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I may be way off base, but I seem to recall that they found two skeletons of adolescent boys curled up under a stairwell in the Tower of London. The speculation of course was that they were what was left of the princes.Quote:
Originally Posted by Paulclem
I can't find a U tube clip from the programme anywhere, but if you can get it the whole thing is here.
http://www.channel4.com/programmes/4od
Or you can try a search, her name is Philippa Langley . The Times did a piece on her entitled, The Woman Who Is In Love With Richard III
There was a discovery of two adolescent's remains in the tower, I presume someone knows where the bones are now as it was a sensation at the time. Then there is Perkin Wellbeck, who claimed to be Prince Richard all growed up. I wonder if the whereabouts of his remains are known.
Has anyone else noticed that Liecester Council spent a million pounds on their Richard III visitor centre before they knew it was him ? Also Liecester Uni put alot of resources in. So I hope there wasn't too much pressure to come up with the right answer when interpreting DNA and carbon dating results. There was some doubt that the skeleton was even male. I hope they haven't dug up some old nun.
Having got rid of the TV, this at least gave me a chance to see the programme. I had forgotten just how crass TV adverts are but the sight of Bruce Willis with the usual car crashes and explosions in tow confirmed that I have done the right thing. Are you ready for Die Hard part 5, or is it 6 ? As for the programme, it was longer than needed but interesting nevertheless, although the script could have done with a few less 'Wow's' and it was hilarious when one of the Ricardians said that: 'as soon as the body was lifted from the grave, it began to sink in.' The tearful woman was silly but it was the guy with check shirt and scruffy hairdo who was more irritating, because there are few things less visually appealing than a leading commentator who looks like Worzel Gummidge. Having usurped the throne, it would be difficult not to agree that Dickie got what he deserved.Quote:
Originally Posted by prendrelemick
He was a strange choice, I think he is a comedian. I suppose the whole thing was a bit of a joke, with those Ricardians digging up a car park and Philippa getting a funny feeling right where there was an "R" painted on the tarmac, it was comedy gold - until they found the remains. Then I bet there was some hasty editorial reviews and they wished they'd got someone with more wieght.
I haven't seen the programme but saw a clip and he looked like one of the guys from Horrible Histories (the one who plays Caligula, and Death) so perhaps not such an odd choice after all. No weirder than Tony Robinson, anyway.Quote:
Originally Posted by prendrelemick
Of course, there was a time when first choice for such a programme would have been somebody like Sir Mortimer Wheeler but we have progressed since then: or so I'm often told.Quote:
Originally Posted by prendrelemick
http://imageshack.us/a/img26/552/stilldigging.jpg
Quote:
Originally Posted by TheFifthElement
I'm so glad you brought up Horrible Histories.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R6JczvS1PL4
And yes, that's where I've seen him before. Stupid deaths!
Amasing that makes me think of ''Horrid Henry''. There is obviously a direct reference to Henry the Eight here. It does amuse me to no ends.Quote:
Originally Posted by prendrelemick
Did someone mention Henry the Eighth?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iSXl_kNJuDg
Right I'll stop now .
Funny I just remembered. I use to think Henry the Eight had eight wives. I still sometimes do. It felt right because of his name. Go figure.:)Quote:
Originally Posted by prendrelemick
Isn't that Clark Gable only old?Quote:
Originally Posted by Emil Miller
Didn't Henry VIII challenge Louis XIV to a wrestling match at some point? Hey, I'm all for the heads of state (or realm) fighting out their differences amongst themselves instead of dragging the whole country into it, but I'm not quite sure it rose to the level of Henry V at Agincourt. Wonder why Shakespeare didn't cover that fight in his histories. Seems to me it would've made for great theater - two sweaty monarchs duking it out in a cage match - two kings enter, one king leaves.
Okay, I'm done.
Nah I would have thought Louis would have chickend out in view of Henry the Eight size and viguor. Louis a weak figure against a tycoon such as Henry. Fat chance. Doubt it would have taken place. Maybe Louis' excuses were he was too busy powdering his nose and face. They did like a bit of thick white make up powder as a shrine of their impending superiority. Go figure.Quote:
Originally Posted by Sancho
I do not think Henry would have enjoyed that on his expensive clothing.
Yes they did and (whisper it quietly) Louis won ( he was called Francis tho). That was in the field of the cloth of gold. Henry was not as young and fit as he thought he was.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_U4GwgTSipw
now I really will stop.
Nah don't stop (best programme on TV) :DQuote:
Originally Posted by prendrelemick
Yeah, there's some good info in those horrible histories.
Also, leave it to a Louis to fight dirty. Probably tripped him by kicking him in his gouty foot. That right there would bring down a big fella.
Given this method of solving international disputes, who would have been our (the U.S.'s) greatest president? I've actually spent some time mulling over this issue. The contenders:Quote:
Originally Posted by Sancho
Abraham Lincoln: the "railsplitter" used to wrestle all comers in his youth. He was in his 50s by the time he became president, and was 6'4", although thin. He might be the leading contender.
Teddy Roosevelt: He was the youngest President, 40 or 41 when he took office. He was also an outdoorsman and athlete who used to spar while in the White House.
William Taft: His 300 pound bulk would have made him formidable.
Gerald Ford -- An all-American football star, albeit 60 by the time he took office.
Andrew Jackson -- The tall, thin Indian fighter killed a man in a duel once, for calling his wife a bigamist (she was a bigamist, but unintentionally. Her divorce hadsn't been finalized when she married Andy, but in snail mail days, they thought it had).
I'd say those are the leading contenders, although the Bushes (the father was an all-American baseball player at Yale; the son was still in his 40s, and worked out a lot); U.S. Grant (for sheer pugnacity, although the years of hard living had taken a physical toll); Bill Clinton (has youth and bulk on his side, but is a little too friendly); and Kennedy (young and athletic, but had that bad back) might have contended.
Any votes? (I hope we don't elect Hillary if we are going to this new system.)
I'm gonna have to go with T Rex, in a fair fight anyway - Teddy was a sportsman. As I was reading up on Henry VIII and Louis XIV, T.R. crossed my mind more than once. In a no-holds-barred fight, Andy Jackson all the way. He'd sucker punch you just as soon as look at you. I mean, look at a Twenty Dollar Bill, he's got those crazy eyes, and his hair - it frightens me.
Gotta agree with you about Hillary. She could take 'em all and not even break a sweat. Case in point, last week's Senate hearings on Benghazi.
Cacian, you're thinking of Peter Noone...Quote:
Originally Posted by cacian
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sZG0NZviGvA
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Not sure if there's any relation to Richard III, but it was 426 years ago to the day (Feb 8) that a head fell from a red wig at Fotheringhay Castle.
That's a perfectly revelant link Gilliat, Richard the Third was born at Fotheringhay Castle!
And it was FRANCIS I, the wrestler,- although Louis has come to mean any old French King.
As for the wrestlers send who ever you like, Mrs Thatcher 'll take em. She kept a house brick in that handbag.
Have you by any chance come across the hypothetical Presidential knife-fight scenario? If not, then: http://faceintheblue.wordpress.com/2...d-win-and-why/Quote:
Originally Posted by Ecurb
Haha. Good link, Lok'.Quote:
Originally Posted by Lokasenna
Looks like the usual names keep popping up. Some how I just don't like Honest Abe, though, due to poor situational awareness. I keep seeing that picture of him standing on battlefield during the Civil War (Bull Run, 1st Manassas, can't remember), towering above everybody else, wearing a stovepipe hat. Finally one of the soldiers had to tell him he needed to duck. He was making too good a target for a Rebel sniper.
Sorry, Mick, I keep screwing up the Louis/Francis deal. My knowledge of French Kings is worse than my knowledge of English Kings, which also stinks. I do know that if you happened to be an English King, you were a lot better off if your name was Henry rather than Charles.
Just to keep this discussion on my level, whooee that Francis I had a beak on him, didn't he?
And oh yeah, Maggie would be tough, but I like my odds in a smack down between her and Hillary. You see, Margret was a conservative and hence would probably fight conventionally. With Hillary, no telling what she'd do. At any rate, it'd be a good fight. I'd pay money to see it. A nonstarter would be a matchup between Margret Thatcher and Richard Nixon - those two would probably just fall into a warm embrace.
I reckon George W Bush would be a contender. ( Jeb 'ud fix it for him.)
Good point. Also Dubya's got agility and good reflexes. Here he is dodging a couple of shoes in Baghdad a few years ago:
http://youtu.be/1rwxIjQZF98
I bet Richard III could take them all in a knife fight. Trained in knife and sword combat.
Thanks for the link. I'd never seen it before. A weaponless fight would favor the moderns more than a knife fight, I think. Clinton, the Bushes, and Obama were probably in better physical shape during their Presidencies than many 19th century Presidents -- just because we are more aware of the health values of working out. I'll grant those old army guys (like Grant or Hayes) were probably tougher mentally. But mental toughness only gets you so far. Size, strength and athletic ability are more important. (Obviously, Taft might not be a contender in a knife fight, but his bulk would make him tough hand to hand.) "W.", if memory serves, used to brag about benching 200 pounds when he was first President. He could King Kong James Madison (who was 5'3" tall) two handed over his head and pitch him out of the ring (if he didn't go awol from the match).
Many of those old English Kings would have been tough with knives. Richard I was a bad ***, too. I believe Henry VIII was a jousting champion in his youth. Obviously, any of the physical combat scenarios would favor those under 40 -- no U.S. Presidents were that young.Quote:
Originally Posted by Paulclem
Which leads us to the question of which English monarch would win in an all-out knife-fight? I suspect my crowd (i.e. the medieval lot) would have a significant advantage. That said, I bet the women would team up - Victoria, Matilda, Mary and the two Elizabeths would be quite the force to reckon with.Quote:
Originally Posted by Paulclem
The obvious choice is King Arthur, who, according to (I think) Mallory, was not Lancelot's equal in the lists, but was his superior on the battlefield. Alfred the Great might garner some support at the tote windows, too (he'd use some tricky tactics).
Of the more historical Kings, Edward IV was 6'5". Edward Longshanks and Richard Coeur d'Leon were also big men, and (if the histories of the times are to be believed) mighty warriors. I'd pick Henry V as the corner man, to make speeches between rounds ("Once more into the breech...."). Richard III had the skill, but not the physical size or strength.
Oliver Cromwell.
Wait, was he a king? Ah well, he was pretty good with a hatchet anyway.
He's the people's choice.Quote:
Originally Posted by Sancho
What a fantastic turn this thread has made.
I'll bet my castle and all my chattels on Richard the First. He had the appetite for it.
The Nobs of those times used to have a thing called a tourney, where our imagined scenario was actually played out. There was a event called the Melee where the last man standing was declared the winner. Geoffrey, Richard's brother, was killed while competing , so they weren't messing about.
I'm afraid when I think of Bush I think of that Monty Python scene in the Holy Grail movie:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=92gP2J0CUjc
:D
I heard Henry VIII was the best swordsman in England, so I was surprised to hear the French King beat him at wrestling so easily. William the Conqueror was definitely a bruiser. Alfred the Great was reported to have charged uphill at the pagans like a wild boar.
I think Ethelred the Unready was a bit rubbish, but you never know, he might have been handy with his fists.
Agility and reflexes are nice and all, but Dubya is the classic "popular" rich boy who could always get others to do his bidding. I don't think anyone would consider him a genuine tough guy like Jackson and Roosevelt.Quote:
Originally Posted by Sancho
Quote:
Originally Posted by kev67
Yer, that William was a right bastard ! (medieval joke)
Oh yeah, Aethelred was a bit of a wimp alright http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=2iwDMLZlkiM heheheheQuote:
Originally Posted by kev67
Presidential cage fighting and medieval kingly smackdown. Does it get any better?
If we could open it up to the Spaniards, I’m going to put my money on Hernán Cortés. He was smart, cool headed, and totally ruthless. He sailed out of Cuba a mere 12 hours before the viceroy was to arrest him (meaning he couldn’t go back). Sailed to and discovered Mexico, claimed it for the King of Spain (brilliantly cutting out the aforementioned viceroy back in Havana). Traveled across land and made contact with the Aztec Empire. Became a guest of Montezuma in their Capitol city of Tenochtitlan (psst! He was casing the joint). Left and then returned with a handful Spaniards and bunch of natives who were pissed at the Aztecs – and destroyed the Aztec Empire, renaming Tenochtitlan Mexico City, and showing the world what a conquistador with an attitude was capable of.
It may be an oversight not to consider the Danish Kings of England. I reckon One-in-the-eye Harold would be pretty handy. However, for me It's the Plantagenets all the way.
If we're going non royal Spanish how about El Cid.
(Whispers to Fifth) I'll try and work in a mention of Charles (King of Bling) the II, then we can post the clip.
I watched the The King in the Car Park last night. I agree that woman was a bit daft, but you have to credit her for pushing the project through and raising the money for the dig. I found the bone expert woman a little annoying too. Simon Farnaby was a bit more sympathetic than when he is playing Death in Horrible Histories. His tag line "Stupid deaths, stupid deaths, they're funny coz they're. Stupid deaths, stupid deaths, let's hope next time it's not you." Then he pokes fun at how people managed to get themselves killed before he lets them pass onto the afterlife. Did anyone else remark how similar the facial reconstruction was to Laurence Olivier's portrayal of him?