the most depressing book you've ever read?

[cacian]

and are depressing books justified?

[Trask]

I don't remember it too much but 1984. Even for my English teacher who has us read books similar to that such as Fahrenheit 451 and Brave New World she said that she was physically too depressed to finish it

[Paulclem]

Tess of the D'Urdbervilles.

As for justified? I'm not sure what you mean. Books are written for an audience. Their patronage of the author justifies it - even Tess.

[Alexander III]

For me the beautifull and the damned is the most depressing book I have ever read. Gatsby and Tender is the Night are very melancholic, but B&D is downright depressing and maudlin.

[cacian]

Tess of the D'Urdbervilles.

As for justified? I'm not sure what you mean. Books are written for an audience. Their patronage of the author justifies it - even Tess.

Hi Paulclem

what I mean by justified is what is it that depressive books add to the enlightment of the mind.
I consider literature as journey that leads to enlightment and fulfillement and pleasures.
How does depression helps anyone adjust to a journey to only find one depressed at the end of it.

[/dev/null]

I consider literature as journey that leads to enlightment and fulfillement and pleasures.

You must pick up one or the other
Though neither of them are to be what they claim.

[Paulclem]

Hi Paulclem

what I mean by justified is what is it that depressive books add to the enlightment of the mind.
I consider literature as journey that leads to enlightment and fulfillement and pleasures.
How does depression helps anyone adjust to a journey to only find one depressed at the end of it.

Hi Cacian,

I wonder about your use of the word depressive. Isn't that used to describe people as in a depressive state? Whereas depressing can be applied to anything.

Despite my dislike of the book Tess of the D'Urbevilles, it is a powerful character study. I don't like it because Hardy seems to be harsh with her - there's no let up in her predicament, and she's a victim type. I would hesitate to suggest that it, or any book, could induce actual depression though.

I consider literature as journey that leads to enlightment and fulfillement and pleasures.

That may be your own aim, but are the aims in some literature any different? Doesn't Shelley tell the story of Frankenstein's monster in an enlightening way? You might still describe the book as fulfilling in that it complete the authors aims and conveys them entertainingly to the reader.

The same goes for many books in that they deal in a thouhtful way with pretty depressing subjects such as prison camps, war, death, estranged love, murder etc etc. What people find in them differs, but the clarity of the writing and the depth of the material is what makes them worthwhile reading.

[cacian]

You must pick up one or the other
Though neither of them are to be what they claim.

why should I?
A pleasure can be both an enlightement and a fulfillement.

[/dev/null]

why should I?
A pleasure can be both an enlightement and a fulfillement.

I might agree, but in general you can't expect enlightment to be pleasing, or pleasure to be fulfilling, etc. Kafka, Dostoyevsky, Camus, Sartre, Mishima, Beckett... all of them wrote highly depressing works in which even partially positive resolutions are rare.

[cacian]

I might agree, but in general you can't expect enlightment to be pleasing, or pleasure to be fulfilling, etc. Kafka, Dostoyevsky, Camus, Sartre, Mishima, Beckett... all of them wrote highly depressing works in which even partially positive resolutions are rare.

Oh well that is a matter of opinion and entirely subjective.
My pleasures derive from fulfillement and enlightment is one of them.
That is not to say that I do not derive pleasures from other sources.
The more I learn about something 'positive' that shed lights on my wonders the more delighted my person becomes.
I must first fullfill my intellectual pleasures in order to fullfil other more pleasants adventures and be in control.

[/dev/null]

Oh well that is a matter of opinion and entirely subjective.

Were you expecting objective answers to any of this?


My pleasures derive from fulfillement and enlightment is one of them.
That is not to say that I do not derive pleasures from other sources.
The more I learn about something 'positive' that shed lights on my wonders the more delighted my person becomes.
I must first fullfill my intellectual pleasures in order to fullfil other more pleasants adventures and be in control.

All I mean is that textbook all-out depressing (whatever we can mean by it other than a medical expression) stories like "The Trial" or "L'Étranger", are at the same time as good an experience as you can get. So my personal opinion is that yes, depressing books are justified.

[LitNetIsGreat]

Despite my dislike of the book Tess of the D'Urbevilles, it is a powerful character study. I don't like it because Hardy seems to be harsh with her - there's no let up in her predicament, and she's a victim type...

That's interesting. I think Scheherazade dislikes it or Hardy in general for similar reasons if I remember rightly. Personally I don't have a problem with it at all because I think it works, but I can see the point, however don't most authors manipulate readers to some degree anyway? I think I would rather have a harsh reality here in Tess, over a neat 'Hollywood ending' I don't know, it is an interesting point. If Hardy does this in Tess though then it is nearly nothing compared to Jude the Obscure!!

[AlysonofBathe]

All I mean is that textbook all-out depressing (whatever we can mean by it other than a medical expression) stories like "The Trial" or "L'Étranger", are at the same time as good an experience as you can get. So my personal opinion is that yes, depressing books are justified.

I completely agree. Keeping with Kafka, The Metamorphosis was one of the most "depressing" (I'm not getting into a semantic debate over this one - I'll leave it to the more qualified linguists) books I've read, and I think because of the level of emotion I experienced while reading it, it will always rank in my favorites.

Obviously every reader has a different impetus for reading, and so justification can't really be spoken about in universal terms. It's a bit of a futile question really.

[Charles Darnay]

I completely agree. Keeping with Kafka, The Metamorphosis was one of the most "depressing" (I'm not getting into a semantic debate over this one - I'll leave it to the more qualified linguists) books I've read, and I think because of the level of emotion I experienced while reading it, it will always rank in my favorites.

.

If I had to pick one book as the most depressing, I agree with you on Metamorphosis

[Paulclem]

That's interesting. I think Scheherazade dislikes it or Hardy in general for similar reasons if I remember rightly. Personally I don't have a problem with it at all because I think it works, but I can see the point, however don't most authors manipulate readers to some degree anyway? I think I would rather have a harsh reality here in Tess, over a neat 'Hollywood ending' I don't know, it is an interesting point. If Hardy does this in Tess though then it is nearly nothing compared to Jude the Obscure!!

I wouldn't advocate a Hollywood ending either - Tess leaps up, punches him in the chops and goes off with one of the cowherders to a happy life.

It's a long while since I read it, but my memory of it is the relentlessness of her trials which she doesn't try to escape. I got the impression that she was complicit in her own fall - doubly damned.

I know that the art of writing is to manipulate the reader, and that it's pointless to rail at Hardy. I think the differences in attitude are probably responsible for the irritation I felt on reading it.

[Paulclem]

Then, sometimes you want to read something depressing. Just to remind yourself ...:biggrinjester:

[LitNetIsGreat]

OK good points Paulc. You should add Jude to the list if you have not read that, my favourite Hardy, Tess second. Lighter Hardy, like A Pair of Blue Eyes, his earlier works, are just not in the same league as his later tragedies. Hardy works much better with tragedy.

In terms of 'depressing' reading, Chekhov usually puts me in a melancholic, brooding sort of mood (though there are some light hearted stories true) the real depression though would come if I didn't read Chekhov! What a fine writer indeed! I've not read him for a couple of months and already I can feel the withdrawal setting in.

I also don't like the term 'justified'. It is justified if the work is good enough, that's the justification, full-stop.

[Prince Smiles]

Here be three titles that although are brilliant works of fiction one needs to be sure of one's positive state of mind before cracking:

"We" by Yevgeny Zamyatin

"Coming Up For Air" by Georgy Boy Orwell

"Hunger" by (King)Knut Hamsun

Depression is a very human condition. I remember reading an interview with Henry Rollins once where he is talking about depression. He was saying that instead of listening to everyone telling you to 'snap out' of it and 'cheer up', go sit in your room and really feel the emotions. This, Rollins said was as real as it gets, so don't run from it (medication), face it and feel it.

I enjoyed the above books. I can listen to The Smiths with a smile on my face, but one of the most depressing shows, The Office with Ricky Whatshisname really gets me down.
Thank Siddhartha that The Office never made it into book form, or did it?

[Frohmankf1]

It is useful for me!Thanks for sharing

good:rofl:http://www.subeducation.info/avatar2.jpg

[cacian]

D.H Lawrence Sons and Lovers.
What a waste of time and words.

[ben.!]

For me, The Handmaid's Tale by Margaret Atwood takes the cake as the most depressing. Such a constrained life of anxiety.

Or perhaps A Day in the Life of Ivan Denisovich by Aleksandr Solzhenitsyn. That novel is heartbreaking. After reading about the tiny chunk of bread under Ivan's pillow, it really makes me feel glad I live in a society with such incredible liberties.

Are they justified? Completely. Solzhenitsyn's novel is a crash-course in what a Gulag is like. And Atwood's novel is one of the great examples of modern dystopian literature. It's like a continuation of 1984.

[AlysonofBathe]

I adore The Handmaid's Tale! I honestly didn't find in overly depressing, not so much because of the content (definitely high in anxiety), but because of the ending. While Offred's outcome is ambiguous, given the historical conference that acts as an epilogue, the reader knows that the world of the novel wasn't condemned to such a fate forever; there was a light at the end of the tunnel.

Cheers,
Alyson

[cacian]

[QUOTE=ben.!;1123154]For me, The Handmaid's Tale by Margaret Atwood takes the cake as the most depressing. Such a constrained life of anxiety.
Anxiety is subjective to an individual and can only be spoken about correctly by the person who lives it/experiences it. I am wondering how much of this anxiety in this book is a reflection on the write herself.

Or perhaps A Day in the Life of Ivan Denisovich by Aleksandr Solzhenitsyn. That novel is heartbreaking. After reading about the tiny chunk of bread under Ivan's pillow, it really makes me feel glad I live in a society with such incredible liberties.
what about the chunk bread. I have forgotten already such a long time ago?


Are they justified? Completely. Solzhenitsyn's novel is a crash-course in what a Gulag is like. And Atwood's novel is one of the great examples of modern dystopian literature. It's like a continuation of 1984.
A crash course?
What always amases me is how these writers always manage to get it right in their endeavour to write,describe and put to words in minute details such humengous tasks of human depravation.
How do they manage it?
I can only say is that I can only describe something so clearly and to the point if and when I have lived it/experienced it and even so I would not manage it as well as these writers.


I adore The Handmaid's Tale! I honestly didn't find in overly depressing, not so much because of the content (definitely high in anxiety), but because of the ending. While Offred's outcome is ambiguous, given the historical conference that acts as an epilogue, the reader knows that the world of the novel wasn't condemned to such a fate forever; there was a light at the end of the tunnel.

Cheers,
Alyson

Hi Alyson what is the picture avatar about?

[AlysonofBathe]

Anxiety is subjective to an individual and can only be spoken about correctly by the person who lives it/experiences it. I am wondering how much of this anxiety in this book is a reflection on the write herself.


Atwood writes from a very feminist perspective, and while labeling The Handmaid's Tale as purely a work of feminist anxiety neglects much of the literary impact of the novel in terms of SF, feminist anxiety certainly thematically drives the novel.


Hi Alyson what is the picture avatar about?

Chaucer's Wife of Bathe, also named Alyson.

[Charles Darnay]

I think Atwood's writing style serves to undercut the depression (or anxiety?) of Handmaid's Tale, particularly when compared to other dystopian works, such as We or even 1984. She writes with enough tongue in cheek that there is a subtle humour to this novel.

While I am not the biggest fan of Handmaid's, I am coming to appreciate her writing more now than I did in high school.

[paradoxical]

There's a few that come to mind. Last Exit to Brooklyn. Angela's Ashes. The Heart is a Lonely Hunter.


It's a long while since I read it, but my memory of it is the relentlessness of her trials which she doesn't try to escape. I got the impression that she was complicit in her own fall - doubly damned.


I have to disagree. Tess of the D'Urbervilles is one of my favorite books, and while I suppose it is a little depressing, I just don't see Tess as being complicit. The themes that Hardy explore in the novel have to do with forces beyond our control. Fate, destiny, and other factors (in Tess's case 19th century male dominance).

[Snowqueen]

My uncle found Tess of the D'Urbervilles to be very disturbing novel. ‘Its a diseased book’ he commented when I was reading it. But I think it’s a fine tragedy.

[Scheherazade]

That's interesting. I think Scheherazade dislikes it or Hardy in general for similar reasons if I remember rightly. Yes, I am the regular Hardy-basher of the Forum!

Would not like to turn this into a Hardy discussion but...

Not simply because the stories are depressing because I have enjoyed reading some books that might be considered more depressing (Angela's Ashes, Boy in Striped Pyjamas). The issue I have with Hardy is that he seems to be enjoying making his books just so. Had he been writing today, we would have been cricital of him for being too formulaic, too predictable (even calculating in doing so). Of course, I am not ignoring the fact that he was writing for his particular audience in times different from ours; however, some of those novels still work and some don't. Hardy's style does not work for me.

As for the question whether depressing books are justified... It is an author's decision on how to tell their story... Of course, they have the right to determine how to express themselves. As readers, we also have the right to determine what we want to read. If depressing-books are not your cup of tea, move onto the next shelf where comedies are stacked up.




I have to disagree. Tess of the D'Urbervilles is one of my favorite books, and while I suppose it is a little depressing, I just don't see Tess as being complicit. The themes that Hardy explore in the novel have to do with forces beyond our control. Fate, destiny, and other factors (in Tess's case 19th century male dominance).Because a book is your favorite does not necessarily mean that it may not have shortcomings or make readers depressed.

As for fate and destinity... (we need a smiley that blows raspberries).

Fate and destinity are fine ways of not taking responsibility for our own actions. How many times did I shout while reading Tess, "Oh, come on, girl!" She made her choices throughout the book.

Maybe we should start another thread for Hardy as this one is getting derailed.

[BienvenuJDC]

Would not like to turn this into a Hardy discussion but...


I prefer Laurel myself, but Hardy is entertaining as well.

[stlukesguild]

Of Mice and Men was surely quite depressing. Blood Meridian was also quite depressing in its own way... and yet at the same time it conveyed such a poetic splendor in the language... especially relating to the landscape. I would also say that King Lear was quite depressing.

Is such an expression justified? Isn't that a rather stupid question? Why not ask whether the expression of humor, or fear, or love, or suffering, or joy, or eroticism, or spirituality, or any other human experience is justified? Is it the role of art to dwell only upon the positive... and even then... who decides what is or is not "positive"?

D.H Lawrence Sons and Lovers.
What a waste of time and words.

Why is that? Because you personally didn't like it? The fact that others have taken great pleasure in this books and others by Lawrence is irrelevant?

I can only say is that I can only describe something so clearly and to the point if and when I have lived it/experienced it and even so I would not manage it as well as these writers.

All I can say is that the arts would surely be sorely lacking if artists/authors were limited to depicting only that with which they have an intimate first-hand knowledge. That would pretty much spell the end of Homer, Virgil, Ovid, Dante, the Arabian Nights, the Bible, and so much more.

Yes, I am the regular Hardy-basher of the Forum!

Would not like to turn this into a Hardy discussion but...

Not simply because the stories are depressing because I have enjoyed reading some books that might be considered more depressing (Angela's Ashes, Boy in Striped Pyjamas). The issue I have with Hardy is that he seems to be enjoying making his books just so. Had he been writing today, we would have been cricital of him for being too formulaic, too predictable (even calculating in doing so).

I can't really speak of Hardy's novels. It's been far too many years since I read the only one that I have read (Tess) and that was a high-school requirement. I doubt that I was in the right mind-set to appreciate of evaluate such a novel one way or the other. I remember hating As I Lay Dying, then... and it now ranks among my favorites. I do find his poems following the death of his wife, from whom he had been estranged for some while, to be profoundly touching.

[Darcy88]

The ending in A farewell to Arms was pretty depressing to me. Oedipus was depressing. I have not read much literature that I'd characterize as "depressing." Some Dostoevsky is very bleak.

[cafolini]

and are depressing books justified?

Anything whatsoever is justified by past or awaiting circumstances. Why would depression lack the capacity of being rationalized in the midst of so many circumstances calling for it?

[AlysonofBathe]

I think Atwood's writing style serves to undercut the depression (or anxiety?) of Handmaid's Tale, particularly when compared to other dystopian works, such as We or even 1984. She writes with enough tongue in cheek that there is a subtle humour to this novel.


I think that's one of the reasons I like this book so much - it is, at least to me, at once depressing and anxious, and yet there's occasional bits of levity via a very astute protagonist. I personally feel it's still a novel very concerned with anxious feminist politics, and Atwood's own remarks on the book indicate she felt similarly during the construction (of course, whether the author's intention is of any relevance is a discussion for another day), but the occasional humor certainly adds another element.

Cheers,
Alyson

[cacian]

Anything whatsoever is justified by past or awaiting circumstances. Why would depression lack the capacity of being rationalized in the midst of so many circumstances calling for it?

Hi cafolini
It is a very good point you make here but here im my justification to my question
I cannot jusfiy writing depressive material because one lives it already.
One needs to approach anyhting once in anyway they chose and because depression is a real thing lived and experienced by the many that to then start loading literature with it too does not make senses to me.
No matter what a writer does or says about depression and bleakness in his or her book it is never going to rival one's personal experiences about it.
I would refrain from giving literature a depressive mood because it is not a place for it when humans are already encumbered with it.

[Paulclem]

Hi cafolini
I would refrain from giving literature a depressive mood because it is not a place for it when humans are already encumbered with it.

Writing is about the human condition, and depression is part of the human condition. In fact, given that novels centre around problems that need to be solved, I would say that the potential for depression in the general sense is a factor in many books.

[PoeticPassions]

I remember I cried a lot after finishing An American Tragedy by Theodore Dreiser. But I was only 12 at the time, so that might have had something to do with it.

I still get kind of depressed when I think about Shelley's Frankenstein... Poor monster.

Madame Bovary is pretty depressing...

I agree about The Beautiful and the Damned

The Winter of our Discontent is also kind of depressing, but a lot of Steinbeck's work was.

I cried a lot reading The Kite Runner as well. And I remember Angela's Ashes being so sad.

I guess there are a lot of 'depressing' books... most of my favorites are pretty gloomy. Oh and I believe there has been a similar, or same, thread as this already... This feels oddly familiar.

I think it would be interesting to add some short stories to the discussion... because I can think of quite a few that sucked all the joy out of me.

[AlysonofBathe]

Writing is about the human condition, and depression is part of the human condition. In fact, given that novels centre around problems that need to be solved, I would say that the potential for depression in the general sense is a factor in many books.

Absolutely! I would actually further that and argue that most classics have a substantial element of depression. Of course some more than others. But emotional highs and lows fluctuate throughout most novels, and for me at least, that can be pretty compelling.

[tonywalt]

The "48 Laws of Power" by Robert Greene and Joost Elffers was depressing-and very true. Not a novel of course.

[TheFifthElement]

Here be three titles that although are brilliant works of fiction one needs to be sure of one's positive state of mind before cracking:

"We" by Yevgeny Zamyatin

"Coming Up For Air" by Georgy Boy Orwell

"Hunger" by (King)Knut Hamsun



I've read both We and Hunger. They're both interesting books. I wouldn't have said depressing (though I can see why that might be a fair point) but certainly with Hunger you need to be in a fairly stable mental state before reading it or it could make you crazy! An excellent book though, if hard going.

Passoa's Book of Disquiet, for me, is the most depressing read. It's so nicely written, but after about 30 pages I had to set it aside because it was making me depressed.

[KCurtis]

For me the beautifull and the damned is the most depressing book I have ever read. Gatsby and Tender is the Night are very melancholic, but B&D is downright depressing and maudlin.

Fitzgerald uses humor though, he did in both Gatsby and Tender is the Night. I have not read the Beautiful and the Damned, but I will this summer.


For me, The Handmaid's Tale by Margaret Atwood takes the cake as the most depressing. Such a constrained life of anxiety.


I agree, and I hated it.

[116]

Of Mice and Men - devastating.

[Kingbob]

As for enlightment of the mind，I think it all depends. Depressing book is always an unexpected result for the author，and also for the readers.

[Adolescent09]

Of Mice and Men - devastating.

I personally did not care for Of Mice and Men. I thought the whole story was bittersweet. The ending seemed forced and the characters weren't developed enough. I just found myself not caring.

Now as for Dostoevsky's The Idiot, well now that's a different story altogether... Truly heart wrenching to the point where I was so depressed halfway through the book that I had to put it off and read it all the way from the beginning again to the end. Even then it was hard. Truly torture. Never do it again.

[cacian]

I personally did not care for Of Mice and Men. I thought the whole story was bittersweet. The ending seemed forced and the characters weren't developed enough. I just found myself not caring.

Now as for Dostoevsky's The Idiot, well now that's a different story altogether... Truly heart wrenching to the point where I was so depressed halfway through the book that I had to put it off and read it all the way from the beginning again to the end. Even then it was hard. Truly torture. Never do it again.

Interesting.
The more depressing a book is the less attractive it is to me.
I work your opposite way I can't stand depressive books.

[ChicagoReader]

Just from looking at my shelves--Notes from the Underground, Night by Elie Wiesel, Of Mice and Men,and Norwegian Wood.

[G L Wilson]

Richard Dawkins's God Delusion. As the Germans say, "The Devil always sh**s on the biggest pile."

[Delta40]

Interesting.
The more depressing a book is the less attractive it is to me.
I work your opposite way I can't stand depressive books.

Then it is merely your personal taste so limit yourself in what you read but literature ought to cover the human condition in all its states and depressing tragedies are certainly one of them and that is why it is justified.

[Gladys]

Now as for Dostoevsky's The Idiot, well now that's a different story altogether... Truly heart wrenching to the point where I was so depressed halfway through the book that I had to put it off and read it all the way from the beginning again to the end.

I found The Idiot inspirational, whereas Crime and Punishment was unremittingly dreadful, including its rather unconvincing ending.


I still get kind of depressed when I think about Shelley's Frankenstein... Poor monster.

Madame Bovary is pretty depressing...

The alienated monster is a tragic indictment of you and me. As for Madame Bovary, the grim ending following the inevitable suicide of Emma was, for me last month, a pleasant surprise. I had fully expected a more pedestrian ending.

George Eliot's The Mill on Floss, and particularly the plight of poor Maggie Tulliver and the hunchback Philip Wakem, was woefully depressing.

[KCurtis]

Of Mice and Men - devastating.

I agree, beautiful story, but I can't read it again. I love Steinbeck, and I'm reading him again.

[FranzS]

I agree about "1984" and "Metamorphosis". And yet they were among the most interesting books I've read.

"Tess" is depressing too, and yet the pace and sense of drama had me gripped.

In fact all the novels I've enjoyed most have been quite depressing. You can't be deep without looking the sadness of existence in the face: most stories in which people are cheerful and happy are pretty boring to read. (Jane Austen and David Lodge manage to buck the trend, but not many others.)

I think insight and a sense of dislocation with the world around you are fundamentally linked. When you're happy, you don't want to think, and when you don't think, you have nothing interesting to say.

Also, part of the appeal of sad books is that they arouse feelings of sympathy in the reader. That's how I feel about "The Unbearable Lightness of Being" and "King Lear". Paradoxically, that feeling of sympathy is a kind of emotional release and almost uplifting.

On the other hand, if I'm feeling really low myself, I can't bear to read sad books. There are limits.

[Kyle]

I'm not too sure if I should post this. The books I have found the most depressing were fairly recent: Tortilla Curtain by T.C. Boyle and Running With Scissors by Augustine Burroughs.

[Shevek]

I still get kind of depressed when I think about Shelley's Frankenstein... Poor monster.


I'll seriously second Frankenstein (the first edition) as the most depressing book I've read. I've always found a glimmer of hope in 'dark' and tragic books; even 1984 had its "place where there is no darkness." But I gleaned no sense of hope by the end of Frankenstein. The monster's persecution was depressing, but Frankenstein's decline just topped off my feeling of utter hopelessness for the human condition.

[tonywalt]

The Pale King by David Foster Wallace is easily the most depressing (and damn long) book I have read, but well written. Of course it was published posthumously - after David took his own life.

Whilst reading the book, I can see his depression, which apparently was quite severe during the last months of his life.

He was arguably the best writer/mind/intellect of the current generation, but if you are looking for his more conventional work you would have to read stuff like "Shipping Out" (published free online by Harpers) which is in my opinion the greatest short non-fiction piece ever written. Damn funny and with piercing intellect and humour.

[PabloQ]

I'll make a distinction between books that were sad (Of Mice and Men, Great Expectations) and depressing. My winner for most depressing is, by far, The Jungle by Upton Sinclair

[ralfyman]

Jude the Obscure

Also, Conspiracy Against the Human Race.

[cacian]

Jude the Obscure
I agree on this one.

Also, Conspiracy Against the Human Race.
Never heard of it.

[Mutatis-Mutandis]

Some of the first books that came to mind were Of Mice and Men (such a great book), Blood Meridian, The Slave Narrative of Fredrick Douglass (it does ha e a redemptive ending, but it's still a depressing book), Night, The Things They Carried, Notes from the Underground, Darkness at Noon, Lord of the Flies, Things Fall Apart, and Heart of Darkness (one of my favorites). Obviously, I don't necessarily find a depressive tone to be a negative aspect.

I haven't read it, but I'm surprised no one has mentioned The Sorrows of Young Werther, a book notorious for depressing people so much they committed suicide.

[Summer M]

The Catcher in the Rye. The thought that so many people like that book depresses me to no end.

[kev67]

Joseph Conrad was pretty depressing. The most depressing of the three I read was Lord Jim. Then most of Orwell's books were depressing too, some only slightly depressing, others very depressing. Burmese Days was my favourite of his fictional works. Even though it was very depressing, more happened than in some of them. The Grapes of Wrath by John Steinbeck was very, very depressing.

[caddy_caddy]

I agree on Metamorphosis,
Beloved , king Lear , and Anna Karenina

if u wanna get really depressed and sick read " The Impressive Darkness " by
Tahar Ben Jelloun, a Moroccan poet and writer

[Freudian Monkey]

Endgame by Samuel Beckett

[Darcy88]

I find Picture of Dorian Grey to be eminently depressing. I can really relate to the tale, to the concept of having dashing looks but a blackened soul. Its one of my favorite books, I find in it much beauty and much joy.....but it also depresses me greatly. I find beauty often does that. The tragic quality of much that is sublime has the power both to overjoy and to depress.

[cacian]

I find Picture of Dorian Grey to be eminently depressing. I can really relate to the tale, to the concept of having dashing looks but a blackened soul. Its one of my favorite books, I find in it much beauty and much joy.....but it also depresses me greatly. I find beauty often does that. The tragic quality of much that is sublime has the power both to overjoy and to depress.

Interesting but not always true analogy.
By the by what is ''blakened soul' and how do I know one when I see one?

[Darcy88]

Interesting but not always true analogy.
By the by what is ''blakened soul' and how do I know one when I see one?

A blackened soul = a tormented soul, a suffering soul. You will know one when you see one by their bearer's silence, tears, screams, shyness, flighty movements, expressed generalized trepidation towards many things which unblackened souls do not at all shy away from or fear.

[cacian]

A blackened soul = a tormented soul, a suffering soul. You will know one when you see one by their bearer's silence, tears, screams, shyness, flighty movements, expressed generalized trepidation towards many things which unblackened souls do not at all shy away from or fear.

I see well from what you have just said there is nothing there that has not been felt and lived by many if not the majority of the population.
It is just that some of us like to turn a page and start afresh and move on and some somehow struggle to let go.
I guess time is a good healer one way or another one is able to eventually rise above it and see the light.
Unfortunately for the very few, and I mean really minor, manage to go unoticed and fade away in the background only maybe they did not notice the time or the time did not notice them.
Either way something had to give and for the fortunate many the blackened soul gave up because they did not and that is how I like to see it for all of us.

[Darcy88]

I see well from what you have just said there is nothing there that has not been felt and lived by many if not the majority of the population.
It is just that some of us like to turn a page and start afresh and move on and some somehow struggle to let go.
I guess time is a good healer one way or another one is able to eventually rise above it and see the light.
Unfortunately for the very few, and I mean really minor, manage to go unoticed and fade away in the background only maybe they did not notice the time or the time did not notice them.
Either way something had to give and for the fortunate many the blackened soul gave up because they did not and that is how I like to see it for all of us.

Nice Cacian. Very inspiring. I'm sure all the blackened souls out there, the ones struggling with depression are happy to hear that for the fortunate many they should just give up.

[tonywalt]

I see well from what you have just said there is nothing there that has not been felt and lived by many if not the majority of the population.
It is just that some of us like to turn a page and start afresh and move on and some somehow struggle to let go.
I guess time is a good healer one way or another one is able to eventually rise above it and see the light.
Unfortunately for the very few, and I mean really minor, manage to go unoticed and fade away in the background only maybe they did not notice the time or the time did not notice them.
Either way something had to give and for the fortunate many the blackened soul gave up because they did not and that is how I like to see it for all of us.

You are not a therapist by any chance?

[Mutatis-Mutandis]

I'm kind of surprised some are saying "Metamorphosis." I thought it was pretty obvious that it's a black comedy, it's so absurd.

[Summer M]

I'm surprised no one said Waiting for Godot.

[Patito de Hule]

Most depressing is without a doubt, Lolita by Vladimir Nabokov

[cacian]

Nice Cacian. Very inspiring. I'm sure all the blackened souls out there, the ones struggling with depression are happy to hear that for the fortunate many they should just give up.
Darcy sorry I must explain what I mean by
''the blackened soul gave up''
what I meant is that within us all there is that ''blackened soul' and so because we did.do not give up on ourselves, we humans are natural fighters, the blackened soul eventually gave up on us and so we successed in ridding ourselves of black souls/thoughts.
Good versus evil scenario where the good always prevail because in goodness there is life and prosperity and evil there is only destruction and so naturally life wins over anytime all the time.
I jope this has cleared by what I meant.


You are not a therapist by any chance?
Hehe I wish thanks for the thoughts though.:p

[cacian]

Most depressing is without a doubt, Lolita by Vladimir Nabokov

Have you read it all the way?

[cacian]

I'm surprised no one said Waiting for Godot.

true although some might refer to it as dynamic and relevant.
I do not see it I find most pointless a read.
I guess literature has more to it then that.

[Summer M]

ESTRAGON:
Didi?
VLADIMIR:
Yes.
ESTRAGON:
I can't go on like this.
VLADIMIR:
That's what you think.
ESTRAGON:
If we parted? That might be better for us.
VLADIMIR:
We'll hang ourselves tomorrow. (Pause.) Unless Godot comes.
ESTRAGON:
And if he comes?
VLADIMIR:
We'll be saved.


They should make a box set of this play, with a quality hardcover copy, a bottle of fine scotch, and a loaded revolver.

[cacian]

ESTRAGON:
Didi?
VLADIMIR:
Yes.
ESTRAGON:
I can't go on like this.
VLADIMIR:
That's what you think.
ESTRAGON:
If we parted? That might be better for us.
VLADIMIR:
We'll hang ourselves tomorrow. (Pause.) Unless Godot comes.
ESTRAGON:
And if he comes?
VLADIMIR:
We'll be saved.


They should make a box set of this play, with a quality hardcover copy, a bottle of fine scotch, and a loaded revolver.

Woww that is solid stuff indeed.
Two things I have in mind as I scrolled quickly through this piece:

a) Who is Didi?

and

b) Godot is already been established the He so in a way Godot is anyone someone anyone right here right?!

If however Godot was never to be refered to by any subject or pronoun one could have been forgiven for thinking it was an IT instead and then it would have been far more tempteous farce me think.
To establish a pronoun to something that is thought not to be attainable is according to my logic as attainable as any.

[tonybacker]

Hi Cacian,

The most depressing book I have ever read is _The Grapes Of Wrath_ by Steinbeck. Pretty sad how all those families had to go out west to nothing but discrimination and heartache.

[larryF]

Infinite Jest I found to be terribly depressing.

[tonywalt]

Infinite Jest I found to be terribly depressing.

You should try reading Pale King also by DFW. Set in an IRS office about the world of Tax Accounting.

[tonywalt]

Just thinking about this thread - I've read some pretty depressing books this/last year: DFW's Pale King, Lorrie Moore short stories, Debra Dean short stories, Grapes of Wrath etc...

These books actually dragged me down a bit, particularly the first three authors - not so much for negavity or depression, but the constant threads of cynicism. The cynicism pounds away like a jackhammer, and it can F#%^ with your mood if you read the content consistently. Don't get me wrong, all are great books with great authors.

Hell, I am going back to mostly non-fiction and now reading about Teddy Rooselvelt and Alexander Hamilton:)

[cacian]

It makes me think that generally so far literature has had her share bit of moody and depressive with nothing to achieve out of it but to depress.

[crusoe]

"The Earth" by Emile Zola. My wife was very surprised when I -out of the blue- started to curse out certain characters in the book out loud. That book drove me insane.

[larryF]

You should try reading Pale King also by DFW. Set in an IRS office about the world of Tax Accounting.

Yeah it's sitting on my shelf, just need some motivation to jump into it.

[Melissa]

Maybe "La Tregua" of Benedetti. His work represented a new breath in the Latin American literature. But Latin American publishers do much only publish works for certain genres and authors of many genres unappreciated are forgotten. For example in Peru only published works of realistic genre. We are now trying to rescue the work of an author of science fiction and your support would help us in our campaign even with a dollar
http://www.indiegogo.com/enriquecaceresalejossciencefictionworks

[ralfyman]

Re: Ligotti's work,

http://naughtthought.wordpress.com/2010/09/18/thoughts-on-ligottis-conspiracy-against-the-human-race/

http://antinatalism.blogspot.com/2010/04/conspiracy-against-human-race.html

[Buh4Bee]

The Beautiful and the Damned was pretty darn depressing, although I am not sure if it is the MOST depressing book I ever read.

The Sorrows of Young Werther was also pretty damn depressing, although a beautifully written book.

[heat4212]

Hi cafolini
It is a very good point you make here but here im my justification to my question
I cannot jusfiy writing depressive material because one lives it already.
One needs to approach anyhting once in anyway they chose and because depression is a real thing lived and experienced by the many that to then start loading literature with it too does not make senses to me.
No matter what a writer does or says about depression and bleakness in his or her book it is never going to rival one's personal experiences about it.
I would refrain from giving literature a depressive mood because it is not a place for it when humans are already encumbered with it.

I think depressive literature also serves to gives us perspective. I think I am depressed when my carpenter screws up my pool deck and runs off with my money. Then I read Les Miserables and realize my life is actually pretty peachy.

Depressive literature can give us insight into the plights of the oppressed or persecuted. Reading the Diary of Anne Frank is depressing as hell (knowing the outcome), but I would rather read it and remember than dwell only on happy thoughts and forget the lessons of the past.

Oh and that's my vote for Les Mis. I don't care that the happy couple ends up together. I had to lock myself in the bathroom to finish the last 100 pages to hide my uncontrollable sobbing.

[Desolation]

The Sound and the Fury
As I Lay Dying
A Farewell to Arms
The Idiot
Incidents in the Life of a Slave Girl
The Awakening
The Bell Jar
Journey to the End of the Night
The Death of Ivan Ilyich
The Red and the Black
The Stranger
Tender is the Night
The Sorrows of Young Werther
Every sequence of letters that Samuel Beckett ever put onto paper

Short Stories:
"The Dead"
"Bartleby, the Scrivener"
"Young Goodman Brown"

[qimissung]

The Bluest Eye. Geez, what a downer. I couldn't finish it. I think it drove me into a mild depression. I did go back and leaf through the final chapters, enough to find out the terrible, terrible ending.

That said, I would highly recommend it. It is a powerful book.

[Venerable Bede]

When I was a kid, I read Sounder by William H. Armstrong. It is definitely one of the most depressing books I've read.

[Red Hot Soho]

The trouble with being born - E.M Cioran

[cacian]

]The Sound and the Fury[/B]
As I Lay Dying
A Farewell to Arms
The Idiot
Incidents in the Life of a Slave Girl
The Awakening
The Bell Jar
Journey to the End of the Night
The Death of Ivan Ilyich
The Red and the Black
The Stranger
Tender is the Night
The Sorrows of Young Werther
Every sequence of letters that Samuel Beckett ever put onto paper

Short Stories:
"The Dead"
"Bartleby, the Scrivener"
"Young Goodman Brown"

Glad to see Faulkner's top of the list.

[cacian]

I think depressive literature also serves to gives us perspective. I think I am depressed when my carpenter screws up my pool deck and runs off with my money. Then I read Les Miserables and realize my life is actually pretty peachy.

Depressive literature can give us insight into the plights of the oppressed or persecuted. Reading the Diary of Anne Frank is depressing as hell (knowing the outcome), but I would rather read it and remember than dwell only on happy thoughts and forget the lessons of the past.

Oh and that's my vote for Les Mis. I don't care that the happy couple ends up together. I had to lock myself in the bathroom to finish the last 100 pages to hide my uncontrollable sobbing.

Don't forget depression is an illness and it is on the rise. Thousands of people suffer from it.

[Kyriakos]

Behind the symbols, probably In the Penal Colony, by Franz Kafka. My own understanding of it is that he is the engineer in the story, along with the miserable man to be executed by the machine, which might represent his writing.

[Alan_M]

Bury My Heart at Wounded Knee - Dee Brown. Really sad book.

[Gregory Samsa]

Flowering Nettles by Harry Martinson.

[GreenLucky]

The Sound and the Fury
As I Lay Dying
A Farewell to Arms
The Idiot
Incidents in the Life of a Slave Girl
The Awakening
The Bell Jar
Journey to the End of the Night
The Death of Ivan Ilyich
The Red and the Black
The Stranger
Tender is the Night
The Sorrows of Young Werther
Every sequence of letters that Samuel Beckett ever put onto paper

Short Stories:
"The Dead"
"Bartleby, the Scrivener"
"Young Goodman Brown"

Journey to the End of the Night is a great pick. I don't know anyone else who has read Celine, though I don't know too many people. I found out about him from reading Bukowski. The Stranger immediately came to mind, but the effect it had on me was more fundamentally unsettling than depressing.

[Kyriakos]

I tried to read Celine, and that novel, but in this language i found the translation to be really hard to accept. Maybe it is very much in keeping with the original's use of idioms and a sort of french version of the lunfardo (to recall Borges), but i did not like its version in Greek at all. This is how it happened ;)

[Brielle92]

Notes from Underground, without a doubt.

[aliengirl]

I'm surprised no one said Waiting for Godot.

I enjoyed reading this play because my teacher was really great. She never let us descend into depression while she managed to bring out its relevance. Also there were a couple of nice guys in my class who always tried to dissect the text so much that it lost all of its depressive touch. Some of their interpretations were quite hilarious. I think a 'depressing' book has less effect when you read it in a class/group.

My top picks for 'depressing' books are

1. The Idiot - I wept all night long when I finished it. Still it is one of my favorites. I read it during Christmas holidays in three days. I'm going to read it again this year.

2. Doctor Zhivago - It's a bleak read. All the main characters come to sad ends. But the prose is beautiful, I should say marvelous in certain places.

3. The Hunchback of Notre Dame - Okay, I knew what was going to happen. Yet the blind injustice of it all filled me with sorrow. It does not mean I dislike it. On the contrary it's one of my favorite novels. Hugo's dark humor is brilliant.

4. Tess - I read it when I was thirteen and it depressed me a lot back then. Ever since I've abstained from Hardy's works. One of my friends has finally persuaded me to check him again. I've not tried yet.


As for short stories -

Maupassant's Ball of Fat - A favorite of mine but quite depressing.

Looking up at what others said I'm in danger of facing serious depression. Kafka's The Trial, Dostoevsky's Brother Karamazov, Chopin's The Awakening,and Faulkner's works are waiting on my shelf. :p

[Varenne Rodin]

Johnny Got His Gun - Dalton Trumbo. Suffocating story. A nightmare. As an anti-war book, it does the trick.

[WICKES]

Thomas Hardy's Jude is pretty bleak: I mean the 'message' is essentially "it's better never to be born" and "hard, uncaring, scheming people with no pride or honour always win, while the sensitive and good just suffer and die meaningless deaths" . Voltaire's Candide is another novel with a bleak message ("ain't no happiness to be had in this world my friend, everything works against it"). Yet strangely I didn't find either of them depressing. Maybe that's because I grew up in a cynical, post-religious country like Britain where such things are taken for granted!!

Far and away the most depressing novel I've ever read is Cormac McCarthy's The Road. A total waste of my time. I took nothing from it other than a hope that, should an asteroid or nuclear war end human civilization, I am killed in the blast. There are passages of beautiful prose, and I no doubt missed many of the clever Biblical references and so on, but what is the point of that novel? It is one of the few books I immediately gave away and never want to look at again.

The so-called uplifting or positive ending is completely unrealistic. I mean, the boy wanders off and runs into a family who take him in and look after him. Are you joking?! We all know he would simply have starved to death or fallen victim to one of the roaming gangs of cannibals.

[Emil Miller]

This one:

Darkness At Noon stands as an unequaled fictional portrayal of the nightmare politics of our time. Its hero is an aging revolutionary, imprisoned and psychologically tortured by the Party to which he has dedicated his life. As the pressure to confess preposterous crimes increases, he re-lives a career that embodies the terrible ironies and human betrayals of a totalitarian movement masking itself as an instrument of deliverance. Almost unbearably vivid in its depiction of one man's solitary agony, Darkness At Noon asks questions about ends and means that have relevance not only for the past but for the perilous present. It is—as the Times Literary Supplement has declared—"A remarkable book, a grimly fascinating interpretation of the logic of the Russian Revolution, indeed of all revolutionary dictatorships, and at the same time a tense and subtly intellectualized drama..."


Or this one:

L'Assommoir (1877) is the seventh novel in Émile Zola's twenty-volume series Les Rougon-Macquart. Usually considered one of Zola's masterpieces, the novel—a harsh and uncompromising study of alcoholism and poverty in the working-class districts of Paris—was a huge commercial success and established Zola's fame and reputation throughout France and the world.

[Anymodal]

'The Tartarian Desert' by Dino Buzzati
'The Process' by Kafka
'The Unbearable Lightness of Being' by Kundera

[kev67]

Thomas Hardy's Jude is pretty bleak: I mean the 'message' is essentially "it's better never to be born" and "hard, uncaring, scheming people with no pride or honour always win, while the sensitive and good just suffer and die meaningless deaths" .


Joseph Conrad is rather like that too.



Far and away the most depressing novel I've ever read is Cormac McCarthy's The Road. A total waste of my time. I took nothing from it other than a hope that, should an asteroid or nuclear war end human civilization, I am killed in the blast. There are passages of beautiful prose, and I no doubt missed many of the clever Biblical references and so on, but what is the point of that novel? It is one of the few books I immediately gave away and never want to look at again.

The so-called uplifting or positive ending is completely unrealistic. I mean, the boy wanders off and runs into a family who take him in and look after him. Are you joking?! We all know he would simply have starved to death or fallen victim to one of the roaming gangs of cannibals.

It wasn't one of our better DVD choices neither.