Tomorrow and Today

[Hawkman]

There is heat in the sun
but where shade is cast by houses
it is chill upon a fresh-cropped scalp.
Above, an airbrushed cerulean glow,
empty and inviting flight -
or contemplation of what lies beyond.

Tomorrow there will be horses
and crowds eager for vague chance
in the sport of kings.

The master’s mount, unburdened,
may snack upon the watered grass,
and maybe I will brush my palm
against its neck,
feel the play of muscle
and the warmth of equine skin;
even the surprising firmness
of a pricked and furry ear.

But today there is just blue sky
and shadows peeling back,
exposing possibilities to light.

[Catamite]

This is really good.

''Tomorrow there will be horses
and crowds eager for vague chance
in the sport of kings.''

That especially is a great observation of betting. But the entire poem is really well-toned and lovely to read.

[Buh4Bee]

I've read this a few times and it just seems to be better each time. I have no criticism to offer, sorry. Brought a gleam of enjoyment to the evening. A very hopeful poem.

[ShadowsCool]

Since I know a thing about horse betting, I must say I enjoyed the images that came to mind.

[Hawkman]

catsmeat: Thank you very much. I wrote it a couple of months ago and forgot about it. We were actually getting some sunshine at the time :D 'twas inspired by the prospect of going to a point to point on the morrow.

B4B: thanks to you too and especially for enjoying it. :)

Shadows: Well I haven't placed a bet since 1986 - lol. Quite enjoyed the mess Grand National sweepstake on at least one occasion. I drew 1st 3rd and 4th if I remember correctly. Paid for a tipple or two - lol. Glad you enjoyed it.

Live and be well - H

[Silas Thorne]

Cerulean!? Cerulean!?

Oh well, despite my usual dislike of this word in poems, I have to admit this is a great poem. You describe things so vividly here- what you see, think and feel, and it has a wonderful ending. Even with 'cerulean'. ;) Wow.

[DieterM]

Always so good to read you, Hawk! And even more so as it seems to me the last time I have seen sun & blue sky must've been in 2011! Thus, I really enjoyed your lines, which immediately brought back that precious memory of "just blue sky
and shadows peeling back,
exposing possibilities to light".
Am not into betting, but i could almost smell excitement and that strong & somewhat homey fragrance of horses.

[Hawkman]

Silas: yeah, cerulean isn't a pretty word, I agree, but it was either that or the bloody cliche of "Azure" - LOL. Thanks for liking it anyway :D

Dieter: No, definitely not been a very sunny year so far! Horses are ok, smell wise. You should try hanging with ferrets - phew! :D Thanks for reading and enjoying :)

Live and be well - H

[MorpheusSandman]

I love that last line. It really captures that anxious energy of anticipation, while what precedes captures the "calm before the storm," so to speak. But it seems to clash against the "eager for vague chance," which, when set against all of the potent imagery, seems a bit out of place to begin with. Good timing with this piece, though, considering they just ran the Preakness. I'm not the biggest horse racing fan, but it's rather exciting to think I may get to see a triple crown winner in my lifetime. :)

[Hawkman]

Hi Morpheus and thanks for reading and sharing your thoughts. I was a little surpirsed by this though:

"It really captures that anxious energy of anticipation, while what precedes captures the "calm before the storm," so to speak. But it seems to clash against the "eager for vague chance," which, when set against all of the potent imagery, seems a bit out of place to begin with."

I don't say you've misread the poem, but it may be that a lack of familiarity with this kind of event, particularly the peculiarity of a local English hunt's association with a provincial race meeting, is colouring your perception a bit. The narrator is in a reflective mood, detached, observational. The eagerness of the betting crowds will not be his. He will be there, but he is looking forward to a quiet moment beside the Master of the Hunt's horse, maybe a word or two with an acquaintance. In the meantime he has an entire day ahead of him to enjoy.

Live and be well - H

[MorpheusSandman]

Interesting clarification, Hawk. I went back and reread the piece with that in mind, but I don't think my initial comment is invalidated by it, because the second and fourth stanzas (and the last line of the first) are very much forward-looking, and both are about the anticipation of some event. So while the speaker is enjoying the moment, and is maybe anticipating/looking forward to something quite different, I still get the sense of "calm before the storm," even if the speaker won't be apart of that storm.

[Hawkman]

Certainly the poem is couched in terms of contrast, and I can't argue against it's displaying anticipation of a change of scene and the certainty of there being crowds, etc. But I would take issue with your use of the word anxious. There be no hint of anxiety here that I can detect, merely acceptance and a little optimistic hope.

I would also query your interpretation of: "or contemplation of what lies beyond." as being forward-looking. The subject of the sentence is the sky, and in the preceeding line, flight refers to flying, not fleeing. I certainly had no intention of conveying a need for physical escape, nor can I see any indication in the poem that the word might be interpreted this way. Empty sky inviting flight would seem to me to be fairly self explanitory. So, the line you interpret as forward looking is in fact being lost in the moment. Contemplation implies meditation and as the subject of the sentence is the sky, the subject of the contemplation is what lies beyond the sky, or the infinite. So I guess the most logical interpretation would be: 'to be at one with the universe.'

The poem's layout puts us in the present of today in verse 1, contrasts this with the certainty of tomorrow and the hope of what this might lead to, and then returns us to the present in S4 which is unfolding in real time. Rather than anticipation, which would seem to imply foreknowlege of a specific event, the shadows peeling back revealing possibilities, merely present options or choices, so the fading thought of the last line, is, if anything, one of indecision. It definitely has an air of optimism though, which was intended.

Live and be well - H

[Jack of Hearts]

Quit horsing around, Hawk.

There's a sense of both apprehension and peace in this poem- the narrator is clearly at peace with 'today', but we know that tomorrow is coming. The narrator knows it,too. The difference is that he doesn't care- for the moment, he's in the moment.

This one was especially readable, Hawk. Great work as usual.





J

[MorpheusSandman]

RE Anxiety: When you’re mentioning “vague chance,” “exposing possibilities,” and “what lies beyond,” “Maybe I will,” all of that creates a pattern of uncertainty: Vague limits our perception, chance limits our control, possibilities don’t tell us WHAT possibilities, what’s beyond doesn’t tell us what IS beyond, and this all the more potent when you’re ending stanzas with them (as you leave the reader in that state of uncertainty). I don’t think you can introduce such uncertainty without creating anxiety, because the primary cause of anxiousness is being in a state of uncertainty about what will happen. That aside, I don’t think anxiety has to be negative, as it can also indicate a certain excitement about what will happen. You mention “hope” and “optimism,” but I can’t ever think of a time when I was “hopeful” that something would happen that I also wasn’t anxious about it happening, so I don’t see “hopeful optimism” as being mutually exclusive with anxiety (I’d argue the opposite, actually, that they need each other).

RE Beyond: When I said it was “forward looking” I was trying to connect it with the other lines that were discussing what would happen tomorrow, in the future, so “what’s beyond” the sky (spatial uncertainty) is connected with “what’s beyond” today (temporal uncertainty). But, as for that “beyond” being solely connected to the sky, there are two things there: One is the hyphen, which joins while separating, meaning that there is always a connection AND disconnection. So it invites one to read “beyond” as referring to the “sky,” certainly, but it also invites one to read it as more metaphoric. The switch from the objective (describing the space) to subjective (mentioning contemplation) also separates it from being strictly restricted to the sky.

Funnily enough, this discussion has inspired me to reread it several times, and with each successive reading I become more encouraged that my interpretation isn’t the least off-base with what’s there. Every stanza seems balanced between what IS in the moment, what WILL be, and what MIGHT be or COULD be. Stanza by stanza:

There is heat in the sun
but where shade is cast by houses
it is chill upon a fresh-cropped scalp.
Above, an airbrushed cerulean glow,
empty and inviting flight -
or contemplation of what lies beyond.

The first 5 lines are all descriptive of what IS (present certainty), but when we hit that last line the contemplation of what’s beyond introduces a note of the unknown “what’s beyond” (present and spatial uncertainty), made all the more potent by the fact that the preceding lines have told us so vividly what is there. That we reach a point that ends the stanza on what we don’t know and are contemplating does bring in an anxiousness.

Tomorrow there will be horses
and crowds eager for vague chance
in the sport of kings.

Tomorrow there WILL BE (future certainty) X, but what WILL BE will be eager (not a word so terribly divorced from anxious) for vague chance (future uncertainty)

The master’s mount, unburdened,
may snack upon the watered grass,
and maybe I will brush my palm
against its neck,
feel the play of muscle
and the warmth of equine skin;
even the surprising firmness
of a pricked and furry ear.

The mount MAY… maybe I WILL (future uncertainty), but the description of what will happen afterwards is certain… IF It happens at all.

But today there is just blue sky
and shadows peeling back,
exposing possibilities to light.

Return to what IS, and what IS HAPPENING (interesting implied transition from simple present to present continuous, as if for the first time we feel the present becoming the future), but what is known about what IS happening is countered by the unknowing about exactly what is contained in that knowledge, what those possibilities are, about what will be chosen.

Hey, just keep talking Hawk, because the more I read it, the more interesting it seems. :)

[Hawkman]

Well, The fact that you are arguing with the author about what his poem actually says only goes to reinforce your rather presumptuous assertion that the reader has the right to impose his own meaning upon a text - lol. There is only anxiety in uncertainty if you are worried about it, and there is absolutely no indication in anything written in the poem that the narrator has a care in the world. Quite the opposite, if anything.

Think what you like, I'll let the work stand on it's own feet :) Live long and prosper - H

PS the short dash is not a hyphen, if it were it would be conected to one or other of the words, It functions here as a caesura. :) H

[Hawkman]

Jack: Sorry, I almost overlooked your response. Thanks for reading and enjoying :) Live and be well - H

[MorpheusSandman]

Well, The fact that you are arguing with the author about what his poem actually saysHmmm, weren't you echoing my words to miyako a while back that what a poet intends and what they actually say are not necessarily the same? You yourself said: "I guess as writers we are all guilty~to some extent~of expecting our readers to automatically discern our intent."


It functions here as a caesura. Let me quote you again: "I don't think it's a question of not knowing how to read (a dash), it's a question of interpreting it in a peculiar context." ;) Dash or hyphen, the effect of joining and dis-joining is much the same.

[Delta40]

Well, - lol. There is only anxiety in uncertainty if you are worried about it, and there is absolutely no indication in anything written in the poem that the narrator has a care in the world. Quite the opposite, if anything.

Think what you like, I'll let the work stand on it's own feet :) Live long and prosper - H

PS the short dash is not a hyphen, if it were it would be conected to one or other of the words, It functions here as a caesura. :) H

Well as I read MS interpretation, I'm inclined to agree with him wholeheartedly. Anticipation is rife throughout the poem except for the last stanza and it easily brings about a sense of uncertainty and even anxiety. Your statement that: The fact that you are arguing with the author about what his poem actually says only goes to reinforce your rather presumptuous assertion that the reader has the right to impose his own meaning upon a text is valid where an alternative interpretation accords with the wider public meaning and that the writers stated intention can therefore be rejected.

As an intellectual nobody, that is my understanding. :p

[Hawkman]

Anxiety: n the state of being anxious. A state of chronic apprehension as a symptom of mental disorder. Anxious: adj, uneasy with fear and desire regarding something doubtful; solicitous; eager for something or to do something.

Had I wished to indicate a state of anxiousness and/or anxiety I would have included indications of it, tells like sweaty brows, increased heart rate or trembling appendages. You will notice that all are conspicuous by their absence. Therefore any impressions of anxiousness or anxiety you discern are YOUR ASSUMPTIONS not being either apparent or implied in the text at any point. My intentions are written clearly in the words I have used, no more, no less. Anything else is what you have imposed upon it. Well we may have different idiomatic interpretations of what a dash my indicate but I've been using separated dashes like this for years.

Now this is absolutely my last word in this discussion, which, quite frankly, is starting to irritate me. I have better ways to spend my time than argue semantics for the sake of it.

QRT, ZUG QSX, QNR, QTL THE BAR.

Pax vobiscum Live and be well - H

[MorpheusSandman]

Anxiety: A state of chronic apprehension as a symptom of mental disorder.Obviously not the way I was using the word.


Anxious: adj, uneasy with fear and desire regarding something doubtful; solicitous; eager for something or to do something.Remove "fear" and I think this perfectly fits my usage, and which I (and Delta, and Jack) see/feel in the poem.


Anything else is what you have imposed upon it. Errr, in my last interpretation I was using exact quotes from the piece to support my interpretation, so I don't know how I "imposed" anything.


Either way, I think it's a good thing. Peace without anxiety can be boring, anxiety without anything to balance it can be too angsty. There's a good balance of both in the piece, and it makes it multi-dimensional. Be happy about that. :)

[miyako73]

In this forum, the sauce for the goose is not for the gander. The cliquish scratching of backs and the blatant indecision of the pliable minds are just too much.

[MorpheusSandman]

In this forum, the sauce for the goose is not for the gander. You will never, ever find me (or Delta, I imagine) negatively criticizing others for their "misreading" of one of our poems. If I ever get people concerned enough to interpret my poems at all then I think I've done something right, regardless of whether it's with or against my intention (what's more, if it's against my intention then it teaches me something about how others react to certain things in poetry). :)

[Silas Thorne]

Going on and on here is being a little irritating, Morpheus. You have already stated your reading and Hawkman doesn't need to agree with them.

Oh, and Miyako73, Hawkman nicely put his poem on here and you have chosen to drop in an unrelated remark and not a comment or criticism of the poem in this thread on it. If you have the time to drop in anyway, why not comment on it?

[MorpheusSandman]

Going on and on here is being a little irritating, Morpheus. Errr, I'm not talking to myself... :confused5: