What would you die for?

[JuniperWoolf]

I don't mean like "I'd give my life to save my baby/mom/whatever," I'm wondering if there is an ideal that you care about so much that under whatever circumstances (it doesn't really matter the specific situation, say there's a war or a holocaust going on or something) you would go to the point of dying for it. I'm really curious, because we have both men and women here of all ages, from all economic backgrounds, with varying sexual orientations and from all over the world. It'll be interesting to see what litnetters value most.

As for me, for reasons that only Nax and Daniel really understand, I would die for women's rights without a second thought.

It's also pretty clear to everyone that knows me that I love Canada. If Canada were under attack, I'd die to protect it, but I wouldn't volunteer to die if we were the ones on the offence and I didn't agree the situation (like for example the Vietnam war, but I don't think that Canada would get involved with something like that; if it did, it wouldn't be the country that I've come to know and love).

How about you?

[applepie]

I can't say that there is anything at the moment that I would be willing to die for. I would die to protect my home and country if needed, but outside of that I can't think of much. The funny thing is that ten years ago I could have given a list as long as my arm, but for the same reasons that I would die to protect my kids, outside of their safety and well being, there isn't much that I would sacrifice my own life for since dieing on them isn't really an option if I have any say in the matter.

Now once upon a time....

I would have sacrificed everything to protect the world's oceans. I had teachers tease me that I would be the person out on the green peace boat or fighting the illegal taking of shark fins. The ocean was and is my great passion in life, and I suppose that one day I might be willing to sacrifice myself for those ideals again. In the meantime I try and stay informed about the things I care about and I devote attention to legislation when I feel it is appropriate.

[1n50mn14]

No. I can make more difference alive and kicking up a ruckus. If I was willing to die for something, whoever in charge of what I opposed would just say, 'Oh, well, thank God she's dead, she was really in the way!'

[skib]

In all seriousness, I would die protecting the 2nd Amendment. Shooting is and always has been an integral part of who I am. It is my expression of my freedom, of my personal protection and my ability to provide for myself. Now, don't take that to mean I would want martyrdom. I would rather be dead than live without that right.
I know, I know, it sounds kinda cheesy and terribly patriotic. In all truthfulness, if my country fell under attack I would be the one hightailing it to the middle of the mountains and hiding out. Not to say I don't love my country, but it can defend itself.

[JuniperWoolf]

No. I can make more difference alive and kicking up a ruckus. If I was willing to die for something, whoever in charge of what I opposed would just say, 'Oh, well, thank God she's dead, she was really in the way!'

Okay how about; for what would you engage in activity that is really, really dangerous that has a high probability of resulting in death?

[The Comedian]

I'm pretty much in line with mkhockenberry at this point in my life. Things change when you have a family of your own; I feel like I am their champion, of sorts (as corny as that sounds) and as such I would lay life down for those girls. And if I were to die for an ideal, I'd abandon them in doing so. And I won't do that.

But when I was younger, unattached, I had a lot of ideals that I felt I would die for. It's kind of strange now, though, I can't really think of any. Maybe I'm thinking too politically (2nd amendment). Or maybe I just want to think of myself as someone who would die for an ideal. Wow, I guess I don't know if there was an ideal I would have died for back then.

Quiet. I think I just might have died for quiet. I'd kick up a hell of a din for that.

But I don't know really. Knowing who I was is harder than knowing who I am.

[OrphanPip]

I'm not sure there is any ideal I would die for either.

Are there things I'd be willing to risk a lot for? Probably. I'd like to think I'd be willing to risk a lot to protect Democracy, and my right to express my sexual orientation. There is always going to be a line where the risk of resisting something will overwhelm the possible benefits.

[DanielBenoit]

I'd die so that I wouldn't have to be a plastic bag. (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YDBtCb61Sd4)

[BienvenuJDC]

I would die for humanity....to defend another person's life...no matter if they were family, friends, Christian or non-christian, born or unborn, young or old, black or white, Asian or Hispanic, or mutt (like me), we all deserve a chance, to live without oppression...I would not die without a fight though, that also means that I would kill to defend life...

[Hurricane]

I'd die to protect other people, whether directly or through extension of dying in the defense of my country. I'd die to protect the rights currently afforded to me, and die to provide those rights to other people: free speech, freedom of religion, the right to a fair trial, and the right to bear arms, among other things.

[Maximilianus]

I would die for humanity....to defend another person's life...no matter if they were family, friends, Christian or non-christian, born or unborn, young or old, black or white, Asian or Hispanic, or mutt (like me), we all deserve a chance, to live without oppression...I would not die without a fight though, that also means that I would kill to defend life...


I'd die to protect other people, whether directly or through extension of dying in the defense of my country. I'd die to protect the rights currently afforded to me, and die to provide those rights to other people: free speech, freedom of religion, the right to a fair trial, and the right to bear arms, among other things.

Very similar to what I was going to say.

The character that Will Smith portrays in I am Legend is coming to my memory; a scientist who eventually sacrifices himself to protect a vaccine he had created to prevent the few remnants of a devastated humanity from becoming ruthless monsters. The man could have run for his own survival only, but instead he stayed, worked hard, created a vaccine and died for it, in a desperate attempt to recover the species to which he once belonged to. It's a meritorious way of dying. It's in the end what most scientists and patriots have done during our history as a species, that is, live for nothing and die for something.

[Mariner]

A Portland Trail Blazer's NBA Championship. Or Greg Oden's health, that kid has been through enough.

In all seriousness though, I would die for world hunger. Everybody needs to be nourished and enjoy all that is food.

[applepie]

I'm pretty much in line with mkhockenberry at this point in my life. Things change when you have a family of your own; I feel like I am their champion, of sorts (as corny as that sounds) and as such I would lay life down for those girls. And if I were to die for an ideal, I'd abandon them in doing so. And I won't do that.

You wouldn't believe how long I sat here trying to think of something, anything other than my children that I would be willing to die for before I came to such a simple conclusion. No ideal that I hold is more important than them. Being a parent puts an entirely new perspective on life.

[MarkBastable]

As we're taking our kids as a gimme, then nothing.

But can I add a bit to the question...

What would you die for?

What would you kill for?

In order to keep the moral math simple, let's say there's no chance of you dying when you undertake the killing, either at the time, or subsequently. No consequence in law or in practical terms. All you have to do is feel justified in taking another - or several - lives.

It'll be interesting to see whether there are things we'd kill for that we wouldn't die for.

[virginiawang]

Die? I would die for a night without a goodnight. It's going to be the coldest night I've ever gone through. It is not cold, but my heart will freeze my whole body and render it unmovable. I am sure I will be lying on my bed with my tears brimming over my eyes, unable to enter my dreams when I am already too tired to figure out anything. I do not understand myself. I am sure I will be submerged by sadness tonight. I am sure, so to give up my life for the dreadful night is simply reasonable. I do not like headaches, but I love him too much to keep myself away from headaches. It is really a difficult situation for me, now at this moment. I am ready to die for the terrible night.
What can I do?

I am willing to die, for reasons I cannot give. I feel bad about myself. I shouldn't have vent my spleen when I went through my headache this afternoon. I am sure my love surpasses all the headaches one ever knows, but I just couldn't help feeling sad when my head did not follow my directions.

The moment gets closer and closer to me. I know I will be disappointed, but I do not know how I am going to go through the night without a goodnight. To give up a part of my life for a goodnight and his smile again is pretty reasonable to me, now, when I have got no idea what else I can do. Perhaps my headache came from my low blood cell counts. Perhaps there is no perhaps. I must be disappointed tonight. No, don't let it happen. I used to believe in miracles, and I still do, now, when I am already aware of the coming night. No, No....

He does not want to smile again. My life is a joke. I am ready to die for the joke.

[Hurricane]

As we're taking our kids as a gimme, then nothing.

But can I add a bit to the question...

What would you die for?

What would you kill for?

In order to keep the moral math simple, let's say there's no chance of you dying when you undertake the killing, either at the time, or subsequently. No consequence in law or in practical terms. All you have to do is feel justified in taking another - or several - lives.

It'll be interesting to see whether there are things we'd kill for that we wouldn't die for.

Simple. I'd kill for the same things that I'd die for.

[Nax]

Ide die for alot of things to be honest. Not because im suicidal and depressed, its just I believe there are alot of things more important to preserve then myself.

I would die for a complete stranger really. If I saw someone getting held at gunpoint and dragged from their car (last year two men died in the city here doing just this to save a woman) I would step in, knowing very well I could die.

But all it takes for evil to prevail is for good people to do nothing.

I would die for love, for honor, for my country, for my people. I would die so that others may live, and maybe one day we can figure out how to actually do this whole humanity thing properly.

I would not die for my government or any government, though of course I would inadvertently do so if I was dying for my country. But it would be the country I would fight for, the government can go eff itself for all I care.

[qimissung]

I think I would die for my country, to protect the democratic ideals that I grew up with, that I see espoused every day as they grapple with the tired and poor of other nations, as they struggle to do the right thing for the original citizens of this country (of which I am one), as they wrestle with the devil lhimself over matters to the right and to the left, they rise, like Daniel Webster, in eloquence, in righteousness, in the audacity of hope. They get it wrong, but they never give up trying to get it right.

[magzarelli]

For my son!

[Olga4real]

I have read all posts and I was surprised that I agree with most of people. I would sacrifice my life for:
- my kids;
- my love;
- mankind;
- animals;
- environment...
Then I imagined what would my daughters feel if I die and asked myself do I have the right to put them through such pain?
I love them so much that I don't have any rights to sacrifice my life for anything.
Sometimes I feel that I would die for some chocolate :wink5:

I would kill only to protect my kids or myself.

I would not kill for love, mankind, animals or environment.

[BienvenuJDC]

Then I imagined what would my daughters feel if I die and asked myself do I have the right to put them through such pain?
I love them so much that I don't have any rights to sacrifice my life for anything.


Especially after losing my mother, I feel that this is most definitely true.

[applepie]

Then I imagined what would my daughters feel if I die and asked myself do I have the right to put them through such pain?
I love them so much that I don't have any rights to sacrifice my life for anything.
Sometimes I feel that I would die for some chocolate :wink5:

I would kill only to protect my kids or myself.

I would not kill for love, mankind, animals or environment.

It really is interesting to me just how much being a parent changes what you are and are not willing to do.

[Olga4real]

It really is interesting to me just how much being a parent changes what you are and are not willing to do.

Totally, especially if you are a woman and you become a mother.

[applepie]

Totally, especially if you are a woman and you become a mother.

My oldest will be 7 this year, and I'm still reeling from the changes in my views:)

[Katy North]

When I was a kid, my mom kept telling me "I'd lie down on the train tracks for you." I thought it was a fairly noble sentiment.

However, as I got older, I got to thinking... if you lie down on the train tracks for me, wouldn't the train just run over you and hit me anyway?

The only person I would die for is my son, and the only way I would die for him is if I gave up on saving him. The reason being that if I die for him I give up fighting for him, and me fighting for him is far more useful that my dying for him.

What would I kill for? I would kill to protect my son, myself and my husband. I would kill to protect any person who's life personally touches mine and whose life is in danger for an unjust reason.

I would not die or kill for my country, my government, the environment, any lofty ideals, or animals. Even if I died, the train would just hit 'em anyway.

[Jozanny]

I think I would give my life for what I considered to be a righteous cause. It rather goes toward my tendency of not being able to let things go, but I could not say what that cause might be--certainly not democracy in the abstract sense, but for justice in a specific instance, I probably could. Since I like other mammals and some reptiles more than people, it would be interesting if I would sacrifice myself for them, like a killer whale, or a cat, knowing that they would not be cognizant of the import.

It is of interest due to the fact that my first cat spared me from even more trauma when I became a crime victim, and I wonder what returning the favor amounts to; that Tilikum is worth millions of dollars as a breeder seems to excuse how often he was involved in the death of human trainers.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qz_SHumjgPQ

Not that the animal is to blame so much as our own hubris in how much we feel we can micromanage other species, but the female trainer's death was basically futile, as no one is going to stop paying Seaworld to stop watching these magnificent creatures play fetch.

[The Atheist]

I'm wondering if there is an ideal that you care about so much that under whatever circumstances (it doesn't really matter the specific situation, say there's a war or a holocaust going on or something) you would go to the point of dying for it. I'm really curious, because we have both men and women here of all ages, from all economic backgrounds, with varying sexual orientations and from all over the world. It'll be interesting to see what litnetters value most.

Damned good question. I'll get to it shortly!

:D


In all seriousness, I would die protecting the 2nd Amendment.

Wow! It's true what those bumper stickers say!


A Portland Trail Blazer's NBA Championship. Or Greg Oden's health, that kid has been through enough.

In all seriousness though, I would die for world hunger. Everybody needs to be nourished and enjoy all that is food.

Well, since dying for it's not going to help anyone, work for it instead!

;)


Totally, especially if you are a woman and you become a mother.

Only in the same way that it's especially if you're a bloke and become a dad.

_____________________________________________


I think Mark's raised a good point as well, because I definitely think I'm far more likely to die for a circumstance than kill for it, although there may be some unknown circumstances which would cause me to kill.

Also, it depends on what you mean by "die for".

If it's a case of undertaking a certain suicide mission, I can't imagine anything I'd do that for, including my children. Martyrdom never appealed to me.

If it's undertaking something which may prove fatal, then I'd do as I always do - weigh up the risks and decide whether or not to take them.

I'm pretty sure I already do things which could result in me being killed - I receive numerous death threats, none of which has encouraged me to stop doing what I do. I don't think this is an easy line to draw.

[Jozanny]

Also, it depends on what you mean by "die for".

If it's a case of undertaking a certain suicide mission, I can't imagine anything I'd do that for, including my children. Martyrdom never appealed to me.

This is relevant, as what, in the 21st century, is worth that degree of sacrifice. Mothers dying for children may not be as predictably heroic as it seems, as I do not think parents stop to think how much they screw up what they have issued forth into the world. OTOH, I sometimes feel my parents should have joined their son when they buried him, because my sister and myself had to swallow the consequences--but I could still die to do the right thing, if I really believed that dying would have an impact on whatever the injustice is that we inflict on each other.


I receive numerous death threats, none of which has encouraged me to stop doing what I do. I don't think this is an easy line to draw.

What you *do* is as important as all that? Being strident is one thing; being radicalized is another, and your views aren't necessarily as provocative as you think. Absolute materialism has its problems as a position supposedly superior to the intangibility of metaphysical struggle.

[The Atheist]

What you *do* is as important as all that? Being strident is one thing; being radicalized is another, and your views aren't necessarily as provocative as you think. Absolute materialism has its problems as a position supposedly superior to the intangibility of metaphysical struggle.

They're nothing whatsoever to do with philosophical or metaphysical questions.

[Jozanny]

They're nothing whatsoever to do with philosophical or metaphysical questions.

You've lost me here, unless you mean that what you do for a living has angered individuals who have the capacity to do you harm, and if that is the case, well, there are progressives in the US who face the same difficulty. Sometimes they lose, and I do not know that I feel that strongly about their particular pet cause.

Though as a published writer I might face some future difficulty if I raise my voice, and in raising it I am not simply censored.

[The Atheist]

You've lost me here....

I run websites that expose fuel-saving devices as scams, which means I cost the owners of the businesses tens of thousands of dollars in income.

A couple of them have got quite upset about that.

[Revolte]

I can honestly say I would die for freedom ( boundless freedom, not the freedom we have come to know in modern day ), love and peace. There have been times that its come close as well. I don't take kindly to suffering or bigotry. If you ask me global happiness is worth dying for.

[Nikhar]

I can sure die for my country. It may sound cliched but it's true in my case definitely. I love India immensely and I do feel so proud to be an Indian.

[blazeofglory]

Whereas I never can die for a country. In fact this is a very narrow sentiment, for I like to be free of such things. It may be an anarchic idea in fact I like a border-less idea. Fighting for one's country means killing others. Maybe it seem impractical to say that there should not be any border but that is my ideal. I want that people from all countries can feel a kind of brotherliness. The idea of country or border created a kind of animosity towards one another, the way there is between Pakistan and India. I do not mean there were no confrontation or hostility at all towards one another example before the partition, there were of course some, kind of ethnic acrimony but after the partition the it worsens. That said I do not mean that the existence of Pakistan wrong at all. It is a different topic altogether and if I say so I may sound to my Pakistani brothers. This is just an idea only. The idea that I hate divisiveness whether it is in terms of political divisions that create different unities. I am always in for bigger unities that transcend geographies or political boundaries. I want to die for this ideology.

[lostworld]

I know what I would die for...I would die for the people I love.

[blazeofglory]

I would doe for nothing because the most important thing in my life is myself.

[Maximilianus]

I would die for a piece of truth, sprouting from the place it sprouts less often from.

[blazeofglory]

I would not die for anything in life and of course I can live for them. I can live for fulfilling my desire, for being a writer, a philosopher. I can live for being a lover but I can not die for it, for dying for something will not make me existential.
I cannot die for anything not even for God, the greatest achievement, for my life is more significant to me and I cannot think about God when I am not here

[keilj]

Saw an interesting documentary about the My Lai massacre a couple night ago. It sort of provided a pretty concrete example of something to die for.

I'll try to summarize it briefly. At My Lai, a company of U.S. soldiers was sent into the village with orders that anyone in the village was Vietcong or Vietcong sympathizers - that the village would be free of civilians. It turns out that everyone in the village was a civilian - mostly women, children and elderly people. Well, once the first soldier fired on a civilian, pretty much everyone else started firing.

It got much worse from there, I won't go into the details. But the "willing to die for" part came a little later. A U.S. copter pilot saw a lot of what was going on on the ground. Then he saw a group of civilians just outside of the village, they were ducking into a blind, trying to hide. But a group of about 6 U.S. soldiers were heading their way. At that point the pilot decided to land on the ground and get those civilians out of there. This was the point for that pilot where he had crossed that boundary where he was putting his life in danger for something he felt strongly about - which to me is sort of what this thread is asking - what are those things where a personal line of life and death might be drawn.

[Maximilianus]

That was a really commendable deed, keilj. Thanks for sharing the story.