to figure something out

[cacian]

''to write is to figure something out''.

it is not necessarily an immediate thing but just a something that may later on be found by someone else a reader/writer.
The writer who reads a story gets it. He or she then writes it up in their own way to pass it on to effect.
And if and when one does not get it then he she writes a story in tangent with it and not against it.

''to write is to figure something out''
is not to be taken literally but synonymously. It could mean to give anonymity a continuity ie allows someone else,s a reader or writer, to explore the fundamentals of words applied to stories and how they can improve in meanings in other stories.

do you agree?

[cafolini]

Cacian always figures everything out of something. Look at the question she's asking now? ROFLMAO

[AuntShecky]

I can’t even begin to address your question because you have an extremely strange and idiosyncratic way of expression which I, for one, find painfully incomprehensible.

There may be a remedy, a way to get your thoughts ready for human consumption.Stop wasting your time by posting thread after ridiculous thread and instead use that time productively by reading.

While immersing yourself in reading over a period of time, it may be possible for you to acquire a working knowledge of Standard Written English, which can be found in published books. By spending lots of time reading you could, perhaps by a process of osmosis, pick up the ability to communicate, or at least one would hope.

Reading many books on various subjects might help carry you to a point where you could write clearly so that others could understand what you are attempting to say.

Always keep a good dictionary near you and don’t be afraid to use it.

Never click to submit a post before reading it first, preferably aloud.

It is completely up to you whether you choose to do more reading. Otherwise, if you ignore this friendly advice and keep on posting gibberish, do not be surprised if your fellow LitNutters continue to vilify or ignore you. Some day you’ll run up one of your thousands of flags only to discover that nobody wants to salute.

[cafolini]

By a process of osmosis. ROF!!

[cacian]

By a process of osmosis. ROF!!

Here is word 'osmosis' I may look up. I could try and imagine what it could mean without checking my dictionary.
could it mean to transform but in surreal manner? I am not sure. I will check it up.

[cacian]

I can’t even begin to address your question because you have an extremely strange and idiosyncratic way of expression which I, for one, find painfully incomprehensible.

There may be a remedy, a way to get your thoughts ready for human consumption.Stop wasting your time by posting thread after ridiculous thread and instead use that time productively by reading.

While immersing yourself in reading over a period of time, it may be possible for you to acquire a working knowledge of Standard Written English, which can be found in published books. By spending lots of time reading you could, perhaps by a process of osmosis, pick up the ability to communicate, or at least one would hope.

Reading many books on various subjects might help carry you to a point where you could write clearly so that others could understand what you are attempting to say.

Always keep a good dictionary near you and don’t be afraid to use it.

Never click to submit a post before reading it first, preferably aloud.

It is completely up to you whether you choose to do more reading. Otherwise, if you ignore this friendly advice and keep on posting gibberish, do not be surprised if your fellow LitNutters continue to vilify or ignore you. Some day you’ll run up one of your thousands of flags only to discover that nobody wants to salute.

AuntShecky I salute you.
I take your advice very simply.

[Delta40]

AuntShecky I salute you.
I take your advice very simply.

But will you take it literally?

[cacian]

But will you take it literally?

Oh yes I will Delta I take everything literally and this where the issue is I think with me what say and how I write.I do write very fast because I think fast. In real life face to face I am very different because I do not have to think speak type.
I can't type also. My keyboard drives nuts. I have had typing lessons and I still can't type. I speak loudly as I type because I need to hear the word first.
It is hard to try to assimilate a language into its written form. My spoken English is fluent. I have lived in England London for at least 18 years married and live with English people too believe it or not. My kids are fluent English speakers and guess what I am not so.
The issue I have is I speed think and then compile lots of words together as if in a race LOL terrible haha.
I now I need to slow down but hey I am in this forum to learn and I guess some may see it a wound up when it is really just trying hard to keep up with the rest of English speaking population.
There is others things as well I cannot talk about and so English I must type because I have too.

[Lokasenna]

I can’t even begin to address your question because you have an extremely strange and idiosyncratic way of expression which I, for one, find painfully incomprehensible.

There may be a remedy, a way to get your thoughts ready for human consumption.Stop wasting your time by posting thread after ridiculous thread and instead use that time productively by reading.

While immersing yourself in reading over a period of time, it may be possible for you to acquire a working knowledge of Standard Written English, which can be found in published books. By spending lots of time reading you could, perhaps by a process of osmosis, pick up the ability to communicate, or at least one would hope.

Reading many books on various subjects might help carry you to a point where you could write clearly so that others could understand what you are attempting to say.

Always keep a good dictionary near you and don’t be afraid to use it.

Never click to submit a post before reading it first, preferably aloud.

It is completely up to you whether you choose to do more reading. Otherwise, if you ignore this friendly advice and keep on posting gibberish, do not be surprised if your fellow LitNutters continue to vilify or ignore you. Some day you’ll run up one of your thousands of flags only to discover that nobody wants to salute.

If LitNet had a 'like' button feature, I'd be hammering it for this post.

As usual, Aunty gives great advice - Cacian, I heartily recommend that you take it on board.

[cacian]

Dear Loka I have taken it on board. Everything of course may be taken on board. But I think there is a tiny message up there in the post that no one really spotted.
I thought we were all about reading. No one read to understand what I wrote and yet I read you all all the time .
There is a bit of give and take in everything. I take reasonably from you but I think you tend to overeact about the spellings and grammar and forget about what I am trying to say. I have written and posted more often then none but that is because I am interested in theory literature badly written books and poetry.
I say what I have in mind dutifully to myself because I feel it needs to be said. It is not done in malice. I have view points that differ from yours and that I think is mainly the issue here. I don't think the same as you.
Anyway enough said. I believe learning is as much about enquiring questioning and wanting to get to the bottom of it as well writing about it. Reading is a leisure next to it.

[qimissung]

I can’t even begin to address your question because you have an extremely strange and idiosyncratic way of expression which I, for one, find painfully incomprehensible.

There may be a remedy, a way to get your thoughts ready for human consumption.Stop wasting your time by posting thread after ridiculous thread and instead use that time productively by reading.

While immersing yourself in reading over a period of time, it may be possible for you to acquire a working knowledge of Standard Written English, which can be found in published books. By spending lots of time reading you could, perhaps by a process of osmosis, pick up the ability to communicate, or at least one would hope.

Reading many books on various subjects might help carry you to a point where you could write clearly so that others could understand what you are attempting to say.

Always keep a good dictionary near you and don’t be afraid to use it.

Never click to submit a post before reading it first, preferably aloud.

It is completely up to you whether you choose to do more reading. Otherwise, if you ignore this friendly advice and keep on posting gibberish, do not be surprised if your fellow LitNutters continue to vilify or ignore you. Some day you’ll run up one of your thousands of flags only to discover that nobody wants to salute.

The painfully incomprehensible part-at this point I really think this is intentional, don't you?

[cafolini]

The painfully incomprehensible part-at this point I really think this is intentional, don't you?

Nooooo. Cacian is exempt from intentions. ROF!!

[hillwalker]

I thought we were all about reading. No one read to understand what I wrote and yet I read you all all the time .
There is a bit of give and take in everything. I take reasonably from you but I think you tend to overeact about the spellings and grammar and forget about what I am trying to say. I have written and posted more often then none but that is because I am interested in theory literature badly written books and poetry.
Reading is a leisure next to it.

Maybe the problem is that LitNet works through the medium of the English language. If we can't understand what you are trying to say or ask then no matter how many posts you submit you're failing to communicate with us effectively. We cannot read your mind.

. . . maybe that's just as well.

H

[Maximilianus]

Here is word 'osmosis' I may look up. I could try and imagine what it could mean without checking my dictionary.
could it mean to transform but in surreal manner? I am not sure. I will check it up.

Dearest cacian, I do believe that your main difficulty is that you think in an overly 'surreal' manner, when things are much simpler than they seem to appear to you. Here goes an example


Osmosis: (slang) Picking up knowledge accidentally, without actually seeking that particular knowledge. Example: I was reading about chickens, and I guess I learned about hawks through osmosis.

See how simple it is? You seem to get carried away with the wild metaphysical meaning that you seem to imagine beyond words or ideas. That's not really helpful in communication. You need to develop communicational skills and, to accomplish that goal, you need to get your foot away from the gas pedal and start using the common linguistic framework that people understand. It's wonderfully useful to become a best friend of dictionaries, spelling, and grammar, but most of all, to take things easy. If you are really interested in communicating, you need to learn to use the language in a way that most people understand. Take your time and refrain from writing or speaking until you master how to frame your ideas in clear sentences. It is evident that you find it hard to master the language; probably you cannot do it on your own and need to seek some sort of professional help. Clear ideas cannot be framed in a matter of a split second hitting the keyboard. Punctuation marks were created for emitters to organize their ideas, to take a break and breathe, and for receptors to catch whatever an emitter is trying to communicate. Spelling serves the purpose of everyone using the same words, so that we all understand what the others are speaking about, to avoid confusion. Grammar serves a similar purpose. If everyone spoke or wrote by following the whims of their own minds, then no one would ever understand no one and communication wouldn't even be a crazy dream. The way we communicate does need to follow a sort of fixed structure; not totally fixed, but definitely not totally loose either.
I think you can make it, but first you need to wish for it. Learn to slow down and be patient with yourself. After that, you need to love English as it is, or you'll never be able to use it effectively. Don't try to change the language any more than the past generations already did; it's pretty good as it is and doesn't need any more whimsical modifications by any of us who are not native speakers of it. In any case, leave the major structural changes to expert grammarians if they so find it convenient. Try to learn the language as it is and you will find a world of happiness in getting your messages through.
Once again, slow down, take a few deep breaths and think at your own pace. You don't need to catch up with anyone because it won't be the end of the world if you can't. Every person has their own speed and needs to accept it. There are more important things in life than keeping up with other people. Your worst enemy is not the others being faster and more accurate than you. Your worst enemy is not accepting that you are what you are, and that you need to put more time and training on the development of your communicational skills.
I do believe you can succeed if you make the decision to start and stick yourself to an improvement plan. It won't come easy and you won't see the results from dusk to dawn, but in time you will find yourself being understood and you will enjoy it.
Most people get jumpy and grumpy when someone speaks or writes in cryptic ways. If you don't accept and learn the basic rules of communication, most of what you will receive will be hostility.
Please think about it very carefully, and when you read all this, by all means make an effort and try to read it slowly to get its essence.

[cacian]

Maybe the problem is that LitNet works through the medium of the English language. If we can't understand what you are trying to say or ask then no matter how many posts you submit you're failing to communicate with us effectively. We cannot read your mind.

. . . maybe that's just as well.

H

Perfectly well. Please do not summarise every one in LiNet, There are many here who understand enough of what I write to get by.
However I also don't seem to get you either. You talk pedogically with specifis and I try and talk across the board metaphysically. I understand you do not see it because all you can see is errors I make. That cannot be helped if one is not native speaker nonetheless it does not mean I shall not carry on writing. One learns by praticing. Practice makes perfect.
There are many things you talk about which do not make sense to me. It is not a structural thing it is a pedagogical one. Logically speaking you talk across me and I talk across you. You have issues with creation of new words/new spellings/new meanings/ new no punctuation. Anything slightely different from what you are used and then it overeactionary.
Your thinking and the way you approach evidences is very different from mine. You pick on derigotaries and you fail to notice the positives of what is being suggested or put in front of you. In the same way I do not have a perfect fluent grasp in the English language. That again does not stop one me from writing and posting. My intentions is to communicate new ideas and learn through them because that is what literature requires one to do. To enquire via a medium of language. Questions and an inquisitive mind is what I am.
Any way enough of me ranting.
I am sure you don't understand anything I have just written as per usual. I will leave it at that.

[Delta40]

I'm cheering for cacian. Especially when given advice from Max. And I will have coffee with you too!

[cacian]

Dearest cacian, I do believe that your main difficulty is that you think in an overly 'surreal' manner, when things are much simpler than they seem to appear to you. Here goes an example



See how simple it is? You seem to get carried away with the wild metaphysical meaning that you seem to imagine beyond words or ideas. That's not really helpful in communication. You need to develop communicational skills and, to accomplish that goal, you need to get your foot away from the gas pedal and start using the common linguistic framework that people understand. It's wonderfully useful to become a best friend of dictionaries, spelling, and grammar, but most of all, to take things easy. If you are really interested in communicating, you need to learn to use the language in a way that most people understand. Take your time and refrain from writing or speaking until you master how to frame your ideas in clear sentences. It is evident that you find it hard to master the language; probably you cannot do it on your own and need to seek some sort of professional help. Clear ideas cannot be framed in a matter of a split second hitting the keyboard. Punctuation marks were created for emitters to organize their ideas, to take a break and breathe, and for receptors to catch whatever an emitter is trying to communicate. Spelling serves the purpose of everyone using the same words, so that we all understand what the others are speaking about, to avoid confusion. Grammar serves a similar purpose. If everyone spoke or wrote by following the whims of their own minds, then no one would ever understand no one and communication wouldn't even be a crazy dream. The way we communicate does need to follow a sort of fixed structure; not totally fixed, but definitely not totally loose either.
I think you can make it, but first you need to wish for it. Learn to slow down and be patient with yourself. After that, you need to love English as it is, or you'll never be able to use it effectively. Don't try to change the language any more than the past generations already did; it's pretty good as it is and doesn't need any more whimsical modifications by any of us who are not native speakers of it. In any case, leave the major structural changes to expert grammarians if they so find it convenient. Try to learn the language as it is and you will find a world of happiness in getting your messages through.
Once again, slow down, take a few deep breaths and think at your own pace. You don't need to catch up with anyone because it won't be the end of the world if you can't. Every person has their own speed and needs to accept it. There are more important things in life than keeping up with other people. Your worst enemy is not the others being faster and more accurate than you. Your worst enemy is not accepting that you are what you are, and that you need to put more time and training on the development of your communicational skills.
I do believe you can succeed if you make the decision to start and stick yourself to an improvement plan. It won't come easy and you won't see the results from dusk to dawn, but in time you will find yourself being understood and you will enjoy it.
Most people get jumpy and grumpy when someone speaks or writes in cryptic ways. If you don't accept and learn the basic rules of communication, most of what you will receive will be hostility.
Please think about it very carefully, and when you read all this, by all means make an effort and try to read it slowly to get its essence.

Hi Maxi just for a minute I thought the whole condensed text was the definition of OSMOSIS.
I am glad it is not. Imagine when I read through the whole only to realise it was not. ;)

[hillwalker]

I am sure you don't understand anything I have just written as per usual. I will leave it at that.

The problem is that I do understand it after some degree of guesswork. I don't have a problem with you abandoning the normal means of communication in order to be creative - it's when you ask us to help you with the meaning of a particular word then disagree with our definition because it doesn' fit your own surreal interpretation. Why ask the question if you already have the answer and don't want to listen to anyone else's?

Language is meant to be fluid and if you were to bother reading some of my work on here you would discover that I don't have issues with "creation of new words/new spellings/new meanings/ new punctuation". But unless you understand the rules, you can't break them.

H

[cacian]

The problem is that I do understand it after some degree of guesswork. I don't have a problem with you abandoning the normal means of communication in order to be creative - it's when you ask us to help you with the meaning of a particular word then disagree with our definition because it doesn' fit your own surreal interpretation. Why ask the question if you already have the answer and don't want to listen to anyone else's?

I do listen and it does not come across as if I do that is because I cannot take on board what I cannot understand. It is in the very same way that you do with me. It is not intentional it is simply that I can only accept what make sense to me. That is the issue I have and like wise others have with me. You can only tolerate what is the same as you. Bu I also think one must allow for more room to manoeuver around differences because it helps the mind open up and tolerate is the word really for it.
Interpretation is wide and far it is not black and white. It sements in all ways shapes or forms one must let one say the way their logic sees it.
It is acceptable to delay insinuations and create new ones. Language can then only prosper and grow.



Language is meant to be fluid and if you were to bother reading some of my work on here you would discover that I don't have issues with "creation of new words/new spellings/new meanings/ new punctuation". But unless you understand the rules, you can't break them.

H
I will have a look at your work and I am sorry if I did not do or seemed have not done.
About breaking rules you put your finger on it. My interpretation of one being able to break the rules is that because one does understand language feels and formations and one needs to readjust it ie 'break the rule' in order that their idea of language perception comes through is. Transformation osmosis metamorphosis is cynical and I am anything and all that. I write to signify identify and rectify the feel of a language i know and understand and hopefully bring forth an intereaction that is deemed worthy of reading. It is engrained in me and there is nothing I can do but carry on molding what I write to a degree of outrageous sensibility. Shy is to sleep on a pillow as far as language is concerned. Stormy and well put is what language wants and I oblige it freely.

[mona amon]

I like Cacian's posts. I don't read all of them because there are just too many posts/threads, but taken in moderation I find them whacky, quirky, original and with a peculiar logic of their own.


Stormy and well put is what language wants and I oblige it freely.

Way to go, Cacian! :)

[Delta40]

I can envision you becoming insensible as you mold language but I have a feeling others around you will become insensible first :-)

[cacian]

I like Cacian's posts. I don't read all of them because there are just too many posts/threads, but taken in moderation I find them whacky, quirky, original and with a peculiar logic of their own.



Way to go, Cacian! :)
Thank you mona mona and I do reciprocate the same feelings. I find what you say and post down to earth and measured. :)


I can envision you becoming insensible as you mold language but I have a feeling others around you will become insensible first :-)

LOl insensible well humours is partly the reason one must insensitise. I understand your point and yes nothing is a smooth ride at first but whilst one is at it one must carry on. Isn't there a saying the ''keep calm and carry on'' one ? :)

[Buh4Bee]

Cacian, don't change. You are almost a legend or myth. Something unreal we all strive to become. Peace to you and yours.

[Shaman_Raman]

Cacian, maybe it's the rum, but if you speak in real life as you write and post, I think you're going to get a following. It'll be called it the religion of Cacian, and it will be spoken in poetic metaphysical synonymous tongue.

[prendrelemick]

Cacian, don't change. You are almost a legend or myth. Something unreal we all strive to become. Peace to you and yours.


I'll second that. (That means I agree with the above.) (I don't mean "above" in the heavenly sense though, I mean I agree with Buh4Bee.) ( I agree with her last post that is.)

[osho]

The problem is that I do understand it after some degree of guesswork. I don't have a problem with you abandoning the normal means of communication in order to be creative - it's when you ask us to help you with the meaning of a particular word then disagree with our definition because it doesn' fit your own surreal interpretation. Why ask the question if you already have the answer and don't want to listen to anyone else's?

Language is meant to be fluid and if you were to bother reading some of my work on here you would discover that I don't have issues with "creation of new words/new spellings/new meanings/ new punctuation". But unless you understand the rules, you can't break them.

H

hillwalker, be a valleywalker too. English is today not for the few perfectionists only. It has through colonization gone far. Of course is not unnatural for a good writer like you to be bothered about when English is raided with barbaric stuffs. I do not know English the way most do here on this forum and yet I cannot give up writing. caain is not a versatile writer and her works do not come up to the standards you and the rest purist school of thought indeed. She is not for the class. She is indeed for the mass. That includes the me type.

I owe you, my friend. I take everything you say positively and indeed your presence and comments are helping us to improve and hone our styles. The only thing I find abominable of you is you look at things from a too much purist lens in this age of globalization.

[hillwalker]

Thanks osho.

What concerns me is that several overseas members visit this site in order to improve their English. Having cacian as LitNet's spokesperson 'for the mass' is about as helpful as having a blind man give an artist directions on how to paint a picture. Her mangled vocabulary has already been commented on by other members anxious to offer advice yet she persists in her mission to create her own alternative language. How that is supposed to help anyone improve their English heaven knows.

It's not a case of being a purist or a perfectionist - it's a case of either accepting defeat and watching this site become a joke or doing something about it. Maybe it's already too late - it seems that the lunatic has indeed taken over the asylum.

H

[cafolini]

The moon, luna, is rolling through the asylum. But we can't give up pointing it out. The meaningless noise has always been bigger from the luna-tic.

[osho]

Thanks osho.

What concerns me is that several overseas members visit this site in order to improve their English. Having cacian as LitNet's spokesperson 'for the mass' is about as helpful as having a blind man give an artist directions on how to paint a picture. Her mangled vocabulary has already been commented on by other members anxious to offer advice yet she persists in her mission to create her own alternative language. How that is supposed to help anyone improve their English heaven knows.

It's not a case of being a purist or a perfectionist - it's a case of either accepting defeat and watching this site become a joke or doing something about it. Maybe it's already too late - it seems that the lunatic has indeed taken over the asylum.

H
I agree to a great extent and particularly when it comes to her poems I often some incomprehensibly bothersome words. She can through conscious efforts better her writing style. I myself am rather poor at writing. One of my weaknesses that raised a lot of comments on my writings, particularly on poems is mainly due to the fact that I am not in the habit of editing or redoing my work. That is why grammatical errors were bound to appear in them. They were not due to my poor knowledge in grammar but mainly owing to my negligence. With this said I do not to claim I can writer at par with native writers. I have yet to go miles.

Of course cacain must take your suggestion positively, plan her learning processes and hone her style. In my case I do not want to use the words I am not sure of. With regards to using words I make conscious efforts. I love words and do not want to make wrong and twisted use of them. This will be injustice and disservice to the reader. I am planning my writing. I read avidly and take pride in the fact that my range of reading encompasses a higher rage from spirituality through economics to literature, philosophy. Anything in print moves me. I am poor at structuring my sentence and sequencing my context but I have full confidence in my word power because I am by nature a bookworm and that has given me the advantage of learning new words and of course new ideas too.

H what I have said may sound irrelevant and out of context here but I am doing this since I have been thinking for long to share my situation as a writer trying to write in a language I took as a second language. It is not to impress anybody here I am doing this but to express myself( borrowed from you) rather boldly and of course publicly.