Does This Suck?

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12-03-2008, 06:16 PM
Countess

Does This Suck?

I should title it that.

You are
An Apollonian delight to the eye,
A divine revelation to man,

Your hair
A million honeyed velvet strands
Foretelling days of Spring

Your eyes
Two bluebirds on high
Twittering black haloed mysteries -

The love for Hyacinth
And Troilus,
The beauty of Narcissus
And Venus’ dead Adonis.

When God speaks, terror strikes men;
Kings topple kings , nations shatter
And vanish from the earth.

With his fingers
He reshapes landscapes.
Tornadoes, earthquakes and whirlwinds
Enrich or impoverish,
Disease eradicates
And indulgence destroys within.

But for all of this
He blesses us
With the grandeur of nature,
The rain-drop glistening upon the delicate oak leaf,
The dappled heavens cascading at Autumn twilight
The crystal moon casting her starry blue rays
upon earth’s green carpet.

And your face - AH!
The crowning king of current creation
(man is the pinnacle of His craft,
As crime is the nadir)

With a glance
it calls me like the sirens
To shipwreck my soul
Upon the beach of your beauty,
And carve an idol out of being.

Our universe now stands
As testimony to the impermanence of man;
Husserl’s epoch’s, Yeat’s gyres
Will unwind and respin

And your beauty will pass away,
with each falling grain in the hourglass,
What time gains
You will lose
Until all is spent in death.

So let your lips blossom
Forever, like honeysuckle in September,
And transform these honeyed strands to gold
And blue eyes to platinum's silver.
12-04-2008, 01:49 AM
Countess

I can't believe nobody has commented, and my friend told me it sucked! Have none of you the required intestinal fortitude to say "it sucks"?
12-04-2008, 08:04 AM
Virgil

It doesn't suck Countess. There are some good moments. My only qualm is that it can be tightened and shortened.

In the first section:

Quote:

You are
An Apollonian delight to the eye,
A divine revelation to man,

Your hair
A million honeyed velvet strands
Foretelling days of Spring

Your eyes
Two bluebirds on high
Twittering black haloed mysteries -

The love for Hyacinth
And Troilus,
The beauty of Narcissus
And Venus’ dead Adonis.

When God speaks, terror strikes men;
Kings topple kings , nations shatter
And vanish from the earth.

With his fingers
He reshapes landscapes.
Tornadoes, earthquakes and whirlwinds
Enrich or impoverish,
Disease eradicates
And indulgence destroys within.

I think that last stanza can be deleted. Either you've already said it in the previous or it's saying the obvious, "He reshapes landscapes."

In the second part,

Quote:

But for all of this
He blesses us
With the grandeur of nature,
The rain-drop glistening upon the delicate oak leaf,
The dappled heavens cascading at Autumn twilight
The crystal moon casting her starry blue rays
upon earth’s green carpet.

And your face - AH!
The crowning king of current creation
(man is the pinnacle of His craft,
As crime is the nadir)

With a glance
it calls me like the sirens
To shipwreck my soul
Upon the beach of your beauty,
And carve an idol out of being.

Our universe now stands
As testimony to the impermanence of man;
Husserl’s epoch’s, Yeat’s gyres
Will unwind and respin

And your beauty will pass away,
with each falling grain in the hourglass,
What time gains
You will lose
Until all is spent in death.

So let your lips blossom
Forever, like honeysuckle in September,
And transform these honeyed strands to gold
And blue eyes to platinum's silver.

I would just keep that first stanza and the last stanza. When a poem turns like that with a "But" you want to give it a short closing punch. By going on as long as you do, the point becomes lost. At least that's my opinion. See if this is a tighter poem by just deleting what I mentioned:

Quote:

You are
An Apollonian delight to the eye,
A divine revelation to man,

Your hair
A million honeyed velvet strands
Foretelling days of Spring

Your eyes
Two bluebirds on high
Twittering black haloed mysteries -

The love for Hyacinth
And Troilus,
The beauty of Narcissus
And Venus’ dead Adonis.

When God speaks, terror strikes men;
Kings topple kings , nations shatter
And vanish from the earth.

But for all of this
He blesses us
With the grandeur of nature,
The rain-drop glistening upon the delicate oak leaf,
The dappled heavens cascading at Autumn twilight
The crystal moon casting her starry blue rays
upon earth’s green carpet.

So let your lips blossom
Forever, like honeysuckle in September,
And transform these honeyed strands to gold
And blue eyes to platinum's silver.
12-04-2008, 08:25 AM
PrinceMyshkin

Quote:

Originally Posted by Countess

I can't believe nobody has commented, and my friend told me it sucked! Have none of you the required intestinal fortitude to say "it sucks"?

I didn't comment a) because I am not referring to the site as often as I used to and I didn't see this until just now but b) it's not so much the intestinal fortitude I might have lacked but the confidence to comment with as much conviction as Virgil did so thoughtfully!

After what is (for now) a rather quick overview, I want to say that it is a most challenging poem in that it manifests the usual broad reach of reference of so many of your posts and that it is an intellectually (and emotionally) demanding one. Excelsior!!
12-04-2008, 04:18 PM
Countess

Virgil - I gave you Legos and you built a house. Gracias! Gracias!
PM - thanks for the read. Yes, like you I don't come around here often - mostly because I'm busy as Satan at Christmastime, but it saddens me everytime I visit that the older, wiser folks don't post as often. Not that youth is to be despised - on the contrary - but I "look up" to certain people - Virgil, yourself, Firefangled among others. I need mentors/ role models too, you know. (-:
12-04-2008, 06:17 PM
cogs

Quote:

Originally Posted by Countess

I should title it that.

You are
An Apollonian delight to the eye,
A divine revelation to man,

Your hair
A million honeyed velvet strands
Foretelling days of Spring

Your eyes
Two bluebirds on high
Twittering black haloed mysteries -

below, i started to wonder if this was a second poem, because
there was no transition.

Quote:

The love for Hyacinth
And Troilus,
The beauty of Narcissus
And Venus’ dead Adonis.

When God speaks, terror strikes men;
Kings topple kings , nations shatter
And vanish from the earth.

With his fingers
He reshapes landscapes.
Tornadoes, earthquakes and whirlwinds
Enrich or impoverish,
Disease eradicates
And indulgence destroys within.

But for all of this
He blesses us
With the grandeur of nature,
The rain-drop glistening upon the delicate oak leaf,
The dappled heavens cascading at Autumn twilight
The crystal moon casting her starry blue rays
upon earth’s green carpet.

now, i thought you resumed your poem:

Quote:

And your face - AH!
The crowning king of current creation
(man is the pinnacle of His craft,
As crime is the nadir)

With a glance
it calls me like the sirens
To shipwreck my soul
Upon the beach of your beauty,
And carve an idol out of being.

Our universe now stands
As testimony to the impermanence of man;
Husserl’s epoch’s, Yeat’s gyres
Will unwind and respin

And your beauty will pass away,
with each falling grain in the hourglass,
What time gains
You will lose
Until all is spent in death.

So let your lips blossom
Forever, like honeysuckle in September,
And transform these honeyed strands to gold
And blue eyes to platinum's silver.

as far as imagery, i love it... i would just suggest more transition(for the reader) and more internal explanation of your imagery. good job, no, it doesn't suck at all, you have the right idea.
12-04-2008, 08:02 PM
firefangled

I was much too late to comment, especially since Virgil did such an excellent editing. However, that said, it does not suck. I think your poems, including this one, sometimes have more than enough for one poem.

When you edit, I would not throw the whittles away for that reason.
12-05-2008, 04:02 PM
Countess

Cog - here are my notes - if you can call them that: (-:

Apollo - Sun god who embodies the concept of kouros, or beardless youth (thus the god who is most closely associated with male beauty). Apollo was the head of the muses, and so the greatest muse himself.

God of prophesy ("fortelling days of spring" - "Black haloed (pupils) mysteries") , poetry and the arts.

God who also had more male lovers than the other gods combined - Hyacinth and Troilus (Some think Troilus was his son; others his lover). Narcissus embodies a beautiful youth's love for himself, and Adonis/Venus - the notion of the love of older women (goddesses) for pretty youths.

In short: male to male, male to self; female to male

Part II - Starting with "When God speaks" - the impermenance of our world - the only constant is change; entrophy, historical epoches. "Nothing lasts".

"But for all of this" - the temporal compensations for entrophy, decay and death.
Specifically - "his face" (male beauty). But even this I convert from blessing to sin by worshipping it the way I do.

Part III - Going back to the previous notion of transition, change etc, his beauty is also fleeting. Time will write lines in the sand of his flesh - and he will grow old and die.

Last stanza: "Nothing gold can stay". Well, let gold become gold then. Transmute decaying flesh into metal (alchemy) so it can last forever (thinking now of Apollo's statue
12-08-2008, 12:16 AM
MorpheusSandman

Reminds me a bit of Milton trying to do imagism... or an imagist trying to do Milton. I like some of the references, and your notes show definite forethought and design. I think the problem with it is making it easier for the reader to make transitions between sections and ideas. The rough changes between stanzas make it too easy for the reader to get lost. You and I have the same problem when attempting to compose long poems in that the greatest challenge with poetry (in general) is making every word, every idea, every change count; and in a long form it becomes especially difficult to glue it together solidly, sustainedly, and still make it seamless.

Work on it a bit more; do some serious self-editing. It by no means sucks; much of the imagery is evocative and the allusions fit nicely with the ideas. Work on the voice; make it a bit clearer who is speaking and then you might can do a short internal monologue that shows the speaker's transition from one idea to the other. The hardest part is in finding a transition that is seamless and relevant. If you can tie the poem together with crux's that act as transitions then you'll be well on your way to mastering the longer forms.

Here's some detailed notes/criticism:

Quote:

Originally Posted by Countess

Your eyes
Two bluebirds on high
Twittering black haloed mysteries -

The love for Hyacinth
And Troilus,
The beauty of Narcissus
And Venus’ dead Adonis.

When God speaks, terror strikes men;
Kings topple kings , nations shatter
And vanish from the earth.

Read these three stanzas together and understand the roughness and confusedness of the transition.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Countess

With his fingers
He reshapes landscapes.
Tornadoes, earthquakes and whirlwinds
Enrich or impoverish,
Disease eradicates
And indulgence destroys within.

But for all of this
He blesses us
With the grandeur of nature,
The rain-drop glistening upon the delicate oak leaf,
The dappled heavens cascading at Autumn twilight
The crystal moon casting her starry blue rays
upon earth’s green carpet.

I think these stanzas should be shortened. This section is the weakest IMO even though it contains some good moments.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Countess

And your face - AH!
The crowning king of current creation
(man is the pinnacle of His craft,
As crime is the nadir)

Again, rough transition. The middle section seems to fragment this which fits with the first.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Countess

With a glance
it calls me like the sirens
To shipwreck my soul
Upon the beach of your beauty,
And carve an idol out of being.

I especially like this metaphor. Though I might find a way to work the sirens/ship/wreck metaphor into the first and last line.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Countess

Our universe now stands
As testimony to the impermanence of man;
Husserl’s epoch’s, Yeat’s gyres
Will unwind and respin

Another rough transition.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Countess

And your beauty will pass away,
with each falling grain in the hourglass,
What time gains
You will lose
Until all is spent in death.

So let your lips blossom
Forever, like honeysuckle in September,
And transform these honeyed strands to gold
And blue eyes to platinum's silver.

I like the idea of connecting the transience of beauty with that of our world. If you can find a way to connect the first two sections then something along this line where you tie the two together will work more powerfully because people will understand how you've set up up the poem to work in two sections with the final tying the two together.

I'm currently working on my own long-form poem which is very ambitious for me. It's coming a long very slowly. I've started it 3 times now after having scrapped the first two attempts. After finding an opening that I think I like I'm trying to work on the transitions between the various sections. I think I have a lot of good ideas, but putting them together is another matter entirely!
12-08-2008, 12:44 AM
cogs

great post morpheus... i find that transitions guide me into places i didn't originally mean for my poem to lead.
i say let the poem drive, because for one, it'll take less time, and for two, it will sound smoother because the transitions are leading to questions that must be answered. i try to guide the poem toward my original thought the best i can.
also, i'm producing a sentiment that i want to share and to be validated in others. when they have trouble following my thought, the ideas are diluted somewhat.
so the reader, to me, is as important as my own thoughts.