Classics that aren't Boring

try germinal by zola
interesting political piece that ends up being a page turner at the end. also has a number of very fertile discussion points on life.
very timely with the chilaen mine story

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Originally Posted by ladderandbucket

Crime and Punishment is a book I always recommend to non-classics readers. Most people seem to like it. It is a pretty gripping story.

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Crime and Punishment is also very readable and a good introductory to Russian literature for anyone who hasn't had time to digest all of the familiar form and patronymic names used by Russian authors.

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Originally Posted by Mutatis-Mutandi

As an English major and a sort-of English teacher (student teacher, at the moment), I always feel the need to read the "classics," (I do not intend this to be a place to debate the merits of reading canonical texts, but if you do, so be it), but am usually bogged down in how boring they are.

Now, I realize this is a subjective view, but it is how I feel. I just got done reading Joseph Conrad's The Secret Agent, and it was a tough go. I loved the story and the characters, but it just got so bogged down in description that it felt too plodding at points. I love "Heart of Darkness," too, but at least it is shorter--the perfect length for the ultra-descriptive style of writing, in my opinion.

Now, I'm not looking for tons of action and explosions, just a story that moves at a reasonable pace. I'm tired of reading (or attempting to read) books that take fifteen pages to describe one simple aspect of the story. It just isn't my thing. I read to escape, and I don't want to escape into a mundane world.

So, if you have any suggestions on some classics I could read every now and then, just to keep my intellectual cred in order, so to speak, I'd be much appreciative.

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Try The Great Impersonation by E. Phillips Openheim

Hmm, coming back to this, Stephen Crane's The Red Badge of Courage might work for high school sophomores as well. It's fairly short, and deals with a character somewhat close to them in age.

I'm not sure what Americans teach in high school, in Canada we had practically no American literature in high school except for Arthur Miller.

Why not try "Jekyll and Hyde", I have just acquired a copy of "Frankstein"
by Mary Shelley, also I have "The Scarlet Letter" on my TBR stack.

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Originally Posted by OrphanPip

Hmm, coming back to this, Stephen Crane's The Red Badge of Courage might work for high school sophomores as well. It's fairly short, and deals with a character somewhat close to them in age.

I'm not sure what Americans teach in high school, in Canada we had practically no American literature in high school except for Arthur Miller.

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Pip!! Please!! No!!! I was forced to read The Red Badge of Courage in three different classes from Middle-School through high-school... each time followed by in-depth discussions on war led by young teachers who had all probably attended college during the Vietnam War years. I quite like Crane... but doubt I'll ever be able to bring myself to read that book again. Why not Ambrose Bierce' An Occurrence at Owl Creek Bridge or Chickamauga and some of Melville's Civil War poems and Whitman's When Lilacs Last in the Dooryard Bloom'd?

Perhaps these wouldn't be appropriate for your students, but for yourself...

Nathanael West- Miss Lonelyhearts
Gore Vidal- Myra Breckenridge
Flannery O'Connor- A Good Man Is Hard to Find, The Artificial Nigger, Good Country People, A Late Encounter with the Enemy, Revelation, etc...
Theophile Gautier- Mademoiselle de Maupin, The Mummy's Foot, Clarimonde: Le Morte Amoureuse, One of Cleopatra's Nights, Omphale: A Rococo Story
Italo Calvino- The Baron in the Trees
Tolstoy- The Kreutzer Sonata
Thomas Mann- Death in Venice
Gunter Grass- The Tin Drum

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Originally Posted by OrphanPip

I'm not sure what Americans teach in high school, in Canada we had practically no American literature in high school except for Arthur Miller.

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I know that Canadians have an ingrown resentment of the United States, but did you at least have any British literature thrust upon you as a child? The Canadian corpus isn't substantial enough to complete anyone's education.

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Originally Posted by mortalterror

I know that Canadians have an ingrown resentment of the United States, but did you at least have any British literature thrust upon you as a child? The Canadian corpus isn't substantial enough to complete anyone's education.

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Of course we had British literature, up until the mid 70s that was essentially what was exclusively taught in schools. Although, I would disagree that Canadian literature isn't substantial enough to satisfy the education of high school students. The American and British canon is devoid of anything that speaks to the experiences of French or native Canadians. The schools also serve a purpose of propagating the cultural traditions of Canada.

It has nothing to do with an ingrown resentment of the USA, you say that as if it should come as a surprise that people would be more interested in their own culture rather than yours. There's plenty American cultural influence in Canada as is.

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Originally Posted by OrphanPip

Of course we had British literature, up until the mid 70s that was essentially what was exclusively taught in schools. Although, I would disagree that Canadian literature isn't substantial enough to satisfy the education of high school students. The American and British canon is devoid of anything that speaks to the experiences of French or native Canadians. The schools also serve a purpose of propagating the cultural traditions of Canada.

It has nothing to do with an ingrown resentment of the USA, you say that as if it should come as a surprise that people would be more interested in their own culture rather than yours. There's plenty American cultural influence in Canada as is.

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We still resent them to an extent though, there is that truth element. Then again, that too isn't restricted to Canada. Still, there is something to be said of not having American literature fed.

The US has the condition of a national literature born in the time of Nationhood, in the Benedict Anderson sense, with also a very strong cultural drive that puts the US as the focus, and seems to limit its perspective - that is pretty much fact, there is no denying that the US is more concerned with the US than Canada is with Canada.

Perhaps people just feel resentment that this self-obsessed culture is pushing itself on top of them. The general attitude of many posts would suggest that.


Reading French literature, for instance, does not seem to have the same nation-idea behind it. Neither does British literature for the most part - so where does that leave Canada.

As a lover of Canadian literature in general, I would argue that perhaps there is something to be gained. Our concept of self is noticeably different, and it is good to have this dialog that is called Canadian literature, especially when literature from the South is constantly throwing its self-obsessed ideas over our heads. Perhaps this idea of showing another side is important - after all, we are not in the same country, and literature is not a museum, but a continual process - a dialog that is constantly changing. Why not then give exposure to the home dialog?

Besides which, from experience, my high school textbook was one of the more multicultural books - it had everything from lesser-known Japanese poets, to Chinese poems (of assorted genres) to essays by African writers, American poets, and all sorts of other stuff. From what I understand the book is a standard in Canada - to suggest a sort of need for American literature is ridiculous.

With translation, we can appreciate from all corners of this world - to suggest that the American or British traditions in themselves are more relevant is quite ridiculous - quite simply, if length wasn't a factor, and you swapped Cat's Cradle for a grade 10 class with Genji, or Don Quixote, or Dream of theRed Chamber nobody would lose, in fact, the gain would be tremendous.

Yes, but one can not deny that great literature has come out of America, and to completely deny oneself or a whole nation of students to that literature out of a resentment to the country's percieved self-obsession would be a disservice, no?

I agree, though, that the USA is too pushy when it comes to the rest of the world, and I definitely agree we are way to self-concerned when it comes to literature--we need much more diversity in the classroom, but don't paint us all with the same brush. Not all of us feel the need to be so egocentric. We all don't come from Texas, which is like a whole other country inside of the US.

I do have to question this quote, though: "there is no denying that the US is more concerned with the US than Canada is with Canada." Really? You seem to be very prideful of Canada, and quite resentful to the USA. I know I am quite dissapointed in the USA, as I know many others in the USA are, and have no real resentment to any other nation. Sorry, but this quote seems quite arrogant in itself.

And thanks for all the suggestions that have been made. Do you, JBI, have any suggestions for contemporary Canadian literature? It is something I haven't explored, I admit.

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Originally Posted by OrphanPip

The American and British canon is devoid of anything that speaks to the experiences of French or native Canadians.

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To hear you tell it, Canadians drive backwards and live on the moon. But 75% live within 100 miles of the U.S. border and 90% live within 150 miles. Ethnic backgrounds, languages, and civilization ages are all roughly the same, but what could we possibly have in common?

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Originally Posted by OrphanPip

The schools also serve a purpose of propagating the cultural traditions of Canada.

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That's what I figure is going on up north. America went through that phase in the mid-1800s when it was trying to show it's independence from the European tradition, even though all we'd really achieved at the time was Poe and Cooper.

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Originally Posted by OrphanPip

It has nothing to do with an ingrown resentment of the USA, you say that as if it should come as a surprise that people would be more interested in their own culture rather than yours.

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At this point, Canadian culture is largely American culture anyway, and it seems a little silly to deny it. You wear our clothes. You listen to our music. You drive our cars. You live in our buildings, watch our movies, and read our books. We're like the girl you **** but won't bring home to your parents.

Of course, you should be more interested in what's yours. But if I didn't own a hammer I'd borrow one from a neighbor. Instead of filling your childrens heads with propaganda about how great their own tradition is, you would probably be better off just teaching them from the best texts available. I'd be pretty upset if my kid was only reading American literature and wasn't getting the best education possible. Vonnegut is alright, but he's no Shakespeare. It's not a native issue, it's a matter of quality. When you only have so much time to reach the little devils, why waste both your times on second rate garbage, even if it was manufactured in the next town over?

By the time I was in high school, American literature felt like a straight jacket. By the time I was in college, the English language felt like a prison. Now I'm older, and the whole Western tradition has begun to feel confining. Getting hung up on things like nationalism seems quaint and provincial at this stage of history when an identity should be so much more than an accident of birth.

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Originally Posted by JBI

With translation, we can appreciate from all corners of this world - to suggest that the American or British traditions in themselves are more relevant is quite ridiculous - quite simply, if length wasn't a factor, and you swapped Cat's Cradle for a grade 10 class with Genji, or Don Quixote, or Dream of theRed Chamber nobody would lose, in fact, the gain would be tremendous.

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Precisely my point. A native resentment doesn't serve anybody. But any largely Anglophone nation, really can't afford to exclude the early contributions of Britain, or the later additions of America.

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Originally Posted by Mutatis-Mutandi

I do have to question this quote, though: "there is no denying that the US is more concerned with the US than Canada is with Canada." Really? You seem to be very prideful of Canada, and quite resentful to the USA. I know I am quite dissapointed in the USA, as I know many others in the USA are, and have no real resentment to any other nation. Sorry, but this quote seems quite arrogant in itself.

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While visiting Plato's home one day, Diogenes, disgusted by its exquisite and costly carpets, contemptuously wiped his feet upon them. "Thus do I trample on the pride of Plato," he declared. "Yes," replied Plato, "with greater pride!"

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Originally Posted by mortalterror

To hear you tell it, Canadians drive backwards and live on the moon. But 75% live within 100 miles of the U.S. border and 90% live within 150 miles. Ethnic backgrounds, languages, and civilization ages are all roughly the same, but what could we possibly have in common?

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If you think French Canadians, or even Atlantic Canadians have much in common with the USA, you don't know anything about Canadians. Did you grow up with a portrait of the queen in your home, because I did. Canada's history and cultural attitudes about itself are far different, I didn't claim we have nothing in common, but we are distinct. I certainly feel distinct from Americans.

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Originally Posted by mortalterror

That's what I figure is going on up north. America went through that phase in the mid-1800s when it was trying to show it's independence from the European tradition, even though all we'd really achieved at the time was Poe and Cooper.

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Um no, American school still propagates American culture, or are you unaware of American government or history courses in American schools. Or American literature even. We're not even speaking of a literary movement, there is no strong nationalist movement in Canadian literature. Most of our prominent writers today are distinctly non-nationalist, Rawi Hage or Michael Ondaatje are hardly promoting a nationalism in Canadian literature. You could maybe make that claim about Atwood, she hates the US. Canada went through its nationalist period in the 19th century too, like every country in the West. It's just your arrogance of cultural superiority that makes you think Canada is just discovering nationalism now.

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Originally Posted by mortalterror

At this point, Canadian culture is largely American culture anyway, and it seems a little silly to deny it. You wear our clothes. You listen to our music. You drive our cars. You live in our buildings, watch our movies, and read our books. We're like the girl you **** but won't bring home to your parents.

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American pop culture dominates everywhere in the world, if we used your definition everyone on Earth is an American. And this is even a recent event in Canada that came around with the invention of the TV. It is also primarily a problem of Ontario and the West, and less so for Quebec and the Atlantic region which have more clear cultural differences from the USA. You also act as if there is no Canadian literature, movies, or books, and that none of us ever interact with them. All those things exist, despite American obliviousness to them. I'm not exactly sure what an American building is too, our floors are actually numbered in the European fashion.

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Originally Posted by mortalterror

Of course, you should be more interested in what's yours. But if I didn't own a hammer I'd borrow one from a neighbor. Instead of filling your childrens heads with propaganda about how great their own tradition is, you would probably be better off just teaching them from the best texts available. I'd be pretty upset if my kid was only reading American literature and wasn't getting the best education possible. Vonnegut is alright, but he's no Shakespeare. It's not a native issue, it's a matter of quality. When you only have so much time to reach the little devils, why waste both your times on second rate garbage, even if it was manufactured in the next town over?

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The fact that you think Canadian literature is just second rate garbage is the reason why nobody likes the US. You should also note I didn't say American literature shouldn't be taught, I just said it shouldn't be emphasized. Why should we shove loads of American literature down the throats of high school students.

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Originally Posted by mortalterror

Precisely my point. A native resentment doesn't serve anybody. But any largely Anglophone nation, really can't afford to exclude the early contributions of Britain, or the later additions of America.

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I think we'll be alright, the later additions of America aren't all that relevant to the needs of high school students. They just need to learn how to read and write properly.

Mortalterror doesn't speak for all Americans.

I have been to Canada (albeit just across the border to Niagra Falls) and just there I could see cultural differences, and that area is about as westernized as Branson, Missouri.

Both of you are arguing at the extreme end of your side. Should Canada focus more on Candian literature? Perhaps. Should Canada disregard all American literature because of American ignorance? Of course not.

From OP:

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Originally Posted by Mutatis-Mutandi

Now, I'm not looking for tons of action and explosions, just a story that moves at a reasonable pace. I'm tired of reading (or attempting to read) books that take fifteen pages to describe one simple aspect of the story. It just isn't my thing. I read to escape, and I don't want to escape into a mundane world.

So, if you have any suggestions on some classics I could read every now and then, just to keep my intellectual cred in order, so to speak, I'd be much appreciative.

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Off-topic posts will be removed without further notice.

That's kind of lame. The conversation evolved to the point it has, and has taken a pretty interesting turn? Why can't it continue?

I have to agree with your detractors, Mutatis. You don't seem to possess an attitude of literary scholarship. No one likes all classics, of course, but where is the depth of appreciation?

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Originally Posted by Mutatis-Mutandi

Yes, but one can not deny that great literature has come out of America, and to completely deny oneself or a whole nation of students to that literature out of a resentment to the country's percieved self-obsession would be a disservice, no?

I agree, though, that the USA is too pushy when it comes to the rest of the world, and I definitely agree we are way to self-concerned when it comes to literature--we need much more diversity in the classroom, but don't paint us all with the same brush. Not all of us feel the need to be so egocentric. We all don't come from Texas, which is like a whole other country inside of the US.

I do have to question this quote, though: "there is no denying that the US is more concerned with the US than Canada is with Canada." Really? You seem to be very prideful of Canada, and quite resentful to the USA. I know I am quite dissapointed in the USA, as I know many others in the USA are, and have no real resentment to any other nation. Sorry, but this quote seems quite arrogant in itself.

And thanks for all the suggestions that have been made. Do you, JBI, have any suggestions for contemporary Canadian literature? It is something I haven't explored, I admit.

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Try the works of Alice Munro, I doubt she would disappoint, also The Studhorse Man by Robert Kroetsch is an excellent comic novel.

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Originally Posted by Jeremydav

I have to agree with your detractors, Mutatis. You don't seem to possess an attitude of literary scholarship. No one likes all classics, of course, but where is the depth of appreciation?

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Have you read the whole thread? If you have, and still feel this way, I don't know what to say. I feel I've explained my attitude of "literary scholarship" quite thoroughly.

And, thanks JBI, I'll check those out.

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Originally Posted by Mutatis-Mutandi

Have you read the whole thread? If you have, and still feel this way, I don't know what to say. I feel I've explained my attitude of "literary scholarship" quite thoroughly.

And, thanks JBI, I'll check those out.

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Nothing you've said in this thread has led me to believe that you enjoy literature as much as you should.

What do you mean, "depth of appreciation"? I've appreciated every piece of classic literature I've read, whether I enjoyed it or not.

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Of course, you should be more interested in what's yours. But if I didn't own a hammer I'd borrow one from a neighbor. Instead of filling your childrens heads with propaganda about how great their own tradition is, you would probably be better off just teaching them from the best texts available. I'd be pretty upset if my kid was only reading American literature and wasn't getting the best education possible. Vonnegut is alright, but he's no Shakespeare. It's not a native issue, it's a matter of quality. When you only have so much time to reach the little devils, why waste both your times on second rate garbage, even if it was manufactured in the next town over?

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While I do not deny that American literature has its great writers and texts, "the best literature possible" does not feature a predominantly American canon in my eyes. There is something to be said of the tradition of American literature, but it is hardly as original or amazing as its promoters make it seem - generally speaking, it is in part American self-promotion (you mention promoting while only having Poe and Cooper) and American ignorance of outside traditions that perhaps leads to this confusion. Simply put, the US is but a short segment of literary history, and its texts, though many are good, are not the be all and end all of literature.

In the textbook for high schoolers, or universities then, why not discuss a place for American literature? Well, we can start by suggesting that the Chinese tradition is longer and more developed, which is a known fact, and that the English tradition benefits from a longer history of writers, and of readers - as do the Italian, French, German, Japanese, etc. traditions - so perhaps we should add them too. While we are at it then, we can say in the past 100 years Latin American authors have also been very influential and powerful players in the development of literature in the world, especially in prose fiction - the works of magical realist authors and nationalist authors using distinctly Latin American-originated motifs and tropes have made it as far as China and back - so we must look at them to while we make our list. Then there are historical presidents - we have our classic canon, from Homer, the Bible on one side, and from hundreds of other texts on others - surely if we are having this great exposure to the great authors, they must be included.

Do not get me wrong, I promote reading great books, but simply put, if you insist that I as a Canadian aught to be appreciating Walt Whitman, I return the challenge and suggest that one cannot say that without first reading the Japanese Book of One Thousand Leaves without realizing a cultural bias that takes its own tradition too seriously. IT is important to read American books, but they are not the be all and end all as many Americans forget.

Likewise English is but one language in the world that just happens to be the major language now (not that Chinese is not an equal rival).

It's funny how much personal opinions and outlooks can change in eight months.

I would suggest you turn to real estate or car sales before you damage any students' budding love of literature.

All classics are boring, that's why they're classics.

Jude the Obscure, by Hardy, blends Victorian ideals and morales with the modern novel and modern writing style. Some say that it's the precursor to Existentialism with institutions, like Christianity, marriage, and higher education, failing the protagonist, and thus, failing Jude. Happiness, in the context to this novel, would be seen as Romanticism in Jude's eyes. Indeed, Jude's actions and fruits of his labor lead him to utter failure time, and time again.

Awesome read.

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Originally Posted by dfloyd

I would suggest you turn to real estate or car sales before you damage any students' budding love of literature.

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Did you read the whole thread? Probably not. And if you have, you're just being obtuse, and I don't feel like rehashing what I've made perfectly clear.

Siddhartha is uber easy and is a philosophical detour from the Western "I must have this" materialism. Very well written, simple to follow, simple to understand; I can't imagine having any students struggling to understand this.

Jane Austen's Pride and Prejudice is the commonplace love story, just better written. The girls will slurp that up, the guys will dig it for the girls, and it covers early English Lit.

Perhaps not yet considered a classic, Italo Calvino's Cosmocomics is a strong introduction to Post-Moderism. It's wildly entertaining, taking the storyline of an essential immortal being that, in the various short stories engrossing the tale, takes different forms and goes through different periods. Enlightening? Perhaps not. But entertaining nonetheless.

Now I havent read this whole thread BUT, it amazes me how much people are jumping on Mutatis, he simply said some of the classics were boring to him, not the majority, some classics bore me too and I'm an English major (planning on teaching), I guess I have to switch majors...

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Originally Posted by ChicagoReader

I guess I have to switch majors...

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Nah, the rest of us will need someone to serve us coffee on our way to work...

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Originally Posted by dfloyd

I would suggest you turn to real estate or car sales before you damage any students' budding love of literature.

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are you being serious? b/c I don't see the sarcasm emoticon!

seriously, for so many that consider themselves literature buffs they have proven to not be very good readers.

the OP never stated that they don't like the classics, or a majority of the classics. I don't know how often I've read from people that they were forced to read so many classics or long books in school and were turned off by literature and reading, this can only be a bad thing for us all.

these same people have subsequently said that perhaps 15 or 20 years later they have returned to some of these books and had a new appreciation of them. Sometimes the books are just above us as younger students and the OP is just simply trying to find ways to keep their students engaged in the reading process. Whether you want to read that as "entertained" or however that's your decision. :smilewinkgrin:

a simple post looking for help from a literature-experienced crowd turns ugly with lots of judging IMO.

the great thing about literature, even just taking into consideration English language literature, is that it is so vast and broad there is something for everyone. I'd bet quite a bit not everyone here likes every single classic or author, and there's nothing wrong with that - but the OP is in the same boat.

just my thoughts, and sorry I don't have any more thoughts as to what actually to read besides what's been dutifully offered here so far. All good suggestions.

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Originally Posted by der wegwerfer

are you being serious? B/c i don't see the sarcasm emoticon!

Seriously, for so many that consider themselves literature buffs they have proven to not be very good readers.

The op never stated that they don't like the classics, or a majority of the classics. I don't know how often i've read from people that they were forced to read so many classics or long books in school and were turned off by literature and reading, this can only be a bad thing for us all.

These same people have subsequently said that perhaps 15 or 20 years later they have returned to some of these books and had a new appreciation of them. Sometimes the books are just above us as younger students and the op is just simply trying to find ways to keep their students engaged in the reading process. Whether you want to read that as "entertained" or however that's your decision. :smilewinkgrin:

A simple post looking for help from a literature-experienced crowd turns ugly with lots of judging imo.

The great thing about literature, even just taking into consideration english language literature, is that it is so vast and broad there is something for everyone. I'd bet quite a bit not everyone here likes every single classic or author, and there's nothing wrong with that - but the op is in the same boat.

Just my thoughts, and sorry i don't have any more thoughts as to what actually to read besides what's been dutifully offered here so far. All good suggestions.

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thank you

Thank you both, :).

LOL at the delusional people who think an English major or even English teacher shouldn't find any classic boring.

If you are one and you don't, you must've not read enough classics.

Besides, do you think Bio or History or Math or Chem or Physics or Philosophy majors don't find ANY parts of their subject boring?