long as we felt we were deriving a maximum of happiness out of our doings."

And a similar thought by Will Rogers:
"We are all here for a spell; get all the good laughs you can."

I used to fret over the state of the world, and what it would be in the future, but now I've realized that I can only affect, if anything, the near future. Anything beyond that is not my responsibility, since I can have no effect on it. In a million years (or probably much less time) the very fact of my having ever existed will be completely forgotten, and I might as well have never been at all, for all the effect my life will have had on that furture world. And a million years is as an eye-blink in the long stretches of cosmological time. Only the here/now has any real meaning for me, and the farther I try to look ahead, the less meaning I can see related to my actions.

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Originally Posted by linz

Philosophy is gibberish to me. I read The Republic as a child, but it seems likely that it was Aristotle who started the trend of actually believing any of us had a clue to what the hell is going on. It is frightful to see these legions of Philosophers and their legion of theories which have gotten us absolutely nowhere. I swear, for every million thinkers, there is a million answers, just like shrinks. Marx is the only person that made sense; it is too bad he wasn't also a pessimist, or he would've known there wasn't a chance in hell mankind could redeem itself.

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Quite a bit of philosophy is meaningless to me, as well. I've had to wade through a lot of BS in order to glean what I considered nuggets worth considering seriously. But I won't say it hasn't been fun!
http://i43.photobucket.com/albums/e3...ce/laie_21.gif

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Originally Posted by quasimodo1

Questioning can be replaced by re-evaluation. Semantics, right?

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I don't see the distinction between questioning and re-evaluating. Is there one?

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Originally Posted by quasimodo1

You have said (quoted) something in latin;mine is rusty...is it Cicero?

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"Any man can make a mistake; only a fool keeps making the same one."

Indeed, Cicero.

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Originally Posted by rsorad3

"It's a it bit contradictory for nihilists to have a representative website isn't it? A bit like anarchists voting!"

Absolutely, these people cannot live with themselves.

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Ha! And solipsists can't live without themselves! ;)

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Originally Posted by jphb

Turgueniev created the first nihilist character, Bazarov, in Fathers and Sons, and he said a nihilist doesn't bow before any authority and has no faith in any principle.

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In case anyone wants to read Fathers and Sons, here's a link:
http://www.ibiblio.org/eldritch/ist/fas.htm

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Originally Posted by quasimodo1

I can't afford a nihilistic point of view; the depression of it would be too much.

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Actually, I find the nihilist point of view very liberating. I think that although it renders everything worthless, that doesn't mean, at least for me, that there is no beauty in this world to be admired. I think beauty is perhaps the only thing that keeps its value for a nihilist.

In this sense, the nihilist can adopt an observer's point of view. Also because if everything is worthless then, in a cerrtain sense, everything is worth the same, and this is an impartial point of view that I think is a necessary starting point for an observer's activity.

Regards

Nihilists lack the will humanity needs to finally move forward. Theists lack the way of thinking it takes to move forward. If people would start putting faith in themselves (and out of imaginary entities [theists] or nothing [nihilists]), then maybe mankind will finally progress.

People are, generally, selfish. When it comes down to it, most of us don't care about the future generations and what will happen to them; whether they'll progress, create new weapons or cure all sickness, because we'll, most likely, be dead.

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Originally Posted by Endymion

People are, generally, selfish. When it comes down to it, most of us don't care about the future.

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And that's why we have philosophy. To counteract this selfishness and open up people's minds.

I'd also say that's why we have civilizations, cultures, religions and pretty much any symbol imaginable.

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Originally Posted by crisaor

“Nihilism is best done by professionals.”
- Iggy Pop

;)

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Hahah!:D Yay for Iggy!

This is just a suggestion

The problem with conceptual issues which have been ascribed the symbolic ending of 'ism' is that none, with which I am familiar are clearly defined. They are vague, sometimes because of well orchestrated intent, sometimes by media 'catch attention' or even journalistic ignorance, and this has led to connotations - meaning through usage, beyond the literal..

Therefore, to debate an 'ism' , it would be wise to first describe the meaning with which that particular thread is aligned. This would help to keep matters more focused and avoid confusion to both participant posters, and in general readers.

There are different interpretations of what 'nihilism really is', though.

The website shown on the first page shows a more extreme side of nihilism, i.e. 'Death to Love, Death to Government', etc.

However, I already stated my interpretation of it on the previous page.

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Originally Posted by jphb

It just means that there are no absolut truths.

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If you say there are no absolute truths, aren't you saying there's only one?

-There is one true statement, there's only one true statement, and all others are false, or less true? But then there'd be levels of truth. One truth above another, but really that truth wouldn't be saying much, just that it was truer than anything else. Because you first say that there's only one thing that's absolutely true, but then there's another degree of absolution.

If you get me.

Can't we say 2+2 is an absolute truth? Isn't that the definition? All 'concepts' don't apply to nature, so they say, but in math and things there is truth.

Well, I haven't read a whole lot about nihilism, just some of Nietzsche and probably others, and an excerpt from that Turgeniev piece; as I have it, nihilism is 'levelling.' That's fine and makes sense with nature, etc. Atrophy or whatever.

So I'm not sure what nihilism addresses, or what it means. Isn't it only a part of other philosophies, hell, even a thing of science?

I guess there was no point to this post since I was only asking a question..