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And the sweeping, elevated emotion of Schubert's Serenata (975), played by the Royal Schubert Orcestra:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=olrNo3W1sTU
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Here at work, staring at yet another electronic surface, I can close my eyes and let this piece transport me back to another time.
Some Glenn Gould and Bach for Christmas (or anytime):
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wyOf_L4cNHc
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qGO0w...eature=related
(Currently listening.)
I have been fond of French mélodies (especially Faure, Debussy, Duparc, etc..) for some time now as several older posts here attest. For whatever reason, I never stumbled upon Berlioz' Les nuits d'été until quite recently. Admittedly, I have long had little or no interest in Berlioz... something that has only recently begun to change. Anyway... sometime earlier this year I got around to playing this disc:
http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7168/6...b2b36b18d5.jpg
I was absolutely blown away by these orchestral songs. I immediately picked up this:
http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7156/6...553b88f914.jpg
This disc featured several orchestral song cycles or suites: Chausson's Poème de l'amour et de la mer (an exquisite work), Ravel's Shéhérazade, and Debussy's 5 Poèmes de Charles Baudelaire (arranged by John Adams). I also discovered that may favorite current female French singer, Véronique Gens, had also made a recording of Berlioz' work... thus I had to run out and get this as well:
http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7145/6...00cc9c0804.jpg
In spite of my love of French mélodies (and I should note I have a good collection of art songs from Russia, England, the US... and even South America... I am profoundly enamored of classical vocal music as a whole) German lieder remain central to my love of "art songs". I must have 7 or so recordings of Schubert's Wintereisse (perhaps my single favorite song cycle), 4 exquisite versions of Mahler's Das Lied von der Erde, and something like 9 or 10 recordings of Strauss' Four Last Songs. Of course I am an avowed Straussian... in that he is my favorite composer of the 20th century.
Tonight I'm going to a local art house theatre to see Lars Von Trier's Melancholia, which makes use of Wagner's Tristan und Isolde!
http://boxset.ru/wp-content/uploads/...isolde1937.jpg
I find that listening to too much Vivaldi makes me feel like a serial killer. All that violin... the same with Paganini. Actually, especially Paganini. He makes me want to hang out in a graveyard like he did, that creeper.Quote:
Originally Posted by Mutatis-Mutandi
The "problem" with Vivaldi is that the majority of his reputation, until recently, has rested upon his numerous concerti grossi which quite often were lighter music... intended as mere entertainment or dinner music to be performed by the young ladies... orphans of the courtesans/prostitutes of Venice housed within the the Ospedale degli Innocenti where Vivaldi was the maestro di violino.
The majority of the music of the Baroque and earlier was long forgotten and seldom performed. With the growth of the so-called Historically Informed Performance Movement (HIP) there has been a concerted effort to rediscover this vast treasure trove of "Early Music". Two huge caches of Vivaldi's music were only discovered mid-century and are still undergoing transcription and editorial process prior to publication and performance. What has be discovered among operas, choral music, motets, sonatas, etc... suggests that Vivaldi was a far greater composer than initially thought:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wFM9WYz6J2s
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ceazCccMvzI
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9XZoW...eature=related
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XQx2TWgxX14
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9zQX2XqAE8c
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NRkyQm_PIWI
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FSVqDBxM55w
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DaYbTPuon_w
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ikHCVWv1uvg
I challenge anyone to find a better performance of this. I'm talking about everything here: Tone, technique, interpretation and whatever else comes to mind.
http://youtu.be/LYi6BQlBCl8
I like Vivaldi too, though I only really know the obvious stuff well, I think.
Still listening to these chaps despite not being religious at all of course:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pnKbPj7EhCg
...
Edit: 'currently' listening to Stluke's top Vivaldi link though, and wow.
Wow, such beautifully channeled emotion. I'm watching through her YouTube oeuvre now!Quote:
Originally Posted by Emil Miller
Yes it's very easy to be sniffy about the new generation of oriental performers who are setting new standards of performance, as opposed to those of established virtuosi of the West, but as someone who grew up with Rubenstein, Gilels, Richter etc. etc., I have no hesitation in saying that these people are simply amazing from every standpoint and musically the equal of anyone already committed to either the concert hall or recordings.Quote:
Originally Posted by chrisvia
How well respected is the singer meredith monk?
I challenge anyone to find a better performance of this. I'm talking about everything here: Tone, technique, interpretation and whatever else comes to mind.
Brian... I know you like your young Asian girls (not that this would bias your opinion:rolleyes:) but as good as she is for a 14 year old, I don't find her world class... let alone Rubinstein class.
I find Ami far more stacatto... "jerky" as opposed to the fluidity found here:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WHKS1Bjzpos
Grigory Sokolov is also brilliant:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gPeZZKh-ye4
Nelson Freire's is quite good... albeit a bit to "French" for my taste:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lZHAaaaVRWI
Of course Rubinstein has been and remains the touchstone by which all other recordings of Chopin... and especially recordings of the Nocturnes have been measured. Unfortunately, YouTube doesn't have a recording of Rubinstein performing the 20th. Here he is on the magical Op. 9 no. 2:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YGRO05WcNDk
Ami may eventually rise to such a level, but you will notice that no critics are rushing to compare her to the greatest concert pianists of today... or the past. Right now she is a child prodigy. What makes her special is her age, but as I stated before, prodigies are a dime-a-dozen. A vast majority disappear as they reach adulthood.
You see, this is precisely what I mean. The Harasiewicz is too slow and the Sokolov one of the most mannered performances I've heard. Nelson Freire's is a fine performance but does not, in my view, match Kobayashi's.Quote:
Originally Posted by stlukesguild
It's worth mentioning here that the Japanese performance is live and therefore had only one take. As a matter of fact, there have been music critics in Japan and China who are speaking of her with the same reverence that is given to other international pianists. She received a great reception at her Carnegie Hall appearance and also in Russia at St Petersburg. Unfortunately, she doesn't like travelling and that is why the majority of her concerts take place in Japan. Of course I would rather watch beautiful oriental women playing than their male Western counterparts but in the final analysis, it's what I hear that's important.
I have the Rubinstein recording that you have posted and have heard it often, but I'm fairly certain that in due course a performance just as fine will be coming from Asia.
You see, this is precisely what I mean. The Harasiewicz is too slow and the Sokolov one of the most mannered performances I've heard...
Who discerns what is "too slow" (or too mannered) concerning Chopin? Is not Glenn Gould often deemed as "mannered"? I think that common sense would lean toward the interpretation by a masterful Polish pianist as opposed to that of a Japanese child. "Interpretation", of course, involves considering and understanding the intentions of the original artist or composer (Murray Perahia, for example, reads up extensively upon any composer he intends to record... including looking at multiple versions of the original scores). Interpretation also involves imposing one's own artistic ideas. One would suspect that much of the "interpretation" of a 14 year-old girl is owing more to her teachers than anyone else. As for imposing her own artistic vision... this commonly involves having lived a bit beyond middle-school.
Again, she is masterful for her age, but whether she continues to develop and eventually join the ratified ranks of the leading concert pianists... this is a question that will still be decided. The percentage of child prodigies who evolve into leading adult performers is rare. Itzahk Perlman comes immediately to mind.
I have the Rubinstein recording that you have posted and have heard it often, but I'm fairly certain that in due course a performance just as fine will be coming from Asia.
Art is not something that evolves or develops in the same manner as science. Any medical student today knows more about the human body and illnesses than the greatest doctors of the Renaissance. No one alive today (that we know of) composes as brilliantly as Mozart or can draw as well as Michelangelo.
The challenge facing the next generation of performers is something that the leading younger performers are already mastering... and that is uncovering and mastering a body of music that goes beyond the usual core repertoire. At some point yet another pianist who can play Chopin or Tchaikovsky brilliantly becomes irrelevant when we can always access Rubinstein. Why do we need a new cycle of Beethoven's symphonies when Karajan's unrivaled 1963 recording is readily available... and sounds better than even? We don't... unless like John Eliot Gardiner we are offered a radically new historically informed interpretation. Both Hillary Hahn and Anne-Sophie Mutter have risen to the top of the ranks of living violinists as a result of their willingness... their insistence on making recordings of less-well-known repertoire that rivals the finest made of Beethoven, Mendelssohn, Tchaikovsky, etc... I think that for
Kobayashi to enter the leading ranks of concert pianists she will also need to bring something new to the dialog.
Admittedly where your opinions are biased by the appearance of the young Asian women, mine are biased by a suspicion of the promotional machinery behind the current crop of Asian "superstars" (such as Lang Lang) promoted with an intention of cashing in on the huge audiences of China, Korea, and Japan.
We all decide which performances we prefer by listening to various recordings and if one stands out as being too slow or mannered, then we say so.Quote:
Originally Posted by stlukesguild
I listen regularly to the BBC music channel which makes comparisons of recordings of the same work, and the presenters are constantly making such references. Music is subjective and it's impossible not to have personal preferences, as you demonstrate by your preference for Rubinstein who, while he is a great performer of Chopin, is not notable for his Tchaikovsky 1st whereas Van Cliburn's is to my mind the definitive performance: although, once again, it's a personal choice. Moreover I have a recording of Rubinstein playing both Chopin concertos with Barbirolli which I don't think as good as that played by Zimmerman and Giulini. As for Karajan's Beethoven symphonies, he recorded the cycle four times during his career. Once with the Philharmonia Orchestra for EMI and subsequently with the BPO on Deutsche Grammophon. So why did he need to re-record them twice after the first set that you mention as being unrivalled? As a matter of fact, I have that set myself.
I do not share your opinion that a prodigy of 14-years-of-age doesn't have the experience to play Chopin at the highest level, a teenage girl is probably at the stage where she will feel the music as perhaps she never will as an adult and her keyboard technique speaks for itself. It's also worth remembering that Mozart was a child prodigy who received the highest praise whether playing in Vienna, Prague, Paris or London.
The promotional machinery applied to Lang Lang and other concert pianists may well be intended to cash in on the oriental market but his record company, namely Deutsche Grammophon, were experts at cashing in on the western market as witness their promotion of the Berlin Philharmonic when Karajan arrived on the Berlin scene post WW11.
Music is subjective and it's impossible not to have personal preferences, as you demonstrate by your preference for Rubinstein who, while he is a great performer of Chopin, is not notable for his Tchaikovsky 1st whereas Van Cliburn's is to my mind the definitive performance: although, once again, it's a personal choice. Moreover I have a recording of Rubinstein playing both Chopin concertos with Barbirolli which I don't think as good as that played by Zimmerman and Giulini.
Yes. Zimerman is another favored performer as Chopin... along with Martha Argerich. Honestly Chopin is not one of those composers who I am so enamored of that I am likely to purchase several interpretations of each work where I might live with such variations and make in-depth comparisons. I love Dinu Lupatti's classic recordings of Chopin. I have Ashkenazy's, which are solid... but don't jump out at me in any way. I have a good number of Martha's Chopin recordings and have heard Zimerman's and both are impressive... but note strike me as sensitive to the nuances as Rubinstein... especially with the Nocturne's.
Now you are certainly right that no performer is an all-around master of every composer. I would turn to Van Cliburn as well for Tchaikovsky's 1st. For Mozart there are numerous contenders, but Perahia is seemingly the standard-bearer. Beethoven? For the concertos Fleisher/Szell, Serkin/Bernstein, Brendel/Levine, Barenboim/Klemperer, Perahia/Haitink... anyone is great. In other instances there is but a single definitive recording... as isn the work I am currently listening to:
http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7155/6...d7df18a49b.jpg
The promotional machinery applied to Lang Lang and other concert pianists may well be intended to cash in on the oriental market but his record company, namely Deutsche Grammophon, were experts at cashing in on the western market as witness their promotion of the Berlin Philharmonic when Karajan arrived on the Berlin scene post WW11.
But then Karajan lived up to the hype (as the disc above illustrates) where Lang Lang is a bit more questionable.
Don't get me wrong. I don't underestimate the Asian performers. Suzuki's recordings of Bach are among the finest available:
http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7146/6...0db5ee5ef5.jpg
Mitsuko Uchida has been masterfully recording and performing Mozart across the world. Her recordings of Schubert's piano sonatas have reawakened interest in this genre and stand second only (perhaps) to Wilhelm Kempff.
http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7003/6...9ec83b56eb.jpg
Yet for all here masterful, elegant touch and classical reserve, she has been equally instrumental in unveiling the splendours of some more knotty Modernist works including Schoenberg's Piano Concerto, works by Berg and Webern, and Debussy's Etudes:
http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7157/6...0cf385d39c.jpg
Myung-Whun Chung is especially adept within the French repertoire. His damnation of Faust by Berlioz is one of the finest and these two discs are essential recordings:
http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7162/6...1c760fb260.jpg
http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7162/6...56f830ca19.jpg
Sumi Jo has proven herself as a brilliant operatic singer. This collection of French songs has been repeatedly re-released... a sign of classic status:
http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7164/6...0c079f1864.jpg
And we cannot forget this recording with Solti:
http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7014/6...ee8671ae03.jpg
And what of Hei-Kyung Hong? This collection of Korean "classics" largely unknown in the West is an example of an artist exploring the less-well-traveled turf:
http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7004/6...6871e165b2.jpg
And then of course there's the Asian with the biggest name in classical music... in spite of the actual brevity of his name. Yo-Yo Ma has proven himself in performances of the most challenging classical repertoire:
http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7003/6...78ae97a141.jpg
... often working in tandem with any number of equally talented virtuoso:
http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7159/6...53b69be6e1.jpg
But he has also explored a broad array of music... from the lush film music of Morricone:
http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7021/6...6e8763d5c0.jpg
... to the tangos of Astor Piazzolla:
http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7003/6...e2c96c67bf.jpg
... to American folk music:
http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7007/6...019ffc59f2.jpg
... and the traditional music of Asia and the Middle-East:
http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7147/6...3ddd57ca4a.jpg
Classical music is truly that word which you so despise: MULTICULTURAL.:D
[QUOTE=stlukesguild;1101789Classical music is truly that word which you so despise: MULTICULTURAL.:D[/QUOTE]
My preference would be for the standard description of music being the INTERNATIONAL language.
I fell for this work when I was very young and I still love it. The harp glissandi at 9.41 used to make the hairs on my neck stand on end.
It is difficult to get the dynamics right because of its cyclical form but here Bernstein in a typically energetic performance succeeds where so many others have failed. The little gesture with his fist after its stunning conclusion is saying "I nailed it."
http://youtu.be/5GbZGJ6uEXA
(not too sure if this was previously posted here....)
For me, great accompaniment for a cold-yet-sunny afternoon: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wbcuteYm-EA
http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/...TL._SS500_.jpg
My favourite recording of one of my favourite works. Absolutely delicious. The orchestration here is lush and luxuriant. (Writing an orchestration text was one of Schoenberg's unrealised projects. :bawling:)
http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/...1L._SS400_.jpg
String Quartet No. 3 . . . Shostakovich was at his best when he was being sarcastic.
My favourite recording of one of my favourite works. Absolutely delicious. The orchestration here is lush and luxuriant. (Writing an orchestration text was one of Schoenberg's unrealised projects.
Yes... too bad he did not spent more effort there and less effort in attempting to throw out traditional tonality with the aim of replacing it with a entirely new musical language. Certainly, one can appreciate the ambition... but despise the pretension. An acquaintance recently suggested that he wished Schoenberg had never existed so that he might have experienced what Berg and Webern might have achieved within a more traditional tonality.
Yes, I know what you mean. He himself said: "There is still plenty of good music to be written in C Major." To be fair, he did spend a lot of time and effort on practical theoretical works. (And they've been an immense help to me, as a musician - teacher, performer, and would-be composer - by trade. He was a great teacher.) Of course, he would have vehemently disagreed with your rhetoric too (all that talk about "throwing out" traditional tonality).Quote:
Originally Posted by stlukesguild
I see Schoenberg's shift toward atonality as analogous to the shift toward abstraction in painting/the visual arts. Wagner, Debussy, Scriabin and others were already pushing the limitations of traditional tonality and these efforts opened up a new world of expressive possibilities... just as the "abstractions" and "distortions" of drawing, space, and color wrought an entire new world of possibilities for painters. In each instance it took someone to take the ultimate logical step toward a complete abandonment of figuration or traditional tonality. In either instance, the strongest artists did not immediately follow suit. Picasso refused to have anything to do with total abstraction. Paul Klee straddles the line between abstraction and figuration. Beckmann and Matisse and Bonnard had little use for the abandonment of figuration. Within the realm of music, Richard Strauss, Benjamen Britten Prokofiev, Shostakovitch... and even Stravinsky prior to his later works... refused to follow where Schoenberg had taken music. In both music and painting abstraction/atonality eventually became the dominant language until critics could speak of the "triumph" of abstraction, and suggest (as Greenberg in Art and Boulez and Wuorinen could in music) that figurative art/traditional tonality was "dead". In both instances I feel that there has been a shift among later artists toward a more moderate positions... a recognition of the expressive possibilities wrought by pushing the limits of tonality and "realism", an acceptance that some will continue to explore the possibilities of pure abstraction or atonality, and a realization that to many later artists the entire either/or dispute is a non-issue as they freely employ both figuration and abstraction/traditional tonality and atonality... as well as building upon sources greatly removed from either side of the debate (popular art/music, non-Western art/music, etc...)
**********
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Unfortunately, Górecki is known almost exclusively for his 3rd Symphony. He did compose a number of other marvelous works as well... as brilliant as the 3rd is. The Beatus Vir and Second Symphony magnificently performed here by Antoni Wit are both worthy of serious attention )as are his string quartets). Górecki, feeling trapped between the conservative limitations proscribed by the Soviet Communists and the Western Avant Garde extremists who initially embraced his early work but who (in his eyes) insisted upon continual formal experimentation for the sake of experimentation initiated a shift in style with these works. He consciously sought to engage a larger audience without sacrificing his aesthetic standards. The music was intentionally public... openly challenging Communist control and its atheistic, anti-religion position at a period in which the Catholic Church represented a serious challenge to the Communist control in Poland. Ironically, while Górecki was taken to task by Western critics as having "sold out" and "taken the safe route" he was in reality taking a heroic stance in facing very real dangers completely unknown to the Western academic safe in their university enclaves.
The style of music Górecki developed became known (often derisively) as Holy Minimalism. Like the Minimalism of American composers such as Philip Glass, Steve Reich, John Adams, etc...) Górecki's music returns to a music largely based upon traditional tonality. The simplicity or Minimalism of this music is often rooted in older musical forms such as medieval chants and the tolling of bells. I personally found both of these works highly effective... strikingly emotional... and deeply evocative of a sense of spirituality. I would strongly recommend this recording to anyone already fond of Górecki's 3rd Symphony.
http://g-ecx.images-amazon.com/image...ec6f3110.L.jpg
I picked up this disc a year ago but for whatever reason never got around to playing it over the holiday season... when its seemed most relevant. I finally got around to it this year. The Fantasia on Christmas Carols is just one of Vaughan-Williams' marvelous settings of folk and choral music... in this instance a setting of 4 well-known Christmas carols. Hodie: A Christmas Cantata, however, is the centerpiece of this disc. This work, written when Vaughan-Williams was into his eighties, shows no sign of waning energies. The piece was dedicated to fellow British composer, Herbert Howells, known especially for his choral work. The work is distinctly English... building upon the English traditions of choral music and anthems. The music also reveals the various aspects of Vaughan-Williams' own work... with elements of the pastoral and the dynamic anthems and lush orchestration.
The logical step? But with whose premises? There are qualitative differences between the premises of Schoenberg and those of the others mentioned. None of the others espoused the sort of all-encompassing musical egalitarianism that Schoenberg did. Of course, Schoenberg knew of the historical precedents. He knew that Liszt, for instance, had used a "tone-row." Schoenberg thought he could appropriate Christ's words, "I am not come to destroy, but to fulfil." But here he was wrong, I think. Schoenbergian atonality is only inevitable given certain dubious premises, regarding the consonance-dissonance dichotomy, regarding the acoustical nature of musical sound, regarding the purpose of art, and so on.Quote:
Originally Posted by stlukesguild
I have a lot of respect for Schoenberg. I've read more about him than any other composer. And I've studied all his theoretical works, even the posthumously-published unfinished ones. He was brilliant. But I think - that is, I came to think - that his premises were wrong, and that his philosophy of art was wrong.
I agree, by the way, that there are telling parallels between the development of music and that of the other arts, to say nothing of philosophy, and so on. As is usual, however, music lags a little behind.
http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/...0L._SS400_.jpg
Exquisite! Barbara Hendricks' voice was light and silvery... yet with a tinge of a deeper sensuality... perfectly suited to much of the French repertoire. For whatever reason EMI has been dumping these two-disc sets by Hendricks and subsequently Amazon Marketplace dealers have been offering them for ridiculous prices. I could not resist picking up the following:
http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/...500_AA300_.jpg
$7
http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/...bL._SS500_.jpg
$8
http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/...kL._SS400_.jpg
$6
http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/...XL._SS500_.jpg
$6.50
http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/...6L._SS400_.jpg
$5.50... And from what I heard from the samples available on Amazon these Christmas carols and beloved songs from childhood are marvelously performed.
A belated Christmas gift to myself. I've been very good.:brow::D
Hey, StLukes, you said this in another thread:
If you have the time, could you (or anyone else, agree ro disagree) elaborate? I'm not at all familiar with contemporary classical music (I still have much to learn about the masters), which is why I ask.Quote:
And...? The art galleries are filled with equally excretory works as are the concerts of contemporary classical music.
While I cannot claim to be an expert on contemporary classical music, most of my experience with it has been pieces like this: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HRuxHVWfQtAQuote:
Originally Posted by Mutatis-Mutandi
which I am not a fan of. My high school music teacher composed a (not sure what it was) based on the Apocalypse. It was actually pretty good, wish I could find it.
Well, if thats a reflection of most contemporary classical music, I don't need much explaining, because that sucked. :lol: I'm all for atonality, but that was just boring, and sounded like it should be background music for a crappy horror movie. Honestly, I didn't listen to the whole thing, just skipped around, so maybe I missed something, but I'm pretty sure I didn't.
Actually, I quite like Tristan Murail... whose music is a great deal "tonal"... albeit in a rather minimal way in that it is virtually structured upon a single tone... not unlike many medieval chants. No... what I think of as "excretory" examples of modern through contemporary "classical music" goes far further into the real of the idiotic or the unlistenable:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yztoaNakKok
I can almost see this one for some horror movie involving ghosts:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ysC_A...eature=related
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N9pOq8u6-bA
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hXqvB...eature=related
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zY7UK-6aaNA&feature=fvsr
A variation on 4:33 is Cage's As Slow as Possible:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/As_Slow_As_Possible
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iCh9ifSoiL8
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Yqdgw2o-BuY
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J0CaG...eature=related
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K46L1cwxxXc
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UDP8H5IK5nw
With Nam June Paik we enter the question as to whether we are experiencing avant-garde art... music... film... or WTF?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u9k1F...eature=related
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ND-ga_BrkCE
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VcHJySm7ZO0
And perhaps up your lane, Mutatis:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G1NDTipMsF0
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FgOg6...eature=related
Quite interesting. Some of that made me cringe, some made me laugh, and the Henry Cowell definitely piqued my beagle's interest. Can't say any of it will be going onto any of my playlists, though, especially those last two. I can sort of understand how one may think a heavy metal fan would like those last two, as many perceive metal to just be "noise," but it does contain melody and structure (usually complex), but that was just noise, pure and simple.
I think for a lot of that it could be argued as to whether or not it's even music, honestly. After all, where do we draw the line?
It is always advantageous to seek the advice of experienced musicians such as Sir Thomas Beecham when discussing music and especially in discussing modern music. Asked if he had ever conducted any Stockhausen, he said, "No, but I once trod in some."Quote:
Originally Posted by Mutatis-Mutandi
Yesterday morning I spent half-an-hour listening to a Bach partita played on the harpsichord and had to agree with Sir Thomas that it was like two skeletons copulating on a corrugated tin roof. It was a relief to find on Youtube this wonderful performance of possibly the greatest piano concerto ever written, and yes I do know the Mozart, Beethoven, Brahms equivalent works that I got to know long before. From 8.26, you can hear God walking across the keyboard.
http://youtu.be/FQK-M54HQX4
Emil... I agree with you... to a given extent. While I like the sound of of the harpsichord as it it is used in playing continuo... or establishing the rhythm in Baroque music, I have long preferred the piano as opposed to the harpsichord when listening to the solo keyboard works and keyboard concertos, sonatas, etc... of the same period. I think Beecham was on to something in that the harpsichord, as it has long been recorded, sounds overly loud... jangly... jarring... and lacking in subtlety. This may change as new performers and subsequent harpsichord builders and sound engineers have learned how to play the instrument, how to place the microphones, and how to construct (or reconstruct) the instruments properly.
The harpsichord, by its very mechanical nature, does not allow for subtle dynamic variations (or control of how loud or soft a note sounds or how long it resonates). Bach must have vastly preferred the organ where he most certainly did have control of these elements (and it might be noted that many of his major keyboard works never stipulated which instrument(s) were to be employed. Nevertheless, the harpsichord, like the organ, has the ability to play different "timbres" so that it need not always sound at the loudest and most metallic. This performance by Andreas Staier illustrates just how delicate the instrument can sound:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XQTqn...eature=related
By the way... I quite like Beecham's work... but he could actually be a brutal critic of many artists, composers, and works that are of real merit:
On J.S. Bach- "Too much counterpoint; what is worse, Protestant counterpoint."
On the music of Frederick Delius- "I found it as alluring as a wayward woman and determined to tame it."
On Beethoven's great late string quartets- "Beethoven’s last quartets were written by a deaf man and should only be listened to by a deaf man"
Yes but much of it was tongue in cheek, although he did have a reputation for consorting with wayward women such as Emerald Cunard. His gruff imperious manner was largely assumed in order to debunk pomposity and he was genuinely admired by the British public as, not only a great conductor, but a real character.Quote:
Originally Posted by stlukesguild
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This recording has been the recipient of some rather mixed reviews, with Abbado accused of being overly fussy and Renée Fleming's finale faulted with sounding overly mannered in an attempt to portray the character of an innocent child... although almost all reviews are unanimous in their praise for Fleming and Abbado's performance of the Alban Berg Sieben Frühe Lieder which were the reason behind my purchasing this disc. Admittedly, I am not a Mahlerian to the point of being able to compare this performance of his 4th to several others. I have recordings of the 4th by Bernstein (with Reri Grist) and Reiner (with the great Lisa della Casa)... both of which I am more than satisfied with.
Honestly, I cannot fault this performance. The Berlin Philharmonic is transcendent... able to cut through and hold together the passages of the greatest chaos while illuminating the exquisite third movement with a crystalline clarity. As a sworn admirer of Renée Fleming I must admit that my bias is such that it would surely take a stupendous failing on her part for me to turn against her. having said as much, I will also admit that singers can and are indeed miscast on occasion. Fleming's voice is full, rich, sensuous, and "womanly". She is not the first singer I'd think of for a role like Cio-Cio San, Susanna from Le Nozze di Figaro, or other more "girlish" roles. The fourth movement sets the text of Das himmlische Leben from Des Knaben Wunderhorn as a child's narrative voiced by a soprano... presenting a sunny, naive vision of Heaven yet a vision laden with its darker elements: the child makes it clear that the heavenly feast takes place at the expense of animals, including a sacrificed lamb. Fleming is not the first singer I would have thought of for this role. Della Casa may have been the best... capturing a child-like innocence and yet not abandoning the serious overtones and slipping into something comic that would have completely undermined Mahler's intentions. I don't get the notion that Fleming comes off as some pursed lipped brat, at one of the worst reviews suggested. I do agree that there is a sense that she is holding back or attempting to hide a voice too big for the role. But then I wonder whether the composer were not to blame in part... expecting a soprano to play the role of a choirboy. Nevertheless, this is all really splitting hairs. Fleming performs admirably and one cannot imagine a choirboy or a lesser "girlish" singer handling the more lyrical and rich passages anywhere near as well.
As for Alban Berg's Sieben Frühe Lieder. For whatever reason... in spite of my own admitted passion for song and assuredly for orchestral songs... I only recently became aware of these exquisite works. Listening to these works almost leads me to a greater level of dislike for Schoenberg. Like Adorno, I'm led to wonder just what Berg might have achieved as a tonal composer. Indeed, I begin to suspect that just as Mozart and Schubert's early demise were such a loss to classical music, so was Berg's relationship with Schoenberg. If only he had come under the spell of Strauss or Zemlinsky instead... These early songs already suggest the richness of Strauss' finer works honed with a more "lyrical"... almost "impressionist" sensibility. Anyone who has never given any of the composers of the Second Viennese School a chance should certainly listen to these magnificent songs by Berg... especially anyone fond of Strauss' songs and operas:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oTgy_oOvsPE
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tS8_Tlcemxo
Fleming's performance is absolutely delicious... perhaps less heroic but more "vulnerable" than Jessye Norman's equally stunning rendition.
A friend of mine recently introduced me to the composer Edwin York Bowen, who, I'd never heard of. I'm only beginning my exploration of his music, but I'm impressed - he was obviously a very fine composer who's obscurity is a result of the changing fashion of the time. He was composing wonderful Romantic stuff by the bucket-load at a time when it was seen as old hat.#
Have a listen to this rather fine Toccata. If you like that, then settle down and listen to the entire length of this rather super Viola Sonata.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PCXg8xo31h0
Currently listening to one of Haydn's string quartets (due to a seed planted by Loka in another thread.) I'm then going in the bath with a bottle of St Peter's Organic ale - nothing to do with music but I'm quite excited about it nonetheless.
Any suggestions on the best of Haydn/favourites?
Haydn's wonderful, and in my opinon he's at his best when composing masses - they are all wonderful, but the Nelson Mass and the Paukenmesse are up there with the best masses ever composed. There's also an oratorio called The Creation, which is an absolute masterpiece.
And, as you are discovering, the string quartets are fabulous - he doesn't set out to do anything big or clever with them, all he wants to do is create nice melody, and this he acchieves in buckets!