Has been Hemingway overrated?

[Frédéric Moreau]

It is a feeling that dawns on me every time I read him, every time I read some Spanish writers of the same period, like Valle Inclán, Unamuno or Pío Baroja. It is the sense that somehow they have been awfully overrated, that in spite of not being terrible writers their works are not masterpieces comparable to that of Dos Passos, Faulkner or Joyce, for instance. Perhaps is only a different way of writing that I, personally, do not like; but, anyway, I would like to know if that feeling is shared by the participants of this Forum.

Thank you,
Frédéric

[Frédéric Moreau]

The thread's title is clearly wrong, but when I realised it was too late. I do not know how to edit it.

[Emil Miller]

The thread's title is clearly wrong, but when I realised it was too late. I do not know how to edit it.

Some postmodernists might think your erroneous title is adept. However, in my view, there are certain inadequacies in Hemingway that are sometimes overlooked in critical analysis of his works. Where he excels is in his ability to conjure up a scene succinctly that leaves a lasting impression on the reader.

[Frédéric Moreau]

I agree with you. I am not saying that he was a bad writer, actually I think that he was a good one, but not as great as is portraited by some critics. And, as I have said before, perhaps my jugdement is not fair because I dislike his literary style, and I cannot utter an appropriate critic.

[Emil Miller]

I agree with you. I am not saying that he was a bad writer, actually I think that he was a good one, but not as great as is portraited by some critics. And, as I have said before, perhaps my jugdement is not fair because I dislike his literary style, and I cannot utter an appropriate critic.

Your critique is one that is often levelled at Hemingway. His style is really one of reportage that condenses the story into its basic elements for dramatic effect; similar to the use of montage in film. In this respect, he is the opposite of Faulkner, Joyce and others of his contemporaries but if the reader want's to get to the heart of a story, Hemingway will take him there effectively and more quickly than most.

[Frédéric Moreau]

Yes, I totally agree with you again, you have extraordinarly pointed out the crux of the matter. And excuse my English, I didn't want to wiite 'protaited'. Portrayed instead.

[mortalterror]

One of the best prose stylists of the English language. Not overrated. Definitely as good or better than his contemporaries Faulkner, Joyce, Steinbeck, Fitzgerald, Woolf, Lawrence, Maugham, Camus, Proust, Hesse, Mann, Lagerkvist, Akutagawa, Nabokov, and better than Dos Passos or Sinclair Lewis. Every bit the equal of his predecessors Kipling, James, Hamsun, Hardy, Conrad, Ford, and as good as anyone since.

[JBI]

One of the best prose stylists of the English language. Not overrated. Definitely as good or better than his contemporaries Faulkner, Joyce, Steinbeck, Fitzgerald, Woolf, Lawrence, Maugham, Camus, Proust, Hesse, Mann, Lagerkvist, Akutagawa, Nabokov, and better than Dos Passos or Sinclair Lewis. Every bit the equal of his predecessors Kipling, James, Hamsun, Hardy, Conrad, Ford, and as good as anyone since.

Hemmingway is probably the most American of authors. In a sense, he is the most understated and subtle of prose stylists the country ever produced, and he manages to capture the "spirit of the age" without even saying anything directly.

IF anything, he is underrated, as the trend now has been to move toward more accessible Hollywood style good old American Kitsch, and away from the sort of gritty harshness that underlies the best of Hemmingway's work. His Iceberg theory of literature is perhaps the best psychological adaptation of an American, particularly a Small Town American mentality which still pervades much of the United States. The Subtlety is the same as Gatsby's great narrator Nick, who has the same sort of Iceberg of a role in the novel.


As for who comes after Hemmingway - well, look at American prose compared to English prose; it's all simple, direct sentences that carry punch, not long, complex, overtly ornate sentences. Such a thing is Unamaerican.

[mortalterror]

Hemmingway is probably the most American of authors. In a sense, he is the most understated and subtle of prose stylists the country ever produced, and he manages to capture the "spirit of the age" without even saying anything directly.

IF anything, he is underrated, as the trend now has been to move toward more accessible Hollywood style good old American Kitsch, and away from the sort of gritty harshness that underlies the best of Hemmingway's work. His Iceberg theory of literature is perhaps the best psychological adaptation of an American, particularly a Small Town American mentality which still pervades much of the United States. The Subtlety is the same as Gatsby's great narrator Nick, who has the same sort of Iceberg of a role in the novel.


As for who comes after Hemmingway - well, look at American prose compared to English prose; it's all simple, direct sentences that carry punch, not long, complex, overtly ornate sentences. Such a thing is Unamaerican.

I don't know that he's so uniquely American. I see a lot of common ground between him and Wordsworth. Both work under an aesthetic of "emotion recollected in tranquility" and have a special place in their aesthetic for lyrical descriptions of nature. He's highly conscious of working in a tradition, and there are nods to American authors such as Ambrose Bierce's An Occurrence at Owl Creek Bridge in The Snows of Kilimanjaro. Here and there there are traces of Stephen Crane, and most notably the prose style he borrowed from Sherwood Anderson. But he just as often shows the influence of Tolstoy's War and Peace, Turgenev's Sportsmen's Sketches, or the short stories of Chekhov and De Maupassant. He's a lot more cosmopolitan, international, and sophisticated then I think most people give him credit for. His letters are full of talk about Flaubert, Dostoyevski, Gabriele D'Annunzio, Henry James, Shakespeare, Izaak Walton, Twain, etc. "Across the River and Into the Trees" had a bunch of stuff about Dante in it. "Islands In the Stream" was full of all the things he'd learned from French museums and painters like Picasso whom he'd hob nobbed with at parties.

[JHG]

In a "gut-level" response the the OP:

Yes, Hemingway is overrated by the general reading population. If you ask a typical American to name three famous American Writers, they'll name Hemingway and struggle with the other two.

But at the same time, he is underappreciated by academics. As JBI states, Hemingway pretty much created a style that exists to this day. This simple style may cause the absorbed Academic to browse over Hemingway and choose Faulkner or Fitzgerald instead (as a focus of study), as there is more to be drawn out and analyzed in those other authors. But the craft is in that simplicity, that directness that Hemingway is so famous for. As a amateur author, I am expecially appreciative. Several times after reading a chapter or a page of Hemingway, I've looked back and asked, "How the hell did he do that?"

[Frédéric Moreau]

I am not going to hide that I don't like his style or, to put it in a politer way, that I don't suit his 'literary world'. However, it has been said here that he wrote better than Dos Passos and that he is comparable to Thomas Mann. Though I don't regard Art as a competition and I think that some works are not comparable to others, I must say that the distance between the depth of The magic mountain and that of, for instance, The old man and the sea (a horrible version of Conrad's The end of the tether—one of the worse rated novels ever) is larger than the Atlantic Ocean.

[Frostball]

If you ask a typical American to name three famous American Writers, they'll name Hemingway and struggle with the other two.

Heck, they'd probably say Stephen King and Dan Brown before thinking of Hemingway

[Frédéric Moreau]

Heck, they'd probably say Stephen King and Dan Brown before thinking of Hemingway

That is so highbrow, probably the innumerable shades of Grey.

[JHG]

I guess I should have qualified that statement about the famous writers. I had a good chuckle at "innumerable shades."

[sandy14]

In short - no.

Whilst Joyce was conducting experiments with the limits possibility of text and reader patience - Hemmingway was producing something eminently readable.

The Old Man at the Bridge is a masterpiece of sparse, clean prose that does a lot with very little. Certainly Fleming & Henry Miller learnt something from Hemmingway rather than Joyce.

[Pope of Eruke]

In short - no.

Whilst Joyce was conducting experiments with the limits possibility of text and reader patience - Hemmingway was producing something eminently readable.

The Old Man at the Bridge is a masterpiece of sparse, clean prose that does a lot with very little. Certainly Fleming & Henry Miller learnt something from Hemmingway rather than Joyce.

That is sacrilege around these parts :smilewinkgrin: Joyce, Beckett and O’Brien, the Father, Son and Holy Ghost of Irish literature...

I do love Joyce though. There is room for the likes of both Hemmingway and Joyce.

[PeterL]

I'm not an enthusiast of Hemingway, but I think that many people underrate mhim, because he wrote in a direct style, but the reader has to read into the story to see what he was getting at.

[Levity]

I enjoy Hemingway's writing. His use of the Iceberg Theory works out well and tends to keep me engaged. If you read Hemingway and take his writing at face value, I can see how the reader can be put off, but it is the undertones and vivid nuances of his story telling that make him a great author.

[Poetaster]

I don't think Hemingway is overrated. He wrote one of my favorite short stories. I do think he was a flawed person, and those flaws affected his writing, but 'overrated'? No.

[Whosis]

I think Hemingway, just like Fitzgerald, was partly known for his style (Fitzgerald used the m-dash unlike anyone else). However, Hemingway's style is widely emulated, particularly the fast-paced dialogue. At least for me, his choice of ending for A Farewell To Arms also shows his maturity as an author.