Further into introverts

I want to read that book, it sounds very interesting, I have to admit though there is something about being an introvert and a public speaker that doesn't fit in my head though. Maybe because I don't like speaking in public.

the difference between being intro and extro is interesting, I was with my friends the other day and when I had gotten just about enough and wanted to go home one said that she wants to make plans after school and do something cause she needs more friends in her life. I just thought WHAT more! I get more than enough going to uni everyday and she want more.

I think about introversion a lot now, mainly because I always thought I was the one that wasn't alright or doing something weird. Now I just think I'm me.

when I was a kid I rarely went out to play with other kids, I had friends, one or two but I preferred to stay inside and read or do scrap books, I still have a really cool Star Wars scrap book I started when I was 10. I still add to it every now and then.

another thing about Cain is that she isn't saying that one is better than the other, just that they should be equal.

I would say the industry I work in is absolutely ruled by extroverts, who can spot an introvert like a limping wildebeest at the back of a galloping pack, whose fate is certain. I have observed them and can say a few things about those observations.

I do admire they way they bowl through the world, acting with their gut, shooting from the hip, very little analysis, no curiosity beyond what is practical and necessary(they figure who's who and what's what quick and act with fierce self preservation and darwinian ferocity), zero or virtually nil introspection, and topped off with a extraordinary sense of self and self worth. There is no time for depression, because their self value is so high, and the world could not exist without them coming through the door. It's a very simple program "I'm right, you are wrong, and f#$k you if you don't like it. If that does not work, just get louder and puff up your feathers, people will back down, and they do. They are extremely difficult to hurt, because the sensitivity chip is so small. And because of the "positive energy" and more importantly Force of Personality(so key in this Tony Robbins world)- the sky is the limit in terms what can be done in a world that is so very socially networked where positions of power or finance are located.

Although it's an artless world they live in (even when my photographs are on display in a gallery, they seem to be on skates going through the museum-such speed and lack of interest).

I still agree with Cain in that both types and all between are necessary-after all that:smilewinkgrin:

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Originally Posted by tonywalt

I do admire they way they bowl through the world, acting with their gut, shooting from the hip, very little analysis, no curiosity beyond what is practical and necessary(they figure who's who and what's what quick and act with fierce self preservation and darwinian ferocity), zero or virtually nil introspection, and topped off with a extraordinary sense of self and self worth. There is no time for depression, because their self value is so high, and the world could not exist without them coming through the door. It's a very simple program "I'm right, you are wrong, and f#$k you if you don't like it. If that does not work, just get louder and puff up your feathers, people will back down, and they do. They are extremely difficult to hurt, because the sensitivity chip is so small. And because of the "positive energy" and more importantly Force of Personality(so key in this Tony Robbins world)- the sky is the limit in terms what can be done in a world that is so very socially networked where positions of power or finance are located.

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Actually, that description of extroverts is how I picture them also. They tend to be the abusers in family and business relationships. Although this might give them some wins, overall they tend to lose. There is always a bigger abuser out there.

An introvert also has positive energy and seems better able to handle their emotions and thoughts.

Wow, quit a bit of extrovert bashing going on. I hear they eat their babies too.

I have actually been searching for people who don't perform the crimes they fight. I have never found anyone yet. Everyone against hate - viciously hates 'haters' because they deserve it. When lecturing against bullying, they savagely bully anyone who disagrees. People who like peace defend war. People who hate racism support exterminating Palestinians for being Semite race and not white like Israelis. Last I read, leading cause of gay murder is other gays; they murder their lover in a fight same as heterosexuals. The honest statement would be just to admit the human mammal is violent, territorial, tribal, and gets deep pleasure from inflicting suffering on others. The reason you should admit this is because the world gets really clear. You notice that the people talking the most are just another bunch of hateful savages and the honest people are just running for the lives from the all social cults, anyone who names themselves their group from atheist to nazi, all the same thing. Another tribal brute forming a pack to go hunt for victims who 'deserve it'. NICE THING about being an activist, someone always deserves your hatred. Just name it something else, like activism.

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Originally Posted by JamCrackers

I have actually been searching for people who don't perform the crimes they fight. I have never found anyone yet. Everyone against hate - viciously hates 'haters' because they deserve it. When lecturing against bullying, they savagely bully anyone who disagrees. People who like peace defend war. People who hate racism support exterminating Palestinians for being Semite race and not white like Israelis. Last I read, leading cause of gay murder is other gays; they murder their lover in a fight same as heterosexuals. The honest statement would be just to admit the human mammal is violent, territorial, tribal, and gets deep pleasure from inflicting suffering on others. The reason you should admit this is because the world gets really clear. You notice that the people talking the most are just another bunch of hateful savages and the honest people are just running for the lives from the all social cults, anyone who names themselves their group from atheist to nazi, all the same thing. Another tribal brute forming a pack to go hunt for victims who 'deserve it'. NICE THING about being an activist, someone always deserves your hatred. Just name it something else, like activism.

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I agree with the above, in that it is a tribal world and that our tribe - call them onlitters can and do smash people we hold in disdain with ferocity(just look at our threads).

But I also observe there are different levels of amorality, and of course I believe people of my nature (call it ambivert or a hybrid) are better to be around for lack of a better way of stating it.

I base this not on self oberservation but oberservation of introverts, amibiverts, and extroverts. I can assure you, dealing with agressive extroverts is so much more stressful in business than dealing with introverts. That is my subjective experience.

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Originally Posted by tonywalt

I agree with the above, in that it is a tribal world and that our tribe - call them onlitters can and do smash people we hold in disdain with ferocity(just look at our threads).

But I also observe there are different levels of amorality, and of course I believe people of my nature (call it ambivert or a hybrid) are better to be around for lack of a better way of stating it.

I base this not on self oberservation but oberservation of introverts, amibiverts, and extroverts. I can assure you, dealing with agressive extroverts is so much more stressful in business than dealing with introverts. That is my subjective experience.

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Wow Tony! I'm in awe that you understood that post! You have my undying respect from here on in...:cool:

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Originally Posted by YesNo

Actually, that description of extroverts is how I picture them also. They tend to be the abusers in family and business relationships. Although this might give them some wins, overall they tend to lose. There is always a bigger abuser out there.

An introvert also has positive energy and seems better able to handle their emotions and thoughts.

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I agree, but I would say an introvert internalizes emotions and thoughts, and that's what might create anxiety or depression. Extroverts tend to externalize things, and if you are around them you quickly hear all about them, their problems, and their achievements.

Please understand the context of my writing, in speaking of the corporate world extroverts as my primary reference in this writing. It's a special breed of agressive extrovert, in many cases.

I am both. When I'm depressed its introversion, and when my adhd acts up I'm outgoing more than the average person. I also experience both tendencies at different times of day. If I don't get my 8 hours of solid sleep I'm tired and tend to be quiet around people. When I'm well-rested and full of energy I'm one of those life-of-the-party type individuals. Overall though I guess I'm often introverted and selectively extroverted.

I sound a little bipolar don't I? I thought I was until two psychologists told me they seriously suspect that I suffer from adult adhd. Was quite a relief. I won't go to a psychiatrist to get an official diagnosis because those bastards really scare me. Hahahaha.

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Originally Posted by tonywalt

I would say the industry I work in is absolutely ruled by extroverts, who can spot an introvert like a limping wildebeest at the back of a galloping pack, whose fate is certain. I have observed them and can say a few things about those observations.

I do admire they way they bowl through the world, acting with their gut, shooting from the hip, very little analysis, no curiosity beyond what is practical and necessary(they figure who's who and what's what quick and act with fierce self preservation and darwinian ferocity), zero or virtually nil introspection, and topped off with a extraordinary sense of self and self worth. There is no time for depression, because their self value is so high, and the world could not exist without them coming through the door. It's a very simple program "I'm right, you are wrong, and f#$k you if you don't like it. If that does not work, just get louder and puff up your feathers, people will back down, and they do. They are extremely difficult to hurt, because the sensitivity chip is so small. And because of the "positive energy" and more importantly Force of Personality(so key in this Tony Robbins world)- the sky is the limit in terms what can be done in a world that is so very socially networked where positions of power or finance are located. Although it's an artless world they live in (even when my photographs are on display in a gallery, they seem to be on skates going through the museum-such speed and lack of interest).

I still agree with Cain in that both types and all between are necessary-after all that:smilewinkgrin:

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That seems to be par for the course these days, especially when power/prestige is a factor. It's comforting to assume that admirable personal attributes like integrity, trustworthiness, empathy, and honor play a critical part in success/position. Unfortunately, in my experience it's often inversely related. The higher up the ladder you go in many firms, the more vile they get. And yes, a healthy percentage are extroverts. But in the final analysis, it all depends on the person. Some of my favorite people are extroverts.

You wouldn't be in I.banking or financial services, by chance?

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Originally Posted by hawthorns

That seems to be par for the course these days, especially when power/prestige is a factor. It's comforting to assume that admirable personal attributes like integrity, trustworthiness, empathy, and honor play a critical part in success/position. Unfortunately, in my experience it's often inversely related. The higher up the ladder you go in many firms, the more vile they get. And yes, a healthy percentage are extroverts. But in the final analysis, it all depends on the person. Some of my favorite people are extroverts.

You wouldn't be in I.banking or financial services, by chance?

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Since my pic and name are on this I cannot confirm that I am in the latter occupation.

You are correct in terms of those personal attributes rarely (not saying never) working for you working your way up the corporate ladder.

It is interesting that on the lower part of the corporate food chain you will see alot of Eastern/Buddhist type stuff pasted on cubicles - Desiderata being very common. On the top level executives you will see alot of pictures and quotes from Donald Trump, Rockefeller, Vince Lombardi ("..winning is the only thing") and on and on.

In a pitch battle, I can pick the winner 9 out of 10, and the Eastern philosophy will be speared and eaten.

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Originally Posted by tonywalt

Since my pic and name are on this I cannot confirm that I am in the latter occupation.

You are correct in terms of those personal attributes rarely (not saying never) working for you working your way up the corporate ladder.

It is interesting that on the lower part of the corporate food chain you will see alot of Eastern/Buddhist type stuff pasted on cubicles - Desiderata being very common. On the top level executives you will see alot of pictures and quotes from Donald Trump, Rockefeller, Vince Lombardi ("..winning is the only thing") and on and on.

In a pitch battle, I can pick the winner 9 out of 10, and the Eastern philosophy will be speared and eaten.

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Depressing, isn't it?

I used to assume that these attributes/behaviors were the natural product of emperor-like wealth, power, and responsibility ala Roman consuls. Then I realized they're simple prerequisites for a Dark-Side Darwinism that has rewritten all the rules. I don't know whether it's always been like this or if it's "new" money and all it's microwave profit, save-your-own-##s glory. Probably a little of both. My grandfather was an executive and he sure never minced words about how far things have regressed. Not the case, obviously, everywhere. But it definitely accounts for the majority of my (and everyone I know) experiences.

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Originally Posted by Darcy88

I am both. When I'm depressed its introversion, and when my adhd acts up I'm outgoing more than the average person. I also experience both tendencies at different times of day. If I don't get my 8 hours of solid sleep I'm tired and tend to be quiet around people. When I'm well-rested and full of energy I'm one of those life-of-the-party type individuals. Overall though I guess I'm often introverted and selectively extroverted.

I sound a little bipolar don't I? I thought I was until two psychologists told me they seriously suspect that I suffer from adult adhd. Was quite a relief. I won't go to a psychiatrist to get an official diagnosis because those bastards really scare me. Hahahaha.

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I wouldn't want to be diagnosed with anything. It just adds something negative to your record that you might have to explain later. It sounds like you are healthy enough without a label.

Being the life-of-the-party may be a way to keep people from getting too close. The real question is how often do you prefer to go to a party rather than, say, walk by yourself in the park? In my case, I only go to the party if I feel required to do so but then I do try to make the best of it and often find it enjoyable.

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Originally Posted by tonywalt

I agree, but I would say an introvert internalizes emotions and thoughts, and that's what might create anxiety or depression. Extroverts tend to externalize things, and if you are around them you quickly hear all about them, their problems, and their achievements.

Please understand the context of my writing, in speaking of the corporate world extroverts as my primary reference in this writing. It's a special breed of agressive extrovert, in many cases.

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I don't think introverts generally feel any more or less depressed than extroverts. But I have no statistics to back that up. My guess is that introverts are just as positive, optimistic, and cheerful as extroverts. Who knows?

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Originally Posted by YesNo

I don't think introverts generally feel any more or less depressed than extroverts. But I have no statistics to back that up. My guess is that introverts are just as positive, optimistic, and cheerful as extroverts. Who knows?

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I would love to agree with that, but disagree. Extroverts are much less likely to have trouble reconciling themselves with society. You can just simply read the books, poems, forum postings of self described introverts or subtly self described introverts and compare it to extroverts - very different. The essential challenge for introverts is their difficulty with fitting into society.


Whilst many would naturally say ''I don't care'', I think that is just necessary cognitive dissonance-and is common default answer.

I would be happy as a pig in mud to have more people like me, hell yes, as it would benefit me in countless ways. Plus, I would have higher chances at reproductive situations(nice way of putting it) which would be bloody brilliant. When I was in college playing football I had alot more attention (especially for an ambivert) and I flipping loved it-soaked it up.