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View Full Version : Enemy Within - Reflections on the Human Self (Nafs)



usman.khawar
07-15-2011, 10:11 AM
Translation of a chapter of my teacher's book.

Amazing!

Enjoy the knowledge and comments

O' My Lord ! give us the knowledge of reality of the things. Amen

“As for the one who feared the facing of his Rabb (Lord) and shunned the nafs(self) from the desire (of all that satisfies his ego), then indeed Paradise, that is the abode (for him)”
(An-Naazi’aat Surah 79:40-41)

Deliberation and reflection on the Human Self has continued unabated over the centuries. From the time that self-realisation was linked to the recognition of God, the wayfarers in the procession of (divine) passion began to search for salvation in the enchanting and tempting vastness of the Human Self. This enigma has continued to engage mankind under the guise of various names, such as, self consciousness, deep understanding and self-realisation. Few, however, have succeeded in attaining to the depth of its meanings: whilst those who were afraid of it, grew more in terror as their understanding of it grew.

Those that did gain some knowledge of it, found the nafs to be the arch enemy of man, dominating every aspect of his life: the lawful and unlawful, good and evil, chaos and order, poverty and opulence, war and peace, the positive and the negative. Further, they witnessed it in the pomp and glory of the victorious and in the wretchedness of the vanquished; in the sublimeness of knowledge and wisdom and in the prejudices of the populace; in the dignity and awe of kings, and in the petitions of the penniless; in the refined style of wordsmiths and in the vulgar tongues of the rabble; in the romance of love and beauty and in the backdrop of libidinal desires. In short the influence of this corrupting Self was felt everywhere.

The question arises: What was its origin? And what is its true nature?

The issue was not always that complicated. Over aeons of time animal characteristics firmly lodged themselves in the inner (consciousness) of man. To such an extent that human life, which began on the basis of survival and self-defence, was unable to shed these characteristics even in the midst of the most advanced social and economic structures. All human systems, no matter how supportive they appear, have in some fundamental way aided and supported some aspect of the nafs.

Despite the change of battlefield and type of contest, the conclusion of the struggle between man and beast was replaced by the struggle of mutual rivalry between Homo Sapiens. Before this time man, on a collective level, was as one single body fiercely upholding his individuality in the face of opposition from other forms of life. Emotions of generosity and kindness grew in strength alongside the spirit of rebellion and arrogance: survival is avarice for life. Further, the sense of survival that the Prophet Suleyman (a.s) witnessed in the procession of ants, surged like a herd of wild elephants in its diverse and varicoloured forms in the character traits of man.

Knowledge and wisdom failed to release the Human Self, which had its origins in the struggle for survival, from the mindset of survival. Instead, it altered the means of achieving the same goal. For instance the entire fields of Arts and Sciences, which attained mastery in the understanding of (physical) reality, and all the methods adopted to civilise man all had their centre and focal point in the promotion of ease, comfort and the strengthening of the Self. The Self constructed channels which would promote sympathy and affection within man in its favour, and would be regarded as the (ultimate) standards of humanity.

How could man possibly regard as an enemy that which had seeped into his consciousness becoming a fundamental part of his life and was now flowing within his blood and veins? Despite the exhortations to adopt the path of guidance, it was an extremely difficult challenge for man to see himself as his own enemy. Indeed, for whom should he wage this war on himself and for what reward: ‘friendship’ of God and an unseen paradise! Moreover, the Human Self depends for its support on outward causes. It convinces and influences man through the agency of the five senses. As a result (Paradise) was seen as a mirage and an (empty) promise, impossible to test before ones death, not to mention God and the Intellect, that were far removed from the (ambit of the) five senses and the boundaries of the heart and vision.

The nafs is another name for the nerve centre of man: it is his childhood, his youth and his old age. Indeed, the Human Self is a ‘packet’ of needs and wants. It is a defence system, resting on the basic instincts of man, which has since prehistoric times become so powerful that the entire body of science and knowledge cannot withstand its defence weaponry. Lurking in the ‘trench’ of survival this warrior is familiar with the strategies needed to ward off all the assaults of knowledge and reason. However, its greatest weapon is to show sympathy and affection to its ‘victim’. This, then, is a war that man has no desire to win. There is no compensation or blood money forthcoming for the one that is slain. In the words of the Generous Lord: I (God) created my biggest enemy in the form of man. Indeed, the inner (consciousness) of man is ruled by this Dajjal and his acts of construction are in truth acts of destruction. This anti-Christ dwells in both you and me. The statement ‘I am’ is an expression of its individuality, for it divides (both people and the person) and is the personality of every individual. It can be glimpsed in the scholar’s boastings of his knowledge, in the depraved behaviour of the ignorant, in the ascetics’ display of piety, in the man of letters’ desire for fame, and in the Princes desire for power and glory.

Psychologists attempted to understand the workings of this bundle of instincts; they searched for the underlying principles of man’s reactions and behaviour; they subjected his feelings to the theories of ‘inferiority’ and ‘superiority’. Discovering in the process a whole host of complexes, phobias, neuroses, psychoses, fantasies and evil whisperings, insanity and madness, lurking in the mind of man. Further, they searched for the fundamental causes of fear and depression.

But why?

Their goal was neither to find God nor to explore the Self in order to find God. It was merely to activate, to reinvigorate, and to strengthen the Self which had become passive, downtrodden, defeatist and inactive. This was simply so that it could once more resume the struggle for survival. However, the main distinguishing factor between psychologists and sufis is that the former seek to understand the Self for the sake of the Self, whereas, the latter seek to understand it so that they can place it in the service of God. Moreover, nafs and Desire are two inseparable companions and together they carve out the priorities and preferences of the Nafs. To the extent that Desires, bosom companions of Satan (Literally who sit in his company and ride together), can affect and alter the ‘seasons’ of the Nafs. The nature of the Nafs is that it craves to dominate others, and jealously guards its own possessions. Yet it seeks to plunder the property of others. Set aside clemency and forbearance, all the civilised behaviour of the Nafs is nothing but ‘camouflage’ and defensive ploys. It is the Governor of the Province of ‘No Mercy’ and ‘No Remorse’; appeals for clemency only add fuel to its tyranny. Further, in defeat it turns dangerous and seeks to inflict injury on others. The full brunt of its enmity is directed towards the ‘alien’ soul that originates from an alien place and dwells within its territory. It exerts its entire efforts to prevent the Soul from returning (to its source of origin).

In contrast, the choice and priorities of the soul are clear and eminently superior. It possesses the consciousness of the One God, and despite being imprisoned in a physical body its yearning for the Divine Presence never ceases. The Nafs seeks to wipe out this memory and longing and, like the angels imprisoned in the chasm of Babel, the subjugation of the Spirit to the body and mind is its fundamental goal. In this struggle for mans’ humanity, the Nafs seeks assistance from Satan by occupying the pathways leading to the Sublime Assembly (mala ‘alaa). Moreover, benefiting from centuries of experience in this struggle, the Nafs becomes a terrifying social force whom none has the power to subjugate save God. As the Prophet Yusuf (a.s) said: ” None is spared from (the attacks of) the nafs: for the nafs always commands evil, only those whom God has mercy (are saved from it)”. Thus, only divine intervention can protect the soul from the domination of the acquisitive and merciless Nafs.

God has declared war on this enemy and has made it known that one who yearns for His love and intimacy must oppose the Nafs no matter what form its takes or what strategy it employs. Since, in every age, the Nafs drapes the ‘corpses’ of its devotees (dead) in the latest style of shrouds. If not as Olympus, Brahman, Shiva and Vishnu, Ashtar and Isis; then as the models of abstract philosophies. If not in the worship of physical objects, then in the festivals of culture and tradition, in the complementary understanding of ecstasy and sobriety, and in the interaction between literature and homosexuality. Today, in our day and age, in the labelling of oppression and injustice as civilisation and the mass media’s propaganda as truth, in the movements of indecency and obscenity promoted in the name of Art, idol worship parades under the guise of the Fine Arts, and any mention of God is dubbed backwardness. Indeed, these phenomenon are master strokes of the Nafs, and executed with the utmost of ease (lit. dexterity of his left hand)

The tyrannical Nafs is always close. So it comes as no surprise when we witness it in the poet’s smile on receiving applaud for his poetry; in the writers eye, as it sparkles in a Literary assembly held in his honour; in the politicians hand as it waves to a cheering crowd: in the humble nod of the holy mans head, when the praises of his piety are sung; and in the Champion (lit. quarrelsome person) who puffs his chest in pride at the rehearsal of his achievements. In all these situations the Nafs is in extremely close contact. Furthermore, when the Nafs enters (our consciousness), God withdraws. For proximity to the Nafs means only distancing from God, the distance between Heaven and Hell, the distinction between the Rahman (Allah) and the shaytan (devil), between the forces of evil (Ahraman) and the forces of good (ahwaramzaada), and in the conflict between light and darkness. Thus the manifestations of the Nafs are unlimited.

Consider the pieces on a chessboard. Despite being limited to just a few pieces, the number of possible moves that can be made are, perhaps, over a billion. Similar is the case of the Nafs. Consisting of a few fundamental instincts common to both humans and animals, the mutual interactions and permutations of these handful of instincts are unlimited. According to one mystic: to this day I have not fathomed two things: the stations of rank of Muhammad (peace be upon him), and the forms of deception employed by the nafs. However, individual instincts acting on their own cannot exert influence and control over the nafs without the mutual involvement of other motivating instincts. From all of these, desire is the ultimate driving force of the nafs, and it operates on ever more sophisticated levels as man becomes more ‘educated (and cultured)’. It reaches a stage where it goes beyond the ‘control system’ (influence) of the fundamental balance placed inside man. When this occurs destruction becomes its second nature.

The nafs, nevertheless, does not deceive, rather it is sincere in its deception: since both its scientific and emotional natures are closely intertwined. Furthermore, its governing principles are plain and evident, namely that, the survival instinct does not recognize any moral values. It has, from time immemorial, been accompanied by all the aides and supporters (agents) it requires to maintain its continued existence: envy, rancour, slander, anger, rage and lust. Not a single one of them will ever betray the nafs, operating universally without distinction of race and religion. Despite fluctuations in the severity and vigilance of their attacks, their aims undergo no such change and remain stable. For instance, their collaboration does not always lead to killing and bloodshed, but envy does not permit even a shred of compassion to enter its dealings.

These qualities stand diametrically opposed to the attributes of God and are devoid of any sense of reverence (lit. worship/servitude). Their field of work is restricted and their horizons extremely limited. The sublime sense of tranquillity is rarely witnessed in the conduct of these instincts, which, akin to a blazing forest fire seek to scorch and ravage instantly everything in their path, offering no opportunities to stop and pause. Its flames are fanned by the winds of egoism, defiance and self-respect (pride). The latter is perhaps the most puzzling and in need of further investigation. It is an interesting and amusing fact that the vast majority of people regard ‘self respect’ as an admirable attribute. The truth, however, is that the notion of Self respect is a ‘Palace of Glass’ built on the twin foundations of luxury or ease, and a sense of inferiority. Indeed, we do not possess a criterion to assess the Self; for it constructs itself by exploiting the crisis and insecurities that we experience in our lives, from childhood into old age. The Nafs adopts the path of antagonism or the path of harmony towards its victim depending on its situation, and becomes itself the raw material for the manufacture of ‘self respect’.

In this scenario ‘self respect’ becomes a highly intricate psychological concern. Despite the fact that the Nafs can be regarded as a factor of great significance and weight, it can, nevertheless, be fully understood in the early stages of its development and before a man becomes ‘cultured and educated’. With the growth of skills, education and new outlooks in a person, the nafs begins to resort to a greater degree of sophistication in its ‘technical’ capacities. Consequently, the acquisition of Knowledge and Art leads to the development of increasingly refined and enigmatic emotions. When united with personal and Self-influenced preferences, these feelings result in the Nafs going beyond the scope of accountability.

This is the phase in which ones’ entire spiritual prowess and thinking becomes a target for manipulation by the Nafs. For no one can surpass it in the hatching of reasons to justify itself. Exploiting the whole spectrum of values of good and evil the Human Self displays the results of its handiwork everywhere: mutual pride, arrogance, detestation of others and their opinions, ostentation and show, the hunger for power, assigning importance to oneself, scientific and intellectual boasting, surrounding oneself by like-minded people, creating ‘mirages’ through speech and manipulation of emotions, creating divisions among people, self love, material opulence, the pandering after choice, the designation of identified approaches to various branches of learning, and in the latest styles of culture and civilisation. We witness the handiwork of the Nafs where ever we turn.

In the western intellectual climate, despite its advancement, longing for power and fame is regarded as a fundamental part of human nature. Thus receiving praise for ones achievements and striving ones utmost for this goal is seen as something noble and worthwhile. Similarly, in the East the endless list of honorific titles at all levels is an evident illustration of the Self’s handiwork. No religious scholar, thinker or professional sees any harm in receiving these titles whose very roots lie in flattery and hyperbole which ultimately originates in the Self’s flattery and praise of the admirers themselves.

Both the mystic and the cynic view the intrusions of the Nafs with ridicule and derision. Despite his mockery and sarcasm of the Self, the cynic cannot, however, shelter himself from being consumed by the flames of envy and anger, a product of the self’s counter attack. In contrast, the mystic neutralises the states and feelings induced by the Self through the adoption of a sublime philosophy of life, intellectual modesty, and achieving balance in life. Furthermore, the cynic resists the Self like a diseased man who shows contempt towards everyone who is healthy. The mystic, walking under the shade of Divine love and affection, does not regard his merits over others as deriving form his own person. Rather he considers all notions of excellence and pre-eminence as a trust and favour from God. Thus he is preserved from the destructive emotions of arrogance and conceit, for he realises too well that any claim to ‘superiority’ (Godhood) based on borrowed ‘goods’ is transitory and groundless.
The Nafs does however have its rivals. Humour is a deadly poison for the Nafs for it possesses an equal footing to the ‘greatness’ and superiority of the Self. Of course, Humour can act as a tool of the Nafs in many ways: finding faults and weaknesses in others, assassination of their character, creating scandals, invading the privacy of others, and gaining pleasure by degrading others. These are amongst the favourite pastimes of Humour. However, when it turns its gaze on itself, it succeeds in breaking the enchanting spell of ‘self sympathy and support’. Digging its heels in the trenches of self-deception and self-centeredness, it deals heavy and sustained blows to the scheming Self. Is not the one who can laugh at himself a thousand times better than one who laughs at the expense of another? The nafs routinely ignores its own defects and yet is constantly vigilant of its status and standing.

However, this watchdog over the Nafs is above morals of right and wrong, oblivious to honour or disgrace, even-handed in times of want and plenty. It flourishes merely through the complete aid and assistance of God. Humour recognises that hopes and aspirations are not the function of the needy, for their period of duration is not long: nor does it attribute its aptitude and ability as originating from itself; nor does it claim the right of ownership over loaned ‘goods’; and nor does it regard life on earth as perpetual. Further, it regards the ultimate goal of knowledge as the achievement of balance and equilibrium in life.

Thus, Humour prevents the Nafs from displaying sympathy towards itself and obliges it to accept its shortcomings. It tolerates each and every person in accordance to his or her intellectual capacities. The single most important factor behind the pervasive influence, in the present age, of conditions such as impetuosity, discontent, depression and boredom, is the refusal of self-accountability, promotion of self-absorption, the desire for ease and comfort, and in the displacement of reverence by the desire to become God. Despite the acceptance of the eternal and all-governing God, indifference and active striving against His guidance, management and submission leads us to assume personal, splintered and self centred ideas, as well as the adoption of negative lifestyles. As a result, there is bloodshed and destruction, intense emotions of dissatisfaction, insomnia, and memory loss. The present age is deeply suffering form these factors.

The nafs does not deceive, rather the phases of trial and testing that the children of Adam have to undergo are of two types: the static and the dynamic’ (‘moving and shiftable). The former ‘technology’ is centred around the Self, whilst the latter is under the control and guidance of Shaytaan. The technology of the Nafs is characterised as static since it does not possess any originality both in its aims and its methods. From pre-eternity till the genesis of man the Self, yearning for everlasting life, led man astray. The outcast Shaytaan manifested this yearning in the time and space dimensions of Paradise with the result that Adam was distanced from the vicinity of God.

The Self furnishes and prepares the ground in which Shaytaan sows the seeds of corruption. Followed by the growth of the sturdy tree of ‘repulsive desires’. It is a poisonous ‘shrub’ which destroys the healthy harvest of knowledge and understanding. The lethal success of the nafs rests primarily on the mind of man and the lack of knowledge and ignorance of the commands and counsels of the Generous Lord. God, like a great and eminent teacher, does not employ compulsion in the matters He has given choice to man. Indeed, it would not have been difficult for God to make the whole of mankind accept His guidance. None would have the power to refuse, nor even to contemplate it. Even the notion of disobedience would not exist.

If this had been the case, the purpose of education would not have been achieved. Since the fundamental goal of education is to develop the capacity to make right choices. For instance, giving a man the ability to make correct choices and then passing judgement on him, would be an arbitrary and pointless system and God is certainly not inequitable. Thus man was provided with opportunities to develop his intellectual capacity through a variety of supportive and encouraging methods. Alongside this, the Self too was equipped with the capacity to sense loss and express regret. From time to time it is possible for this capacity to lead man to awareness, and offer him, yet again, another opportunity to regain his sense of balance and soundness.

In short, this Human saga in Gods view consists merely of three possibilities: sin or error, the sense of regret (guilt), and repentance and forgiveness. Can there be anyone more unjust than the one who knows he has wronged, knows that his repentance will be accepted, and still fails to make amends for his loss and failures. It is this injustice and ignorance alluded by God in the Quran as the ‘trust’ of knowledge bestowed on man. The rehabilitation of man and inspiring him towards it by means of hardship, is at least in Gods wisdom not a possibility. Since hardship can itself lead to a kind of enmity and the harbouring of hidden notions of pride and arrogance. Indeed, sacrificing ones life is not such a worthwhile action and, certainly not one, which leads to deserving the proximity and closeness of God. If this were the case, the sturdy bull that drives the oil press would surely be the greatest mystic and knower of God! The Self adulterates logical necessity with false claims and demands, making it a constituent part of shaytan’s repertoire (lit. Satanism).

In any case, God regards man superior to beasts and animals and Intellect as the most distinguished part of his creation. Deliberation and reflection offers man the capacity to make his choices more freely and autonomously. Although the Nafs promotes the currency of its transitory preferences and priorities, recognising true identity is a product of the efforts of ones Fitrah (primordial nature) and balanced intellectual curiosity. However, the Nafs does possess a vulnerability that can be exploited by the folk of knowledge. It is this weakness which can be utilised to temper its excesses and halt the flow of its destructive tendencies, namely, that the Nafs possesses, more than any other desire, intense curiosity and inquisitiveness. It is continuously engaged in the acts of smelling, tasting and finding out. It seeks amazing and bewildering sensations and occurrences, always hungry for new experiences, and it has a passion for individuality. This passion drives it to seek knowledge of the world and its surroundings and occasionally directs it to tread the path leading to God.

By utilising the Self’s inquisitiveness and curiosity, its level of knowledge and training can be increased, thus distinguishing it from the common masses and the poorly educated. It resembles a wild, predatory beast almost impossible to tame. However, it is not uncommon to observe that even wild and predatory animals such as lions, wolfs, wild dogs, and poisonous snakes can be reared as pets. In the early stages of training and despite its willingness, the Self revolts and refuses to submit on account of its original characteristics. It unceasingly struggles to act according to its former tendencies and habits. Similarly, in the early stages of its ‘nurturing’ the nafs should not be driven by any sublime and worthy ideals, rather its curiosity should be used to make it seek and strive harder.

After the completion of its training and the adoption of new habits and tendencies, the Nafs is eager to stamp its individuality and distinguish itself from others. With the passage of time and growth of knowledge the Nafs begins to develop love and affection for this new approach and internalises it as a permanent and freely chosen practice. This developmental stage of the Self’s thought, leads to the desire to seek the friendship of God. The ideas of this new ‘world’ and the discovery of new horizons prevent the Self from abandoning this choice for divine longing. All the while, its original instincts are striving to pull it back to its days of ignorance (Jahiliyya). However, the strength and fortitude of the new practices keep it steadfast on the path towards God. Further, through the mercy and support of God, tranquillity and inspiration descends upon the Self. This unexpected blessing is one that the Human Self has never tasted before. It is now that its purpose in life becomes (crystal) clear and its beliefs and thoughts clarified. Indeed, (ultimate) consciousness is attained.

However, this phase is not without its own perils and dangers. Righteousness, coupled with the intense desire for piety and the hardships of the struggle for self-purification, seek to instil in the Self the craving to make claims of superiority and the pursuit of a special status for itself. In this phase of its intellectual evolution, apart from the Love of God and sincerity nothing else can help the Nafs. Indeed, the love of God and submission to the Messenger are beacons of Guidance in this way station. However, compliance to the messenger does not merely consist of outward actions and optional acts of worship. Rather it requires a complete and in-depth understanding of the Prophets’ love, ethics and values.

In all of this three ranks of the ‘sweetness’ of faith are clearly discernible. Firstly, when love is for the sake of Allah and enmity for the sake of Allah. Secondly when love for the messenger of Allah is stronger than all worldly ambitions and desire for wealth. Finally when the nafs feels absolute abhorrence to return to values of the animal instinct, which are synonymous to unbelief or kufr. The self at this stage of its ‘training’ will not, under any circumstances, turn back to its former ways. It is also at this stage that the minor mistakes of the Nafs are overlooked, and it is given the news of forgiveness both in this world and the next. This is alluded to in the Quran: ”O the Nafs (that is) content, return to your lord pleased and pleasing. So Enter (amongst) my bondsmen and Enter my Paradise”.

Finally no one can claim to be the ultimate specialist or an expert on the Nafs. However, broadly speaking, the Nafs is surrounded by the habits and tendencies acquired during three main phases. Thus it consists of genetic qualities; immediate parental upbringing; and personally acquired capacities. The latter two factors seem more prominent and are easily identified. However, the former, centuries old ‘Fitrah’ can be an invincible enemy. Thus, the mystic fights his ultimate battle against his own ‘Fitrah’. In the face of overt and secret enemies, namely the Nafs and the Shaytaan, it is Allah alone who can influence this Fitrah, which He created. Ultimately, Allah’s Grace and Love can conquer this level.

billl
07-21-2011, 03:11 AM
Look, the Self is often just doing the good job of trying to defend itself from indoctrination. I'm not at all impressed by the game of making one's Self (or Pride, or Dignity, or Self-worth) get dragged through the mud as if it were a colossal mistake. Of course, people can be arrogant, or selfish beyond reason at times (and that sort of mistake deserves reflection, awareness, and correction, and is worth talking about). But that's no reason to completely surrender to some Book/system (and Islam is not the only one), no reason to make some spiritual construction into one's teacher.

We might live in an age of technological advancement, and the idea of a Utopia might seem pretty obvious and exciting--but the technology and the powers swirling around today (and yes, I'd say the mystic ones, as well, if you insist on trumpeting them as being particularly useful... which is different than simply special) leave us as vulnerable as ever to "teachings" that seek to make us sheep. Or zombies. Or children. Or tools.

Even in the context of surrender and ego-diminishment, people will, in fact, go on for many hundreds of words (about mysticism, and holy books, and psychological adjustments) trying to gain influence over others, and not even realize what they're doing.

G L Wilson
07-21-2011, 03:35 PM
I have no problem with Muslim submission before Allah, none at all. It keeps them out of mischief.

Paulclem
07-22-2011, 02:21 AM
God has declared war on this enemy and has made it known that one who yearns for His love and intimacy must oppose the Nafs no matter what form its takes or what strategy it employs. Since, in every age, the Nafs drapes the ‘corpses’ of its devotees (dead) in the latest style of shrouds. If not as Olympus, Brahman, Shiva and Vishnu, Ashtar and Isis; then as the models of abstract philosophies. If not in the worship of physical objects, then in the festivals of culture and tradition, in the complementary understanding of ecstasy and sobriety, and in the interaction between literature and homosexuality. Today, in our day and age, in the labelling of oppression and injustice as civilisation and the mass media’s propaganda as truth, in the movements of indecency and obscenity promoted in the name of Art, idol worship parades under the guise of the Fine Arts, and any mention of God is dubbed backwardness. Indeed, these phenomenon are master strokes of the Nafs, and executed with the utmost of ease (lit. dexterity of his left hand)

What you have written is interesting, but also famiiar. From what I have read, it is not unlike the messages contained in other religions for example the self as the source of problems. I see that you mention Hinduism and "abstract philosophies" as being deceptive, but that is to dismiss the wisdom of centuries. Does this represent tolerance or understanding?

Why pick specifically on Hinduism, or is the "worship of physical objects" a reference to wider religious symbolism that the author doesn't want to name?

usman.khawar
07-22-2011, 03:01 AM
Look, the Self is often just doing the good job of trying to defend itself from indoctrination. I'm not at all impressed by the game of making one's Self (or Pride, or Dignity, or Self-worth) get dragged through the mud as if it were a colossal mistake. Of course, people can be arrogant, or selfish beyond reason at times (and that sort of mistake deserves reflection, awareness, and correction, and is worth talking about). But that's no reason to completely surrender to some Book/system (and Islam is not the only one), no reason to make some spiritual construction into one's teacher.

We might live in an age of technological advancement, and the idea of a Utopia might seem pretty obvious and exciting--but the technology and the powers swirling around today (and yes, I'd say the mystic ones, as well, if you insist on trumpeting them as being particularly useful... which is different than simply special) leave us as vulnerable as ever to "teachings" that seek to make us sheep. Or zombies. Or children. Or tools.

Even in the context of surrender and ego-diminishment, people will, in fact, go on for many hundreds of words (about mysticism, and holy books, and psychological adjustments) trying to gain influence over others, and not even realize what they're doing.


After the completion of its training and the adoption of new habits and tendencies, the Nafs is eager to stamp its individuality and distinguish itself from others. With the passage of time and growth of knowledge the Nafs begins to develop love and affection for this new approach and internalises it as a permanent and freely chosen practice. This developmental stage of the Self’s thought, leads to the desire to seek the friendship of God. The ideas of this new ‘world’ and the discovery of new horizons prevent the Self from abandoning this choice for divine longing. All the while, its original instincts are striving to pull it back to its days of ignorance (Jahiliyya). However, the strength and fortitude of the new practices keep it steadfast on the path towards God. Further, through the mercy and support of God, tranquillity and inspiration descends upon the Self. This unexpected blessing is one that the Human Self has never tasted before. It is now that its purpose in life becomes (crystal) clear and its beliefs and thoughts clarified. Indeed, (ultimate) consciousness is attained.

billl
07-22-2011, 03:06 AM
And the programming is complete. Once the "freely chosen" (after preparatory indoctrination) part is done.

usman.khawar
07-22-2011, 03:19 AM
God has declared war on this enemy and has made it known that one who yearns for His love and intimacy must oppose the Nafs no matter what form its takes or what strategy it employs. Since, in every age, the Nafs drapes the ‘corpses’ of its devotees (dead) in the latest style of shrouds. If not as Olympus, Brahman, Shiva and Vishnu, Ashtar and Isis; then as the models of abstract philosophies. If not in the worship of physical objects, then in the festivals of culture and tradition, in the complementary understanding of ecstasy and sobriety, and in the interaction between literature and homosexuality. Today, in our day and age, in the labelling of oppression and injustice as civilisation and the mass media’s propaganda as truth, in the movements of indecency and obscenity promoted in the name of Art, idol worship parades under the guise of the Fine Arts, and any mention of God is dubbed backwardness. Indeed, these phenomenon are master strokes of the Nafs, and executed with the utmost of ease (lit. dexterity of his left hand)

What you have written is interesting, but also famiiar. From what I have read, it is not unlike the messages contained in other religions for example the self as the source of problems. I see that you mention Hinduism and "abstract philosophies" as being deceptive, but that is to dismiss the wisdom of centuries. Does this represent tolerance or understanding?

Why pick specifically on Hinduism, or is the "worship of physical objects" a reference to wider religious symbolism that the author doesn't want to name?

God has declared war on this enemy and has made it known that one who yearns for His love and intimacy must oppose the Nafs no matter what form its takes or what strategy it employs. Since, in every age, the Nafs drapes the ‘corpses’ of its devotees (dead) in the latest style of shrouds. If not as Olympus, Brahman, Shiva and Vishnu, Ashtar and Isis; then as the models of abstract philosophies. If not in the worship of physical objects, then in the festivals of culture and tradition, in the complementary understanding of ecstasy and sobriety, and in the interaction between literature and homosexuality. Today, in our day and age, in the labelling of oppression and injustice as civilisation and the mass media’s propaganda as truth, in the movements of indecency and obscenity promoted in the name of Art, idol worship parades under the guise of the Fine Arts, and any mention of God is dubbed backwardness. Indeed, these phenomenon are master strokes of the Nafs, and executed with the utmost of ease (lit. dexterity of his left hand)

i dont think the author pick only hinduism, even many muslims( groups) are doing the same thing that is wrong.

unfortunatley yes. the author dismiss the wisdom of centuries. according to him big names(including muslims scholars of few centuries) mislead the mankind(muslims scholars also gave priority to traditions only and not solving the basic wish of God, e.g " i was a hidden treasure i wish to be known, recogonize" ). by giving lessor importance to the ist priority of the life. and give more importance to the lessor priorities. according to him, the ist priority of intellectual curosity is to solve the very ist basic question.is there any God?. did any of big name of the centuries just spend time in search only for God as they spend for little part of any branch of knowledge? for several years? is there any work, colleges, universities for this work. what is the goal of mankind? its has been hijacked actually from the path towards Lord. Who said I showed you the path, gave you mind, now its upto you whether to deny or thankful.
why we are here on the earth? from where we come and where we go after death? what happen after death? these are very important questions.
is it all by accident? what a beautiful accident than! everything is running in perfect scenario.

G L Wilson
07-22-2011, 05:08 AM
" I'm a fan of man. I'm a humanist. Maybe the last humanist." - The Devil (Al Pacino) in The Devil's Advocate. I laughed at this, no-one else in the cinema did.

usman.khawar
07-22-2011, 05:46 AM
G L wilson! nice quote but should be posted in the thread my fav quotes or you can/should start another thread for it.

YesNo
07-22-2011, 10:28 AM
The "nafs" remind me of the "gunas" in the Bhagavad Gita. Are you familiar with that Hindu text, usman.khawar?

Does the philosophy you are presenting require you to be a Muslim? Or could you be a Hindu or a Christian as well?

G L Wilson
07-22-2011, 10:31 AM
G L wilson! nice quote but should be posted in the thread my fav quotes or you can/should start another thread for it.
At least Hollywood got the joke.

Paulclem
07-22-2011, 02:27 PM
i dont think the author pick only hinduism, even many muslims( groups) are doing the same thing that is wrong.

unfortunatley yes. the author dismiss the wisdom of centuries. according to him big names(including muslims scholars of few centuries) mislead the mankind(muslims scholars also gave priority to traditions only and not solving the basic wish of God, e.g " i was a hidden treasure i wish to be known, recogonize" ). by giving lessor importance to the ist priority of the life. and give more importance to the lessor priorities. according to him, the ist priority of intellectual curosity is to solve the very ist basic question.is there any God?. did any of big name of the centuries just spend time in search only for God as they spend for little part of any branch of knowledge? for several years? is there any work, colleges, universities for this work. what is the goal of mankind? its has been hijacked actually from the path towards Lord. Who said I showed you the path, gave you mind, now its upto you whether to deny or thankful.
why we are here on the earth? from where we come and where we go after death? what happen after death? these are very important questions.
is it all by accident? what a beautiful accident than! everything is running in perfect scenario.

It seems to be a rhetorical question, the search for God, if you are from this tradition. Is it a quest that is truly undertaken then?

The problem with the idea of God is that it seems a redundant concept. The creation of the earth can be traced by science, and seems to be a series of cause and effect that is explainable.

The extract talks of Nafs, but if you remove the metaphysical aspects of the extract, you end up with a convincing psychology, and good advice for leading a good life.

So that begs the question why do people still believe in God? I presume that some find their own evidence for the prescence of God, but what about the general population? Is it just a tribal identification with a religion rather than a properly consdered, open minded path that they have investigated?

what a beautiful accident

This argument - that everything is as God has planned it, that everything is perfect and as it should be - really doesn't do it for me. The suffering and death in this world is evident to anyone who wants to look. Famines, floods, earthquakes - to cite the latest few natural disasters. Even if you look upon a pleasant meadow in the countryside, then if you look closely enough, the insects and animals are killing and eating each other - suffering and dying. What's so beautiful about that?

G L Wilson
07-22-2011, 05:25 PM
It seems to be a rhetorical question, the search for God, if you are from this tradition. Is it a quest that is truly undertaken then?

The problem with the idea of God is that it seems a redundant concept. The creation of the earth can be traced by science, and seems to be a series of cause and effect that is explainable.

The extract talks of Nafs, but if you remove the metaphysical aspects of the extract, you end up with a convincing psychology, and good advice for leading a good life.

So that begs the question why do people still believe in God? I presume that some find their own evidence for the prescence of God, but what about the general population? Is it just a tribal identification with a religion rather than a properly consdered, open minded path that they have investigated?

what a beautiful accident

This argument - that everything is as God has planned it, that everything is perfect and as it should be - really doesn't do it for me. The suffering and death in this world is evident to anyone who wants to look. Famines, floods, earthquakes - to cite the latest few natural disasters. Even if you look upon a pleasant meadow in the countryside, then if you look closely enough, the insects and animals are killing and eating each other - suffering and dying. What's so beautiful about that?

Religion is definitely tribal. I've got the scars to prove it.

usman.khawar
07-25-2011, 09:16 AM
GL Wilson, Paulclem, yes no and all dear fellows
There are series of good questions I saw. And I have posted the answers of these, some answers in the thread “why I believe in God”. I suggested the name of that thread should b “why I believe in God. Why I rejected God” as well :)

There are many things which was considered metaphysical or parapsychology in few decades before but now they have come in the circle of physical or psychology and have gained the status of science But one word is always being the top of them. That is God. And the answers or explanations of your questions I mentioned in why believe in God, there the arguments was given was not any internal phenomena argument.

But here I like to clear one point that God is not a redundant concept. If there is God, give only one percent chance of His existence, then? Trillions and trillions years life, I should say unlimited time ahead would be on risk. Isn’t it? A good business mind will never ignore it.

In the chemistry of human, I think God has feed his idea and it reflects in everyone’s mind to examine the person pursue it or deny it, Believe him or deny him. So this is reason word God (different names in different era for One God (Allah) concept, who is above all, nor borne nor have any children, He is not like anything which we can imagine even, has no wife, He is ist etc. ) is always popular.

We also see that science theories also proved wrong as it happened about the movement of universes, etc . hypothesis, experiments are done again and again and finally when reached on some invincible point explained the Quran statement. Like some examples I quoted in my other post. A fact takes a lot of time to get the status of science. Hypothesis, experiments, wrong and then again hypothesis and experiments. But we see when the God of Quran talks he talks with full confidence. If he mentioned some scientific facts He doesn’t hesitate that it could be wrong. why? becoz He is the creator. Muslims were afraid( many who wrongly translated the some words so that it couldnt not contradict with science but finally science proved it right) but God is not afraid to describe. As I mentioned in my other posts. Scientist today says that before the earth n sky there were clouds(of gases) and we know it for 14 centuries before.

We can explain the things or earth with the series of cause and effects. yes we can explain. so thats very reason we need any external scientifc argument to prove the existance of God. which is mentioned in the thread "why i beleive in God".... but the question why don’t we apply(cause and effect theory) on our self. What is our cause of being here? Is there any effect will happen upon me if i don’t fulfill my cause?

This world and universes are running in a perfect manner, a perfect guess of God. People are worried about suffering and deaths. And found it a counter argument against perfect scenario.
What happened with the people? People ask or demand there should be only day not night?
Only good not bad? only truth but not lie? Only God not self+devil? My dear fellows if you consider again than by this there would be no growth of mind. No usage of mind. No need for thinking. Consideration dies its own death. There would be no grades. There would b no advancement. Everything would be standstill and static. And vice versa.

Yes No ! the philosophy which is presented. and the detail answer is given. For ist two stages of mind I believe its not necessary. But for the 3rd stage and ahead only for Muslims. Why ? Is explained already in above article before, if you read the thread, another thread about "mystics, the path, the reality" you will find more help why i said so. and there is also the answer very brief answer of ur question in my ist post in the thread why i beleive in God.

But the thing i beleive that for ist two stages as well, Muslim can overcome more easily than another. Becoz in this war muslim seeks help from God and understand power is from God also there are many ways/arguments for this way as well explained by islam/and lot of saints told the mild stones of the way which make it more easy for the person who go for it and walk towards reality with balance. its all about balance actually.

There is quote of a muslim saint “ khawaja moein ud din chisti”

Quote! Those who think that it’s a difficult path, God forgive them I went so easily.

YesNo
07-25-2011, 10:32 AM
We also see that science theories also proved wrong as it happened about the movement of universes, etc . hypothesis, experiments are done again and again and finally when reached on some invincible point explained the Quran statement. Like some examples I quoted in my other post. A fact takes a lot of time to get the status of science. Hypothesis, experiments, wrong and then again hypothesis and experiments. But we see when the God of Quran talks he talks with full confidence. If he mentioned some scientific facts He doesn’t hesitate that it could be wrong. why? becoz He is the creator. Muslims were afraid(as i observe many who wrongly translated the quran that i not contradict with science but finally science proved it right) but God is not afraid to describe.as I mentioned in my other posts. Scientist today says that before the earth n sky there were clouds(of gases) and we know it for 14 centuries before.

...

Yes No ! the philosophy which is presented. Well for ist two stages I believe its not necessary. But for the 3rd stage and ahead only for Muslims. Why ? Is explained already in above article before, if you read thread another thread about "mystics, the path, the reality" you will find more help why i said so.

...

I think 21st century science is compatible with many religions, not only the Muslim religion. This was not the case with science a hundred years ago and it may not be the case with science in the future.

Some Christians and Muslims, and perhaps others, take the texts they believe in too seriously to the point that their behavior could be considered idolatrous, that is, the texts become a sort of god or idol that they identity with and worship.

However, I don't want to encourage you to change your religious viewpoint. It apparently works for you. I believe that other religious viewpoints can achieve the same results. That is where we might disagree.

Thanks for responding to my question!

usman.khawar
07-25-2011, 11:16 AM
I think 21st century science is compatible with many religions, not only the Muslim religion. This was not the case with science a hundred years ago and it may not be the case with science in the future.

Some Christians and Muslims, and perhaps others, take the texts they believe in too seriously to the point that their behavior could be considered idolatrous, that is, the texts become a sort of god or idol that they identity with and worship.

However, I don't want to encourage you to change your religious viewpoint. It apparently works for you. I believe that other religious viewpoints can achieve the same results. That is where we might disagree.

Thanks for responding to my question!
yesNo
you are welcome.
its only your thinking i dont mind.
thanks for not changing my viewpoints. but if you give me any other better arguments, i'll change my viewpoint.

GL Wilson, Paulclem, and all dear fellows
There are series of good questions I saw. And I have posted the answers of these, some answers in the thread “why I believe in God”. I suggested the name of that thread should b “why I believe in God. Why I rejected God” as well

There are many things which was considered metaphysical or parapsychology in few decades before but now they have come in the circle of physical or psychology and have gained the status of science But one word is always being the top of them. That is God. And the answers or explanations of your questions I mentioned in why believe in God, there the arguments was given was not any internal phenomena argument.

But here I like to clear one point that God is not a redundant concept. If there is God, give only one percent chance of His existence, then? Trillions and trillions years life, I should say unlimited time ahead would be on risk. Isn’t it? A good business mind will never ignore it.

In the chemistry of human, I think God has feed his idea and it reflects in everyone’s mind to examine the person pursue it or deny it, Believe him or deny him. So this is reason word God (different names in different era for One God (Allah) concept, who is above all, nor borne nor have any children, He is not like anything which we can imagine even, has no wife, He is ist etc. ) is always popular.

We also see that science theories also proved wrong as it happened about the movement of universes, etc . hypothesis, experiments are done again and again and finally when reached on some invincible point explained the Quran statement. Like some examples I quoted in my other post. A fact takes a lot of time to get the status of science. Hypothesis, experiments, wrong and then again hypothesis and experiments. But we see when the God of Quran talks he talks with full confidence. If he mentioned some scientific facts He doesn’t hesitate that it could be wrong. why? becoz He is the creator. Muslims were afraid( many who wrongly translated the some words so that it couldnt not contradict with science but finally science proved it right) but God is not afraid to describe. As I mentioned in my other posts. Scientist today says that before the earth n sky there were clouds(of gases) and we know it for 14 centuries before.

We can explain the things or earth with the series of cause and effects. yes we can explain. so thats very reason we need any external scientifc argument to prove the existance of God. which is mentioned in the thread "why i beleive in God".... but the question why don’t we apply(cause and effect theory) on our self. What is our cause of being here? Is there any effect will happen upon me if i don’t fulfill my cause?

This world and universes are running in a perfect manner, a perfect guess of God. People are worried about suffering and deaths. And found it a counter argument against perfect scenario.
What happened with the people? People ask or demand there should be only day not night?
Only good not bad? only truth but not lie? Only God not self+devil? My dear fellows if you consider again than by this there would be no growth of mind. No usage of mind. No need for thinking. Consideration dies its own death. There would be no grades. There would b no advancement. Everything would be standstill and static. And vice versa.

G L Wilson
07-26-2011, 08:20 PM
I could live quite happily without the Devil, thanks.

Paulclem
07-27-2011, 07:38 AM
But here I like to clear one point that God is not a redundant concept. If there is God, give only one percent chance of His existence, then? Trillions and trillions years life, I should say unlimited time ahead would be on risk. Isn’t it? A good business mind will never ignore it.

I don't find this argument very convincing - that we should believe in God just in case.

I'm not saying that a belief in God is bad - i think a religious viewpoint/ belief in God can provide a counter to prevailing negative trends in societies.

This world and universes are running in a perfect manner, a perfect guess of God. People are worried about suffering and deaths. And found it a counter argument against perfect scenario.
What happened with the people? People ask or demand there should be only day not night?
Only good not bad? only truth but not lie? Only God not self+devil? My dear fellows if you consider again than by this there would be no growth of mind. No usage of mind. No need for thinking. Consideration dies its own death. There would be no grades. There would b no advancement. Everything would be standstill and static. And vice versa.

This doesn't necessitate the need for a God either. Apart from the idea of it being perfect - which I find to be a term hard to apply to a description of the universe - eg perfect as opposed to what? - humankind would face challenges with or without divine creation.

usman.khawar
07-28-2011, 07:51 AM
PaulClem: But here I like to clear one point that God is not a redundant concept. If there is God, give only one percent chance of His existence, then? Trillions and trillions years life, I should say unlimited time ahead would be on risk. Isn’t it? A good business mind will never ignore it.

I don't find this argument very convincing - that we should believe in God just in case.

u didnt get what i said. its not argument for His existance. is it look like an argument to you? well the argument i have given in another threads for his ultimate existance. thats is about quran.

what i said above basically proceed once again what i have said earlier that did human solve the ist basic question? does God exist or not? should we give importance to this very ist question? should not we solve this quesiton in our early time of life? if He dont exist than there is no problem at all. be happy and do whatever you want to do. but tell me one thing if after my death i cant get the reward of my good doings than why i do good things? why i care about anything? why i promote/act so called good things? if some people remember me after my death in good manners, what can i feel, what i would gain? what is my benifit? or should i'll be happy in nothingness?

what i said above was not argument but what if God is awaiting?/?

well Job is not very difficult. and has been explain in so many verses.

Lo! We have shown him the way, whether he be grateful or disbelieving. (Dahar: 3)

I give you a talent, I give you thinking, and I give you apparatus of mind to think. And all I wanted you on earth, go on earth, think about surrounding, think about universe, think about life patterns and try to find out who is the creator? And you should develop greater love for him rather than any thing. It will be absurd to look for things below God’s status as God’s. So we are bound to consider God is the top truth reality. And not only that one who interfere in every bit of our life, in our first breath, in our last breath. He gives us honor, he gives us dishonor. He gives us children. He gives us parents, and when every thing is given by God then who is such a wise man, who will say God is a lesser importance or lesser priority. And you see our fault is very simple. This fault lies with every human being. We give lesser importance to top priority and more importance to lesser priorities.

religion was the way only. Goal was always same from adam to Muhammad. that is "there is no other gods but Allah( One God, free from all wants, not father of any creation nor son. nothing is like Him, most merciful n benificial etc)"



after death(transfering into next state/stage) there would b a single question ist of all. " who is your Lord? " .. one who used his mind and solve this question in the world will easyily give the answer. and will be awarded a boarding card. and will enter in his destination after dooms day for ever.

for me after solving the ist question the 2nd question was very simple , that whether i should move towards Him or not? for His nearness? should i take the side of God or Devil, take the way of good or bad? i had to clear my intention.

"This world and universes are running in a perfect manner, a perfect guess of God. People are worried about suffering and deaths. And found it a counter argument against perfect scenario.
What happened with the people? People ask or demand there should be only day not night?Only good not bad? only truth but not lie? Only God not self+devil? My dear fellows if you consider again than by this there would be no growth of mind. No usage of mind. No need for thinking. Consideration dies its own death. There would be no grades. There would b no advancement. Everything would be standstill and static. And vice versa. "

This doesn't necessitate the need for a God either. Apart from the idea of it being perfect - which I find to be a term hard to apply to a description of the universe - eg perfect as opposed to what? - humankind would face challenges with or without divine creation.

Dear! what i said above was in context "why sufferings why deaths?" hope u consider it again.

Short explanation for those i think who could not read above article about nafs. and for those who wanna summarize above.

Define ‘Nafs (Self)’ ‘Qalb(heart)’ Rooh( Soul, spirit)’.

Well! Many things have been said about these. Actually you don’t know any thing. You always pass a confusing statement about those things. When people did not know much about Nafs they said; it is the greatest enigma in the history of mankind (what is nafs) but it was not difficult. Nafs is actually the basic packet of your instincts, when get together they create a self that is nafs. And Qalb is a place; its very equivalence place where wisdom and nafs both act. It is a place. If I don’t have a place for anger in my heart I won’t get angry. Even if the Satan works very hard with me we provide him something from inside so it is a kind of land where he cast his seed. Heart is a place which lives with God. It only remains happy with God. But when it is not with God it is land of mischief. So everybody can come and puts some wrong in it. So I already told you when things go cracked, Qalb and nafs from a bad way of thinking moves on too. As Quran says:

God has created every thing in balance.

Nafs is fifty percent wisdom and fifty percent of the satanic impression. When you do get balance, heart gets balance, even Rooh gets balance. But when it gets corrupted, heart gets corrupted even the spirit gets corrupted and you go to Hell. When these are impaired, when they are not properly functioning, when they are not fulfilling the purpose of their creation they go to Hell. And if they succeed in knowing themselves Even a particle of faith will not die. Even a particle of faith will take you to the heaven if you are sincere. So basically there is no difference. We use people, use the mystic the mystic, use these words for facility. They don’t have any worthwhile explanation, what is heart? What is this? May be a teacher explains it as metaphysically, others mystically, the third one scientifically. And basically they use these words and phraseology for explaining certain conditions of mind so nafs is a word which is used for all negative qualities of man. And Qalb is a name which is used for a balanced sheet which has fifty percent both. And Rooh is used for the utmost purification of life. There are three mental conditions. I have never found a difference between Rooh and nafs and all this because to me they all work together this way or that way.

Paulclem
08-02-2011, 06:27 PM
u didnt get what i said. its not argument for His existance. is it look like an argument to you? well the argument i have given in another threads for his ultimate existance. thats is about quran.



But I didn't say it was an argument for his existence. I was saying that it's not a very convincing argument promote belief in it. You could say the same about forms of gambling.

So you're saying that God leaving people to suffer means a development in the human mind. It promotes thnking and problem solving. without challenges, then the human mind doesn't progress/

If you are a believer in God and the Devil, then perhaps this would be convincing. Given the amount and depth of human and animal suffering, then don't find this convincing either.


Short explanation for those i think who could not read above article about nafs. and for those who wanna summarize above.

Define ‘Nafs (Self)’ ‘Qalb(heart)’ Rooh( Soul, spirit)’.

Well! Many things have been said about these. Actually you don’t know any thing. You always pass a confusing statement about those things. When people did not know much about Nafs they said; it is the greatest enigma in the history of mankind (what is nafs) but it was not difficult. Nafs is actually the basic packet of your instincts, when get together they create a self that is nafs. And Qalb is a place; its very equivalence place where wisdom and nafs both act. It is a place. If I don’t have a place for anger in my heart I won’t get angry. Even if the Satan works very hard with me we provide him something from inside so it is a kind of land where he cast his seed. Heart is a place which lives with God. It only remains happy with God. But when it is not with God it is land of mischief. So everybody can come and puts some wrong in it. So I already told you when things go cracked, Qalb and nafs from a bad way of thinking moves on too. As Quran says:

God has created every thing in balance.

Nafs is fifty percent wisdom and fifty percent of the satanic impression. When you do get balance, heart gets balance, even Rooh gets balance. But when it gets corrupted, heart gets corrupted even the spirit gets corrupted and you go to Hell. When these are impaired, when they are not properly functioning, when they are not fulfilling the purpose of their creation they go to Hell. And if they succeed in knowing themselves Even a particle of faith will not die. Even a particle of faith will take you to the heaven if you are sincere. So basically there is no difference. We use people, use the mystic the mystic, use these words for facility. They don’t have any worthwhile explanation, what is heart? What is this? May be a teacher explains it as metaphysically, others mystically, the third one scientifically. And basically they use these words and phraseology for explaining certain conditions of mind so nafs is a word which is used for all negative qualities of man. And Qalb is a name which is used for a balanced sheet which has fifty percent both. And Rooh is used for the utmost purification of life. There are three mental conditions. I have never found a difference between Rooh and nafs and all this because to me they all work together this way or that way.

I find the explanation interesting, but could it not be a metaphor for the positiver and negative drives in human emotions? The model you have described works without the need for divine or satanic drives - just human ones.

G L Wilson
08-02-2011, 07:10 PM
Is not soul self?

cl154576
08-02-2011, 08:40 PM
Is not soul self?

I'm not sure about in the religious context, but in life, no. The question reminds me of the scattered bits I've read on Internal Family Systems (IFS). The self has many "parts" – parts that suffer so much we avoid and suppress them; parts that try to manage all of our emotions and pull us through life; parts that resort to desperate, impulsive coping techniques when the managing parts fail (self-injuring behaviors, for instance).

Whether or not that makes sense, essentially everybody has a sort of Dissociative Identity Disorder (DID). In actual DID the difference is that the parts don't recognize each other.

For instance, in one person there can be a parenting part, a spouse part, a traumatized kid part, an addict part, etc., with each part behaving slightly differently (the parent might be stricter, the spouse more indulgent).

The self is the combination of all of them. The soul I'd say is the spiritual/religious part if such a part is relevant.

G L Wilson
08-02-2011, 10:42 PM
I'm not sure about in the religious context, but in life, no. The question reminds me of the scattered bits I've read on Internal Family Systems (IFS). The self has many "parts" – parts that suffer so much we avoid and suppress them; parts that try to manage all of our emotions and pull us through life; parts that resort to desperate, impulsive coping techniques when the managing parts fail (self-injuring behaviors, for instance).

Whether or not that makes sense, essentially everybody has a sort of Dissociative Identity Disorder (DID). In actual DID the difference is that the parts don't recognize each other.

For instance, in one person there can be a parenting part, a spouse part, a traumatized kid part, an addict part, etc., with each part behaving slightly differently (the parent might be stricter, the spouse more indulgent).

The self is the combination of all of them. The soul I'd say is the spiritual/religious part if such a part is relevant.

Are you saying that the self performs like the different actors in a play, independently in each role? Is the self no more than a circus monkey that jumps from role to role? Who is the ringmaster in this circus? Are we just a compartment of masks? Is the soul phoney like everything else? The soul is our genuine self, it is the task of all to get in touch with their soul.

usman.khawar
08-03-2011, 09:22 AM
is not soul self?
Are you saying that the self performs like the different actors in a play, independently in each role? Is the self no more than a circus monkey that jumps from role to role? Who is the ringmaster in this circus? Are we just a compartment of masks? Is the soul phoney like everything else? The soul is our genuine self, it is the task of all to get in touch with their soul.

No. Soul is not self. These are opposite of each other. For more clarification, soul, as you said it is the task of all to get in touch with their soul. Why? Coz soul knows everything, the ultimate reality, soul has no other wish except Lord. Soul is like a guest from Lord in our body.Body! Captured by self, who always want to live on earth but the soul always want to get back towards the lord. Mind is the attribute of Soul.
You asked “who is ringmaster in this circus?” it’s a very good question indeed! Well i like to explain it with an example but besides example i have to say that all things work together.
Your body is like a county/city/country/world/universe :) better word for the sake of example is city. But indeed every person is a sample of universe indeed a universe itself, anyway.
Who is the ringmaster?!? So your body is a city, where you appointed a governor which is self. This governor is very very greedy! And greediness leads many bad qualities as well u know. You have a prime minister which is your mind. This P.M always gives suggestions and clear you against the governor. Body parts like legs and arms are your economical and financial sectors. Eyes and ears are information sectors. Anger is a Police head. If you don’t keep the P.H under your control it will destroy each n everything. You are the king and I mean you as Heart. Heart is the king heart is the ringmaster. Everyone feel happiness and pleasure to obey the heart. If Heart orders then no one deny him. That king will be successful who listen to his P.M, always have an eye on governor and appoint anger on both of them. These all are necessary for his government so handle them nicely. Hint: Governor can be trained and trimmed through knowledge easily.
So heart is like a court/place as explained in my respected teacher explanation as well. I once again request you to read the article coz i know my knowlegde is far low than my teachers.
And thank you very much that I took a lot of time of yours.


But I didn't say it was an argument for his existence. I was saying that it's not a very convincing argument promote belief in it. You could say the same about forms of gambling. my dear! you didnt say it was an argument and on the other side you are saying its not convincing argument.? its not rocket science which i wrote. its very simple. very simple for those who read it with curosity to learn/know without prejudices.

So you're saying that God leaving people to suffer means a development in the human mind. It promotes thnking and problem solving. without challenges, then the human mind doesn't progress/

be grow up! this is what we use for growing kids so that they can understand their responisiblities and think and conisder to pick the best choice.

If you are a believer in God and the Devil, then perhaps this would be convincing. Given the amount and depth of human and animal suffering, then don't find this convincing either.

well you should read it again from the start daer :) i have already explained suffering or perfect scenario in my different posts. and if you or someone dont convinced, or someone is convinced what should i do? what i can do? everyone has own mind. but i know one thing , weaker mind(argument) cant stand before the stronger one. So in Quran as well Lord says , whoever lives lives with argument whoever dies,die by argument.

G L Wilson
08-03-2011, 12:34 PM
No. Soul is not self. These are opposite of each other. For more clarification, soul, as you said it is the task of all to get in touch with their soul. Why? Coz soul knows everything, the ultimate reality, soul has no other wish except Lord. Soul is like a guest from Lord in our body.Body! Captured by self, who always want to live on earth but the soul always want to get back towards the lord. Mind is the attribute of Soul.
You asked “who is ringmaster in this circus?” it’s a very good question indeed! Well i like to explain it with an example but besides example i have to say that all things work together.
Your body is like a county/city/country/world/universe :) better word for the sake of example is city. But indeed every person is a sample of universe indeed a universe itself, anyway.
Who is the ringmaster?!? So your body is a city, where you appointed a governor which is self. This governor is very very greedy! And greediness leads many bad qualities as well u know. You have a prime minister which is your mind. This P.M always gives suggestions and clear you against the governor. Body parts like legs and arms are your economical and financial sectors. Eyes and ears are information sectors. Anger is a Police head. If you don’t keep the P.H under your control it will destroy each n everything. You are the king and I mean you as Heart. Heart is the king heart is the ringmaster. Everyone feel happiness and pleasure to obey the heart. If Heart orders then no one deny him. That king will be successful who listen to his P.M, always have an eye on governor and appoint anger on both of them. These all are necessary for his government so handle them nicely. Hint: Governor can be trained and trimmed through knowledge easily.
So heart is like a court/place as explained in my respected teacher explanation as well. I once again request you to read the article coz i know my knowlegde is far low than my teachers.
And thank you very much that I took a lot of time of yours.

Heart, mind and body - a very good combination.

Paulclem
08-03-2011, 05:56 PM
Is not soul self?

There are various systems for looking at it, and as Usman says, the soul and self are different.

In Buddhism, the self is the sense of me that we have as we progress through our lives. The Buddhist view is that this self is determined by lots of factors, and as such is an amorphous, changeable, and you suggested phoney thing.

The Buddha, through his exploration through meditation, could not find a soul- which is supposed to be some eternal/ spiritual part of the human being. At that time the debate in India ranged between eternalism - we all, or potentially all - are eternal beings with a spiritual aspect, and on the other hand annihilation - that there is no spiritual part to humans and at death we die and end. (Does this debate sound familiar?- it rages in the religious texts section between the scientists and those proponents of most of the religions ad infinitum).

The Buddha developed the Middle way between these two extremes. The teachings say that whilst there is no eternal component in a human body that can be found and named, as they are all transient, the Karmic energy from a life causes the next life. this is the basis of reincarnation.

G L Wilson
08-03-2011, 06:05 PM
Usman says the mind is substantial, that it is soul. In humanism, the mind is located in the brain and nowhere else. Therefore the mind dies with the brain. In other words, we have no soul other than the thought of it.

Paulclem
08-03-2011, 06:10 PM
Yes, that's where the Theistic (As in overall creator God) Religions and Buddhism part company. In Buddhism The Gods are seen as merely part of the Wheel of Life.

I have to say though, that the psychological view Usman has described is similar to the Buddhist view of the self as a struggle between the positive and negative urges of the self. The Buddhist view does not contain the symbology of satan and the Divine though.

I feel I can pop a bit of Buddhism in precisely because of this correlation. I'm not intending to highjack Usman's thread.

usman.khawar
08-04-2011, 08:42 AM
Usman says the mind is substantial, that it is soul. In humanism, the mind is located in the brain and nowhere else. Therefore the mind dies with the brain. In other words, we have no soul other than the thought of it.

Did i say so :)
i like those people who take time to consider. consider and consider again. reached at conclusion and then reconsider on the conclusion to refined the things. i love refinement law/procedure. and love to apply on mind,self, heart, my conclusions, and on everything i have.
well i dont say mind is substantial that it is soul. when did i say? may be i cant clear you according to your mind. well i said about these two (mind n soul) " mind is the attribute of soul" its just means a real mind always speak or advice of truth and good things like soul. simple.
Paulclem dear r u budhist?
i saw budhist teachings as well. i thought He was a prophet too. as in quran Allah says He didnt destroy any nation before He send His messenger/prophet there. before telling them their limits. i observe budha's rules dont contradict islam. but islam is too wider in concept/logic/explanation.

haha highjack the thread. well its happens often i saw it here as well. hey G L dont mind if i say you do it sometime ,, well let me tell you a secret i like G L :) we freinds often use this abbreviation, G.L (Gold Leaf) , what is ur name by the way G L

G L Wilson
08-24-2011, 07:29 AM
Ego is not a dirty word, people.

usman.khawar
09-05-2011, 01:52 PM
Yes, that's where the Theistic (As in overall creator God) Religions and Buddhism part company. In Buddhism The Gods are seen as merely part of the Wheel of Life.

I have to say though, that the psychological view Usman has described is similar to the Buddhist view of the self as a struggle between the positive and negative urges of the self. The Buddhist view does not contain the symbology of satan and the Divine though.

I feel I can pop a bit of Buddhism in precisely because of this correlation. I'm not intending to highjack Usman's thread.

what i think about budha other than what i said about him is that he was a genious man. he found the reality( Lord) but didnt name Him. why? i think the answer is hinduism. hinduism made idols of everything. hinduism absorbs many religions by making idols. budha was afraid to give name to lord that hinduism will make another idol for him and absorb it . but bad luck to him people make his idols. budha name the reality by the light/knowlege.
i like to listen what u wanna to say. it was better if u guys raise questions after reading some pages to fully understand for the topic which was started.


I think 21st century science is compatible with many religions, not only the Muslim religion. This was not the case with science a hundred years ago and it may not be the case with science in the future.

Thanks for responding to my question!

you think , but what i saw that people are fed up by the religions as religions contradict with what are facts explained by the science. about islam i have expalined in " why i beleive in God" that how islam doesnt contradict with facts n science. if you like to read.


Ego is not a dirty word, people.

you are liberal to say anything to people.. but m sure if u read the article and try to understand then may b u get a lot about it :)

G L Wilson
09-05-2011, 06:36 PM
you are liberal to say anything to people.. but m sure if u read the article and try to understand then may b u get a lot about it :)

I am free to say anything I wish, could the same be said of you, usman.khawar?

usman.khawar
09-14-2011, 09:53 AM
Ego is not a dirty word, people.

just assume for a while there is a God, God who have started all these universes and earth with His intention. intention is necessary for all this thing.

its His intention/order/wish which is applying everywhere resulting in happenings. now what i think that our self ( the packet of instincts, wish, intention) try to stand before what is coming from upword planing.

. so i beleive as much difference is low as much the frustration would be low. in other words if i have to define frustration/depression/anger etc , then i would say

" Frustration is the difference between the two plans. Plan of Lord and plan of self ."

I wrote this in another discussion in the post wilson which u have started with the name of know thyself. by this explanation i think there are two type of ego. self's ego and Lord's ego. i often say a sentence " let the happnings do happen" by this sentence i always means that whatever Lord does is always better in reward then what i do. some sufi says that if u withdraw from your ego its like a drop emerge in ocean is not remain mere a drop rather become ocean.

billl
09-14-2011, 01:04 PM
This is a very common observation, and makes a very good point about spirituality/meditation/mysticism, etc. But Wilson was still correct. Calling individuals "drops" is propaganda. We are a lot more interesting than drops, and the human ego is nothing to be ashamed of, not something we should be seeking to eliminate or denigrate unconditionally.

usman.khawar
09-27-2011, 08:23 AM
This is a very common observation, and makes a very good point about spirituality/meditation/mysticism, etc. But Wilson was still correct. Calling individuals "drops" is propaganda. We are a lot more interesting than drops, and the human ego is nothing to be ashamed of, not something we should be seeking to eliminate or denigrate unconditionally.

i dont know why some people leave the context of the sentences bill. anyway who said that the self will be eleminated. i have expalined it already , didnt i ?
like i said before as below: you will see its not eleminating rather its refinement procedure. most beneficial. :

After the completion of its training and the adoption of new habits and tendencies, the Nafs is eager to stamp its individuality and distinguish itself from others. With the passage of time and growth of knowledge the Nafs begins to develop love and affection for this new approach and internalises it as a permanent and freely chosen practice. This developmental stage of the Self’s thought, leads to the desire to seek the friendship of God. The ideas of this new ‘world’ and the discovery of new horizons prevent the Self from abandoning this choice for divine longing. All the while, its original instincts are striving to pull it back to its days of ignorance (Jahiliyya). However, the strength and fortitude of the new practices keep it steadfast on the path towards God. Further, through the mercy and support of God, tranquillity and inspiration descends upon the Self. This unexpected blessing is one that the Human Self has never tasted before. It is now that its purpose in life becomes (crystal) clear and its beliefs and thoughts clarified. Indeed, (ultimate) consciousness is attained.

usman.khawar
09-27-2011, 08:25 AM
how to train , well ist of all how to find it or recogonize it? i think read the article plz slowly with consideration. its not rocket sceince.

billl
09-27-2011, 09:40 AM
i dont know why some people leave the context of the sentences bill. anyway who said that the self will be eleminated.

I don't know who said that. It wasn't me, and it wasn't you.

(To save you the time of reading the actual posts again, let me just mention that I was talking about the human ego--"self's ego", which you had mentioned--and the elimination OR denigration of that.)

virginiawang
09-27-2011, 11:03 AM
"Embosomed for a season in nature, whose floods of life stream around and through us, and invite us by the powers they supply, to action proportioned to nature, why should we grope among the dry bones of the past, or put the living generation into masquerade out of its faded wardrobe? The sun shines to-day also. There is more wool and flax in the fields. There are new lands, new men, new thoughts. Let us demand our own works and laws and worship."
Ralph Waldo Emerson » Nature » Introduction

If I am God, will you worship me?

usman.khawar
10-06-2011, 10:22 AM
"Embosomed for a season in nature, whose floods of life stream around and through us, and invite us by the powers they supply, to action proportioned to nature, why should we grope among the dry bones of the past, or put the living generation into masquerade out of its faded wardrobe? The sun shines to-day also. There is more wool and flax in the fields. There are new lands, new men, new thoughts. Let us demand our own works and laws and worship."
Ralph Waldo Emerson » Nature » Introduction

If I am God, will you worship me?

yes i'll :) but you are not God. Actually the article with which i started the thread is concerned with, that now self (the enemy within,nafs) like to be god. at the end it behaves like pharoh. When Ibrahim went in his court and didnt bowed pharoh said that i m the Lord, Ibrahim said how can u be a lord? my lord is one who give birth and death. pharoh did an intersting thing in reply. he killed an innocent person and gave liberty to guilty one who was sentenced to death. and he said i can do same as ur lord. Ibrahim smiled at him and said my lord rise sun from the west and dawn at east. phorah caught in surprised with no answer. Actually God is so big that we cant imagine Him nor we give any example from His creations that how is look like. we even couldnt imagine the time n space which are his creations. its all not bychance. so perfect and so balanced and unimaginable creations. all by chacne ? well He can be recogonize by His attributes. We can be sure of His existance through His signs in ours and out spread around. Everything is from Him and will return to Him. if his existance can be proved then is there any question like how He looks like , where He lives etc ?


more wool and flax, dry bones of the past..new lands new men new thoughts. let us demand our own works and laws and worship. :)

it seems good wording to get rid of past experiences. there are many points gather in this statement. one can live like this many lived as well. the question is that has today's new human succeeded to overcome problems/crimes/classles societry with his own laws? man gave so many systems but failed isnt it?. wt is new ? some materialistic progress ? homosexuality? or what ? dont u see land, human chemistry and thoughts are same as in past. worship to whom? burrying head like ostrech in sand is not the solution. ignoring the main questions for our existance on earth is like closing eyes from the reality like pigion who do it after seeing cat at very close.
in Quran Allah says they (non beleivers) will say that these are the stories of old people ,in quran Allah asked , dont they understand? they will say/ask how can Lord will reborn us after death. O prophet told them wt they think that making ist time is more difficult or 2nd time?? do they understand?? dont they see that we rain on death earth and it become alive. we will awake them again certainly. wts the new thoughts ? in quran Allah says they will reach at the point that time(nature) give us birth time kill us, what is nature ? many centuries ago Allah told where would the philosopers reached at the point!! poor nature haha can do everything gave billions colors of life around us, so technical so creative but has no tongue lolzzz cant speak to his creations. i m surprised todays when everyone like to go with arguments n logic when talk about religion ignor the argument. mostly i saw people when accept religion or reject it do it without argument. actually now people dont want to take risks of accepting others strong reasons. may b ego's matter.

virginiawang
10-06-2011, 07:19 PM
I can debate with you, but I am not interested here.

usman.khawar
10-25-2011, 05:21 AM
I can debate with you, but I am not interested here.

kindly let me know where u'll b interested ? :)

usman.khawar
11-14-2011, 08:57 AM
I can debate with you, but I am not interested here.

We can discuss like friends as well.. i like questions ..

cafolini
11-14-2011, 11:07 AM
I have no problem with Muslim submission so long as they are not like Jehova's Witnesses
that visit too often. I would even invite them for a few drinks to see if I can get them to a more realistic and coincident trance.

usman.khawar
11-14-2011, 11:11 AM
I have no problem with Muslim submission so long as they are not like Jehova's Witnesses
that visit too often. I would even invite them for a few drinks to see if I can get them to a more realistic and coincident trance.

Jehova's Witnesses
that visit too often, invite where or why?

cafolini
11-14-2011, 11:24 AM
Jehova's Witnesses
that visit too often, invite where or why?

Why do cows don't have kittens? Because...because...because.

usman.khawar
11-14-2011, 11:40 AM
Why do cows don't have kittens? Because...because...because.

haha coz cats dont have cows.

enjoying the book ? feed back will be welcomed.you can send at private messages :)

MIKE :He?

Where did gender come from eh?

Why not She?

It is not surprising that men pondered on things philosophical while women did the carrying, cooking, suffering and the bearing.

It is thinking beings who create creators. Otherwise thoughts are unbearable.


Yes you are right that thoughts are unbearable coz the poorest mind is one whose question is bigger than its data. For instance, a kid of primary class asked me to teach him a mathematical question of post graduate class then what happens. i have to tell him about digits, plus . Minus, multiply etc those are the basic things. So thoughts are unbearable when you take the question that is bigger than the data you have in ur mind.
Logically there should be some start for this universe and everything. it is impossible to imagine that there is no start of all this which we have around us. There should be one who must have the attribute Al-Qayum (The Self-Existing One).

Miss mike thomas hehe! No offense if i called u miss i also at the end wrote two times "he,he" to cover one time forgot :)

Well i think for me it is more surprising that Woman is bearing the work outside and inside home as well. What made woman to get rid of home's government? This is long debate. From thousands of years we know that woman take the responsibility of home, to stay in home n make a family. For man (as he was physical strong) it is decided by Time to go out and work hard for earning. This division was the decision of the Time. Now in this era we see that family system of West has been destroying as they promote woman to come out form the home. Here u wrongly wrote suffering and bearing only for woman so neutral thinking is seems more normal to me as Man is also suffered. May be u saw some sort of individual experience of some miserable situation of any woman i can’t say anything on it.

We have a long list of woman in Islam who when ponder on things which u say philosophical, or if we say remembrance+philosophical of Lord, they took comprehensive lead like Hazrat Rabia Basri, Hazrat Aisha etc .

Well I like to share a chapter with you from Quran just to ponder that Allah is nor he nor she but I think Lord like to say himself as 'He' for us for our understanding. But one thing i m sure that Lord is not like that which we can even imagine nor Allah has any example that how He looks like, which exist in between skies and earth or gender as He is the only One of His type. This universe, time n space and everything in between and outside are His creation and He said He made it by just saying :Be! and its created. Look at the creation power! Creator is much much bigger than its creation.

Surah 112. Al-Ikhlas (The Unity, Sincerity, Oneness Of Allah)
In the name of Allah, Most Gracious, Most Merciful.
1. Say: Allah, the One and Only;
2. Allah, the Eternal, Absolute;
3. Begetteth not, nor is Begotten;
4. And there is none like Allah.

will write more to clarify this improtant quesiton of yours.

Time

May be I couldn’t explain very well but what I think about Time n space as there are so many things in mind about it without sequence. Among so many philosophers who tried to understand Time and Space I like only one explanation. I don’t remember the name of philosopher in which he explained, Time n Space, as when one moment of time is adjoin with some unit of space. Its long ago so I cannot remember exact wording as well but the explanation says when one moment of time is adjoin with some unit of space, It is done due to minimize the friction of everything to each other. In some space, in some specific time, people in specific and things in general meet together. Like in a room, the space is specified but in different times there are different happenings. If there is no time then the situation will be very weird.

Some modern philosophers came at the conclusion that Time gives us life and Time gives us death. Wow Quran already told me “they will reach at the conclusion that Time gives us life and Time gives us death”. According to Quran Time is also the creation of Lord to minimize the friction like u can see traffic signals. Quran tells us an era will come after that there will be no need of time because that life will be everlasting.

In Quran Lord tells us a beautiful story of a man in which he asks Lord to show me His power. In this story Lord present beautiful explanation to tell us a different dimension to show that time is also his creation and work according to His will. When the man asked Him then Lord made him asleep. When he woke up Lord asked him how much time u slept? He said may be half day or one! Lord asked him to see his donkey! When he saw his donkey (which he uses for the purpose of travelling) it was dead as centuries have been passed on him. Then Lord asked him to see towards his food which was as fresh and hot as there is no time even seconds was passed on it. Look at the power and consider! A specific space and Lord used time on different things in different ways as centuries have been passed on donkey, time was static on food and the man was in the normal time frame.

there is a lecture of my teacher on this topic. wonderful n mind opening explanation, i'll share with u guys once if i get it somewhere written.

Thanks n Regards

usman.khawar
02-21-2012, 10:16 AM
a event of my life happened last sunday!

This Sunday there was annual session in which my teacher usually selects a topic and gives lecture every year. The topic was namely Man, Universe and God (with God’s perspective or point of view). That was very informative. But I m not writing this post for this topic or information but the purpose of writing this post is that I like to share a wonderful and mind blowing happening which is some kind of miraculous to me.

From Lahore we started our journey towards his city “Gujr khan” for this annual session. I used to go there for last 6 or 7 years. Few of my friends were very 1st time going there to meet my teacher. Everyone was anxious to meet him personally due to many reasons. My teacher got another special knowledge in which he just tell the whole nature of that person with a simple suggestion to refine self in most easiest and applicable way after listing only the name. Many people are living very successful life in a state of mind where there is neither grief nor frustration after meeting with him. People are surprised how he can know the things which no other knows. Every one of us has some questions in our mind. For me my question had been solved, now I just wanted to see something odd; personally, no matter I know my teacher through his arguments and believe him! For instance, I wanted my teacher to tell my friend’s name and nature/problems and solution by himself. Most of my friends were laughing at me even me too. But I have two strong reasons behind this kind of thought.

1stly Quran tells about a prophet Daniel. In his time the king saw a dream and called everyone including more than 100 false prophets of that time to come and tell him both the dream and its meaning. Everyone failed because how to guess about the dream, but Daniel gave him the answer of both things as God already told him about that dream and its meanings. So I was thinking if my teacher is a friend of God than he must know the name and his problems and have solution by himself. 2nd reason is concerning Abraham life story in which in 1st part which is mentioned in “Abraham’s methodology of intellectual enquiry” in my other thread. When Abraham got the answer and found God using that methodology and God pronounce him as His friend as well. Abraham knows Him and knows that God can do everything. One day he asked God “how do u give birth to dead”? God asked him “doesn’t u believe me? He replied I believe u from my mind. Intellectually I believe u but I want to see it myself to strengthen my belief. Then there is story about it to give Abraham’s answer in Quran. From here we also found the grades of belief or knowledgebility. Anyway come back to the actual point. We reached there at Saturday night. We got a full home which my teacher’s neighbors gave us voluntarily. Thousands of people come to see him at that time and some hundreds arrived earlier like us so people do voluntary acts for my teacher’s guests, this also shows the greatness of my teacher.

In short, we slept and one of my friends, Jimmy Jafri, who was most anxious and frustrated due to his financial and other crises, came and asked us to get up. Finally we got up and went towards at 2nd floor of my teacher home and stood outside his room because he was reciting the Quran. As soon as the door opened by some of his companion we all friends rushed in and met with him. There is always a lovely and kind smile on his face. He asked to go down and tells us about the breakfast is ready for thousands of people and we should go down and I’ll be there for you. One by one we were departing from his room, in the last we were two only me and jafri when my teacher said to jafri “ Jafri i know you I received your message so don’t u worry now” we were just shocked coz my teacher don’t keep cell phone, he don’t know my friends because they were here very 1st time also jafri was with me and all night and the 1st one who fell asleep when we arrived. There were nothing more conversation and we left the room. Jafri’s eyes were full of tears and he told us that last night I saw your teacher in the dream and I was telling him about my matters in the dream! In this meeting of hardly one or two minutes we all friends have got our answers!

thanks and regards

usman.khawar
03-08-2012, 09:16 AM
God has showered His merci upon me and showed His blessings in shape of daughter. i am father of a cute baby now,Mariyam. :)