Where does the authority lie?

I'm sorry that you seem to miss my point, but like I said before, if you check your Bible that might help.

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Whether you think so or not, by saying that my form of worship is wrong, you're judging me, and you have no right.

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I'm sorry also that you feel this way. I did no judging, but if you have a problem with the scriptures that I cited, there's nothing I can do about that.

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I take offense to you saying that your way of worship is better than mine in the eyes of God. Do you believe that God thinks better of you because you worship in a traditional style? That's absolute bologna.

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If I worshiped in a "traditional style", I would more or less have a ritual service. I worship as close to the first centry church as possible as was described in the Bible. I cannot say that God thinks better of me because of the way that I worship. I do not presume to know the mind of God. All that I can say is what is given to us in God's word. If I agree to the authorization of anything else, then yes, I would presume to know the mind of God.

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It's people like you that give Christians a reputation of being intolerant, high - and -mighty people.

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Well, then I suppose Paul was high and mighty. Can you show to me where in the Bible Paul and the apostles taught about being tolerant of different beliefs?

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Also, one other point, maybe contemporary services are designed to bring people who wouldn't enjoy a traditional service into church. For instance, I play bass guitar in my church's praise band. It is certainly aimed at a younger generation, and those people who want something less "boring." I know my goal by playing in this band is to bring some people to Christ who wouldn't otherwise become Christians. I find it unfortunate that they don't appreciate a traditional service as well, but that's not what is important. It's knowing that I helped save someone's life that is important. If you think worshipping in a very strict, traditional form is more important than trying to bring non-christians to Christ, then that's your choice, and I respect that. But don't tell me I'm wrong in what I'm doing. I love praising God, but I also feel it is important to help save other people.

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Though you don't think that my scripture references have any relevence, I'll cite it anyway because it does.

Hebrews 13:8-9
Jesus Christ is the same yesterday, today, and forever. 9Do not be carried about with various and strange doctrines...

We cannot bring God down to man's level. The fact that you mentioned "boring" in reference to worship, it shows that you see worship as entertainment. Remember, God is the audience, not people who may or may not find your bass playing appealing. Exactly how do you feel that you've brought someone to Christ by entertaining them?
I'm sure you want to bring people to Christ, but you've got to look at how the apostles brought men to Christ; by teaching, not entertaining.

I know that was just your rant, but I couldn't let that go. Thanks for taking the time to hear my reply.

I may have been a little worked up last night. I really didn't take offense to what you said, I was just ranting. Anyway, I do not find worship boring. It is more than just a form of entertainment for me. What I meant was that for those who do find that type of worship boring, maybe they need something more. It's not necesarily that they want entertainment, but sometimes, for a person to be truly passionate about worship, they need more than hymns. If they are sincere in their worship, then what does it matter if it's not the way you think we should worship? I realize that you're not saying your form of worship is better than mine in the eyes of God, but the way you put it, you made it sound like your way was the right way. All your Bible verses may tell you that that is how we should worship, but they don't convey the same message to me. It is all a matter of interpretation, I suppose.

Also, I am not playing my bass guitar to entertain. If people wanted entertainment, they would go to a rock concert, not a church service, I don't care who they are. I guarentee you there is not many people in the world who would go to church to be entertained. It's a way of telling these people about Christ, and letting them praise and worship him in a way that they find most effective. If they aren't loving worhshipping God, then nothing is getting accomplished. I understand what you're saying, but, unfortunately, I'm not an apostle, and what worked 2000 years ago just isn't going to work today. Worship is a way of coming to the Lord, and it doesn't matter how it's done, as long as it is heartfelt and sincere. Show me a verse that say specifically, not in an indirect manner open to interpretation, that there is only one way we can worship. Unless you can do that, I'm going to have to say that you're wrong.

These were all the verses that I found on unity.

Matthew 23:8
"But you are not to be called 'Rabbi,' for you have only one Master and you are all brothers.

Acts 4:32
All the believers were one in heart and mind. No one claimed that any of his possessions was his own, but they shared everything they had.

Romans 14:19
Let us therefore make every effort to do what leads to peace and to mutual edification.

Romans 15:4-5
4For everything that was written in the past was written to teach us, so that through endurance and the encouragement of the Scriptures we might have hope.
5May the God who gives endurance and encouragement give you a spirit of unity among yourselves as you follow Christ Jesus, 6so that with one heart and mouth you may glorify the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ.

1Corinthians 1:10
I appeal to you, brothers, in the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, that all of you agree with one another so that there may be no divisions among you and that you may be perfectly united in mind and thought.

2 Corinthians 13:11
Finally, brothers, good-by. Aim for perfection, listen to my appeal, be of one mind, live in peace. And the God of love and peace will be with you.

Ephesians 4:3-6
Make every effort to keep the unity of the Spirit through the bond of peace. 4There is one body and one Spirit--just as you were called to one hope when you were called-- 5one Lord, one faith, one baptism; 6one God and Father of all, who is over all and through all and in all.

Philipians 1:27
Whatever happens, conduct yourselves in a manner worthy of the gospel of Christ. Then, whether I come and see you or only hear about you in my absence, I will know that you stand firm in one spirit, contending as one man for the faith of the gospel

Philipians 2:2
If you have any encouragement from being united with Christ, if any comfort from his love, if any fellowship with the Spirit, if any tenderness and compassion, 2then make my joy complete by being like-minded, having the same love, being one in spirit and purpose.

Philipians 3:16-17
Only let us live up to what we have already attained.
17Join with others in following my example, brothers, and take note of those who live according to the pattern we gave you.

1 Peter 3:8
Finally, all of you, live in harmony with one another; be sympathetic, love as brothers, be compassionate and humble.

Especially note 1 Corinthians 1:10. There should be no divisions if we all follow what the Bible teaches instead of adding what we "feel" is right.

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maybe they need something more.

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How can we need anything more than Christ?!

Hebrews 12:2
Let us fix our eyes on Jesus, the author and perfecter of our faith, who for the joy set before him endured the cross, scorning its shame, and sat down at the right hand of the throne of God.

Also look at Matthew 10:35-38
For I have come to turn
" 'a man against his father,
a daughter against her mother,
a daughter-in-law against her mother-in-law--
36a man's enemies will be the members of his own household.'[5]
37"Anyone who loves his father or mother more than me is not worthy of me; anyone who loves his son or daughter more than me is not worthy of me; 38and anyone who does not take his cross and follow me is not worthy of me.

If we are expected to even give up family if they oppose you for Christ's sake, then how much more do we need than Christ himself?

I understand that there is nothing more we need than Christ, the point I'm trying to make (but which obviously isn't getting thru) is that people don't realize that all they need is Christ. If there were a way to get people interested in Christ w/o having to cater to them, that'd be great, but it is ur duty as Christians to bring non Christians to Christ, and if that is an effective way of doing so, than how can it be wrong?

Well, really just a simple Bible study will help. Honestly, the studies that I have been doing on this forum have really helped me out a lot more than music could! My knowledge has grown and my understanding is easier. I am closer to God than before and I've been thanking him for allowing me to join this site! I find that I'm looking for answers to questions that I already knew the answer to. But because I'm talking to people about it I can't just paraphrase the answer in my mind, I have to look it up again and that drives it more to home. Plus, I have the reassurance that everyone can see our conversations so that I can plant the seed of Bible study and question asking in others.

Matthew 28:18-20
Then Jesus came to them and said, "All authority in heaven and on earth has been given to me. 19Therefore go and make disciples of all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit, 20and teaching them to obey everything I have commanded you. And surely I am with you always, to the very end of the age."

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If there were a way to get people interested in Christ w/o having to cater to them, that'd be great, but it is ur duty as Christians to bring non Christians to Christ

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We can't force people to be christians. I'm not saying that that's what you're trying to do, but If we've shown them truth and they refuse to accept it then there's nothing more you can do. You've done what God commanded. To keep on doing it and never lose heart dispite the failures that is also what God commanded.

2 Timothy 4:7-8
7I have fought the good fight, I have finished the race, I have kept the faith. 8Now there is in store for me the crown of righteousness, which the Lord, the righteous Judge, will award to me on that day--and not only to me, but also to all who have longed for his appearing.

You never know when you've simply planted a seed that just takes a little while to germinate. ;)

you also never know when you are annoying the little seeds to death.

Ok, little seed, you obviously have no interest in sincerely studing the Bible because you've said nothing constructive at all. So, what are you doing here except annoying those of us who would like to have a discussion?

Ok...let me get this straight...you think that we have to worship in church the traditional style of worship. I see your point of veiw and this is actually a continual debate amougst Christian churches. My church (i play in the church band and my dad is are worship leader) we play a mixture of contemp. music and traditional hymns. We believe that some of the contemp stuff has a powerful message and a strong worship power to them. Check out Michael W. Smith and his worship album. Also see Avalon and their song The Glory. What about 4 Him and Mercy Me. They both have worship albums out. They all have powerful messages and meanings. Joel Engel is the one of the best praise and worship artists (in my opinion) out there. No where in the Bible does it say that a person must sing the old traditional hymns inorder to worship God. In that matter does a person have to SING why not PLAY. I worship when i play my flute. We play beautiful songs and i get caught up with the Spirit of God moving through me and my playing. But does that condemn me?! I don't really think so.
Think about this...you cited earlier that the pharacies were condemned b/c they didn't worship the way Jesus thought was acceptable. He did that b/c they had forgoten the reason why they worshiped not how. They "worshiped" b/c they wanted the people of Isael to see that they were great in God's eyes, but that was not the case. They worshiped becuase they thought they were gaining something for themselves and Jesus was rebuking them because of their intentions behind the worship. Thier heart was not in it.
It really doen't matter how you worship but the reason behind your worship. If you are glorifying God through the songs that Reliant K sings or though Amazing Grace, I don't think God really cares...as long as you are worshiping, loving and glorifying him. Haven't you heard that 'in all things i do i do for the glory of God?' If you live your life with the standard that you are living for the glory of God then you are worshiping Him through your actions/life. You are not at a church singing As the Deer, but you are living your life for God. Worship comes in several different forms...not just one single right form. So did the slaves during the Civil War...when they sang songs to God while they worked in the fields...were they wrong? They couldn't go to church but they worshiped and praised God anyway. The man who wrote Amazing Grace...he was on a ship in a storm before he turned to Christ. He wrote the song/poem when he was a missionary in Africa. He WORSHIPED while he wrote it. Now that is a hymnal...the song wasn't around when Jesus was on the earth nor was it around when the Bible was written! Yet it is still considered to be one of the greatest hymnals of our time. Michael W. Smith and his wife wrote songs that are now considered to be great hymnals...yet he is a contemp. Christian recording artist.

I see what you are getting at and i see where you are coming from. I do believe that the churches are trying to appease the thier public by creating different services for the different styles of worship. I think that may not be the wisest desision in the world but that is my opinion. We have a drum set and we sing old hymn music. Is that wrong? At my church we combine the two into one and i like that much better. Sometimes i wonder if the mega churches are just trying to get more members, appease them and look good, than to actually bring people to Christ. Like i said earlier...this is an issue that is bouncing around the Christian community and thier churches...i think it is more what your style of worship is and how you want to present it to God. IF YOUR HEART IS IN YOUR WORSHIP THAN GOD IS GLORIFIED. ISN'T THAT WHAT REALLY MATTERS?!

I'm not going to beat a dead horse about the instruments in worship. I think I've pretty well covered that. Somewhere else here, I talked about Christian bands. There really is nothing wrong with them so long as it's kept out of a worship service. Same with anyone playing and instrument at all. I play a harp and can play all sorts of hymns, but I usually play at weddings, funerals, restaurants, dinner parties, nursing homes, etc... I never play in a worship service of any kind.

The Bible said to sing in "songs, hymns, and spiritual songs" If someone wrote a song that was biblically accurate 2 months ago, there is no reason not to sing it in a worship service. It's a spiritual song.

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Ok...let me get this straight...you think that we have to worship in church the traditional style of worship.

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It isn't what I think that's important, it what's pleasing to God. I'm not sure what everyone keeps describing as 'tradition worship' is. I simply go by what's been given to me in the Bible.

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Think about this...you cited earlier that the pharacies were condemned b/c they didn't worship the way Jesus thought was acceptable. He did that b/c they had forgoten the reason why they worshiped not how. They "worshiped" b/c they wanted the people of Isael to see that they were great in God's eyes, but that was not the case. They worshiped becuase they thought they were gaining something for themselves and Jesus was rebuking them because of their intentions behind the worship. Thier heart was not in it.

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I had a hard time figuring out the point of this statement, but I think that I can help by quoting this verse. If I missed your point please tell me. ;)

Matthew 23:5-12
"Everything they do is done for men to see: They make their phylacteries wide and the tassels on their garments long; 6they love the place of honor at banquets and the most important seats in the synagogues; 7they love to be greeted in the marketplaces and to have men call them 'Rabbi.'
8"But you are not to be called 'Rabbi,' for you have only one Master and you are all brothers. 9And do not call anyone on earth 'father,' for you have one Father, and he is in heaven. 10Nor are you to be called 'teacher,' for you have one Teacher, the Christ. 11The greatest among you will be your servant. 12For whoever exalts himself will be humbled, and whoever humbles himself will be exalted.

No Shea, you are wrong. I have every interest in studying the Bible.

"Ok, little seed, you obviously have no interest in sincerely studing the Bible because you've said nothing constructive at all. So, what are you doing here except annoying those of us who would like to have a discussion?"

This topic is stupid and irrelevant. I really doubt that God cares if you use contemporary music in a worship service. You are taking a bunch of verses that don't support your point, quoting them, and then arguing until someone agrees with you. As long as they are worshiping God, and not trying to appear holy, they have accomplished the purpose of the worship service.

And Shea... honestly... next time you quote something.... please please please let it support your POINT!

In fact, you have spoken so much, I have lost track of your point. Do you have one? If so, could you spell it out for me?

Ok..... Thank you for asking that question. I have no idea how to word things any different to help you understand, so I'll try to single it out (though I've repeated it many times). My point is to study the Bible and apply the truths to your life!!! Everything a christian needs for salvation is in there!! Spirtual growth, delight in God, rules for worship, rules for life, how to evangelize, the structure of the Lord's church,... EVERYTHING!!! There is no need to improve on God's Word! But I see people doing it all the time by adding traditions from man. How can someone say they follow God but then does something contrary to what He told us to do according to the words of Christ and the apostles!

By the way, I'm sorry about the "little seed" thing. I didn't mean to get snippy, :oops: I was just frustrated because I didn't know how to make things any clearer. Does this general point help or do you want me to go verse by verse to show how their supported by what I've said?

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Originally Posted by Shea

On my way home this evening, I passed a church building that had a sign posted out front stating their times of service. Not only that, it also stated the type of service that it would be; informal, contemporary, or traditional. My question is, where do they get the athuority to change the worship service other than to do what was commanded of us in the Bible? God set certain rules for us to follow, and if we don't follow them, aren't we guilty of itching ears? (See Tim 4: 2-4) Many people pose the argument that "Well, society changes and we just want to bring the people in the door." So people presume that they can bring God down to the level of society instead of bringing people to God with truth as He commanded.

God doesn't change, so why should our worship to Him have to?

[quote ommited due to length]

He didn't say that if you change and have 3 different types of services that you are OK. So who has the authority to say that these forms of worship are acceptable?

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Shea- don't be sorry for being snippy... I started it. :rolleyes: anyways... I never would have guessed that is what your point is... based on your first post... plus... I don't remember you talking about that before now, but thx for clearing things up for the curious.

No problem! I'm glad that helped! :D I thought that was an understood thing. Oh, well! I'm still getting used to Bible study through this medium! :rolleyes:

well i'm glad you guys are not tearing eachother's necks out. Sorry...i've been on a band trip for the weekend so i've been wondering what has been going on here. 8) Anyway, you said that everything is in the Bible. I agree, everything Christians need is in the Bible. And yes i do agree that humans/man are adding things to make "tradition" (IE: the Catholic Church...errr...let me rephrase that...some if not most Catholic Churches) Don't kill me! Hear me out. Man's nature is to be repetitive and very mithotical (that is probally how you don't spell it oh well, i'm a horrorable speller anyway :-? ) Ok...we like structure. Think back to when you were in high school... :o You found out where your classes were and then you would find the best path way down the halls to get to them. You would usually do this in the first week or so, of school. Then, from then on you would take that same route for the rest of the year. Don't you do something simular when driving to a friend's house or to work? (pretend there are no traffic back-ups). You are being mithotical. Man/Humans are like that. Tradition is using the same concept. I don't know if that made any sense to you...if it didn't i'm sorry i have no brain functions b/c of my band trip...anyway...i'll stop rambling...
You have to remember that we are not perfect. We can't follow the Bible word for word...we can try and some ppl are better at it than others are, but we are all falty...that's why we have Jesus.
About the music thingy in church...remember that David sang hymns with his stringed instrument. They didn't have churches like we do today but God looked down upon David with love and honor. He loved the songs and hymns that David wrote and sang with his instrument. Also, tamberings, flutes and trumpets are mentioned as instruments of praise. (I'm sorry, i don't remember exactly where but i do remember it!) If the Bible sais that those insturments can be used as a praise and worship tool...then why not use it? So are you saying that we can play our instruments in our homes (or elsewhere) while we worship and not in church? The church is the people not the building...and i know God emphasizes that in the Bible. A building is nothing. I went to a local highschool for awhile inorder to attend church. A highschool does not have pews nor hymnals but the people know the songs and the people are the ones worshiping. That is what a church is...so we can't worship with instruments? We are the church...?

Now please remember...i'm just telling you my POV and my side of the 'argument'. Don't get mad...its what i think...and you are entitled to your own opinion...i respect that.

And I do respect your opinion Chardata, (the word your looking for is methodical). It is in man's nature to be methodical and have a structure. You'll find that the structure is in the Bible. I listed those verses when I was talking to 'Rosebud' (I hope she's Ok, she seem to have vanished. :( )

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Which brings me to why I entered this forum today. You asked me to post an order of worship as described in the Bible. The first century church had 5 main areas of worship:

1. The Lord's Supper.
Acts 20:7-On the first day of the week we came together to break bread. Paul spoke to the people and, because he intended to leave the next day, kept on talking until midnight.

2. Praying.
Acts 2:42-They devoted themselves to the apostles' teaching and to the fellowship, to the breaking of bread and to prayer.

3. Singing. (as previously quoted)
Colossians 3:16-Let the word of Christ dwell in you richly as you teach and admonish one another with all wisdom, and as you sing psalms, hymns and spiritual songs with gratitude in your hearts to God.

Ephesians 5:19-Speak to one another with psalms, hymns and spiritual songs. Sing and make music in your heart to the Lord,

4. Preaching.
Acts 20:7-On the first day of the week we came together to break bread. Paul spoke to the people and, because he intended to leave the next day, kept on talking until midnight.

1 Timothy 4:11-Command and teach these things.

2 Timothy 4:2-Preach the Word; be prepared in season and out of season; correct, rebuke and encourage--with great patience and careful instruction.

5. Giving.
1 Corinthinans 16:2-On the first day of every week, each one of you should set aside a sum of money in keeping with his income, saving it up, so that when I come no collections will have to be made.

We are also commanded to attend.
Hebrews 10:25-Let us not give up meeting together, as some are in the habit of doing, but let us encourage one another--and all the more as you see the Day approaching.

The order in which these things take place makes no difference as long as they are all there for Sunday- the first day of the week. At the particular congregation where I worship, we first have a sort of call to attention and then a welcome to all the visitors along with the announcments. Then worship begins with usually 2 songs and then an opening prayer. We then sing another song in which the word help prepare our minds for the Lord's supper. 6 men then will go up to the table that we have prepared, and one will say some words to also help get our minds ready to take the unleavened bread.

1 Corinthians 11:27-29
Therefore, whoever eats the bread or drinks the cup of the Lord in an unworthy manner will be guilty of sinning against the body and blood of the Lord. 28A man ought to examine himself before he eats of the bread and drinks of the cup. 29For anyone who eats and drinks without recognizing the body of the Lord eats and drinks judgment on himself.

We have another prayer and then the bread is distributed among the christians. The men then go back up and have another prayer for the "fruit of the vine"- we use grape juice. After that is distributed, we then take up a collection. (no titheing)

2 Corinthians 9:7
Each man should give what he has decided in his heart to give, not reluctantly or under compulsion, for God loves a cheerful giver.

Then a member from the congregation will then go up to read a passage of scripture that partains to the sermon for that day. After that one of the men will preach and then there is an invitation for baptism along with another song.

Acts 2: 37-41
When the people heard this, they were cut to the heart and said to Peter and the other apostles, "Brothers, what shall we do?"
38Peter replied, "Repent and be baptized, every one of you, in the name of Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of your sins. And you will receive the gift of the Holy Spirit. 39The promise is for you and your children and for all who are far off--for all whom the Lord our God will call."
40With many other words he warned them; and he pleaded with them, "Save yourselves from this corrupt generation." 41Those who accepted his message were baptized, and about three thousand were added to their number that day.

Then we have a closing prayer.

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We aren't perfect, but we are commanded to be diligent and hold fast to God's word. We do have Jesus to save us from condemnation because we are fawlty, but its a two way street.

John 12:47-50
"As for the person who hears my words but does not keep them, I do not judge him. For I did not come to judge the world, but to save it. 48There is a judge for the one who rejects me and does not accept my words; that very word which I spoke will condemn him at the last day. 49For I did not speak of my own accord, but the Father who sent me commanded me what to say and how to say it. 50I know that his command leads to eternal life. So whatever I say is just what the Father has told me to say."

Note verse 50. If we do something contrary to what God commands in the Bible, then how do we know that we are saved? I don't want to "scare" anyone to Christ, I just want truth to be known.

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About the music thingy in church...remember that David sang hymns with his stringed instrument. They didn't have churches like we do today but God looked down upon David with love and honor. He loved the songs and hymns that David wrote and sang with his instrument. Also, tamberings, flutes and trumpets are mentioned as instruments of praise. (I'm sorry, i don't remember exactly where but i do remember it!) If the Bible sais that those insturments can be used as a praise and worship tool...then why not use it? So are you saying that we can play our instruments in our homes (or elsewhere) while we worship and not in church? The church is the people not the building...and i know God emphasizes that in the Bible. A building is nothing. I went to a local highschool for awhile inorder to attend church. A highschool does not have pews nor hymnals but the people know the songs and the people are the ones worshiping. That is what a church is...so we can't worship with instruments? We are the church...?

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This is something else that I talked about early on too. All the commands that were given in the OT no longer apply.

Romans 7:1-6
Do you not know, brothers--for I am speaking to men who know the law--that the law has authority over a man only as long as he lives? 2For example, by law a married woman is bound to her husband as long as he is alive, but if her husband dies, she is released from the law of marriage. 3So then, if she marries another man while her husband is still alive, she is called an adulteress. But if her husband dies, she is released from that law and is not an adulteress, even though she marries another man.
4So, my brothers, you also died to the law through the body of Christ, that you might belong to another, to him who was raised from the dead, in order that we might bear fruit to God. 5For when we were controlled by the sinful nature, the sinful passions aroused by the law were at work in our bodies, so that we bore fruit for death. 6But now, by dying to what once bound us, we have been released from the law so that we serve in the new way of the Spirit, and not in the old way of the written code.

Actually, if you could please read more of the previous posts on this topic, that would really cut this one shorter. ;) But I think that your mistaking the assembly with the church as people. As christians, we're commanded to have christian lives.

Colossians 3:17
And whatever you do, whether in word or deed, do it all in the name of the Lord Jesus, giving thanks to God the Father through him.

Our very lives are a sort of "worship" to God, but we do have commands from Him considering the assembly (as afore mentioned) You're absolutely right though about the church not being the building, but the assembly of the church is actually what is talked about when we talk about a worship service.

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Now please remember...i'm just telling you my POV and my side of the 'argument'. Don't get mad...its what i think...and you are entitled to your own opinion...i respect that.

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Of course I'm not going to get mad. I'm still getting used to talking to people this way. I'd rather not call this an 'arguement', but more of a discussion designed for learning. Because I'm learning from everyone here, just as I hope your learning from me! :)

I see where you are comming from. I think you missunderstood me. The congrigation of ppl IN a church BUILDING is important inorder to learn...life long lessons, Christian lessons, and to learn from God. The ppl who attend the congrigation make up the church. I still stand by my statement: a building is a building and can go nor do anything more. Do you remember that God said he would gather His church up into the clouds. I don't think he's going to uproot the foundation to all the churches in the world. 8) Anyway, i'll talk more...but this is the jist of everything. I'll say more later...maybe after school one day... :-?

Hmm..., I think you misunderstood me too. We can have the assembly where ever we want, the building makes no difference. I once went to a worship service in a Grange Hall. My point is the Bible is specific about what is to take place in a worship service.

Ok...i see know. But like i said in my LB post...some things are open to interpritation...This is your view on this topic and i have my own. We are both obviously hard-headed and stuborn in our views so i don't think we will reach an agreement...so i'm making a neutral agreement...we both have our diff. views and that is that...respect them and move on.

I'm sorry that you said that. :( My goal has been to try and show how the Bible is very specific about many things and point of view or interpretation make no difference. Oh well, I guess I'll get better at it as I gain more experience.

well...i just got tired. Anyway, i don't agree with you and we aren't getting anywhere!!! So...i hope you see where i'm comming from. Don't forget i have school work to worry about on top of everything else. So...i come here for a break off of school work...i like debating but not after working for class. :P Get what i'm saying?! I hope so. I still respect you're POV! 8)

I do see where your coming from. Please don't compromise your schoolwork just because you feel the need to debate me, I'll still probably say things that you don't agree with though. But don't be afraid to back me up if you do agree! ;)

Don't worry...I will! 8)

I have this urge to make a rude, insulting comment at everyone reading this post...

ummmm...ok...please refraign from any violent acts...or...any rude comments...they will just get you into trouble. 8)

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Admin

I don't think you'll find a strict description of what worship must be in the bible. The traditional worship style was created by the Catholic Church.

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Could you please elaborate on that Admin?

I wanted to post something, but I changed my mind.