the three musketeers, unique role portrayal

So, here is my random thought. Has anyone noticed that traditional tales portray heroes as having no faults, beautiful being good and ugly being evil. Yet, in the three musketeers Porthos is proud and showy, Athos is cynical (especially in romance) and proud, Aramis is very unsure of himself and D'artagnan is impulsive and not as well educated as his musketeer counterparts. in regards to beauty and ugliness, it appears that milady has the internal thoughts of a 'wicked witch' and the outer, beautiful appearance of a heroine or damsel. Just some thoughts, anyone else pick up on this or anything else unusual in the three musketeers? What do you think?

One could say Lord Byron already did happen, it is all romanticism, but then , heroes were always flawed (achilles is hysterical, ulysses a liar, Agamenon arrogant, etc) and the idea of pretty woman causing a guy's fall is old as eve...

Haha you have me thinking now :) just the stories I have been looking at lately, the women especially, all seem to be sitting around waiting to be married. I think that is why Milady fascinates me :) you cant like her but she does have spunk haha

Speaking as one with a professional interest folklore, in 'traditional tales' (as you have termed them) the use of beauty in a moral dimension is a lot more complex than you have suggested. Yes, you have ugly old witches and troll-women, it is true - but another class of mythical stereotype is the demonic/erotic woman.

I wrote my MA thesis on this character-type. She crops up everywhere - her great physical beauty is matched only by her capacity to cause chaos and destruction. This makes her a more worrying figure - the seductive qualities of her sex appeal give her an influence over both people and society. The old crone in the forest might be troublesome, but at least she is over there. The beautiful witch who has managed to infiltrate the society (and who is thus by implication more powerful) is a problem right on your own doorstep.

Milady fits very well into this pattern, though Dumas pulls it off with a degree of flair and artistry that make her an unusually captivating villain.

Ooh, I don't know about our heroes being 'heroes' in the perfect sense of the word. They surely win in the end, but is that legitimate and by what was it motivated?

Even so, I don't think Porthos has a lot of pride. He has a heart of cake, as they say in Flemish. The fact that he lives on his mistress's money was quite a normal fact in those days... Soldiers had to pay for everything themselves (including armour, horses, valets; there were no uniforms per se), don't forget, and they pay was practically non-existent. Still, they had to keep up appearances, so most had a rich mistress they spunged. Soldiers in uniform are sexy and mistresses are easy and fun, so why not? He is incredibly generous to his friends and will do anything in his power to help them (even lay down his life for them), although can be quite gullible and naïve and that is his great weakness.

As for Athos's pride and cynicism... He may be disillusioned, but in all his grief he does not become obnoxious or even boring. He does not wallow in self-pity, but only bears his due, quietly but not less afffected. He is maybe a proud man, but he is a rich man, and his pride mainly situates itself in his nobility. I don't know whether he is a cynic. Imagine yourself being cheated as he was. Would you ever trust anyone again? POSSIBLE TRILOGY SPOILER The way he dotes on Raoul and wastes away proves to me that he is touchable and incredibly generous, if only he has an object. firstly, I think, d'Artagnan becomes his object somewhat as he takes a kind of father role upon himself. Then it will be Raoul, his (il)legitimate son. POSSIBLE TRILOGY SPOILER OVER. To be honest, the only thing I think Athos wants to do is die as he has nothing to live for, though he seems to get som will to live from d'Artagnan.

I don't know whether Aramis is really insecure. He has a clear aim: taking revenge on that guy that offended him and that is why he is in the musketeers. I don't know if he ever did, but he will come to be a great man. Whether he reached that aim honourably or not, is the great (answerable) question, though. But I will say no more.

D'Artagnan is indeed not perfect, but he will grow up, even by the end of The Three Musketeers. I have always believed that Dumas meant him to be a somewhat ideal combination of all those three musketeers... Hene why the book is not called The Four musketeers which would have been more appropriate. A man with a noble and generous spirit (Athos), boisterous and courageous as well as generous towards his friends (always ready to help) (Porthos) and ambitious and clever (Aramis). It is true, all of them admire him for his clever and quick spirit, for his courage and for his ambition. At some point they even say he masters them all, and that despite his young age and lack of experience. He will reach his aim, be the most respected of them all and will have nothing to reproach himslf with, unlike another...

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Originally Posted by Lokasenna

Speaking as one with a professional interest folklore, in 'traditional tales' (as you have termed them) the use of beauty in a moral dimension is a lot more complex than you have suggested. Yes, you have ugly old witches and troll-women, it is true - but another class of mythical stereotype is the demonic/erotic woman.

I wrote my MA thesis on this character-type. She crops up everywhere - her great physical beauty is matched only by her capacity to cause chaos and destruction. This makes her a more worrying figure - the seductive qualities of her sex appeal give her an influence over both people and society. The old crone in the forest might be troublesome, but at least she is over there. The beautiful witch who has managed to infiltrate the society (and who is thus by implication more powerful) is a problem right on your own doorstep.

Milady fits very well into this pattern, though Dumas pulls it off with a degree of flair and artistry that make her an unusually captivating villain.

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Oh, and not to mention the fact that no-one suspects the nice little blonde, unlike the old and ugly crone...

Only the ugly/nonerotic large brunette need apply.



:banghead: