George Orwell

[Rebecca1122]

I recently finished two books by George Orwell.

What do you think his significance is? Why does he still matter today?

Why do you think he wrote 1984 and Animal Farm?

Thanks for sharing your opinions in advance :)

[Germ]

It is difficult to underestimate the importance of Orwell. In order to truly grasp his significance, you have to read his essays and other novels.

Basically, Orwell is the classic canary-in-the-coal-mind. He is trying to warn us of a great threat, and he paints an accurate picture of this threat with considerable artistic power.

[Polednice]

Indeed, he has tremendous significance, and ought especially to continue to be of great significance to people today, though his works are neglected by all but those with a particular interest. His forewarnings of a certain type of totalitarianism seem unlikely and inapplicable to our world today (Huxley seems to have got the nature of our dystopia right!), but I think his greatest value has to do with his contribution to how we think about language, writing, and speech. His discussions of style and rhetoric are some of the most important that anyone has ever contributed, and his acknowledgement of euphemism to sugar-coat atrocity is something that needs to be rediscovered by the reading populace.

[PeterL]

At this point Orwell is not very important, but he was, and some day he may be important again. The idea of state socialism waspopular in the middle part of the 20th century, so someone had to point out how evil state socialism with its control of all aspects of life from education to medical care t to personal opinions was.
Hmm, maybe people should read Orwell agian. Big Brother is capturing pretty much everything on the internet, including this. I wonder how long before I get a visit from a man wearing sunglasses with a bulge at his armpit.

[Calidore]

I recently finished two books by George Orwell.

What do you think his significance is? Why does he still matter today?

Why do you think he wrote 1984 and Animal Farm?

Thanks for sharing your opinions in advance :)

Our opinions or your homework answers? What do you think and why?

[cafolini]

Orwell was always pure propaganda. Those of us who understood the 20th century knew before hand that we were burying communism for keeps.
Even the Russians knew about their burial, and marched towards it unable to do a thing.

[Polednice]

At this point Orwell is not very important, but he was, and some day he may be important again. The idea of state socialism waspopular in the middle part of the 20th century, so someone had to point out how evil state socialism with its control of all aspects of life from education to medical care t to personal opinions was.
Hmm, maybe people should read Orwell agian. Big Brother is capturing pretty much everything on the internet, including this. I wonder how long before I get a visit from a man wearing sunglasses with a bulge at his armpit.

That's not socialism and it's disingenuous to label it such.

[cafolini]

That's not socialism and it's disingenuous to label it such.

Agree.

[Venerable Bede]

That's not socialism and it's disingenuous to label it such.

Agreed. I would label it as "totalitarianism" instead; a destination that socialism, for all its good intentions, typically is headed for.

[IntravenousJava]

Politically Incorrect = Doubleplus Ungood

[OrphanPip]

Agreed. I would label it as "totalitarianism" instead; a destination that socialism, for all its good intentions, typically is headed for.

I don't really think that's true, social democratic political parties have formed governments throughout Europe, and in Canada, without causing the dissolution of human rights.

Also, the idea that Orwell was opposed to "state socialism" is absurd since he was a lifelong social democrat. Also, 1984 has absolutely nothing to do with socialism.

[paradoxical]

I don't really think that's true, social democratic political parties have formed governments throughout Europe, and in Canada, without causing the dissolution of human rights.

Also, the idea that Orwell was opposed to "state socialism" is absurd since he was a lifelong social democrat. Also, 1984 has absolutely nothing to do with socialism.

Exactly. Many people have been exposed to so much capitalist propaganda that it is inconceivable to them that capitalism is much more likely to lead to a totalitarian state. I think one could argue that the United States has already descended into a national security state and is well on its way to fascism. Getting back to the significance of Orwell today, just look at the language of bills such as the Patriot Act, Citizens United, etc. Or military jargon such as "friendly fire" or "collateral damage". Double-speak is everywhere.

[Venerable Bede]

I don't really think that's true, social democratic political parties have formed governments throughout Europe, and in Canada, without causing the dissolution of human rights.

True, but are they really socialist to the same extent as the Soviet Union or China? I think that socialism sounds great in theory, but it relies on human beings not behaving in the typical selfish manner to which they are prone.

[OrphanPip]

True, but are they really socialist to the same extent as the Soviet Union or China? I think that socialism sounds great in theory, but it relies on human beings not behaving in the typical selfish manner to which they are prone.

One can easily ask the same question of the Soviet Union and the PRC, whether they are as socialist as they identify themselves as. Marxist-Leninism and Maoism are radically different from Social Democracy because of the principle of the Vanguard Party and Centralized Democracy (invented by Lenin) not the degree to which they put socialism in practice.

[PeterL]

That's not socialism and it's disingenuous to label it such.

You are wrong. Maybe you should study political theory.

[Mutatis-Mutandis]

You are wrong. Maybe you should study political theory.

He isn't wrong. You are.

[PeterL]

He isn't wrong. You are.


It looks like political theory is not being taught well. I suppose that I shouldn't be surprised at such ignorance , because this isn't a political forum, but people really shouldn't post when they don't know what they are posting about.

See this article for a slight explanation of state socialism. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/State_socialism
It is a wiki article, so it isn't complete, but it's more than some people who post hear ever knew about the subject.

The USSR, Red China, and teh Eastern European countries all operated state socialist economies. That wasn't long ago, and there are pressures to make it happen again. Orwell wanted to point out the evils of such systems and to try prepare people to fight against them. At this point I am trying to do the same thing. Government intrusion into personal freedom and into realms of activity that are not appropriate for government are the steps toward completely totalitarian state socialism. When the government tries to tell you how to live your life, there is a problem with the government.

[Mutatis-Mutandis]

He was warning against totalitarianism. This has been said already. Even the wikipedia link you provided in no way describes the world presented in 1984. Did you even read the book?

[mal4mac]

Anyone can warn against totalitarianism. Orwell produced a work of art that illustrated a very convincing form of totalitarianism in action, and produced a coherent novel around his ideas. I'm reading "The Handmaid's Tale" by Margaret Atwood at the moment, which is obviously influenced by 1984 (and is itself it a great example of the important genre centred on Orwell's seminal works.)

[kev67]

The USSR, Red China, and teh Eastern European countries all operated state socialist economies. That wasn't long ago, and there are pressures to make it happen again. Orwell wanted to point out the evils of such systems and to try prepare people to fight against them. At this point I am trying to do the same thing. Government intrusion into personal freedom and into realms of activity that are not appropriate for government are the steps toward completely totalitarian state socialism. When the government tries to tell you how to live your life, there is a problem with the government.

At the time didn't we call them communist countries? Over here, the British Labour party was a socialist party until Tony Blair repealed clause 4 of its manifesto, which called for the nationalisation of large industries, or in other words, the public ownership of the means of production. Even before clause 4 had been repealed, Britain under the Labour party was hardly a totalitarian state compared to the Soviet Union under Stalin or China under Chairman Mao.

[kev67]

With regards to the OP, Orwell wrote other books than 1984 and Animal Farm. His non-fiction books were highly influential too. Homage to Catalonia is an eyewitness account of the Spanish Civil War by someone who took part in the fighting. Down and Out in Paris in London Orwell described his life among the poor and and homeless in both these cities. None of these could have done his health much good, probably explaining why he died relatively young. Some of his other fiction books are influential. In Burmese Days he criticised colonialism but also corruption among the natives. He was also famous for advocating writing straightforward prose with easy to understand words and simple sentences.

[crusoe]

Sorry, please disregard this Entry.

[crusoe]

Down and Out in Paris in London Orwell described his life among the poor and and homeless in both these cities. In Burmese Days he criticised colonialism but also corruption among the natives.

Thanks for mentioning my two favourite Books by G.O.
He wrote a lot of good Essays and let's not forget "The Road to Wigan Peer".
(Depressing)