On Libertinism

[Alexander III]

I just want to have a small discussion on Libertinism. There is the whole cliche of pursuing this lifestyle to try and fill a void in the self and that it does not lead to happiness but only more sorrow and emptiness. That is false, there is no void, in fact the majority of decent and respectable human lives in my eyes seem pathetic and empty. Libertinism does not lead to sadness, that is what those who forgot to taste Youth while it was still ripe say to comfort themselves. Is that not perfectly human? She is beautiful and I want her, but she does not want me and I can never have her, so I say to the man who is fvucking her that she is a whore and such women disgust me. Libertinism gives a great deal of happiness. Last night I had a minor coke overdose (minor as in I was sick for an hour or 2 but then I got fine) but the thing is, that is ok, it happens. The more and more I pursue every kind of pleasure I can imagine, the more I realize that this is life, what do I care wither I came from and wherefore? Why should I? Why should life be dedicated to anything but the pursuit of pleasure. When you die and mind you, you shall die, what great achievement was it to have been respected by society, what is the point of that legacy and immortality you have conquered by your great deeds; do we stop at every spec of dust and ponder ahh you were once a mountain beyond mountains, or do we merely trample over it on the way to work or to that restaurant which serves the mussels in that delightful red sauce. What is there if not for pleasure, it is tangible and real. Many of this site give diatribes against religious men for dedicating their lives to what is irrational and illogical, to that which is not real, to an illusion. Yet in my eyes that is what most men do, they dedicate themselves to Society and Wealth and Knowledge and Thought and Philosophy and Love - and those gods are just as pathetic and false and ridiculous as the suicide bomber martyring himself for his virgins and his paradise. Why pursue anything but pleasure? Why sacrifice the bull and grapes to that mighty and unwavering invisible god, when you can eat the bull and the grapes and let your neighbors sacrifice their bulls and grapes to appease the might god? Sure their God will be happier than your God, but your stomach will be full and you shall feel pleasantly drowsy and warm.



So yes I created this thread because it has been a topic which I have wanted to talk about for a long time, so please do speak and post and share, any thoughts will do.

[YesNo]

Why pursue anything but pleasure? it is real unlike everything else.

Yes, pleasure is real although it is temporary. Pain is real, too, and it seems unavoidably linked to pleasure like a minor coke overdose to coke heaven. Both are temporary.

The problem with the argument is the "unlike everything else" part. If you're wrong about that then you've made a mistake with pursuing pleasure, but we all make mistakes.

[tonywalt]

It was probably badly cut coke, if you were throwing up.

That said, I would not see coke as a productive pursuit of pleasure. The shi$$y comedown and lethargy that follows puts it in negative balance. It will eventually effect your overall mood-no need to get into the dopamine thing as most people already know.

It's gives you fake happiness followed by real despair-as a birdy once told me.

Happiness is not real unless it is shared(another true cliche). Maybe not shared then and there, but eventually it has to be shared. People and love(of all varieties and objects) are the only things that can really fill the void.

[Alexander III]

Yes, pleasure is real although it is temporary. Pain is real, too, and it seems unavoidably linked to pleasure like a minor coke overdose to coke heaven. Both are temporary.


Hence the constant pursuit, the never ending chase, like a hunter. Hence never ceasing to chase, because


The problem with the argument is the "unlike everything else" part. If you're wrong about that then you've made a mistake with pursuing pleasure, but we all make mistakes.

But why would I be wrong about it ? Pleasure is tangible. An orgasm is not metaphorical, no one needs to explain to you why an orgasm is good, you never have doubts if an orgasm is real. An orgasm is an orgasm.


It was probably badly cut coke, if you were throwing up.

I would have taught that too, but my friends did not have any problems.


That said, I would not see coke as a productive pursuit of pleasure. The shi$$y comedown and lethargy that follows puts it in negative balance.

Oh come now, your an intelligent guy, you know that is an easy problem, in fact that problem is easily turned into a benefit. When I was 17 I learnt that once I started taking, I would keep on taking and would only let the comedown kick in once the night was over and I decided to go to bed. The comedown is avoided by sleeping, and the lethargy helps with inducing the sleep.


It will eventually effect your overall mood-no need to get into the dopamine thing as most people already know.

It's gives you fake happiness followed by real despair-as a birdy once told me.

But it doesn't. the happiness the pleasure is all very real. And I have never know the despair. I cannot help but feel that it is all a myth of propaganda.


Happiness is not real unless it is shared(another true cliche). Maybe not shared then and there, but eventually it has to be shared. People and love(of all varieties and objects) are the only things that can really fill the void.


I am not on the pursuit of happiness, that is too complicated - pleasure suffices and in fact is better. It is constant, it is logical, it is real.

[tonywalt]

I would have taught that too, but my friends did not have any problems.

You may have swallowed some. No matter, just be careful.



Oh come now, your an intelligent guy, you know that is an easy problem, in fact that problem is easily turned into a benefit. When I was 17 I learnt that once I started taking, I would keep on taking and would only let the comedown kick in once the night was over and I decided to go to bed. The comedown is avoided by sleeping, and the lethargy helps with inducing the sleep.

But it doesn't. the happiness the pleasure is all very real. And I have never know the despair. I cannot help but feel that it is all a myth of propaganda.

The comedown is very significant according to many experts. It does last all the next day, if you had a certain amount. If cocaine was just a simple case of sleeping it off and feeling great the next day it would not create so much havoc-and it certainly does. And yes there are controlled users or periodic users, but they tend to be in the minority. I doubt you have never experienced a comedown - the next day after you wake.



I am not on the pursuit of happiness, that is too complicated - pleasure suffices and in fact is better. It is constant, it is logical, it is real.


That's cool, but I've never known any long time regular or periodic user having a positive experience.

[Paulclem]

I think you assume that other people who don't share your views now haven't been there. They have. Where do all the young men go who pursue the delights of a hedonistic lifestyle? They're all about you doing their jobs, getting on with their lives now.

I know that it's hard to believe, but it becomes tiresome for many different reasons - health, money, love, age, other interests, life's purposes, satisfaction in other things, art, sport...in no particular order, and the list is probably endless.

The big thing though, that Tony mentioned, is that it's essentially selfish - and I don't mean that in a pejorative way. I mean it's self centred, when in fact sharing is what it's all about.

Yes you can share good times and fun and sex and all those things, but it will never be enough, and your friends will find other things - probably other people - they actually want to share things with more than they do with you anymore. You'll change, hopefully before it comes to that. It is an old story and just the way of the world.

[Mutatis-Mutandis]

It's sounds like a very childish and selfish lifestyle, but I guess that's the point. If you like to live that way, more power to you, but I'd rather not hear you ***** about it when you end up in a ditch, completely broke, and with no memory of how you got there in your pursuit of pleasure.

Frankly, it sounds like you need to grow up, Alex. The whole OP sounds like a very lame and forced justification of a lifestyle that you know is empty.

[Alexander III]

But it is not empty, in fact it gets better - you all say it is empty and it ends badly, but it doesn't - not for me anyway. And I think I did make some valid points in my OP, and I want to have a genuine discourse on this, Paul if it would not be personal maybe you can tell me about your past experiences with such a lifestyle and why it ended. I cannot fathom why ever settling for an illusion.

[LitNetIsGreat]

The decadent lifestyle never led to anything much apart from an early death - so don't follow that path. If I was you I'd tone it down a little, cut out the silly drugs for beer or wine and go fishing instead! Thus you'll find both pleasure and happiness in one. :nod:

Uncle Neely knows best.

[Desolation]

I'm on the fence about the whole thing.

On the one hand, it's your life, and your life is all you really have and you should do whatever you damn well please with it...So long as no one else is getting hurt by what you do.

But, there is a dark side...And I don't mean some romanticized suffering - I mean a very real very bad darkness that you can't come back all the way from. I've lived it, I've seen it. I can tell you first hand that it ain't any fun. If you think the careless pursuit of pleasure doesn't have a bad end, try spending a few hours in a methadone clinic. Most of us are not Keith Richards...We can't skirt the horror.

[Mutatis-Mutandis]

Maybe you could elucidate on the valid points? I read over it again and I couldn't find them--they could be there, still.

As to how it ends. Aren't you like 20, Alex? How do you know how this path will end? What, you "have control" of everything. Gee, I've never heard any future ditch-dwellers say that. And, if you are 20 (and I'm 90% sure you said you were), you're brain isn't even fully developed yet, so it doesn't surprise me. If I was a betting man, I'd bet big on either your mindset changing, or you ending up in rehab or worse.

But, like some have said, it's your life and if that's how you want to live it, good for you. I would never tell someone my opinion of such a lifestyle--I've known and have many friends who live very much how you describe (and they're all bums)--but you asked.

[tonywalt]

I mean if it's healthy hedonism, yea, sure - pursue with good sense. It's just that I don't advocate White as a regular fixture in someone's life because of the dopamine effect.

[Paulclem]

Paul if it would not be personal maybe you can tell me about your past experiences with such a lifestyle and why it ended. I cannot fathom why ever settling for an illusion.

I began drinking when i was about 16 - late compared to some of my mates, and it built up, as it does, over the next few years.

Friday and Saturday nights meant I was out with my mates whooping it up. I had a great laugh. I moved into a rented house, and when the girlfriend moved out after a while, I got another mate in. Things really took off then. It was party time whenever we weren't working. (None of us had much money, but it's amazing how much you can go out when you have the will). I was 20-21, fit, and ready to party all weekend. Sometimes the local nightclub had 10p a pint nights, which we took full advantage over, and I still managed to get to work most days.

I got to know another bloke who lived next door who introduced me and my mates to some substances, and then we had two houses. Another mate moved in with him - we had guitars and a drum kit, and we would jam through the night with whatever we had. We made homebrew, bought cheap stocks, and some of my dodgier mates would nick booze if they could.

We got to know more and more people - dealers, hangers on, party people, and it became apparent, after a couple of years at this, that they were all very transient. A close mate had mental problems, which we didn't know or recognise or care about at the time. Maybe the drugs were no good for him. It's difficult to tell, but his rages and depression now seem obvious to me.

There was sporadic violence fuelled by drink and the inevitable young man's competition that goes on. We were all involved in fights - at first with others but then between ourselves. There were often lots of tensions which we were quite happy to try to forget as we went out on the town, but they always came back. We thought that we could live like this ad infinitum, but it was a dream. Two of us - quite independantly - decided to go to Uni, and I think deep down we recognised that what had begun as a constant party was becoming a constant hangover.

I moved 300 miles away to Uni, made new friends, was given lots of money to spend - called a grant then!! - and I carried on. They introduced all day drinking in 1989. I took full advantage. I would go back to see my former mates and we would go out - but time moves you on, and things inevitably changed. I changed. I got friendly with a guy at the Uni who had decided, with his mates, that they were going to give up the drink at 30. I was overweight with the beer, and unfit after a few years at it - and not too many years either. I began to think it would be a good idea too.

After only a few years at it I had seen the effects on young blokes, and met quite a few older ones who never stopped. One bloke I knew i went to see in the mental hospital wards. He would go there when things got too much for a holiday. He was 30 and a wreck. His associates were a wreck.

I met a young woman with kids who went out with one of my mates who also had to go into the hospital. She was in her twenties, and ended up on that drug that makes you sick if you drink. They were all poor, transient and forever avoiding the landlords. I met a bloke called Emu whose mind was completely shot by glue. he'd been a punk as a kid and could hardly string a sentence together. He lived with my mate for a while. On a good week he would buy four bottles of sherry. On a bad week, he would buy two. My mate with the mental problems kicked him out when he had one of his rages.

I met another lad - younger than me - whom I had vaguely known at school. He'd lost all his teeth after a kicking one night. He wore obvious dentures - he was 21 - and spent all his money on beer. He also went to live with my mate, and he also got kicked out during one of my mate' rages. I've no idea what happened to him. He was a strangely vulnerable chap who seemed completely devoid of ambition and idea. He was a tramp before we met him one night and my mate invited him back. I hope he made more of himself.

the more I think about it, the more comes back to me. Sure we had a riot. We took the piss, got drunk, partied, played music - but there's always a payoff. peope move away. You lose friends through stupid disputes, and worst of all you realise it was for the best. You meet dodgy people who seem friendly, but cannot be trusted. You lose contact and all sense of your family. I neglected my younger brothers and sisters all this while in this wild pursuit which I still regret now.

Perhaps worst of all, you become totally self obsessed with the idea of going out and having a good time. It's all about the going out, and normal human feelings get repressed.

Scarily, if you have ever met an alcoholic, you see this self obsession in them. You know then that it's the beginning of a very bad time if you carry on. You don't realise this until much later. Before then you're having too much of a good time to notice what it does to you and your friends.

I caused a lot of pain to people of one sort and another at this time - and I wasn't a violent thug or anything. I was just trying - in the age old mantra - to have a good time.

I also wasted my time. I could have done so many things in those years I spent wasting money in the pub. I could have done courses, travelled - actally done something useful instead of just having a supposed good time.

But I'm very lucky. In my journey through this, certain people gave me good advice. It started with an old guy in a pub when i was about 16. i'll never forget him. he told me to stay off the beer. I didn't - but eventually I listened.

I met a lad who had been at school with me. I got on really well with him. He told me that one night someone had spiked his drink with acid, and it had sent him on a bender for two days with his mates. His girlfriend had presented him with an ultimatum in the pub as he was tripping. You either come home now or never. He went home and never touched the stuff again. I'm glad because he was a great bloke.

They do say that childbirth is the most dangerous - probably - thing a woman can do.

The most dangerous thing for a bloke is to be young. :biggrin5:

I'm sorry the post is so long. Y'know - when you get started. And I left out all the juicy bits!

[tonywalt]

I began drinking when i was about 16 - late compared to some of my mates, and it built up, as it does, over the next few years.

Friday and Saturday nights meant I was out with my mates whooping it up. I had a great laugh. I moved into a rented house, and when the girlfriend moved out after a while, I got another mate in. Things really took off then. It was party time whenever we weren't working. (None of us had much money, but it's amazing how much you can go out when you have the will). I was 20-21, fit, and ready to party all weekend. Sometimes the local nightclub had 10p a pint nights, which we took full advantage over, and I still managed to get to work most days.

I got to know another bloke who lived next door who introduced me and my mates to some substances, and then we had two houses. Another mate moved in with him - we had guitars and a drum kit, and we would jam through the night with whatever we had. We made homebrew, bought cheap stocks, and some of my dodgier mates would nick booze if they could.

We got to know more and more people - dealers, hangers on, party people, and it became apparent, after a couple of years at this, that they were all very transient. A close mate had mental problems, which we didn't know or recognise or care about at the time. Maybe the drugs were no good for him. It's difficult to tell, but his rages and depression now seem obvious to me.

There was sporadic violence fuelled by drink and the inevitable young man's competition that goes on. We were all involved in fights - at first with others but then between ourselves. There were often lots of tensions which we were quite happy to try to forget as we went out on the town, but they always came back. We thought that we could live like this ad infinitum, but it was a dream. Two of us - quite independantly - decided to go to Uni, and I think deep down we recognised that what had begun as a constant party was becoming a constant hangover.

I moved 300 miles away to Uni, made new friends, was given lots of money to spend - called a grant then!! - and I carried on. They introduced all day drinking in 1989. I took full advantage. I would go back to see my former mates and we would go out - but time moves you on, and things inevitably changed. I changed. I got friendly with a guy at the Uni who had decided, with his mates, that they were going to give up the drink at 30. I was overweight with the beer, and unfit after a few years at it - and not too many years either. I began to think it would be a good idea too.

After only a few years at it I had seen the effects on young blokes, and met quite a few older ones who never stopped. One bloke I knew i went to see in the mental hospital wards. He would go there when things got too much for a holiday. He was 30 and a wreck. His associates were a wreck.

I met a young woman with kids who went out with one of my mates who also had to go into the hospital. She was in her twenties, and ended up on that drug that makes you sick if you drink. They were all poor, transient and forever avoiding the landlords. I met a bloke called Emu whose mind was completely shot by glue. he'd been a punk as a kid and could hardly string a sentence together. He lived with my mate for a while. On a good week he would buy four bottles of sherry. On a bad week, he would buy two. My mate with the mental problems kicked him out when he had one of his rages.

I met another lad - younger than me - whom I had vaguely known at school. He'd lost all his teeth after a kicking one night. He wore obvious dentures - he was 21 - and spent all his money on beer. He also went to live with my mate, and he also got kicked out during one of my mate' rages. I've no idea what happened to him. He was a strangely vulnerable chap who seemed completely devoid of ambition and idea. He was a tramp before we met him one night and my mate invited him back. I hope he made more of himself.

the more I think about it, the more comes back to me. Sure we had a riot. We took the piss, got drunk, partied, played music - but there's always a payoff. peope move away. You lose friends through stupid disputes, and worst of all you realise it was for the best. You meet dodgy people who seem friendly, but cannot be trusted. You lose contact and all sense of your family. I neglected my younger brothers and sisters all this while in this wild pursuit which I still regret now.

Perhaps worst of all, you become totally self obsessed with the idea of going out and having a good time. It's all about the going out, and normal human feelings get repressed.

Scarily, if you have ever met an alcoholic, you see this self obsession in them. You know then that it's the beginning of a very bad time if you carry on. You don't realise this until much later. Before then you're having too much of a good time to notice what it does to you and your friends.

I caused a lot of pain to people of one sort and another at this time - and I wasn't a violent thug or anything. I was just trying - in the age old mantra - to have a good time.

I also wasted my time. I could have done so many things in those years I spent wasting money in the pub. I could have done courses, travelled - actally done something useful instead of just having a supposed good time.

But I'm very lucky. In my journey through this, certain people gave me good advice. It started with an old guy in a pub when i was about 16. i'll never forget him. he told me to stay off the beer. I didn't - but eventually I listened.

I met a lad who had been at school with me. I got on really well with him. He told me that one night someone had spiked his drink with acid, and it had sent him on a bender for two days with his mates. His girlfriend had presented him with an ultimatum in the pub as he was tripping. You either come home now or never. He went home and never touched the stuff again. I'm glad because he was a great bloke.

They do say that childbirth is the most dangerous - probably - thing a woman can do.

The most dangerous thing for a bloke is to be young. :biggrin5:


And we are happy you came out just fine! It takes courage to do what you did and say what you just said.

[Mutatis-Mutandis]

Ditto to Tony. Paul, you've been making some very interesting posts, lately. Thanks for sharing.

[JuniperWoolf]

Many of my friends have perpetually lived the way that Alex describes between the ages of 16 and 24ish. People who never quit and stay that way are very rare. I have two friends and one family member who has never quit partying perpetually and to excess. One friend is 29 and he still gets high on anything that's going around and has an unbelievable amount of sex. He looks a bit leathery from it all now whereas when he was younger he was much more beautiful, but he doesn't seem to mind that. He's still off-puttingly observant as he's always been, and funny. His case is interesting actually, he's lived a very "active" life an he hasn't paid for it in the slightest like everyone is told must happen. He's had the same job at the power plant for the last seven years, and he just works and has fun and has crazy adventures and seems happy. My friend Dwayne took way too much acid (I'll never take that drug, even it's title sounds corrosive), and his brain is very addled. He's never been smart and he's always been depressed, but now he's paranoid too. Another friend, Greg (and Greg's wife) takes care of him now, poor Dwayne. The only other long-time drug user I know is my uncle, I think he likes meth and coke, his teeth are all brown and he's hideous and has no money whatsoever which is why my father is his "roomate" once every few years (meaning my father prevents him from starving to death and lets him sleep on the couch). He fights a lot too, I've had to literally sew that man back together. He's pleasant enough though. Almost 50 years old now.

The rest of my friends who have lived to extreme excess (I'd say about 10 people) only go out on weekends like "normal" people now, except for maybe three of them who have allowed themselves to become completely repressed by their wife/girlfriend or husband/boyfriend. When he was twenty, I watched Devin rolling around on the living room floor screaming about how flamingo letters finally accept him for who he is, and now he's twenty-three and I see him at the water park with his two year old and wife. Unhappy ****er, he looks like he's about to open a vein at any second, so maybe Alex is on to something when he calls it "emptyness." Maybe we need abandonment in order to feel balanced. The hedonistic part of life is one that many people experience and if they don't **** up then they benefit from it: they don't regret not having any fun in life, and sometimes things happen that just broaden your world so much that it's impossible to explain it to someone who's never had that experience. There's actually a long-time tradition of excess as a means of becoming enlightened. Think about it: Dionysian bacchanalias, that was religion. In any case, the risk is the choice of the person who chooses to engage in that lifestyle and there's really nothing anyone can do about it (and organizations have tried).

Personally, I love it too - in moderation. I've only ever been able to live like that for maybe five days at the most. At the end of five days, I feel kind of hollow and worn out and usually sick, then I work and read and study and hang out with my more level friends for about two months until I get the unconquerable urge again. I'm okay with that.

[tonywalt]

[QUOTE]
Personally, I love it too - in moderation.


Juniper, are we talking about White?

I was just separating White out from the others, namely alcohol, herb, and psychedelics. It's just much trickier than those three - which I am not jumping up and down about.

[Mutatis-Mutandis]

Is "white" a Cayman Islands slang term for coke? I've never heard it before.

[JuniperWoolf]

Me neither. By "it" I was referencing the whole abandonment to revelry lifestyle. I've only done coke twice (on occasions when I've been hanging out with people who happened to have it, and who I strongly liked and knew well), and I'm not going to lie, it was great. Really, it was completely different than I imagined it would be. All I wanted to do was run around and play and look at all of the pretty lights.

I don't think my brain was made for psychedelics, I've never had them and I can't imagine a situation in which I would. Maybe a ritual, drinking some peyote tea with a witches' coven or something. Haha, that sounds cool.

[Mutatis-Mutandis]

Funny. My dad said he tried coke once when he was a teen and all it did was make him super nervous and jittery.

I'm not unknown to drugs, myself, though mine are all legal. I take Vicodin regularly, and I won't lie, I'll take a bigger dose than I need when I want to chill. Percocet's the best, though, aside from morphine, though I've never had that outside of the hospital, and wouldn't want to. I got mildly addicted to Percocet a few years ago. It was incredibly easy to do. It wasn't bad, but for about a week I didn't sleep more than a couple hours a might because I couldn't stop shaking. Not shaking like spasming, it was like a weird vibration. It wasn't that great of an experience.

[Darcy88]

I drink socially. Never done hard drugs. I often abstain for long periods of time from sex. Its not nobility. I just have fun doing other things. Creative things. Working out. Reading. Making and saving money.

[JuniperWoolf]

I don't like drinking, I hate being nauseous more than anything in the world. If I were in Dante's hell, the worst for me would be the tenth bolgia of the eight circle reserved for perjurers and falsifiers. Eternal nausea, dear god, that's worse than any other punishment. I'd rather be in a perpetually red-hot flaming tomb in the sixth circle for non-believers which I guess is where I would actually end up. So, I'm only drunk maybe five times/year, almost exclusively during local festivals.

Anyway, I like legal drugs too. They really just serve to calm you, and if you only take say four/month most doctors are cool with giving you an unlimited supply as long as you're all like "I'm a student working full time, stress and what not... yeah..." Zopiclone and ativan are my favorites, I like taking them on sunny days off when I sit outside on a hammock under the trees. Then of course there's the very confusing "decriminalized" drug, marijuana, mild and easy to aquire. That's my absolute favorite, and I take that one only when I'm by myself too. I like smoking on sunday morning, last day of my shift, in the mid-morning when the rest of you are all waking up and I'm winding down before bed.

[tonywalt]

Is "white" a Cayman Islands slang term for coke? I've never heard it before.

No, not common here. It's just a party circuit word picked up from Northern countries.


Me neither. By "it" I was referencing the whole abandonment to revelry lifestyle. I've only done coke twice (on occasions when I've been hanging out with people who happened to have it, and who I strongly liked and knew well), and I'm not going to lie, it was great. Really, it was completely different than I imagined it would be. All I wanted to do was run around and play and look at all of the pretty lights.

I don't think my brain was made for psychedelics, I've never had them and I can't imagine a situation in which I would. Maybe a ritual, drinking some peyote tea with a witches' coven or something. Haha, that sounds cool.

I've only tried psychedelics a few times, and didnt like it as much as opiates.

[Revolte]

It's gives you fake happiness followed by real despair-as a birdy once told me.

.

Not true, it's a very real happiness. Drugs work by increasing the output of the drugs already in your body, they don't throw stuff in you that you don't already have. This is why you won't get high off of smoking cotton, though I wouldn't suggest disproving me with that.

The problem is it uses up your natural supply and it takes years to get to a normal state while off the drug. This is why long term users often do drugs to feel normal instead of high.

Fun Fact: Cardio releases dopamine. Because of this, not only do some people get addicted to it, but it is used as a treatment in rehab. Often with positive results.

[tonywalt]

I agree with you Revolte, I understand the dopamine effect - let's just say it is happiness induced by a foreign substance.

Still, I say be a bit cautious. Some wines are only for sipping occasionally.

[Paulclem]

Good advice Tony.

Thanks for the comment by the way - Mutatis too.

[OrphanPip]

Drugs and alcohol have never done much for me, just a kind of bland forgettable experience.

[Mutatis-Mutandis]

I've just started occasionally drinking. While I've yet to get full-blown drunk, I've gotten tipsy, and I don't like how it makes me feel. I get kinda weirded out. It's not an unpleasant situation, but I hesitate to call it pleasant. It's only been a few times, though. I did find that it did work as a literal painkiller, though.

[LitNetIsGreat]

I've just started occasionally drinking. While I've yet to get full-blown drunk, I've gotten tipsy, and I don't like how it makes me feel. I get kinda weirded out. It's not an unpleasant situation, but I hesitate to call it pleasant. It's only been a few times, though. I did find that it did work as a literal painkiller, though.

Bloody hell, is hat all? I've drnak moderately alomst everyady for the lsat 20 yearsish and it's nvere doen me anyahrm...!!?

[Mutatis-Mutandis]

Bloody hell, is hat all? I've drnak moderately alomst everyady for the lsat 20 yearsish and it's nvere doen me anyahrm...!!?

:lol: Well played.

[The Dilettante]

Hedonism is fine, but like anything it has it's limits. I don't mean to be condescending, but I believe there is more to my life than just pleasure. I have ambitions and they are not satisfied with simple pleasures.

That being said I am not opposed to partaking on some occasions, although I stick to alcohol and the occasional psychedelic.

[JuniperWoolf]

Drugs and alcohol have never done much for me, just a kind of bland forgettable experience.

My friend Rosie is the same way. She tried marijuana once, and her entire experience was as follows: she remembered that she forgot to water her plants earlier in the day, she then watered said plants, and then she went to bed. The next morning she was like "did I not do it right?"

[tonywalt]

I wish I could stop getting the munchies. I have eaten more carrots than a Giant Killer Bunny!! ( I eat the carrots to avoid my stock munchie food pizza and/or chips and dips).

[tonywalt]

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