Could 1984 actually become a reality?

Baz i don't quite agree..i believe Balkans' place on the map (the crossroads of 3 continents etc) is responsible for the mess ;) but we can't discuss that since we are bordering on politics so i am self-moderating my post and stop here :D :p

I am right now reading Goldstein's "Manifesto" which is for me the best part in the book (at least so far). Some great truths here. Don't you think this part speaks volumes on how the real world is working?

I also liked the part were it is said that all the novels and songs are witten by machines. No artistic creation. And how they are creating a new language where all synonyms and antonyms of words are missing. An easy way to narrow the proccess of thought and eventually destroy it, don't you think? I always believed that the beauty and reachness of a language enhances thinking. And also by destroying people's aesthetic criteria you gradually reduce them to a point of foolishness. Hehehe this is partly a reality (check out how awful modern tv programms are and a big quantity of modern songs and novels :lol: :lol: ). This was said half in jest half in earnest ;) .

About the red belt those kids wear..it reminds me of the chastity belt women wore during medieval ages..could the puritanistic turn society has taken in "1984" be an allusion to church and its strict doctrines during past eras..(Orwell doesn't strike me as a religious person) not sure why i thought that :goof: (Well perhaps beacuse celibacy is mentioned too many times and the demonization of sex as a means of pleasure )

Hehehehe take your time..

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Originally Posted by manolia

Baz i don't quite agree..i believe Balkans' place on the map (the crossroads of 3 continents etc) is responsible for the mess ;) but we can't discuss that since we are bordering on politics so i am self-moderating my post and stop here :D :p

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It's not politic, it's...history:D In many places on earth, continents are crossing and there was nowhere such a mess like it was on Balkan through history.
Muslim, Christians and Orthodox on really too small area. Croats are Christians. Then Federation of Bosnia and Herzegovina: norther part are Serbs; they are Orthodox. Then Bosnians - they are Muslims, and finally Croatian part; Christians again. Then Republic of Serbia, Montenegro, Greece - all Orthodox. I consider Turkey also as a part of Balkan, no matter of geography. :D Once in Austrian empire, then part of Turkish empire, then Balkan wars against Turkish empire, then WWI, Kingdom of Yugoslavia, WWII, SFRY...and of course; Turkey. Before Mustafa Kemal, they were always in war with someone.
That country in Asia, near the gulf, with 3 religions in it, you know...:D

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I am right now reading Goldstein's "Manifesto" which is for me the best part in the book (at least so far). Some great truths here. Don't you think this part speaks volumes on how the real world is working?

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Yes, that's the best part. Real world? I hope not! Just hope...


Hah, we live in a time of Dan Brown and Britney Spears, so Orwell was quite right about that! :lol:

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About the red belt those kids wear..it reminds me of the chastity belt women wore during medieval ages..could the puritanistic turn society has taken in "1984" be an allusion to church and its strict doctrines during past eras..

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Well, I doubt that Orwell was looking in Middle Ages; it think he was referring on red star, proud symbol of communism. Pioneers were wearing them on their funny hats. Church was loosing her influence in communism so I don't see why would Orwell be against them

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Hehehehe take your time..

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It was a pleasure, although I needed time!

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Originally Posted by bazarov

Muslim, Christians and Orthodox on really too small area.

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History and politics go together. Politics are a part of history :D ;)

Orthodox are christians too. I am sure you know that but i am clarifying it for anyone who doesn't and may read this post ;) We have here the same christian faith as the majority of Russian people ;)

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Originally Posted by bazarov

Yes, that's the best part. Real world? I hope not! Just hope...

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Well the part about the constant wars and why they take place is quite realistic ;) and the part that human societies consist of 3 classes mainly ;)

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Originally Posted by bazarov

Hah, we live in a time of Dan Brown and Britney Spears, so Orwell was quite right about that! :lol:

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Yes, my thoughts exactly plus the whole telescreen thing and how people are constantly brainwashed by it...he (Orwell) wasn't very fond of tv either :lol:

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Originally Posted by bazarov

Well, I doubt that Orwell was looking in Middle Ages; it think he was referring on red star, proud symbol of communism. Pioneers were wearing them on their funny hats. Church was loosing her influence in communism so I don't see why would Orwell be against them

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No, i didn't mean that. He makes a combination of things and influences. In the part i am reading now he makes a short reference to the strict doctrines of the church ;) and how church succeeded in staying into power for centuries by "adopting" people from various social strata rather than belonging to a certain class and also by giving people the hope that there is an after life. So church is definately mentioned in the book.
Now the part about the kids and their way of life reminds me both of what i said before and what you said above (which is kinda obvious ;) ). Who knows? Two in one..

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Originally Posted by Martin Esslin

"There is, after all, not that much difference between a society that floods the masses with cheap, noveltish romance, raucous and sentimental pop music, and pornography to keep them amused and politically inert and one that does the same thing for commercial gain-but the identical ultimate political result: apathy, ignorance of real issues, and acquiescence in whatever the politicians are doing. And does not commercial television do just that?"

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The result is the same, but the intent is drastically different. The similarities between today and the world of 1984 are motivated primarily by profits, not a desire to control.

bazarov wrote

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Hah, we live in a time of Dan Brown and Britney Spears

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I know who Dan Brown is, sorry, can't say i am much of a fan but who is Britney Spears? I found Dan Brown boring, he doesn't even seem to try to put any effort into captivating his readers. Seems pretty amateur compared to some of the greatest writers like Stephen King and Bret Easton Ellis. I'm guessing Britney Spears is another one of those writers similar to Dan Brown, if she is, tell her not to waste her time writing because it is boring. It goes on and on and on........ :crash::lol:

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Originally Posted by TheFoxxx

I know who Dan Brown is, sorry, can't say i am much of a fan but who is Britney Spears? I found Dan Brown boring, he doesn't even seem to try to put any effort into captivating his readers. Seems pretty amateur compared to some of the greatest writers like Stephen King and Bret Easton Ellis. I'm guessing Britney Spears is another one of those writers similar to Dan Brown, if she is, tell her not to waste her time writing because it is boring. It goes on and on and on........ :crash::lol:

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:lol: :lol: Even my mother knows who is Britney Spears; she is what they call ''popular singer'', American. I don't know how somebody doesn't know that although; I must admit I envy you on that!

I think that 1984 is a reality in small ways. I'm not saying it could become a reality, but a lot of the things Orwell said does make sense. I agree with the earlier comment about it being more from the Corporate world. Privacy is one thing that stands out, but I won't get into that...also, look at the similarities between North Korea and 1984. Its insane.

bazarov wrote

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Even my mother knows who is Britney Spears; she is what they call ''popular singer'', American. I don't know how somebody doesn't know that although; I must admit I envy you on that

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You want to know something else that is Hilarious, i am a music journalist. If i heard one of her songs i might know who she is but as for names. Sorry mate:lol:

I'm into Country and New Wave. My favs are Lindsey Haun, Lila McCann, The Wilkinsons, Carrie Underwood, Ryan Adams, Doc Walker, Jewel, The Cars, Tears For Fears, Emerson Drive, The Warren Brothers, Aleyce Simmonds and Shooter Jennings. The only new pop singers i have taken any notice and liking to are Avril Lavigne, Daughtry, Andersrock, Bo Bice and a few others mainly from watching Idol.

Yesterday i watched the American Music Awards to see all the country stars on it but i did not see a Britney Spears on it. However i did see some girl called Beyonce (who i think may of come from Destinys Child) perform a duet with Sugarland.

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Originally Posted by TheFoxxx

You want to know something else that is Hilarious, i am a music journalist. If i heard one of her songs i might know who she is but as for names. Sorry mate:lol:

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Excuse me while I wash the complete disbelief out.

You claim to live in Sydney and that you are a music journalist yet have never heard of Britney Spears?

No polite way I can put this: I'm quite confident that you're lying on one or other of those statements, and probably both.

Just out of interest, using Google produces the following results:

"Alanis Morissette" 1.65m responses

"John Lennon" 2.1m responses

"Jesus Christ" 7.6m responses

"George Bush" (which, of course, gets two shots) 11.7m responses

"Britney Spears"?

A staggering 43,900,000 responses.

Having done that, I can't stop!!

"George Orwell" produces 1.6m - and LitNet ranks fourth!

"William Shakepeare" - 5.3m and LitNet 4th again!

Even people in West Sydney with no access to the internet can't escape from the Britney phenomenon; the ABC's site search produced:

307 news articles

Poor Bey-once only had 121.

Thank god for the reality of an actual news organisation, "Dubbya" has over 12,000 stories on him. Given that he's Galactic President for the past seven years, my faith in humans is a little restored by ABC redressing the balance!

I guess it proves the theory that 95% of the internet is rubbish.

Yay that LitNet is in the other 5%!!!

The Atheist wrote

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You claim to live in Sydney and that you are a music journalist yet have never heard of Britney Spears?

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Country Music Journalist. It's not my job to listen to pop music nor would i want to from some of the rubbish i have heard such as the Backstreet Boys and Eminem. So i guess i am very lucky.

By the way we just had the greatest change in Australian history this weekend. Kevin Rudd is now our Prime Minister. This is a great man who will lead us into the future.

in my opinion, i believe that there is a possibility that 1984 could very well become a reality.As my teacher said, It won't be long before future generations are sitting in class being watched by teachers or higher administration. i think that Orwell is telling us many times that this book could very well end up as the way of life,if we're not careful:

Not in Australia mate:lol: We now have one of the best governments around. You know i was just thinking yesterday, if nineteen eighty four could become a reality then so could Resident Evil: Apocalypse. No doubt we better watch out or the Umbrella Corporation (the largest commercial entity in the world) might take over and turn all its people into zombies:alien: :eek:

In a word? Yes. In some ways, it already is.

Try not to think of it in terms of a world that is precisely as Orwell envisioned it. Instead, think ahead. Look at where we are now and imagine what could happen based upon what you already know.

I believe the internet has been Big Brother just waiting to happen since it's inception. Now I know a lot of eyes are rolling but think about it. Someday, probably not in the too distant future, it will be all but impossible for the average nitwit to do anything online without it being possible for all of it to be monitored and recorded. Currently, there are ways to avoid this but they involve a little more complexity than the average user is willing to go through just for anonymity. As the saying goes "I have nothing to hide so I'm not worried about it".

And while the internet may not technically be able to monitor you with a physical lens like the 1984 Telescreen, it has the potential to be far more insidious. It has the potential to record what you think and how you think. Also what you're interested in. It has the potential to stare deeper into your being than even Orwell imagined.

Technology advances. What is science fiction today is reality in ten years or whatever. If you can imagine it, it can probably be done.

So. While we're all sitting here feeling all safe and comfortable, what we have sitting in front of us is a telescreen in disguise. Maybe a primitive one. Maybe your every thought isn't being piped into some gigantic supercomputer to be scrutinized and analyzed yet but how far off do you think that is? Take a look at the headlines from the last few years. Warrantless wiretapping, data mining, etc.

Think about how much information a single hard drive can hold. Just a common hard drive that anyone might have in their computer. And the capacities are growing exponentially. Google has so much free storage space that they can afford to give people 4 gigs free. And it isn't lost on me that Google has been developing increasingly sophisticated software. Who doesn't use Google to search for the things they're interested in?

Some people would say this is "tin foil hat paranoia". Maybe so. But such people would be Big Brother's best friend. They would ridicule anyone who saw him coming and the peer pressure would silence anyone who didn't want to be ridiculed.

The thought police is/are everyone. Everyone is so paranoid that they willingly do Big Brother's hardest job for him.

Big Brother, in turn, is not a person but rather, the personification of tyranny. He is the symbolic figurehead of a tyrannical government. Not just a government but an entire system that's built from the ground up to enforce compliance. In fact, Big Brother can be interpreted to be everyone. People willingly obey BB because of the social pressures placed upon them by other people. BB is more than any one man or even just a government or a corporation. He's everyone working together to defeat and/or destroy any trace of individuality.

Thoughtcrime is anything (particularly an idea) that displeases or threatens Big Brother or his hold on power.

The so-called mental health system and the CJS is (in a way) the ministry of love and room 101. It tells us we're crazy if we don't conform to social norms and gives us pills to keep us "sane". If we're especially disobedient, we are sent to room 101 (prison) to face our greatest fear. Loss of freedom (what little there is) and being subjected to an overwhelmingly frighting environment.

Love for BB must consume us and our obedience to him must be unquestioning. To the point to where we would report our own lovers, children, parents or siblings for disobedience.

Is it like this yet? No. But there are ominous warnings everywhere. It's no surprise that references to 1984 are popping up everywhere.

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Originally Posted by RandomPrecision

Is it like this yet? No. But there are ominous warnings everywhere. It's no surprise that references to 1984 are popping up everywhere.

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Nope, I think you're badly wrong, but to tell you why would be to get into politics, so we can't do that.

The reason references to 1984 abound right now is that Orwell and 1984 have been largely hijacked by pubescent boys who like to pretend to be revolutionary by seeing consipracies on every street corner. It's essentially a form of cowardice - attack organisations which will not act against you - governments and government agencies.

Don't respect the ravings of a small number of idiots to let you think the world is inexorably headed towards 1984.