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I remember the cartoon. Bing Crosby narrates and sings the story. I usually hate the way Disney perverts fairytales and legends, but I liked the Sleepyhollow adaptation.
I have read half of the story and the cartoon does follow it pretty well so far.
Okay, I will not say a word about it
OK you may all start reading now :D
and if you are coming to the live chat think of at least one thought provking thought before hand ( I was going to say and not a Depp comment either but I guess I will allow that:lol: )
Can everyone coming to the live chat PM me your ahh approximate location ( so I can translate the tiime for you :D)
Well unless youve already figured it out !!
this is basically a BUMP message
so thans everyone wh PMmed me back whether you are coming or not to the live chat tommorow at 2300 GMT wich equals
1800 New York, and montreal time (est??)
900 (sunday morning)( ithink) sydney australia
I think that about covers it :D
If anyone is still unsure Pm me and ill work it out :D
Hi Nightshade, I don't have an MSN account, I'm on yahoo.
hey if you get this B-mental Yahoo can be used on MSN!
:D
Can you post a link to the chat?
Thanks!
well here are my start off thoughts about the story
1. “Women are the source of all evil”. Is this true here?
2. Vanity as in icabond, bones, and Katrina?
3. Is Icabopnd crane likable?
4. Sarcasm and satire?
5. Bones?
6. Adaptations---please limit the Johnny Depp-ying ;)
7. Katrina Van Tassel?
8. High German doctor reference To Mesmer?
9. Is it just about the power of superstion?
Ichabod Crane was quite likeable, and he won. He is a heroic character, because he didn't get stuck with Katrina, and he got out of Sleepy Hollow, and he had some success after leaving.Quote:
Originally Posted by Nightshade
The story is almost as tongue in cheek as Rip van Winkle. I didn't laugh out loud, be I found it quite amusing.
Franz Anton Mesmer was born in 1734, so he would have been roughly contemporary with the story, and his work would have been known to Washington Irving, but he was well after the time that would have been " the early days of the settlement". I consider the "high German doctor" to be a fictional item.
The story is only peripherally about superstition. The main plot is about the success of Ichabod Crane "for a country schoolmaster to be refused the hand of a Dutch heiress is a certain step to high preferment in the state."
does anyone like Icabond
me its a big fat no
hes yuckkkk
hes vain and a hypocrite
and he fell in love with her because he wanted her
land
for once I'm not that big a fan of corporal punishment
and when it's actually practised why play nice when
everyone knows they offspring get... friendly with the rod
good point
her reminds me of a lot of jerks i know. he is
selfish, shallow, a golddigger and really ugly!
ok that a good opinion that lead straight to the
next q which is
Do uyou think the whole thing is a satire?
yes of course
so Irving makes sure we dont like Ichabod
yes so is it satire??
irony sarcasm whatever its called?
he surely has a tongue in cheek attitude towards
him
and the way he spreads the rumours
uh-uh*nods*
so he doesnt like him??
or does he?
ichabod is merely more than a caricature, I think
so we are not expected to like him
it has to be a sort of spoof, i mean the way they
describe that guy, compared to brom he is utterly
repulsive, no matter how sweet his voice is in the choir.
it sort of reminds me of shrek, how they take all the
faerie tales and make a spoof of them.
he is not hero material
*agrees *
exactly hes just yuck
he is not yuck
he is a parody
simply funny
not at all he is such a user and an opportunist,
always looking for the next meal, seeing katrina as a means
to an end, all luxury living for him.
and hes full of himself
whcih makes him even funnier
well he is certainly full of something, i'll give
you that!
hehe
hum yes maybe he is funny but he annoyed me (i was expectting a depp carcterr)
carachter
ohh I cant spetlllit
i will admit the way he dances and fascinates all
the black servants is sort of well admirable, this tall
thin bag of bones gyrating all over the place.
interesting.yah i am sure katrina fell 'head over heels'
for the bum
err anyone here know when the civil war was??
1865-69?
or there abouts?
might be relevant although even the yankees thought
the ex-slave to be poor dumb creatures
so not before he died
well the description of them is to me rather
demeaning even if it is meant to be a compliment. icannot imagine even back then any black person being enamoured by
a white guy's dancing. it is just how i feel.
interesting so does this em.. mean maybe that he was
trying to what? lower crane??
i havent seen the movie crane is depp?
i think so because icahbod had such a high opinion
of himself and perhaps, just perhaps the black participants
were actually laughing AT him
the whole thing is so funny
i cant believe it is considered a scary story
whats funny?
the story
yes thats why Im saying is it a satire
satire of what?
ohh i dont know that part of the Us where is it
anyway
and the women miostly the women I think
NY me thinks
the story is mostly about and aimed at them
state not city
i think it might be a spoof of all the witchy things
that really were supposed to have occured through the U.S.
and back then, at least according to books i have read,
people were very spiritual and believed deeply in signs and
portents and every strange thing that occured, always
ascribing to it a supernatural cause. and it wrecked many
people's lives because they were sort of like the horoscope
readers of today that swear by them and live by
them. it is just a thought. perhaps irving thought is
slightly mad, who knows
yes andd that lead to another question but did
anyone notice the mention of high german doctor?
anyway Mesmer ( of Animal mesmerism 0 from whom we
get the word mesmerise
hypnosiss actually
was around oh at the time Irving was in his youth
so I though could it be a snide remark aboutr him,?
very interesting
what does all crane's eating and enormous appetite
signify anyway?
The seven deadly sins!! ( always usefull in literature:brow:)
do you think he really has a heart, i mean does he
actually care for anyone but himself on any level.?
pride,greed,lust anger,gluttony, envy and sloth or
laziness,oh that seven.
yupp
so is icabond like all good caricture a big
exageration of somthing and in this case what and can we
connect him to the seven?
or iis Bones rage?
this passage is so funnyQuote:
Such was the formidable rival with whom Ichabod
Crane had to contend, and, considering all things, a
stouter man than he would have shrunk from the competition,
and a wiser man would have despaired. He had, however, a
happy mixture of pliability and perseverance in his nature;
he was in form and spirit like a supple-jack—yielding, but
tough; though he bent, he never broke; and though he bowed
beneath the slightest pressure, yet, the moment it was
away—jerk!—he was as erect, and carried his head as high as
ever.
why is that passage funny?
it is so sarcastic
so... tongue in cheek!
well the list is growing :brow:
1. Women are the source of all evil”. In the light of this statement Sleepy hollow??
2. Vanity as in icabond, bones, and Katrina?
3. Is Icabopnd crane likable?
4. Sarcasm and satire?
5. Bones?
6. Adaptations---please limit the Johnny Deppying ;)
7. Katrina Van Tassel?
8. High German doctor reference To Mesmer?
9. Is it just about the power of superstion?
10. Seven deadly sins and Icabond.
11. whats it really about?
12. spooky ?
13. generally women in the story.
14. fav part?
15. Has it ever happened to you?
nightshade, you really got into this one. I'm glad you brought this story up because I never read Irvings original version. I only knew of the adaptations. For your information, the story is listed under Irving on this site. There is also some other interesting bits included. I'm not even going to try to answer the questions you raised but I did enjoy the read. I am going to add this to my holloween tradition for years to come.
I read the story, but wasn't really enthousiastic. Maybe it was the language, sometimes I didn't get it. And in my point of view, it wasn't very suprising, from the beginning I had the idea something would happen to Icabond.
Maybe it's just me, I think I prefer novels above short stories, mostly I miss the deeper meaning...
so does anyone else think maybe vanity was Icabonds downfall??