Who Were the Antichrists?

[JuniperWoolf]

I have these two friends who really dig prophecies (Nostradamus and what-not). They're also Christian. The other day, they were arguing about antichrists. Just now, I read something about antichrists in the "Do We Need A New Prophet?" thread, which reminded me.

According to most prophet-theories (and maybe some religions, I'm not sure), we've already had a couple of antichrists, right? Both of my friends seemed to agree that there were two so far. However, they disagreed on who these antichrists were. One said Hitler and Nero, the other said Bush and some name that I've never heard before (I lol'd).

So I was just wondering: is there any actual word on that? I know nothing about religious theory, have they really tagged some historical figures as "antichrists?"

What do you think of the whole antichrist notion (and I'm talking to believers and non-believers alike).

Since I already know what non-believers think, I'm really more curious about what religious people think: the antichrist is the opposite of Jesus, right? Is that really going to happen, has it already happened, or is it just not something that you believe? What's supposed to happen to the world once the antichrist shows up, is it armageddon or do we enter a "new age" (like the age of Christ, anno domini, which we are said to live in right now)? Is it said to be preventable, or is just something that's going to happen eventually no matter what? How will we know that it's an antichrist, and not just some random evil insane person with a lot of power?

*edit* By the way, Rosemary's Baby has always been one of my favourite films.

[Virgil]

I believe a very good case has been presented that the historical figure identified as such in Revelations was the Emperor Nero. http://www3.telus.net/trbrooks/Nero.htm But given that the lack of specificity and the ambiguity, people insert whomever they currently hate in the role.

I'm sure this subject is a tailor made for spewing all sorts of hate. I'm sure that's what will ensue.

[JuniperWoolf]

I'm sure this subject is a tailor made for spewing all sorts of hate. I'm sure that's what will ensue.

Nah, not if we don't talk about current politics. But really though, what's supposed to happen to the world when the antichrist comes around?

[Virgil]

Nah, not if we don't talk about current politics. But really though, what's supposed to happen to the world when the antichrist comes around?

I don't think there really is much to it theologically. I think it's mostly folklore built up on fears and hatreds. Whatever slight mention is made in Revelations, it seems to say that the appearence of the antichrist will be the last hour before the end of the world. But I'm not a theologian.

[blazeofglory]

Jesus could have been a prophet two millenniums ago and today it is not necessary that his ideas will appeal to us. We still hook ourselves to some of his ideas even today but most of his ideas have gone obsolete.

We of course need a new prophet. The reason there are too many sectoral ideas and cults today all are in constant frictions with one another.

I always feel we need a prophet, a powerful prophet who can amalgamate or kind of integrate all our divisive natures and string together different cultural values and arrive at a new philosophy or vision.

We know religious thoughts have been more bigot. Today the greatest threat to mankind is religious or racial threat. We need a new prophet who can blaze our way.
Antichrist is the voice of the day. We know all old ideas have been ineffective. We need very powerful slogans and ideologies that can replace the old decayed one

[johnnya]

Whoever is this anti-christ will be, he will be subtil in his presence. Might get a dose of technology with supernatural. Revelations is some book to read, seems everday events are pushing this towards that time. Hitler seemed to be one of them, and other war generals or commanders that created great destruction. Are war tryants considered to be more anti-christ than others? Perhaps the anti-christ is a system coming into development or has been. Now perhaps it's in the media, entertainment, tv, and things we use.

[GregNewing]

As far as I know, there are anti-Christs in each dispensation. That is, each time a Prophet is made manifest by God there comes anti-Christs. Generally they are quite subtle for Jesus one could say it was was Simon Magus, for The Bab it was Karim Khan and for Baha'u'llah it was Siyyid Muhammad Isfahani.

I am not 100% sure on the ones for Moses and Muhammad, nor am I sure of the ones for Adam, Noah, and Abraham. I also am not sure of the ones for Krishna, Buddha, or Zoroaster...

However, the definition of the anti-Christ can be seen as something much broader; something that is in direct opposition to the Will of God, or someone who attempts to undermine the Prophet for a certain age. This would be an anti-Christ. Generally they would attempt to decieve the Prophet's companions and cause mischief..... or in the future attempt to undermine the religious community or even actively oppose the teachings of that day.

So, as a Baha'i I would consider the definition of Hitler as an anti-Christ to have some truth since he promoted a racist ideology.

However, those who are able to resist the anti-Christ have proven themselves to have risen to a great standard of nobility and purity of heart.



Hopefully this helps,



Greg

[GregNewing]

Also, blazeofglory, you seem to be interested in the idea of a new Prophet. I agree heavily with you when you say:


"I always feel we need a prophet, a powerful prophet who can amalgamate or kind of integrate all our divisive natures and string together different cultural values and arrive at a new philosophy or vision."

As well one of the most important aspects of a Prophet is that He abrogates ritual and dogma that has lost its meaning.

Have you heard of the Baha'i Faith or Baha'u'llah?

I would highly recommend reading the Kitab-i-Iqan, which is, in English, called the Book of Certitude. It is considered one of the most important of the Baha'i writings. It makes reference to many of the questions you have. Whether you embrace the message of Baha'u'llah or not, it is still a fascinating read for anyone interested in the nature of a Prophet and the general history of religion.

Here is a link:

http://reference.bahai.org/en/t/b/KI/




-Greg

[dizzydoll]

GWB

lol. I will have to get back to this to thread read it from the beginning... my response is the first thing that came into my head, with good reason. lol

[Il Dante]

There is the folklore and pop-theology about the anti-christ, and then there is what the New Testament says.

The AC is referenced only in the writings of John, specifically the books of Revelation and the Epistles of John. In Revelation it is THE antichrist, a man who, according to the prophecy, will rule a revived Roman empire, etc. In the epistles of John it is antichristS, plural. These refer specifically to the heretics of John's day who denied aspects of the person of Christ. Thus John called them ANTI-Christ, because they denied Christ.

[dizzydoll]

So I was just wondering: is there any actual word on that? I know nothing about religious theory, have they really tagged some historical figures as "antichrists?"

What do you think of the whole antichrist notion (and I'm talking to believers and non-believers alike).



I can just see you having a giggle while you typed this. lol

For a start, as the name anti-christ implies, the world has seen a damn sight more than just two anti-christs. There have been thousands of anti-christs over the years.

The church likes to make people scared, and so before we all take off in the rapture we must be reminded of this evil demon...

"the devil made me do it"

how convenient, isnt that typical of humans we always got to find someone else to point our finger at.

anyway there are many of us who will not be invited on the rapture... so I guess we will face this anti-christ, while all the goodie-2-shoes point fingers at us from heaven. lol.

I wouldnt worry your precious little head about Armageddon coming in 2012, its just another date... another lie. Humans have been obsessed with "the end" from the very beginning of time. After we get through 2012 the bible punches will have another date do get all afraid about, and so their loyal devotees with start all over again... got to keep them scared you know, how else will you keep control?

After we get past the 21st Dec 2012, what date do you think the next Armageddon will be?

Perhaps it will be 2060 as per Isaac Newton...

http://www.isaac-newton.org/update.html

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Isaac_Newton's_religious_views

I seem to recall there is a youtube video about Newtons 2060 prediction of Armageddon too.

Anyway according to some of the students interpreting Nostradamus' quatrains, he said the world will come to an end in 3795 [give a year or two]

All the same, dont think you are gonna get out of buying those Xmas gifts in 2012 otherwise if you do you will have a lot of unhappy faces in 2013.

[Vautrin]

I would say the first anti-Christ had to have been Judas. Think about it. According to Christianity, Jesus made the ultimate sacrifice, giving his life for the betterment of humanity, whereas Judas essentially sold out the world for money. He did the exact opposite of what Jesus was put here/set out to do. That's a quintessential yin and yang example to me.

As for the second anti-Christ; It's a toss up between Dr. Phil or Mr. Burns.

http://claytravis.net/mailbag/uploaded_images/montgomery-burns-700445.gif

[The Comedian]

I would say the first anti-Christ had to have been Judas. Think about it. According to Christianity, Jesus made the ultimate sacrifice, giving his life for the betterment of humanity, whereas Judas essentially sold out the world for money. He did the exact opposite of what Jesus was put here/set out to do. That's a quintessential yin and yang example to me.

As for the second anti-Christ; It's a toss up between Dr. Phil or Mr. Burns.

http://claytravis.net/mailbag/uploaded_images/montgomery-burns-700445.gif

I have one thing to say about this post: excellent. . . .:devil:

[sunnysmiles]

We call the Anti christ the Dajjal in Islam before the dajjal actual comes their will be over 30 minor dajjals that will appear . Many of these have already appeared .The actual dajjal will be one eyed and will have the word Kuffar(disbeleiver) written across his forehead . The Dajjal comes towards the end of time and Prophet Jesus (may peace be up on him and the mahdi will come . The Dajjal will be killed . The dajjal will come with particular signs . If you see how the world is becoming in the last few years . You will see that the time of the Anti christ is not too far of . Like World Government and the liar will be beleived and the truthful will be disbeleived .

[Lynne Fees]

I have these two friends who really dig prophecies (Nostradamus and what-not). They're also Christian. The other day, they were arguing about antichrists. Just now, I read something about antichrists in the "Do We Need A New Prophet?" thread, which reminded me.

According to most prophet-theories (and maybe some religions, I'm not sure), we've already had a couple of antichrists, right? Both of my friends seemed to agree that there were two so far. However, they disagreed on who these antichrists were. One said Hitler and Nero, the other said Bush and some name that I've never heard before (I lol'd).

So I was just wondering: is there any actual word on that? I know nothing about religious theory, have they really tagged some historical figures as "antichrists?"

What do you think of the whole antichrist notion (and I'm talking to believers and non-believers alike).

Since I already know what non-believers think, I'm really more curious about what religious people think: the antichrist is the opposite of Jesus, right? Is that really going to happen, has it already happened, or is it just not something that you believe? What's supposed to happen to the world once the antichrist shows up, is it armageddon or do we enter a "new age" (like the age of Christ, anno domini, which we are said to live in right now)? Is it said to be preventable, or is just something that's going to happen eventually no matter what? How will we know that it's an antichrist, and not just some random evil insane person with a lot of power?

*edit* By the way, Rosemary's Baby has always been one of my favourite films.

1 John 2:18
[ Warning Against Antichrists ] Dear children, this is the last hour; and as you have heard that the antichrist is coming, even now many antichrists have come. This is how we know it is the last hour.

This seems pretty clear that there will be many. (The "big" one will be the worst, though.)

[andrewoberg]

As for the second anti-Christ; It's a toss up between Dr. Phil or Mr. Burns.

http://claytravis.net/mailbag/uploaded_images/montgomery-burns-700445.gif

Lol! I'd have to go with Mr. Burns, too. But he does have his loveable moments, doesn't he?:biggrinjester: